How long to get investment back on the Volt?

[SharkVolt]

I drive my Volt almost every single day, and I have been averaging about 1000 miles every month, for nearly a year and a half now. And I just realized what is really wrong about the comparisons people make between the Volt and all the other cars. They overlook several things.

For instance, they like to claim it will take 10 years or more before you get back the difference in extra cost for the Volt. That is just plain WRONG! When you or I buy a car, we seldom pay the $40,000 up front. we get a car loan and make payments, or some of us may lease the car.

Either way, we are driving a $40,000 car around and saving enough on gas bills to drop our cost to drive the Volt per month down to about the same as the payments and gas bills on a $20,000 econobox!

No other car can do that!

The payback is not ten years from now, it is INSTANT and it is ongoing.

And that does not even count the $7500 tax credit we get during the first year.

And, it also doesn't count the far lower ownership costs over extended ownership. After ten years I will have driven 120,000 miles. With the Volt, that is hardly even broken in. GM estimates 600,000 miles life on the electric motors. That would take over 40 years on mine. My ICE only is being used about 10% of the time. Even if it was a terrible motor for engine life and needed rebuilding after 100,000 miles of use, that will take a MILLION miles on the car. And, since the transmission only has to clutch shift about one tenth the amount of a regular automatic transmission, and those shifts are speed matched by the computer so there is virtually no slippage or wear, it will probably easily exceed a million miles with no work required.

The only expensive consumable item that will possibly need replacement in the Volt is the battery. And the life of that will probably easily exceed ten years, by which time they will be pretty reasonable in price, and probably have higher storage capacity and lower weight than the current one. It will be like putting a higher power engine in your old car, an instant upgrade to even better performance/economy.

The Volt may become the first car in history that retains most of it's value even 10-20 years after purchase.

I am sure the rest of the world, even the bigots, will eventually see this, and when that happens, there will be a mad scramble to buy this car. (And maybe even some GM stock)

And I also think if you are waiting , so you can buy a used Volt to save on the purchase, get in a long line! I don't think Volt owners will part with those cars easily, and the used market price for one is going to stay high besides. (I know it will be a long time before anyone could buy mine.)

After six years, when I am done making payments, I will be driving around nearly for free! And I don't even have solar panels yet!

[Gary Norton]

All your points about ownership are true. But in my case there was no premium cost for the Volt. My Volt cost the same as a comparably equipped Cruze when I factor in the Federal and Colorado credits of $13,400. Based on my electric cost of 4.6 cents/KWH my operating cost difference ranges between $1200 and $2400 per year, depending on how much of my driving involves gasoline.

[dax777]

I agree on all the above points concerning the cost of ownership....this car pays for itself right out of the box...love my Volt...I leased and will order another Volt again when this lease expires....

[GeorgeH]

Cars aren't an investment. They're an expense. If you were concerned about return on the purchase, a $5k used Honda Civic getting 45mpg is a vastly better deal. Your cost per mile over ten years will be dramatically lower, even with repair costs. Economics is never a good way to measure a car purchase because the math only works when you exclude options for non-economic reasons.

"Retains most of its value" means something specific -- that you can resell the car for most of what you spent, and it will not do that. If it would, the lease would be nearly free and Chevy would be selling a half million of them a year.

If you leave the fancy tech aside, you're getting a $25k quality vehicle (go look at a Hyundai Sonata, as an example of what $25k gets you in a "normal" car today. Rock solid reliability, meticulous build quality, cutting edge infotainment, leather, etc), for ~$35k after the tax incentive. If you are in the sweet spot of driving and use very little gas, you'll definitely recoup the difference after a few years, but not right away. Like a Prius, if you aren't in that sweet spot, you may never recoup the difference in cost.

But, in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter. I bought a Volt because I wanted the Volt. I liked the technology. The savings around driving is a nice fringe benefit. The quietness of it is a benefit. It also sort of balances out my other car, which is so loud I need earplugs, gets horrible gas mileage and doesn't even have catalytic converters... Its sort of a ecological balancing of the ledger.

Even if the math doesn't work out for people, I'm not sure the math was intended to on the Volt. The Prius didn't make economic sense for most drivers until the latest generation got prices down enough. The Volt is meant to be a public testbed for significant new technology, and they did it in a car that is great looking and great to drive. I'm sure GM expected early adopters would be buying them for those reasons alone, even ignoring the math -- just as the early adopters of the Prius did. And, IMO, they are right. We're driving the tech leaders, ahead of the curve. The real deals will be when you can buy a Voltec Cruze for $22k. Our money is subsidizing that future.

[dax777]

Cars aren't an investment. They're an expense. If you were concerned about return on the purchase, a $5k used Honda Civic getting 45mpg is a vastly better deal. Your cost per mile over ten years will be dramatically lower, even with repair costs. Economics is never a good way to measure a car purchase because the math only works when you exclude options for non-economic reasons.

"Retains most of its value" means something specific -- that you can resell the car for most of what you spent, and it will not do that. If it would, the lease would be nearly free and Chevy would be selling a half million of them a year.

If you leave the fancy tech aside, you're getting a $25k quality vehicle (go look at a Hyundai Sonata, as an example of what $25k gets you in a "normal" car today. Rock solid reliability, meticulous build quality, cutting edge infotainment, leather, etc), for ~$35k after the tax incentive. If you are in the sweet spot of driving and use very little gas, you'll definitely recoup the difference after a few years, but not right away. Like a Prius, if you aren't in that sweet spot, you may never recoup the difference in cost.

But, in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter. I bought a Volt because I wanted the Volt. I liked the technology. The savings around driving is a nice fringe benefit. The quietness of it is a benefit. It also sort of balances out my other car, which is so loud I need earplugs, gets horrible gas mileage and doesn't even have catalytic converters... Its sort of a ecological balancing of the ledger.

