Just theoretical of course... :-)

But how would one go about doing that?

Following up from a previous thread, the idea is to tap either the 12 volt power source, or if you feel really brave, the high voltage traction pack. I have no idea what voltage the traction pack sits at for the Volt, for the Prius Gen II it was around 300 volts.

Tapping the 12 volt side is pretty straight forward; just buy a 12v-120v DC-AC inverter, clamp it to the 12v source, connect the other end to the house panel and you're off. And yes, turn off the mains breaker! I'm also assuming here the Volt actually has a 12v system?

Tapping the traction pack is much more risky, at least it can be. Lets say it's 300v or thereabouts. You can search eBay, craigslist and other places to find really nice, high power DC-DC inverters that convert 300v to 12v, 24v or whatever, lets say we pick 300v-12v. Now we simply wire the 12v DC to the same inverter above and you should be good to go.

The thing about the Volt is it really doesn't want to recharge the batteries with the ICE, by design. So in theory, once the pack is depleted and the ICE starts, it probably will continue to run as long as a load is being drawn. The Prius does use the ICE to recharge the batteries so it will cycle; from full charge until ICE turns on, ICE runs until batteries recharged, ICE off, repeat.

I don't know that it really matters which way the vehicle operates in the long run, in both cases the inverter should provide continuous power until the gas tank and battery pack are both exhausted.

One other thing is I have no idea if the Volt's computer could become confounded by this unofficial use of it's power plants, it may protest by calling OnStar (:

In Wot's post on the APM he says the output capacity of the APM (the high voltage to 12 V converter is 12 volt 175 amps max). Further comments in that thread describe using 1kW to 2kW Tripplite inverters for portable power uses. Powering your house off it would have all sorts of safety issues...

This idea is more than just speculation. V2G (vehicle to grid) or V2H (vehicle to home) will undoubtably become a reality within the next 10 years. V2G will be used to back-feed power to the grid during peak loads. Instead of using inefficient backup power plants, they will use thousands of vehicles plugged into the grid to offset that load. Or as suggested, V2H, you could run your home or portions of it, during power outages. Yes, this volt may have issues preventing this from being implemented at the moment. But when we have a million EV's out there, things will change.

Following up from a previous thread, the idea is to tap either the 12 volt power source, or if you feel really brave, the high voltage traction pack. I have no idea what voltage the traction pack sits at for the Volt, for the Prius Gen II it was around 300 volts.

Tapping the 12 volt side is pretty straight forward; just buy a 12v-120v DC-AC inverter, clamp it to the 12v source, connect the other end to the house panel and you're off. And yes, turn off the mains breaker! I'm also assuming here the Volt actually has a 12v system?

Tapping the traction pack is much more risky, at least it can be. Lets say it's 300v or thereabouts. You can search eBay, craigslist and other places to find really nice, high power DC-DC inverters that convert 300v to 12v, 24v or whatever, lets say we pick 300v-12v. Now we simply wire the 12v DC to the same inverter above and you should be good to go.

The thing about the Volt is it really doesn't want to recharge the batteries with the ICE, by design. So in theory, once the pack is depleted and the ICE starts, it probably will continue to run as long as a load is being drawn. The Prius does use the ICE to recharge the batteries so it will cycle; from full charge until ICE turns on, ICE runs until batteries recharged, ICE off, repeat.

I don't know that it really matters which way the vehicle operates in the long run, in both cases the inverter should provide continuous power until the gas tank and battery pack are both exhausted.

One other thing is I have no idea if the Volt's computer could become confounded by this unofficial use of it's power plants, it may protest by calling OnStar (:

The Volt traction battery is 360 volt. For the kind of power a house would need I would think tapping the traction
battery would be the only answer. 1 or 2kw from the 12v system just won't cut it for a whole house generator.

The Volt converts the 360 volt DC to 3 phase 120v AC for the drive motor.

Seems like it would be straight forward to tap two of those phases to supply the house.

You've got a drive motor rated at 111kw and a generator motor rated at 54k, this thing should easily replace my 20kw generator.

Just theoretical of course... :-)

But how would one go about doing that?

