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Chevy Bolt EV 60 KW battery & the Volt

12K views 60 replies 27 participants last post by  saghost 
#1 ·
Does anyone know if GM might be adapting the new high capacity (60 KW) battery pack used in the new Chevy Bolt for the next generation Volt? It would be great to have the higher battery capacity available, perhaps an an option.
 
#2 ·
I doubt it. After a certain point (say 20 kWh), it is no longer beneficial to add an ICE generator backup. You are basically "all in" at that point. The Bolt EV's battery weighs close to what you would expect the typical ICE system to weigh, so you could basically get 80 kWh of capacity for the same weight and space as a 20 kWh + ICE generator system. At that point, you'd have close to 300 miles of range with the ability to recharge about 250 miles in less than an hour.
 
#11 ·
True...EXCEPT...what IF the Power grid goes down...for whatever reason?? Then ALL YOU HAVE IS A NICE PLANTER??
That is why it is NICE and maybe essential to have BOTH??:))
 
#4 ·
The Bolt's battery weighs about twice what the Volts battery weighs and it has almost four times the capacity so a 30KVh battery using the Bolts batteries would weigh no more than the current battery but it would give the Volt a hundred mile EV range. A Volt with a hundred mile EV range would be ideal. A one hundred mile EV range would take care of all local driving, the current 53 mile can't. I'd upgrade in a heartbeat if they upped the range to 100 miles so I hope they drop Bolt batteries into the Volt.
 
#6 ·
Yup, what you ask is Top Secret info, but if the Volt is to survive even one more design cycle in the face of ever-improving battery energy density then it will surely have to keep extending its EV capacity to remain competitive. More is always welcome. Volt may evolve along the lines of the i3 EREV: 'bigger' battery/much smaller ice.
 
#7 ·
A compact car doesn't need 60 kWh of battery unless it's driving electric for a few hours at a time - I doubt anyone will add an ICE to a pack of that size for a compact car.

However, it's the same number of cell groups and nominal voltage as the rest of the recent GM EVs, and appears to use a very similar heating/cooling strategy - so it could fit in to a Voltec system without much changing in the software and system architecture.

I don't think it makes sense for the next generation Volt (assuming GM makes one, instead of going all electric in 2020/2022), but if they decide to make a Voltec Silverado/Tahoe it could make sense for that...
 
#8 ·
Look for the Gen 3 Volt to have a 75-100 mile all electric range, and a 50+ mpg when just running on the gasoline engine. Also possibly a different body style reflecting that of a VW Sportwagen. I would imagine the weight would also come down to perhaps 3300 lbs as well.
 
#9 ·
how about buying a bolt and adding a small diesel engine and generator,,drive the front wheels w/ it.maybe a .71 ratio single gear drivebox and couple w/ a clutch.complicated yes,,doable,,depends on space up front.
but if the volt went 100mile ev,,I'm in,good by gen1.
 
#10 ·
You either have a big battery and a small range extender or a small battery and a big range extender.

Do you really want the volt to become an i3
 
#12 ·
Folks, don't forget what drove the Volt's battery sizing in the first place: 90% or something of the population can do their daily driving in the range that's currently offered. If it's easy, convenient, and cheap, to add to that range, Chevy will do so, and has. But if the new range comes at a loss in any of those categories, they already HAVE the Volt where they want it, targeting the audience that it was designed for. You're more likely to see a DIFFERENT vehicle pop up with a Voltec-style hybrid system (maybe llninja's six-seater crossover) than a Volt that's much more than the same kind of refinement over the Gen 2 that the Gen 2 was over Gen 1.
 
#15 ·
The current Volt will be around for another 3 years at least. The main issue will continue to be price. The $7500 Gov rebate will go away and then GM has to figure how to recoup some of that without passing it on to the end user. If the cost rises too much more, no takers. Also for about the same money you can by a Bolt-for me it looks too much like a cheap Honda Fit to take the plunge. If the model 3 is close to what they say it will be, then I don't see the Bolt doing very well.

