: First problem (12V battery dead)



wizkid057
05-15-2012, 09:05 PM
So, left for the weekend on Friday, plugged in the Volt, and took another vehicle on a road trip. Returned Sunday, slept, got up for work Monday.

Well, the Volt didn't listen to the key chain remote when I told it to unlock the doors. Door buttons dead too.
Popped the door with the physical key (for the first time ever) and power button was unresponsive, no lights, etc.

Figuring that the 12V battery had died, I popped the hood and threw a 30A charger on it. After a few moments things started coming to life again. After a bit (~15 minutes), I hit the power button. The screen stayed on the "Initializing..." screen for quite a while (minute maybe?) then I heard the ICE attempt to start, and everything died again.

So, I left it sit a little longer, tried again, and it fired up this time. ICE started (because the hood was up) and I disconnected the 12V charger and the J1772 charger and closed the hood. ICE stopped after a few moments, gauges showed a full EV battery.

Check engine and red battery shaped indicators were on. Pic:

5745

Called OnStar, they said that I had a few trouble issues and I scheduled service for that afternoon.

Car drove fine.

Dealer said they were going to order a new 12V battery for me, and cleared the trouble codes.

Left the 12V battery with a trickle charger on it last night just in case, since the new battery wont be installed until Wednesday.

Well, this morning I had the check engine indicator on again. OnStar told me three issues this time. Got the codes for two of them... P1E00 (Something about the Hybrid electrical system not functioning adequately), P04C4 (Fuel Filling Door issue?), and another code from Vehicle Integration that for whatever reason he wasnt able to supply. Forwarded this info to the dealer, since I'm going there tomorrow anyway.

Not sure on the whole Fuel door thing... haven't refueled in over two weeks, so, no idea whats going on there. I opened it, opened the cap, closed etc and they say its still troubled.

Plugged in my cheap ELM327 ODBII USB interface and used ScanMaster to check the various ECUs reported, but, no useful data since the codes aren't recognized by ScanMaster. (Same data OnStar gave, basically.)

Just wanted to share my first problem with the Volt. I assume its nothing major, probably just a faulty mini-12V battery... which in my opinion is undersized...

-wk

DonC
05-15-2012, 09:17 PM
You're not the first person to report a dead battery. Was the Volt plugged in when you went on your trip? And did you notice whether everything on the center console was off? It might be your battery but we've had several people with dead 12v batteries who definitely didn't have a bad battery. Could be an exception though.

Note the battery is probably not undersized given that starting doesn't involve cranking. (I think the Leaf battery is so small you can't use it to jump start another car).

saghost
05-15-2012, 09:33 PM
Actually, the Volt's battery is 60 Ah - exactly the same as my VW Eos. We're also told that the Volt has one of the lowest power off drains in the industry. As mentioned above, there have been half a dozen incidents on this forum of people finding the 12V battery dead - neither we nor GM are sure of the cause. Some of the earlier incidents appeared to involve Bluetooth calls that may not have ended properly.

A few questions, to try to find common patterns:
Which model year/what month of production is your Volt?
Nav? Non-Nav? My Link?
How long have you had the Volt?
Do you have a Bluetooth phone linked?
Were you on the phone the last time you drove the Volt?
Did you do anything different on the last trip or before leaving for your roadtrip compared to your past habits (that you remember)?

WopOnTour watches these forums fairly closely, and can give out definitions and explanations for your trouble codes. As I remember from past discussion, P1E00 is a "master caution" type - it sets in addition to the other codes whenever there's a problem in the hybrid system. He's also mentioned in the past that a low 12V battery can result in a lot of codes, which may not in fact be problems, but merely false errors resulting from the low Bus voltage.

wizkid057
05-15-2012, 09:52 PM
Going down the list...

Yes, I had the car plugged in to the 240V charger all weekend... although I've read that this doesn't help the 12V battery.
When the car was dead, yes, everything was off. No lights, no LCD glow, no indicators, no blue power button light, nothing. No response to any buttons, etc.

As for model, I have a 2012 with Nav, Bose, etc. (See sig). Not sure the year/month of production. Voltstats shows me as #2012-09289.

I've had the car about 2.5 months. I've racked on 7400 miles in that time frame due to my lengthy commutes. (I do get to charge at my destination, usually, and sometimes using 240V).

