GM Volt Forum banner

Chevy Volt 2014 New Engine?

18K views 39 replies 27 participants last post by  Mathew Hennessy 
#1 ·
Hi I am considering getting a 2013 Volt, but i have been reading about how the 2014 Volt is getting 2.0 L Turbo engine.
have you guys heard anything about that being true?
 
#2 · (Edited)
That rumor is from June 2012. Point to your sources. That is not true as far as what I've read and saghost had a nice post about why.

Do a google search and read these past threads using: site:gm-volt.com ("2.0L" OR "2.0 L")
 
#4 ·
I don't get this whole need for a turbo. They generate extra heat that would have to be managed under the hood (not much extra space in there), turbos don't make engines smoother. I had a turbo and was happy it didn't prematurely fail because they aren't cheap (especially small ones built for very small volume engines). I'm glad we didn't wait for a 2013 - I just wanted to drive the car! There will always be something different, but GM would be nuts to make a big change like this with such a low volume model.
 
#5 ·
Yea, the 2011 was supposed to get a 3 cylinder Turbo Charged ICE too. Don't hold your breath.
 
#7 ·
I do support the statement saying the ICE engine is mostly a big piece of metal to (most of the time uselessly) haul around.
I would prefer that GM puts an even smaller engine, like a 3 cyl 1.0L, to take off some weight off the car.
The engine must simply provide the AVERAGE power, as peeks are handled by the energy buffer kept in the 16.5kWh battery.
However, GM did use an off the shelf production engine, so they keep the costs low by not having to
design and build a new engine specific to the Volt.

Francois
B2653
 
#9 · (Edited)
The engine's job is to run the generator. No matter whether it is a turbo 2 liter, a 1.3 liter, or a 427 ci V-8, it's the generator which gets all the benefits. So - the best engine for running the generator is whatever allows it to do its job the most effectively, the most efficiently.

The generator's job is to maintain battery charge at a level which maintains full performance. So - if the Volt is to be expected to be driven hard for sustained periods of time, the generator has to be up to snuff to maintain charge, with an engine which allows it to do its job under these extreme conditions. Whether or not the present engine is up to the task, I can't say. But it just might - and if so, a larger, turboed engine would be pointless overkill.
 
#11 · (Edited)
If the Cruze Diesel is an indication of GM's approach to diesel propulsion, I wouldn't want a diesel in the Volt. It's definitely very heavy in the Cruze implementation. And there is also a 4.5 gallon urea tank. (To clean up the diesel exhaust?) If you are running low on urea in your Cruze, I wonder if you can take a leak into the tank? :D

http://www.caranddriver.com/news/2014-chevrolet-cruze-diesel-photos-and-info-news

Also, the Volt somtimes runs as a parallel hybrid. So maybe some more ICE grunt isn't completely out of the question.
 
#12 ·
I would like to see a diesel as well so I could make my own bio fuel and run it off that. The car burns gas so rarely I could easily keep up with the demand with a very small bio plant in the garage. It would be like making beer for my car. I would be ok with E85 capability too but that has drawbacks with water absorption.
 
#17 ·
Not sure, but there is the spoilage aspect of diesel fuel that sits around not being used - not good for those who might need gas once or twice a year.
Nah, diesel will last a couple of years, especially in a sealed tank and being bounced around all the time.
Got a diesel engine in my boat and lately I have only used the boat once a year with no ill effects.
 
#18 ·
The 2014 Volt will probably get another round of "tweaks" similar to what Caddy did to the 2014 Voltec. I can see another increase in battery range to well over 40 miles and maybe even slithly better performance numbers like 0-60 times cut by .1 or .2 seconds and hopefully a bit better cold weather performance. But that's it.

And I wonder why GM didn't have a 2014 Volt at any of the major auto shows???? They had everything else new for 2014.
 
#19 ·
I would much rather my Volt run on Propane than on Diesel. And we will likely never see either one. The only purpose for the generator is to take longer trips. On those rare cases you are going to want the fuel that is most abundant and easier to find. So if anything at all changes about the fuel, I suspect it will be going to regular 87 octane.
 
#20 ·
My thoughts were

  • They will modify the existing 1.4 to add Direct Injection (tweaked for fuel economy) and convert it to all aluminum. That’s only if they don’t have any major changes in the drive train in the next revision.
  • A good candidate for a revised engine might be the 1.2 already available in the spark, then Volterize it.
  • The next iteration of the Volt should have a lighter body, thus requiring less power to move and a less powerful ICE.

If GM wants to have a diversified lineup of Voltec, they will have to get a universal engine for the Voltec (like it is right now with the 1.4). Keeping the costs low it the key, the engine will have to be also present (partially or completely) in a regular ICE car. Making a unique engine doesn’t really make sense right now, with the sales number.
 