Except possibly for the 12VDC hack discussed above, I would say that it isn't possible with the first model Volt. I can tell you that GM isn't going to risk it's traction battery for this, or for V2G at this early stage. Using the car as a convenient "electricity bucket" is not likely to be addressed before a decade of experience just powering vehicles down the road.

Strictly speaking, the solution for using the Volt as a generator would be to use the ICE range extender in a special mode to create the external electricity required. This sidesteps the whole issue of possibly damaging the pack, and more nearly matches the actual requirement (In a prolonged power outage, when would you have opportunity to recharge again? What if power is lost at night, while the Volt is charging?).

The idea wouldn't be straight forward to implement. It would likely not be possible to use the generator's full output, since the only connector and cable available aren't capable of carrying that load (but if a higher-voltage "Level III" jack is ever added, perhaps it could). Programming would have to reassign connectors in either socket (probably on handshaking with the special cable / outlet box required to access the power. Such an external device will likely be needed to protect the car's generator from conditions possibly encountered with a makeshift, external load). Needless to say, the car's drive would also have to be disabled.

In short, this is an issue for a later model; which isn't happening without the full intention of and engineering effort at GM (and likely not in any sense with the current Volt without voiding it's warranty). I do believe that such a feature would add value to the Volt, by effectively throwing in a very robust emergency generator almost for free with the car.

In short, this is an issue for a later model; which isn't happening without the full intention of and engineering effort at GM (and likely not in any sense with the current Volt without voiding it's warranty). I do believe that such a feature would add value to the Volt, by effectively throwing in a very robust emergency generator almost for free with the car.

As an EE, I agree with you, Jackson. I posted something about this in a similar thread. GM will not allow the present Volt model to be used as a emergency generator, and if the Volt owner modifies his car to do so, that will void the warranty. A future design is needed to be practical, and only GM has the engineering knowhow to incorporate this feature.

For now, only 12 VDC to 120 VAC converters could be used, and most of these converters cannot handle the 3 KW or more of electrical power that a typical home needs without damaging the 12 VDC systems in present Volts.

Raymond

The volt's generator seems too powerful for a home-power generator. You can pick up a portable generator for under $800.00 that can do 4kW. It's on my list of things to do this spring. I always wonder about when some damaging storm will come through and take down power for a few days. The refrigerators are primarily my concern and having 3000-4000W of 120v power is about right. They only use about 2kWh a day each so even a small generator helps with that.

Has anyone here ever put in a 240v home-generator? Would the cost of that be prohibitive or is it a smart move? We have well-water and need to run the well-pump at 240v. That means tying into the electric breaker panel and paying for electrician work bringing the cost of a generator up.

I think you could easily rig up a 1kW generator from the Volt using the fuse panel in the rear of the Volt and a 12V inverter. There was some discussion on that in another thread. This would be off the 12V rail, and I wouldn't think that it would void the warranty... It's no different than hooking up aftermarket audio equipment IMHO.

Has anyone here ever put in a 240v home-generator? Would the cost of that be prohibitive or is it a smart move? We have well-water and need to run the well-pump at 240v. That means tying into the electric breaker panel and paying for electrician work bringing the cost of a generator up.

I have a 15kw Kholer genset wired to my house, it runs most everything except the furnace, it does run the heat pump, just not the emergency backup heat. Feeds off a 1000gal propane tank. Back in 2005 it was not an inexpensive proposition, the genset itself was $7500 delivered, figure another $2500 to have it installed, inspected etc.

Like you I have a well and it's included in what the generator powers up.

Anyway, electrical power up here is cheap but in the winter it can be shaky, being able to leave town for a week or two to a warmer place without worrying about freezing pipes made it a worthwhile expense in the long run.

Except possibly for the 12VDC hack discussed above, I would say that it isn't possible with the first model Volt. I can tell you that GM isn't going to risk it's traction battery for this, or for V2G at this early stage. Using the car as a convenient "electricity bucket" is not likely to be addressed before a decade of experience just powering vehicles down the road.