I do have a Bluetooth phone linked, but, I had not made or received any calls on it prior to parking it for the weekend.

Didn't do anything different, really. Just plugged the car in as usual and let it be.

I do have a charging schedule set for Time-of-Use metering to charge in the late evening, but, I doubt that's related.

As for the battery being undersized... *shrugs* Just my opinion. Not sure what could have drained it so quickly. From the time I plugged it in on Friday to the time I got up to leave on Monday was only about 64 hours.

-wk

saghost
05-15-2012, 09:56 PM
As for the battery being undersized... *shrugs* Just my opinion. Not sure what could have drained it so quickly. From the time I plugged it in on Friday to the time I got up to leave on Monday was only about 64 hours.

-wk

Our current belief is that the center console screen and some of the driving electronics aren't shutting down for some reason. IF that's the case, discharging a battery in 12 hours wouldn't be hard, let alone 64.

I don't have any answers, I'm just hoping that if we put enough of these incidents together we'll find enough commonalities for GM to find the bug. :)

wizkid057
05-15-2012, 10:00 PM
did you notice whether everything on the center console was off?

Little under the weather today... I interpreted this as if you were asking if the center console was off when I found it dead.

As for if it was off when I stopped the car, yes. I actually hit the power button habitually to turn off the radio/nav/etc when parking the car and it stops at the Volt logo screen, which disappears when I open the driver's side door after powering off.


Our current belief is that the center console screen and some of the driving electronics aren't shutting down for some reason. IF that's the case, discharging a battery in 12 hours wouldn't be hard, let alone 64.

I don't have any answers, I'm just hoping that if we put enough of these incidents together we'll find enough commonalities for GM to find the bug. :)

Yup, thats why I figured I'd share. :)


Seems there should be some software-based fail-safe for this problem, especially when the car is plugged into AC power. For example, logic defined as: If the 12V battery voltage drops below a threshold AND the charge cord is connected, activate charger and the DC-DC converter to boost the 12V battery and possibly throw a trouble code stating that this had to happen.

Just an idea...

dwl
05-15-2012, 10:13 PM
I always thought it would make sense to use that big old battery in the Volt to jump the little battery in situations like this. :) But maybe the circuitry would be more complicated and/or bulky than I think it would be.

saghost
05-15-2012, 10:19 PM
I always thought it would make sense to use that big old battery in the Volt to jump the little battery in situations like this. :) But maybe the circuitry would be more complicated and/or bulky than I think it would be.

It's a catch-22. The big battery is locked out for safety behind a set of contactors (high powered relays) and only allowed out to play when its nanny computers says it can. But the nanny computers are powered off the 12V battery, so they can't decide the battery is safe and open the contactors to deliver the 12V power.

What I'd like to see (and don't know for a fact isn't present, actually,) is the ability to slave off of A/C power. The charger module has its own 12V source, generated from wall power, which could potentially unlock this mess and allow the car to start.

Next time a car is found dead near a plug, before trying anything else to start it, unplug it (if it was plugged in,) and plug it in again. If the designers were as clever as they were in so many other corners of the design, it might wake up. :)

dwl
05-15-2012, 10:28 PM
Or that. :) Just so much electricity everywhere. Seems like such a strange problem to have.

mikeg3
05-15-2012, 11:49 PM
Seems there should be some software-based fail-safe for this problem, especially when the car is plugged into AC power. For example, logic defined as: If the 12V battery voltage drops below a threshold AND the charge cord is connected, activate charger and the DC-DC converter to boost the 12V battery and possibly throw a trouble code stating that this had to happen.

Just an idea...

The charge port on the left side of the car is connected to an On Board Charge Module on the right side of the car. The OBCM has a high voltage output to charge the main battery and a separate low voltage output to charge the 12V battery. However, when the main battery is fully charged, the OBCM stops completely and the 12V battery is on its own.

There is a path from the main battery through the Auxiliary Power Module to the low voltage rail to the 12V battery. However, the APM is not used to maintain the 12V battery in a powered-off Volt.

Each device that can connect to the main battery, the APM, the OBCM, and the Traction Inverter, can only connect through contactors that keep the high voltage under computer control. Without low voltage, the computers can't operate, and the contactors stay open. Supplying power to the jumper terminals under the hood provides low voltage so that the computers can operate. At that point, pressing the Volt's power on button will close the APM's contactor so that it can power the computers and start charging the 12V battery.

