From the WSJ:

"The biofuels revolution that promised to reduce America's dependence on foreign oil is fizzling out.

Two-thirds of U.S. biodiesel production capacity now sits unused, reports the National Biodiesel Board. Biodiesel, a crucial part of government efforts to develop alternative fuels for trucks and factories, has been hit hard by the recession and falling oil prices."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125133578177462487.html

I hope the government doesn't try to fix the situation by artificially jacking up the price of dino fuel. One bad idea chasing another.

Oil prices will rise again and the dormant facilities will become active again.

It does appear that hybrid techs will retard fuel demand growth, so higher oil prices will resume at a later date.

It does appear that hybrid techs will retard fuel demand growth, so higher oil prices will resume at a later date.

Not by much, 99% of the cars in the US, and especially the world are just regular ICE vehicles, and the 1% that are hybrid are just using slightly less fuel per mile, but that's offset by the fact that these people choose to drive more with their lower cost of fuel.

One problem with Bio diesel is that there is such a small amount of diesel cars in the states. Should the country start thinking of exporting diesel to European countries?

We need a bio fuel that is scalable and competitive with fossil fuels and once it becomes a commodity, the price of fossil fuels can be raised with taxes or whatever similar to what the EU is doing.

From the WSJ:

I hope the government doesn't try to fix the situation by artificially jacking up the price of dino fuel. One bad idea chasing another.






Yeah, that would be a bad idea. I like global economic rollercoasters! -sarcasm-

Don't worry, there is just too much power in oil for any pre-collapse change. Just this week Saudi Arabia was bitching that our oil independence stance was a bad thing and we are only doing it to win elections and political points. Make them mad and we are going to be waving to each other as we pass riding our bikes.

If you think about it, how are OPEC nations going to handle the world transitioning away from petroleum? When was the last time you planned a vacation to Saudi Arabia or purchased an automobile from Iran? Perhaps dinned at an Iraqi restaurant? Only a few countries are preparing for peak oil. Dubai is doing great and I would love to visit. That is if the entire airline industry doesn't collapse along with petroleum production.

That's why I recommend that alternative energy promoters have ready their post-peak-oil plans. Don't waste too much time trying to win over decision makers that have multiple well funded lobbyists working against you. Just be ready when the **** hits the fan.

When we hit that next collapse cycle after oil demand reaches the level it did back in July 2008 and forces oil prices to knock the world out, again, we need to have things ready for the next wave of empire-ending stimulus funding. No, building parks is not going to do it for us. No, working to re-start our economy for exponential growth is not going to hold this time. We need to bite the bullet and work toward transitioning to a far more sustainable economy.

Texas,

I worry when I agree with you too much.

omnimoeish: "... but that's offset by the fact that these people choose to drive more with their lower cost of fuel."

Got some authoritative source for that? Nobody I know bought a Prius so that they could drive more.

And "slightly less?" Try half. Especially in the city.

They need to get some quality standards in place, in order to get the OEMs on board with bio-diesel. Currently GM only permits a maximum of 5% biodiesel (B5) in their Duramax diesels or else you void your warranty. Apparently modern common rail injection pressure pumps don't care for it much (wear) and it tends to cause accelerated plugging of the Diesel Particulate Filters neccesitating more frequent regeneration cycles, using much more fuel. (than they already do, due to the the reduction in BTUs per pound compared to regular dino-diesel)

I have a buddy who tried to run locally produced B20 in his Powerstroke and it when it got down to near freezing during a freaky cold snap in October last year, it practically solidified in his fuel tank and his truck wouldnt run. He had to pay $400 to have the dealer drop his tank and clean it all outta there.
WOT

They need to get some quality standards in place, in order to get the OEMs on board with bio-diesel. Currently GM only permits a maximum of 5% biodiesel (B5) in their Duramax diesels or else you void your warranty. Apparently modern common rail injection pressure pumps don't care for it much (wear) and it tends to cause accelerated plugging of the Diesel Particulate Filters neccesitating more frequent regeneration cycles, using much more fuel. (than they already do, due to the the reduction in BTUs per pound compared to regular dino-diesel)

I have a buddy who tried to run locally produced B20 in his Powerstroke and it when it got down to near freezing during a freaky cold snap in October last year, it practically solidified in his fuel tank and his truck wouldnt run. He had to pay $400 to have the dealer drop his tank and clean it all outta there.
WOT







Yet biodiesel has been successfully tested in airliners, at altitude.

I again cry BS, WOT. Are you sure your "buddy" wasn't just running filtered vegetable oil? That will solidify when it gets cold. Perhaps you can give us some specifications for biodiesel compared to plain diesel, especially temperature ranges of operation.

Note: the entire world would run very well, when compared to current fossil fuel based diesel, if we just used algae to produce biodiesel. It’s sustainable and can eventually produce far more energy than the ground ever could. When and if this technology becomes the low cost energy alternative remains to be seen.

Are there proposed or published standards/specs for biodiesel? News to me. I just know much of it doesnt meet ASTM D975 or anything like that. (How many farmers do you know would pay to have their homebrew bio-diesel "certfied" as long as their tractor will burn it)

To be honest I dont know what type of biodiesel it was in terms of how it was made, (vegetable, animal, algea?) and I personally didnt see it go "solid". (that might have been a poor choice of words) But it apprently did stratify in the tank and thicken up after sitting in the cold for a couple days.

Then once he tried to start it congealed around the filter sock in his tank and then wouldnt pick up enough fuel to run. Once they drained his tanks, replaced his filters, and filled it with fresh diesel he was back on the road. I told him if they had just left it in the shop for a few hours, it might have loosened up enough on it's own- but in the end they raped him for $400. LOL

Again, I guess it might depend a lot on how it is made, and that was really my point. No %*(^ standards
WOT

omnimoeish: "... but that's offset by the fact that these people choose to drive more with their lower cost of fuel."

Got some authoritative source for that? Nobody I know bought a Prius so that they could drive more.

And "slightly less?" Try half. Especially in the city.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2009/07/68494710/1

Apparently hybrid drivers also get more tickets, but that makes sense seeings how they are driving more.

I don't think your point is proven. The underlying article admits there are a lot of unkowns. In particular, the traffic tickets appear to have more to do with the location of the majority of owners. One also can't rule out police targeting.

There may be something here but it smells like the famed (or infamous) CNW Marketing "study" on hybrids, which is widely quoted and more widely wrong.

I don't think your point is proven. The underlying article admits there are a lot of unkowns. In particular, the traffic tickets appear to have more to do with the location of the majority of owners. One also can't rule out police targeting.

There may be something here but it smells like the famed (or infamous) CNW Marketing "study" on hybrids, which is widely quoted and more widely wrong.

There's really know way to figure out which is coming first, the chicken or the egg. Do hybrid drivers drive more because the fuel is cheaper, or do people who drive more buy cars with cheaper fuel costs? Probably about 50/50 if I had to guess.