Strictly speaking, the solution for using the Volt as a generator would be to use the ICE range extender in a special mode to create the external electricity required. This sidesteps the whole issue of possibly damaging the pack, and more nearly matches the actual requirement (In a prolonged power outage, when would you have opportunity to recharge again? What if power is lost at night, while the Volt is charging?).

The idea wouldn't be straight forward to implement. It would likely not be possible to use the generator's full output, since the only connector and cable available aren't capable of carrying that load (but if a higher-voltage "Level III" jack is ever added, perhaps it could). Programming would have to reassign connectors in either socket (probably on handshaking with the special cable / outlet box required to access the power. Such an external device will likely be needed to protect the car's generator from conditions possibly encountered with a makeshift, external load). Needless to say, the car's drive would also have to be disabled.

In short, this is an issue for a later model; which isn't happening without the full intention of and engineering effort at GM (and likely not in any sense with the current Volt without voiding it's warranty). I do believe that such a feature would add value to the Volt, by effectively throwing in a very robust emergency generator almost for free with the car.

Well it would not be easy, and I am sure GM has put measures in place to try and prevent this, but I do not think it would be impossible. And for sure it would definitely void the warranty. I think GM's choice not to do this is first and foremost a liability thing, plus they already had a lot on their plate just getting this revolutionary vehicle to market without worrying about the ramifications of it being used as a whole house generator. But certainly the vehicle has more than enough capacity to function as a whole house generator.

Straight from the generator is one option. However, because the Volt apparently has a DC to AC converter, it might be advantageous to tap in at that point, and this may have the added advantage of allowing the battery to act as a buffer to smooth out the load, and provide very clean electricity.

Wonder what the frequency of the Volts 120v power is?

The J1772 is definitely underpowered for such an operation, but that doesn't mean that it is impossible to tap into the Volt electrical system at some other point.

It will be interesting to see if the service manual provides any insight when it is released in April.

I have a 15kw Kholer genset wired to my house, it runs most everything except the furnace, it does run the heat pump, just not the emergency backup heat. Feeds off a 1000gal propane tank. Back in 2005 it was not an inexpensive proposition, the genset itself was $7500 delivered, figure another $2500 to have it installed, inspected etc.

Like you I have a well and it's included in what the generator powers up.

Anyway, electrical power up here is cheap but in the winter it can be shaky, being able to leave town for a week or two to a warmer place without worrying about freezing pipes made it a worthwhile expense in the long run.

There is such a thing as a whole-house generator; there are units which run off natural gas and cut in automatically. These are very expensive, professionally installed items.

I would place a Volt-genset-derived generator somewhere in between the teeny portables and the stationary pro-installed jobs.

Keep in mind also, the difference between an EPA rated automobile engine and a buzzy portable in terms of pollution (including noise). Unlike a standby generator, the Volt would have the additional benefit of being run on a schedule ("maintenance mode"); and would be much more reliable in an emergency than some seldom-used portable. It also has it's own fuel tank, so there would be no need for hauling gas cans in your trunk: just drive to the local station, fill up, and drive back.

There isKeep in mind also, the difference between an EPA rated automobile engine and a buzzy portable in terms of pollution (including noise). Unlike a standby generator, the Volt would have the additional benefit of being run on a schedule ("maintenance mode"); and would be much more reliable in an emergency than some seldom-used portable. It also has it's own fuel tank, so there would be no need for hauling gas cans in your trunk: just drive to the local station, fill up, and drive back.

My Kholer standby includes an "excerciser" program that fires it up every couple of weeks or so, similar to maintenence mode.

The last portable generator I used for backup I converted from gasoline to propane. US Carburetion sells a kit that even me with 10 thumbs was able to install. The generator ran so much better on propane it was remarkable. Much easier to start, in fact it always started on the first "pull". No need to worry about storing gasoline with shelf-life issues or concern that the gas stations themselves may not have power to pump gas. Anyway, it fed off a 500gal propane tank that was not used in the winter since it's primary purpose was to run a pool heater during the shoulder seasons. Had I lived on a NG area I'd have converted it to that fuel.

I think Northern Tool and others sell tri-fuel generators now so you can take your pick of fuel source.