See the Volt Owner's Manual page 10-81 (2011) or 10-70 (2012).

DonC
05-16-2012, 12:46 AM
As for if it was off when I stopped the car, yes. I actually hit the power button habitually to turn off the radio/nav/etc when parking the car and it stops at the Volt logo screen, which disappears when I open the driver's side door after powering off.Just so we understand, you hit the main power button which turns everything off, right?

The choices seem to be: (1) console doesn't turn off so there are parasitic losses which deplete the battery; (2) something stays on after charging is complete which depletes the battery; or (3) battery is bad. Not every dead 12v has to have the same cause. We have a couple of reports of not being able to turn the console off but it may just be that your battery is bad. That may in fact be the case because usually the report is the Volt springs to life immediately while you're reporting a more labored process.

FYI the 12v does charge during charging.

Hope you get this sorted. Since we've gotten the electrics the ICE just sits and we end up with a dead battery fairly frequently. A complete PITA.

wizkid057
05-16-2012, 09:45 AM
Just so we understand, you hit the main power button which turns everything off, right?


Both, actually. I turn the radio and nav off with the round power button on the center stack as a pull in the driveway usually. Then I park and hit the shiny blue button to power down the car.



FYI the 12v does charge during charging.


During charging, but, not after a full charge, as I've read many times on this forum.

Heading to the dealership in a few hours, so, we'll see what they say. I already know they're replacing the 12V battery, so, doubt they know more than we do at this point.

-wk

DCFusor
05-16-2012, 02:55 PM
Has anyone had multiple failures like this on the same car yet? Seen a few dead 12v batteries - and it would have been soo easy to add a trickle charge to the big charger that ran even after the main charge is done it's a silly oversight IMO. But would a passive ammeter hack on the 12v system do anyone any good? Wouldn't be real hard to implement, as the wiring back there is really simple to stick a shunt and good ol moving coil meter into.

You know, it might not be that it ran down during being plugged in. It could be it's just failing to charge when it should - the symptom would be the same - eventual dead 12v battery. You might pay attention to the incandescent dome lights if you're not put in leds to see if they are getting dim...when they shouldn't be. Maybe a failure to charge when the car is on or the big battery is charging is the actual fault here. Until we tag and bag this one - we simply don't know.

raj7
05-16-2012, 03:17 PM
I had this happen to my prius, my wife did not close the hatch back door and the light was on for over 48hrs and the battery died, but after I jump started it did drive fine. So I always lock the car when I leave to make sure all the lights are off and doors are locked properly

wizkid057
05-16-2012, 04:26 PM
Well, just returned from the dealership with no CEL/MIL finally.

They replaced the 12V battery with a new one. The technician said that he tested the original 12V battery and it had a dead cell... this diagnosis is also reflected in the service/warranty work paperwork.

I won't really be able to test if this solved the issue any time soon, though, because I drive the car every single day and it never sits for more than 14 hours before being driven again. This past weekend was a rare exception. (Girlfriend's Prius-C gets better all-gas highway mileage than the Volt, so, we took her's.)

-wk

dwl
05-16-2012, 04:31 PM
Did the tech say that he thought the dead cell might have caused this? Or just that there was a problem with the battery so it needed to be replaced anyway. And hopefully that was somehow a contributing factor.

wizkid057
05-16-2012, 04:34 PM
Did the tech say that he thought the dead cell might have caused this? Or just that there was a problem with the battery so it needed to be replaced anyway. And hopefully that was somehow a contributing factor.

He said that the 12V battery being bad and flat lining over the weekend was the root cause of all of the issues/trouble codes. Basically the charging system had yet to be able to bring the 12V battery back up to a full charge, which was throwing some code with the electrical system and the few other issues were due to the under-voltage on the 12V system due to the dead cell.

We'll see I guess.

dwl
05-16-2012, 04:38 PM
I'd buy that explanation. Doesn't sound like he was BSing you to me.

Good luck!

wizkid057
05-16-2012, 04:42 PM
I'd buy that explanation. Doesn't sound like he was BSing you to me.

Good luck!

Yeah, I believe it. Just a quick note, while I think most of the dealer techs probably wouldn't know enough about the Volt on the service side of things to really diagnose an issue like this, I think that my dealership has the upper hand on this one. They were recently named the "Largest Volt dealer in the country"... and it's pretty obvious, as they have over a dozen Volt's on the lot.