#21 ·
I do wonder what will be the next perfect engine, knowing the engine is just a big generator, i wonder if the generator industry as better solution....., like any good home generator.

http://www.canadiantire.ca/AST/browse/6/Tools/ShopEquipment/Generators.jsp

Is there any good engineer here that could do some math and proposes an alternative to a regular motor I'm just curious.....


My main concern , and i think it was mention, is for longer trip. I need a generator that can run and produce enough electricity to recharge the battery to a level the generator can stop (like in one/two hours) so i can do another 20/30/60/80Km on electricity

Is it possible for the generator to produce 240v+ or more amp to cut the charging time?

Of course the fuel consumption would need to be in an optimize range
 
#22 ·
I do wonder what will be the next perfect engine, knowing the engine is just a big generator, i wonder if the generator industry as better solution....., like any good home generator.

It is more than just a generator, read many other posts here about the direct coupling of mechanal power when the ICE is running at speeds of 70 MPH or more.

Also in cold tempatures it is also the cabin heater, so an air cooled engine would not do.
 
#23 ·
BMW i3's getting an optional 650cc 2cyl motorcycle-derived range extender. I could see a compact 1l 3cyl made of aluminum and/or magnesium, DI, VVT, with a turbo that had a generator on it (ecomotors-style) that altogether weighed around 100kg being an excellent replacement for the compromised 1.4l off-the-shelf lump that's in Voltec 1.0 .
 
#25 ·
The i3 is designed under different assumptions. The Volt is truely a dual fuel car - offering full performance on either electricity or gas. On the one side are PHEVs like the Energi twins - full performance on gas, reduced perfomance on electricity. On the other side is the new BEVx category (invented for the i3) - full performance on electricity, reduced performance on gas.

The i3 isn't expected to take road trips on its engine - the real purpose of the engine is to let you use the last quarter of the battery without fear, to catch owners who got slightly to optimistic with their battery range. As a result of this different philosophy, it's a much smaller engine, and always in series. It likely will get worse CS economy despite being 2/3 the weight - but the two gallon gas tank isn't intended for much use.

The Volt's current engine hits optimal fuel efficiency right at 70 mph (not suggesting you get better mileage there - the load is do much higher there) and reaches the targeted 100 mph cruise easily. Unless the next generation car has radically lower power requirements (due to decreased weight, better motors/inverters, or better aero,) the next generation engine should be targeted at the same power levels (and thus not much, if any, smaller - I'm actually expecting a somewhat larger Atkinson engine (Atkinson engines throw away a third or so of their displacement/charge volume to get the assymetric long exhaust stroke.))
 
#29 ·
A diezel is the best choice for our Volt generators for shure. My GM engineering friends say that a diezel is an almost impossible choice in the US because of the many California restrictions. VW has the diezel Jetta but the exhaust plumbing and amonia container are a mess. That engine gets 65 mpg in Europe and 42 mpg after the California rules choke it.
 
#30 ·
Yes and no. Yes, the emissions controls are painful and expensive. But the story is more about test standards than it is about actual efficiency: The Ampera is rated for 52 miles (83 km) AER. It doesn't use a bigger battery, it isn't any more efficient than the Volt. But the official EU test is enough easier that it magically gains 14 (or 17? it isn't clear which year was tested,) miles of electric range - almost the same 50% increase you're seeing on the Jetta numbers.

More importantly, the newer common rail diesels don't like US fuel quality: about 1% of those highly efficient diesels seem to be experiencing high pressure fuel pump failures, a ~$6k repair after it scatters metal fragments throughout the fuel system.

Days like this I'm glad my Volt has a simple, well understood relatively low tech range extender. Not quite as efficient, but close - and far less likely to leave me at the side of the road or induce a multi thousand dollar repair bill.
 
#32 ·
One aspect not noted in this thread is SMOOTHNESS. A 3-cylinder engine has a lot more noise and vibration to manage. This requires a lot more engineering in terms of mounts, counter balance shafts, etc. Sticking with a 4-cyl keeps the vibrations down to a more "normal" level.

Here's a link to an early test of Ford's 3-cyl 1.0lT. They did their homework on the vibration damping and it sounds promising. Given this competition, I think GM will do the homework to have such an engine for Spark/Sonic use - and then available in the parts bin for a Volt/ELR.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-reviews/first-drives/2014-ford-fiesta-1
 
#37 ·
One aspect not noted in this thread is SMOOTHNESS. A 3-cylinder engine has a lot more noise and vibration to manage. This requires a lot more engineering in terms of mounts, counter balance shafts, etc. Sticking with a 4-cyl keeps the vibrations down to a more "normal" level.
BMW had turbine-smooth 3cyl 750cc motors 25 years ago, on their K-series bikes, and those 'flying brick' motors were stressed members.
 