Never mind the ICE. I am much more interested in using the Volt battery as a whole-house UPS and as a time-shifting energy device. Charge the battery from the grid at night when it is cheap and then use that energy during the day when the grid is expensive. If some charge is still left over, feed it back into the grid during peak hours...

Never mind the ICE. I am much more interested in using the Volt battery as a whole-house UPS and as a time-shifting energy device. Charge the battery from the grid at night when it is cheap and then use that energy during the day when the grid is expensive. If some charge is still left over, feed it back into the grid during peak hours...

Probably cheaper to just go buy some batteries in that case.

Here's what I would use if doing the 12VDC option from the rear of the car that I discussed above:

http://www.amazon.com/Power-Bright-PW1100-12-Inverter-1100/dp/B000NIG2FG

At that price it's almost certainly a modified sine wave inverter, which is fine for many appliances. Some will either not work at all, or perform poorly with such a waveform. A true sine wave inverter will cost quite a bit more.

Yes, it's a modified sine wave inverter. My understanding is most all appliances these days work fine with modified sine inverters, with a few abstract exceptions that don't seem as important in a power outage. I found this claim online, though you can find any stance you want to on the internet these days ;):

"Most appliances such as TVs, Lighting, stereos, computers, inkjet printers and power tools run find on modified sine wave power.

About the only appliances that you may see a problem with are some Laser printers and some of the cheaper types of battery powered tool chargers. In fact 95% of the inverters in RV's today are of the modified sine wave type."

The inverter suggested here can draw 100 Amps from the 12 V supply. Will the 360 volt to 12 volt converter in the Volt handle 100 or more Amps? The battery voltage will proably not hold above 12 V for not more than 5 minutes with that high of a load.

Even with this 1,100 Watt model will not even power one hair dryer let alone part of a house.

This idea of using an electric car to help power a house is not new, I remember reading something about 10 years ago in connection with a fuel cell concept car.o it

What GM would have to charge for a designed option to do this would proably be as much or more than a stand alone generator would cost with similar capabilities.

For peek shaving the previous sugestion of using deep cycle SLA batteries for storage is proably more cost effective Assuming size and weight is not a concern. But to be able to acomplish this seamlessley would be cost prohibitive because you would need sign a sign wave inverter capabile of syncing with the line like solar systems use, so why not just go all the way and get a solar cell system?

The inverter suggested here can draw 100 Amps from the 12 V supply. Will the 360 volt to 12 volt converter in the Volt handle 100 or more Amps?

According to WOT, the APM (which does the conversion to 12V) can handle 175 amps. See my prior posting in this thread for a link to his posting.

The inverter suggested here can draw 100 Amps from the 12 V supply. Will the 360 volt to 12 volt converter in the Volt handle 100 or more Amps? The battery voltage will proably not hold above 12 V for not more than 5 minutes with that high of a load.

Even with this 1,100 Watt model will not even power one hair dryer let alone part of a house.

What GM would have to charge for a designed option to do this would proably be as much or more than a stand alone generator would cost with similar capabilities.



Exactly the 12v system is a "no go" for a whole house generator.

And yes a GM option would be quite expensive no doubt. Yet it seems if GM hasn't made it too difficult tapping into the Volt's system shouldn't be mission impossible.

Anyone been able to find even a rudimentary schematic for the Volt's electric system?

Anyone been able to find even a rudimentary schematic for the Volt's electric system?

Probably going to be few and far between, at least until the service manual (http://www.helminc.com/helm/Result.asp?Style=helm&Mfg=GMC&Make=CHV&Model=VOLT&Year=2011&Category=&Keyword=&Module=&selected_media=) becomes available. The website (http://www.helminc.com) says it should be available April 15th 2011, for $150.

You wouldn't have to tie it to the home breaker. Just have an extension cord with some plugs to run a fan, lights, maybe the fridge intermittently. Maybe it could be an app or another mode of operation. Why not use a perfectly good battery/generator for emergencies?. I currently have some deep cycle auto batteries in the house and inverters in case of short power outages. The Volt would be much better and perhaps could last a week or two. I believe I have read on another thread that the power module cuts off the flow from the battery after ten minutes when the car is off, but maybe if the car is "on" that would be overridden.?