Classic Chevrolet in Maple Shade, NJ (Moorestown, NJ)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3877763/2012-05-14%2015.37.27.jpg
(one section of Volts)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3877763/2012-05-14%2015.46.05.jpg
(My Volt in the foreground)

Not trying to advertise for them or anything, but, I just wanted to explain why I feel they know what they're doing. :)

Also, I know they've done the battery reinforcement work on dozens of Volt's. I've actually seen a different Volt in one of their service bays with the HV battery removed almost every time I've been there. Going to be having mine done next week probably.

-wk

DonC
05-16-2012, 05:23 PM
It seems that you had a bad battery rather than something else. Love all those Volts! Thanks for the pics.


Has anyone had multiple failures like this on the same car yet? I think the survey indicated one person but no details. One person said they had one failure and "caught" another -- the console hadn't turned off and they had to turn off their phone to get it to turn off.

Obviously until this is sorted it seems the wise course would be to follow the OP's practice and to turn off the console, and make sure it's off, before powering the car down. That won't help if it's a failure during charging but it will eliminate one possible source of the problem.

WopOnTour
05-16-2012, 07:50 PM
Wow. Two on the exact same weekend. That's nuts! Could this be the result of moon phases or solar flares? lol j/k
Obviously there is "something" to this dead battery issue. Whether it's bluetooth or some other combination of factors it's important that the incident at least be reported to your Volt Advisor, or better yet have a dealer check it out and get a "case" active with Volt techncial assistance.
There just hasnt been enough of these occurances in the wild to get much going on it.
WOT

cnicholson
05-16-2012, 11:14 PM
Wow. Two on the exact same weekend. That's nuts! Could this be the result of moon phases or solar flares? lol j/k

OPEC hackers cracked the code on ONStar and are demoralizing EV buyers....

sallarry
05-16-2012, 11:20 PM
We had our 12V die about a week after taking delivery of 2011 demo Volt last month. It was parked in a parking structure during the day and not hooked up to a charger. We jumped it and did not take it into a dealer. It has not happened since in the last month (keeping fingers crossed).

WopOnTour
05-16-2012, 11:44 PM
OPEC hackers cracked the code on ONStar and are demoralizing EV buyers....LOL nice one... keep the humor (and the faith) cn
Just trust that it's not being taken for granted.
We WILL get to the bottom of it

WOT

wizkid057
05-17-2012, 04:02 PM
I figure it's probably something pretty silly. I think I am going to put a shunt between the battery and the car and use a data logger to monitor the current drawn... when I get the time. Might help find the problem if it resurfaces.

-wk

SXBB
05-18-2012, 12:22 AM
I'm glad to report that after a week of being plugged in while I was out of town, my Volt started right up!

Dan97408
05-18-2012, 01:29 AM
If you don't push up all the way on the shifter when parking the shift to park switch won't be In the off position.
The computer will be running all night on the the 12 volt battery even though the car is plugged in. This will drain
The 12 volt battery. It happened to me. Gm sent an engineer to my dealer witch found out that was the cause.

Cord
05-18-2012, 04:12 AM
That's interesting !
What would be the indications that this is actually happening with the switch ?

I would think the parking breaks would not be able to set ?

-------
AMP shunt sounds like an idea- ( I have a few old LINK-10 systems with a 100 amp shunt but no way to record the data)

I was going to just use my clamp on amp meter and aim the smart phone camera at the digital meter and use facetime or SKYPE.

donstim
05-18-2012, 10:40 AM
[QUOTE=Cord;150119]
I would think the parking breaks would not be able to set ?
QUOTE]

The parking brake should be set [B]before[B] you shift into park.

cnicholson
05-18-2012, 10:55 AM
If you don't push up all the way on the shifter when parking the shift to park switch won't be In the off position.

FYI, that was not my issue. I always wait for the honks/blinks and solid green indicator showing charging. It won't *START* charging if "ON."