Even if the math doesn't work out for people, I'm not sure the math was intended to on the Volt. The Prius didn't make economic sense for most drivers until the latest generation got prices down enough. The Volt is meant to be a public testbed for significant new technology, and they did it in a car that is great looking and great to drive. I'm sure GM expected early adopters would be buying them for those reasons alone, even ignoring the math -- just as the early adopters of the Prius did. And, IMO, they are right. We're driving the tech leaders, ahead of the curve. The real deals will be when you can buy a Voltec Cruze for $22k. Our money is subsidizing that future.

Nicely put GeorgeH, I think the Volt is the best car I've ever driven. After just a 5 mile test drive, I traded one of my Priuses in on this super futuristic car...You're also correct in the assumption that I purchased this car because of all the shear pleasure and personal satisfaction of driving in EV mode gives me

[2BeLivingGreen]

Sharkvolt good thread and info. I agree with you. Interesting in how the VOLT is one of the few, maybe only car, that many people expect it to pay itself off. Amazing the savings the VOLT generates and yet many will not consider one since it may not completely pay itself back in a couple or years. Yet they will drive their conventional vehicle and there is no savings at all.

All I know it is great to be a VOLT owner and pass up gas stations, let alone all the great driving experiences that the car gives back.

[TheProgrammerGuy]

Cars aren't an investment. They're an expense. If you were concerned about return on the purchase, a $5k used Honda Civic getting 45mpg is a vastly better deal. Your cost per mile over ten years will be dramatically lower, even with repair costs. Economics is never a good way to measure a car purchase because the math only works when you exclude options for non-economic reasons.

"Retains most of its value" means something specific -- that you can resell the car for most of what you spent, and it will not do that. If it would, the lease would be nearly free and Chevy would be selling a half million of them a year.

If you leave the fancy tech aside, you're getting a $25k quality vehicle (go look at a Hyundai Sonata, as an example of what $25k gets you in a "normal" car today. Rock solid reliability, meticulous build quality, cutting edge infotainment, leather, etc), for ~$35k after the tax incentive. If you are in the sweet spot of driving and use very little gas, you'll definitely recoup the difference after a few years, but not right away. Like a Prius, if you aren't in that sweet spot, you may never recoup the difference in cost.

But, in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter. I bought a Volt because I wanted the Volt. I liked the technology. The savings around driving is a nice fringe benefit. The quietness of it is a benefit. It also sort of balances out my other car, which is so loud I need earplugs, gets horrible gas mileage and doesn't even have catalytic converters... Its sort of a ecological balancing of the ledger.

Even if the math doesn't work out for people, I'm not sure the math was intended to on the Volt. The Prius didn't make economic sense for most drivers until the latest generation got prices down enough. The Volt is meant to be a public testbed for significant new technology, and they did it in a car that is great looking and great to drive. I'm sure GM expected early adopters would be buying them for those reasons alone, even ignoring the math -- just as the early adopters of the Prius did. And, IMO, they are right. We're driving the tech leaders, ahead of the curve. The real deals will be when you can buy a Voltec Cruze for $22k. Our money is subsidizing that future.

Ditto.
I bought the Volt because I like it, never even thought of an investment. It's a car! Not a retirement plan.

[bonaire]

It never is a good investment to buy a new car. The press and nay-sayers who talk "return on investment" for an economy car is silly.

Millionaires out there drive 10+ year old vehicles (that they may have bought used) to 250,000 miles or more. They save money - that's why they are Millionaires One frugal move is to buy a $4K car in 2011, invest wisely for 3-4 years and buy a used 2013 Volt in 2015 with 20K miles on it. People buy new Volts for a wide variety of reasons. Some want to try new, interesting technology. Others don't want to use gasoline/foreign oil. Others want to move from a 20mpg car to 40mpg CS-mode along with the benefit of the CD-mode too. But if you want to "save money" don't buy any car - keep your existing car and just buy gas. You spend far less putting gas in a wholly-owned 20mpg car than buying a new Volt, installing a 240V charger, etc.

With Ally offering 0% loans, you can't beat the free-money on the new models.

[Mybatcar]

I'm enjoying lower operating costs by driving over 76% of the time on battery, but off-setting the purchase price never factored into my decision to buy. I just wanted a new high tech car and had my eyes on the Volt for a few years during the development . I couldnt wait to get one, and yes, now almost a year and a half of ownership, the actual costs to drive it have been remarkably lower than anticipated.

[ronr64]

The whole idea of "investment" and "pay back" is a bit of a trick question when it comes to automotive purchases. It depends upon what the base line is. It is kind of like this; What is the odds of flipping a quarter and it landing on heads if I just flipped one and it was heads? A lot of people might answer 1 in 4 thinking that is the odds of flipping two quarters in a row. But it is not. It is 1 in 2 or 50/50. Why? Because the first quarter is old news, it is a given. How does that relate to the Volt payback/investment discussion you are probably wondering? It depends upon what is the given. If it is a given that you are going to drive a late model car that you purchased new then discussions about 5 year old Honda's being a better deal are irrelevant. If it is a given that you don't drive the cheapest econobox available then other models are also irrelevant - just as irrelevant as that first quarter. The comparables are going to be what YOU (and each "you" is different) would have purchased instead of the Volt. Only then can we talk in terms of "savings", "paybacks" and "investments".

So if you are the type of person who buys his brother in laws 5 year old Impala or Camry when he is done with it - forget about it - the Volt will never, ever save you a dime. (unless of course you buy his 5 year old Volt when it is available! ) On the other hand if you are looking at other vehicles in the 30K and up range (even lower depending upon driving habits) then the Volt is a break even or for some a money saving alternative.