They made the Gen 2 too much like a regular car. In this case a Chevrolet. What made the Gen 1 unique was it was a cool concept that happened to be a Chevrolet, much like a Corvette. Being a Chevrolet was no big deal to wanting one. The current Volt is now viewed as Chevrolet that is a hybrid car. No big deal. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure the Gen 2 is a better car. But it is not a car that people are drawn to because it looks like a Cruze or a year old Honda.
 
#18 ·
...a Bolt-for me it looks too much like a cheap Honda Fit to take the plunge....
.... The current Volt is now viewed as Chevrolet that is a hybrid car
.....people are drawn to because it looks like a Cruze or a year old Honda.
You put a lot of stock in 'Looks'. Like a woman buying a dress. Some men look at the spec sheets of cars.

I wish the Volt was viewed as a 'hybrid'. It's a Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle: PHEV, with a +50 mile EV range.
But you won't hear GM talk like that. It's all, "when the generator powers up blah, blah ....".
It's a hybrid with a big ass battery that can power the car as a full 4-season EV, unlike some other PHEV's on the market.

Some people are drawn by looks.
 
#21 ·
I look at vehicle EV range in terms of Radius Miles from my home. Currently 13 miles. In few months hopefully it will be up to 20 miles. I live in small town USA. Getting groceries is 6 - 8 mile round trip. Going out to dinner is usually in the next town 13-15 miles (26-30) RT Miles away depending which one I go to. If I need to go to the big city, 55 miles away (110-120) RT depending where I need to go. I can't even go for joy ride without running out of range. I would love a 100 mile EV range Volt with the same Available ICE miles range. For traveling and Refueling ANYWHERE in 10 minutes. I love long driving trips. To me this is the most practical EV configuration with contemporary Vehicle utility for a normal lifestyle. This avoids the gas pump most of the time and I don't need to rely on having another Vehicle.

I met a fellow that had a BMW i3 with RE. He said, the fuel tank was 2 gallons. About 80 mi range. He told me, he hadn't taken it on any long trips yet. To him, it was a bit of an annoyance to have to stop every hour to put in 1.5 gallons. He said, A 5 gallon tank would have been more practical.


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#22 ·
...I met a fellow that had a BMW i3 with RE. He said, the fuel tank was 2 gallons. About 80 mi range. He told me, he hadn't taken it on any long trips yet. To him, it was a bit of an annoyance to have to stop every hour to put in 1.5 gallons. He said, A 5 gallon tank would have been more practical.
Right, and I think the i3 REX does not allow a 'Hold' mode so you can burn off the 80 miles of gas first when 'attempting' a road trip. Weird implementation. I think the Euro version is better in this regard.
 
#23 · (Edited)
I'm guessing any future Volt-type vehicle won't have more than 75-100 EV miles range. That probably gets most to 100% electric except for road trips. More than that, and the great debate is why have the range extender, just add more battery... I'm not sure exactly what that magic EV range number is, but the greater the EV range the stronger the argument against having the range extender. Maybe the future range extender will use fuel but not be consumed by an ICE. Personally I like the flexibility of EREV. I don't need to worry about coping with days of the grid down, time sensitive emergency with insufficient charge... I don't think the charging infrastructure is even close to ready to replace gas stations.
 
#24 ·
If money is being saved I could see the Gen2 adopting the same LG Chem cells as the Bolt...

I wouldn't be surprised at all if there wasn't any Gen3 Volt yet let's see sales...Will need a few months with the Volt and Bolt selling along side to see how the Volt sells...Many think the Prius Prime will be the best selling PHEV for 2017 and if it is the case does keep PHEV idea going...

But I sure hope it isn't another compact sedan, offer some sort of AWD SUV...
 
#26 ·
People facing adverse situations could use a little more range than what is being offered now. Better battery technology and lower costs will likely make that happen. I am hoping for faster charging and a little more battery on a gen 2 design refresh.