AySz88
05-18-2012, 02:47 PM
LOL nice one... keep the humor (and the faith) cn
Just trust that it's not being taken for granted.
We WILL get to the bottom of it

WOT

No idea if this is related, but a few months ago, I noticed what could be a related bug or race condition when using Siri over bluetooth on my mother's iPhone 4S, when giving the command "Call (someone in contact list)". This causes the iPhone to try to rapidly disconnect the "call" with Siri and immediately initiate the new call. It turns out that sometimes, the bluetooth in the car fails to switch away from Siri, leading to a silent and broken connection, even though both sides think that the bluetooth connection is still active. I have to manually end the bluetooth connection on both the iPhone (switch to speakerphone) and the car (end call) to get the bluetooth to work again.

Hope that helps?

montgom626
07-15-2012, 03:06 PM
Just so we understand, you hit the main power button which turns everything off, right?



I thought it automatically shutdown after 10 minutes?
Bob

montgom626
07-15-2012, 03:13 PM
If you don't push up all the way on the shifter when parking the shift to park switch won't be In the off position.
The computer will be running all night on the the 12 volt battery even though the car is plugged in. This will drain
The 12 volt battery. It happened to me. Gm sent an engineer to my dealer witch found out that was the cause.


Any indication when this failure to engage occurs? What would i notice if the shift to park is not fully engaged?
Bob

Murlan
09-05-2012, 10:31 AM
I had this same problem about three months ago. The car was towed into dealership. They had it for three days. Not sure what they did but the car ran fine until yesterday morning . . . Same problem. Car is at the dealership now. They have a GM engineer on the job by phone. Near as I can tell nobody really knows what is going on. It's annoying of course, but we love the car and I chalk it up to being an early adopter.

DonC
09-05-2012, 12:34 PM
Sorry to hear about your issue. This won't prevent the problem, but you might want to get one of those small battery chargers. That way you'd be able to just get the car up and running and drive to the dealer.

mark4090
10-19-2012, 10:05 AM
We just experienced the dead battery issue yesterday morning after overnight charge. Nothing, including the key fob would work. Called Volt advisor and she said something must have been left on. Can't imagine what. Anyhow, I said I'd like to use our portable charger to get it back going, but didn't know where to charge it from. SHe had to put me on hold for a while to find out. Turns out, it had to be charged from the back under the panel that covers the 110 charger. Well, due to the hatch being locked, I had to put the seats forward and crawl back to lift the panel to expose the battery posts. I asked the Volt advisor if a tow truck driver would be willing to do the same thing. I doubt it. Anyway, I set the charger at 10amp for about 30 minutes or so at which time the car finally had enough juice to power up. At that point, I opened the hood to start the engine thinking it would finish charging for about an hour. I put the car back in the garage and attached the 110 starter/charger which displayed approx. 50% charge. I reconnected the charger for an additional couple hours until the needle read full charge. I was not advised to have the car serviced or anything. There we several error messages coming up as the car initialized. I couldn't keep up with them. The car is running today, but should Onstar maybe connect to it for diagnostics or should it be in for service? We'd hate to go through that again, especially on the road.

Volt #951/2011

Steverino
10-19-2012, 02:46 PM
should Onstar maybe connect to it for diagnostics or should it be in for service?
Volt #951/2011

Why not? It comes with car. Be ready with pen and paper to write down the error codes (if any) and post them here.

However I suspect something was left running, which won't produce an error code. Where you using bluetooth to connect your phone before you left the car?

Cord
10-19-2012, 03:11 PM
Seems like you did all the right steps. Guess we can't have an inside hatch back release or the kids would roll out.

the 3 most common car not able to move problems.

1. out or gas -- there is a gas gauge in the car
2. Flat tire -- there is a gauge in the car and a air pump
3. low/dead 12 volt battery -- dash indicator but NO GAUGE. ( I use a power port volt/temperature monitor)

Its very important that all driver know how to handle these items.

AND you charge the 12 volt battery from the FRONT.

SolarJoe
10-19-2012, 03:29 PM
Where you able to find out what the problem was?

Steverino
10-19-2012, 07:44 PM
AND you charge the 12 volt battery from the FRONT.

From the Owners Manual:
Jump Starting the Volt
If the Volt won't start, the 12‐volt
battery may be run down. To jump
start the Volt use the underhood
remote positive (+) and negative (−)
terminals.

SuaVolt
03-28-2013, 08:17 PM
I had this experience twice since I purchased my 2012 Volt with Nav in August 2012. Woke up to go to work (after having the car plugged in overnight) the car wouldn't unlock and also unable to power the vehicle.