#33 ·
A lot of bleeding edge tech mixed together in one engine. It'll be interesting to see whether it works out the way they think it will, or whether one of their innovations trips them up on the first car, like they have some many times before.
 
#36 ·
I came across this paper on the Internet:

http://delphi.com/pdf/techpapers/2010-01-0590.pdf

"SUMMARY AND CONCLUSIONS

Turbocharged GDi engines are a key enabler for downsizing that can substantially reduce CO2 emissions from gasoline engines. Good low end torque is critical to maintain good driveability with downsizing and downspeeding in turbocharged engines. Low end torque increases with GDi because it allows improved scavenging efficiency and cools the intake charge to reduce knock. GDi also improves fuel control and mixture motion to improve combustion efficiency.

For downsized engines, reducing the number of cylinders offers advantages over simply reducing cylinder displacement volume. In smaller vehicles, for a given engine displacement, 3-cylinder engines provide less heat transfer surface area and a reduction in the quench layer and crevices for improved combustion efficiency and lower engine-out emissions compared to 4-cylinders. Lower firing frequency per engine cycle with 3-cylinders reduces exhaust pressure pulsations during the gas exchange process providing better scavenging at high loads. Reduction in number of cylinders also results in reduced friction and lower cost, but introduces unbalanced torque pulsations inducing a front-back rocking action of the engine. For higher specific outputs in turbocharged engines, counterbalancing compensations can provide acceptable NVH for cylinder displacements up to approximately 0.5 liters. Consequently, 3-cylinder turbocharged engines are attractive for engines up to 1.5 L displacement."

I'm no fan of 3-cylinder engines, but this type of engine appears to be a good match for future Voltec powertrains. According to the paper, fuel consumption is significantly lower for a 3-cylinder as compared against a 4-cylinder normally aspirated engine at the same power output, also smaller, cheaper and better emissions performance.

So now the question is can you operate a 3-cylinder turbo using a modified Atkinson cycle? Turbocharging produces a lot of heat, it seems to me the effectively longer ratio od power to intake stroke of an Atkinson cycle verses the traditional ICE would be particularly advantageous in increasing the thermal efficiency of the engine.
 
#38 ·
I believe BMW is making 3-cylinder 1.5L engines now.

The Volt, I see an Atkinson cycle engine via valve behavior to be the next logical step in increasing CS efficiency. All the good hybrids have it so why shouldn't the Volt. The increased displacement needed to attain the same power as a pure OTTO cycle engine doesn't matter that much. The increased efficiency of the combustion cycle is the main thing.
After that comes lean burn but emissions are tricky with that. Toyota is trying to figure it out.
 
#40 ·
I believe BMW is making 3-cylinder 1.5L engines now.
Yup, and they have an inline 6 for the K1600GT[L] touring bike that has perfect primary and secondary balance, and is roughly as narrow as a motorcycle inline 4.

The Volt, I see an Atkinson cycle engine via valve behavior to be the next logical step in increasing CS efficiency. All the good hybrids have it so why shouldn't the Volt. The increased displacement needed to attain the same power as a pure OTTO cycle engine doesn't matter that much. The increased efficiency of the combustion cycle is the main thing.
After that comes lean burn but emissions are tricky with that. Toyota is trying to figure it out.
If the thermal efficiency exceeds the efficiencies in mass and size that you'd get from a 3cyl turbo, then that'd make sense. I have the feeling that these Atkinson cycle engines are maybe a step up from the Volt's off-the-shelf lump, say with a different head and valve timing but a shared block. I'd be surprised if any current hybrid's engine was specifically purpose-built for that application, though perhaps Toyota's had a chance to create such a thing.

I’m surprised people would want a diesel in the Volt. I owned several diesels, but don’t want any more. They are heavy, the fuel is expensive, they are louder, more expensive and don’t like cold weather.
If anything, Volt would be an _ideal_ platform for coddling a diesel and its gel-prone fuel IMO. Plenty of battery to run glow plugs and a block and oil pan heater. However, it seems kind of pointless unless your goal was to be biodiesel capable or to satisfy a fuel type requirement like for the military. Also, diesel blocks weigh quite a bit more than gas blocks, and the performance characteristics overlap a bit with electric motors: both diesels and electric motors have lots of torque, relatively little HP, so you may as well have a gas genset with plenty of HP but little torque.
 
#39 ·
I’m surprised people would want a diesel in the Volt. I owned several diesels, but don’t want any more. They are heavy, the fuel is expensive, they are louder, more expensive and don’t like cold weather.

The engines take more energy to start and would run rough until warmed up.
This is bad because the Volt needs something quick to replace the energy it was receiving from the battery.

I don’t believe GM will lower the output to try to get better mpg.
I have a feeling they will instead try to make the car slightly more efficient and focus more on performance.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top