I suspect there will be a Volt Gen 3, as I see more auto manufacturers developing EREV cars for future product offerings. Most people are not ready for BEV yet and EREV is the bridge for them to accept BEV. The Bolt is for zealots and it is expected that there will be some. People in cold places will continue to demand EREV because they can burn gas in the winter and be electric in the summer all in the same car.
 
#28 ·
People facing adverse situations could use a little more range than what is being offered now. Better battery technology and lower costs will likely make that happen. I am hoping for faster charging and a little more battery on a gen 2 design refresh.
Actually, that might be the point GM should aim for. I think their DOT-based approach was correct (40 miles covers most driving needs), but they should shoot for that number even in the worst conditions. That likely equals an EPA-estimated range of close to 80 miles, and I doubt Volt owners would complain.
 
#29 · (Edited)
Here in northwestern Oregon 5 blocks from the Pacific Ocean, we have storms that rival that of Hurricanes and power can and has gone out for days. Thats were the Volt shines. My wife's 2016 Volt even when the battery is depleted has a gasoline engine that can still deliver 45+ mpg on regular gas. We also have several 5 gallon cans of regular gas for the standby generator that can run a few appliances like the freezer's etc. and of course the extra 5 gallons of gas from those cans can run my wife's Volt and my 2010 Prius as well. When spring comes we use the gas in our cars with no problems..

A pure electric car would look nice in the garage or driveway but with an empty battery and no electricity to charge that's all it could do for you....
 
#30 ·
... power can and has gone out for days. ... We also have several 5 gallon cans of regular gas for the standby generator that can run a few appliances like the freezer's etc. ...

A pure electric car would look nice in the garage or driveway but with an empty battery and no electricity to charge that's all it could do for you....
Why not charge a BEV with that generator? That's my plan. Anything but firing up that gasser in the driveway.:p
 
#34 ·
CARB is giving EV clean vehicle credits at 50, 75 and 100 mile range thresholds...so just adding 10 miles to the current Volt range doesn't get them any kind of return on investment. Market conditions from competing car brands may improve the Volt, but it will be from another maker that hits the 75 mi range mandate to get 2.5 EV credits vs 2 credits for the 50-75 mile threshold.

For me personally, I would like more range, but beyond a certain point, I would not be able to charge a larger battery for free because of size constraints on my rooftop PV. Unless they can make a 23-24kwh battery that weighs the same as the current t-shaped pack, I don't think they will go for it.
 
#36 ·
Many cars are deemed ugly when they first come out, but after exposure, people start to find the image/look comforting if not enjoyable. I actually think the Tesla models at this point are quite ugly, but it also might be a result of which color. I know that for the Bolt EV, when I saw them in person, I was elated that I had the chance to switch my reservation to a different color because it, in my opinion, looked so much better.
 
#41 ·
With our 2016 Volt it cost less per mile to use gasoline than to use the generator to charge the battery and then drive the same distance on electricity. Just like some charging stations charging $1.50 / hour to charge. It would take nearly 4 hours to completely charge the battery in our Volt. With gas at $ 2.40 / gal. its far less money to drive on gas. Not many free charging stations here in northwestern Oregon...
 
#42 ·
I would love if GM took the Bolt battery and cut it in 1/3 or 1/4 and put it in the Volt. With that dense packaging (and in the floor), the Volt could finally have a real 5th seat and still increase range a bit over gen2 (and might even weigh less). I'd love 60-70 miles AER, but too much above that starts to be silly in an EREV, and I do want the Volt to remain a true EREV. Doubt they'll do it, though, since they'd have to totally redo the chassis to get away from the t-battery. Oh well, a guy can dream...
 
#43 ·
This,
in my mind a volt with a smaller but denser battery, more interior room, weight loss and gas motor efficiency gains is far more compelling.

After all a Bolt 15kw battery likely has almost as much useable capacity as the 18.4 gen ii battery while weighing less and hopefully costing less.

Add to this a lighter car with some minor aero improvements would likely go further on less and end up with another 5 or 10 city miles all else being equal.

Yes a guy can dream
 
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