Fulgerite
03-28-2013, 08:25 PM
My theory is... You mistakenly left the car on. Very easy to do. Ran the battery down.

TSquare
03-28-2013, 10:42 PM
My theory is... You mistakenly left the car on. Very easy to do. Ran the battery down.

Don't forget that when the battery runs down, the ICE starts. So when you come back, either the car is running on gas or it has stopped because it has also run out of gas.

Chevrolet Customer Svc
03-29-2013, 12:52 PM
I had this experience twice since I purchased my 2012 Volt with Nav in August 2012. Woke up to go to work (after having the car plugged in overnight) the car wouldn't unlock and also unable to power the vehicle.

SuaVolt,

Sorry to hear about the two no starts. Have you been in contact with the Volt Advisor Team for any of them? If it were to happen again please call 877-486-5846 and speak with any of our Advisors.

-Ian Chevrolet Volt Customer Service

WopOnTour
03-29-2013, 01:03 PM
I had this experience twice since I purchased my 2012 Volt with Nav in August 2012. Woke up to go to work (after having the car plugged in overnight) the car wouldn't unlock and also unable to power the vehicle.Make sure the dealership checks and re-torques:
- all fasteners in the junction block above the brake booster (aka the B+ "boost" points)
- all fasteners at the 12V battery including battery fuse block (mounted on top of the battery and connected to B+)
- main ground for 14V Power Module (aka Accessory Power Module or DC-DC Converter)
*Have seen some poor connections here from factory that manifest into this condition at some point

WopOnTour

PS> I'm going to create and post a summary of these 12V fasteners and torques in case owners want to double-check them themselves...

mocnarf
09-10-2013, 12:09 PM
Yes, I think GM/Chevy needs to re-think the way the 12 volt system works. I too have had the dead 12 volt battery issue. Why the 12 volt battery isn't charged when the volt is plugged in is beyond my understanding. Also, I would like to have more information available about the 12 system, battery heath info of some kind. And while I am requesting improvements, I would like the instrument panel to show the amount of KW remaining in the main battery in addition to the mileage estimate.

edk
09-28-2013, 11:51 AM
I, unfortunately, recently joined the Volt's dead battery club. I went out to my car one morning at the end of August to go to work and it was completely dead. I couldn't even open the trunk. It had been sitting overnight and should have had about 20 miles left on the charge. Once the tow truck operator got it jumped, I noticed that the batteries were completely drained and it was running on gas. The dealer charged the 12 volt battery, checked it out, couldn't duplicate the problem and gave it back. I was told by the dealer that others had the same issue over the past month, but haven't come back - yet. I've had the car for 16 months and have absolutely loved it, but now I'm really concerned about how reliable it is. If I go away for the weekend, will I be able to get back home? Does anyone have any idea what is going on? I don't use the bluetooth, so that has nothing to do with it.

somms
09-28-2013, 12:34 PM
Why the 12 volt battery isn't charged when the volt is plugged in is beyond my understanding.

Funny part of this is that the service manual seems to indicate that under certain instances, 12V battery is being 'sustained' while vehicle is plugged in!?:confused:

Taken from pg 4194 of the service manual linked below in my signature:


Accessory DC Power Control Module Description and Operation

Location

The 14 V Power Module, also called the Accessory DC Power Control Module, is located in the rear trunk compartment underneath the floor stowage trim panel. It is attached to the chassis with four fasteners and connected to a plastic cooling duct. The 14 V Power Module has a high-voltage pigtail that passes through the floor of the rear compartment and connects to a high voltage cable that comes from the hybrid battery pack. Also connected to the 14 V Power Module are the 12 V cables + positive and - negative, and a signal connector for serial data.

Operating Functions

The 14 V Power Module is an electronic device that takes the place of the generator on a traditional vehicle. On a hybrid or electric vehicle the 14 V power module converts high voltage (300 V) direct current (DC) to low voltage (12 V) DC for accessory electrical operation and to charge the 12 volt battery.

Normally, the 14 V power module only supplies 12 volts DC when the vehicle is under a normal drive cycle. However there are certain instances when the vehicle is being charged through a standard wall socket where the 14 V power module operation is required to sustain the 12 volt battery.

The 14 V power module is capable of supplying up to 180 Amps of 12 volt DC.