I bought my Volt (“Evey”) three weeks ago, and I am starting to have the some fleeting doubts about whether I made the right decision. Today is the third straight Monday I have been to the dealer to get something fixed. The first issue was the A/C not working. Refrigerant was never put in the system, so the dealer charged it. Last Monday, I posted about the brake grinding/vibration issue I am having. It seems to come and go, but the problem still isn’t resolved. Those issues are relatively minor compared to the latest problem. It started yesterday afternoon, when the check engine light came on. I called OnStar, and they saw error codes that indicated there was an issue with the temperature management for the traction battery. The Volt Advisor I talked to said the car was safe to drive to the dealer in the morning.

Last night I went to start Evey. The initializing screen was up for a long while, and when the instrument display came up, the battery charge indicator was missing. Evey wouldn’t move when shifted into drive or reverse, and also wouldn’t power down. Every time I pressed the power button, the initializing screen came back up. Another Volt Advisor recommended that I walk 200 feet from the vehicle with the key fob, and then walk back to try to shut it down. That didn’t seem to work, but sitting in the car, wrapping the key fob in aluminum foil, and then pressing the power button did allow me to successfully power it down.

A flatbed came this morning and extracted Evey from my garage. It was not fun driving across town with a brand new Volt on the back of a tow truck. We will see what the dealer has to say today. I know my experience so far is very different from that of most of you on the forum, so I am hoping this can be resolved quickly and I can get back to enjoying my new car!

5374

Update 4 days later...
DTCs:
P1EBE
P0D21
P0AF8
P1EC6

Cause: failure in "drive motor battery wire junction block relay"

Wow. You've had some really really bad luck. I'd probably be thinking the same thing if I were in your shoes.

How many miles have you put on it?

Frustrating, no doubt. I hope your Volt Advisor and GM are as aggressive with correcting your problems as they have been with the few other cases we've seen like this. For the most part, they've been over-the-top with the customer satisfaction actions. And it seems like you've earned them with this experience.

That's a bummer man! While waiting at the dealer, ask if they have any lemon-aid :p

How many miles have you put on it?

Only 577 miles.

I hope your Volt Advisor and GM are as aggressive with correcting your problems as they have been with the few other cases we've seen like this. For the most part, they've been over-the-top with the customer satisfaction actions. And it seems like you've earned them with this experience.

It has been great dealing with the Volt Advisors - I honestly didn't expect anyone to be around to help me on a Sunday evening. OnStar took care of arranging the tow and let the dealer know I was coming, which was good. It's the last link in the chain that I am most concerned about - the dealer. I expected them to be more on top of this, especially since they seem to have sold more Volts than any other dealer in the area. The service person asked me whether the car was turning over. I tried to explain the problem was with the traction battery, but I'm not sure how much got through.

I think at this point I'd be mentioning lemon laws and trying to get a whole new car out of them. It seems every car manufacturer just lets a few get out that just weren't built right. It's as if something really dumb happens at the beginning of the line, then as the car moves down the line, everyone sees it and thinks there's no point in doing the rest right either - sure the car will be rejected at the end anyway or something (or maybe just all hung over on monday).

Most Volts are a heck of a lot better than this - mine's been totally flawless in every regard for the 3.5k miles I've driven it, not one even minor issue.

Yeah, I havent had a single problem in 6k miles in 4 months. But it happens.

There are definitely some pains in being an early adopter, however. I suspect something will happen, just not sure what.

Both GM and the dealership would be better off giving you a new car, Evey II, and using Evey for the betterment of the kind. This is the only way for them to restore your confidence and save face.

I have never purchased a car (new or old) without having some problem, but they have always been minor. The last new car I purchased (a 2001 Hyundai Elantra GT, with a similar "fastback" style hatch) had the factory radio replaced twice in the first two months. I expect a little bit of inconvenience being an earlier adopter, but I do expect a reliable car that isn't going to leave me stranded someplace.

Lemon laws differ by state, but Utah requires that you have 4 attempted fixes of the SAME problem before it applies.

Bummer on the situation, I hope it gets settled soon!

I agree with DCFusor. It is time to mention the lemon laws to the dealer, and then up the chain to GM. Tell your Volt Advisor how unhappy you are. GM does not want this kind of bad publicity. They have enough to deal with on the Volt already!

And I also have to agree with the others here that my 6.5 month old Volt has been absolutely flawless. It is the best car I have ever owned.

I hope you get this taken care of, so you can be driving with the "Volt Smile"!!

C-5277

Sorry to hear about all these issues. Over the course of a year I've had one and it's minor. Fewest issues with a new car I've ever had.

I'm usually sanguine but I'd want a different car. This one just seems to have so many problems.

Here is a link to the Utah Lemon Law official site

http://consumerprotection.utah.gov/consumerinfo/automobiles.html

Thanks MTN Ranger, mikeg3 for the lemon law info.

I bought my Volt (“Evey”) three weeks ago, and I am starting to have the some fleeting doubts about whether I made the right decision. Today is the third straight Monday I have been to the dealer to get something fixed. The first issue was the A/C not working. Refrigerant was never put in the system, so the dealer charged it. Last Monday, I posted about the brake grinding/vibration issue I am having. It seems to come and go, but the problem still isn’t resolved. Those issues are relatively minor compared to the latest problem. It started yesterday afternoon, when the check engine light came on. I called OnStar, and they saw error codes that indicated there was an issue with the temperature management for the traction battery. The Volt Advisor I talked to said the car was safe to drive to the dealer in the morning.

Last night I went to start Evey. The initializing screen was up for a long while, and when the instrument display came up, the battery charge indicator was missing. Evey wouldn’t move when shifted into drive or reverse, and also wouldn’t power down. Every time I pressed the power button, the initializing screen came back up. Another Volt Advisor recommended that I walk 200 feet from the vehicle with the key fob, and then walk back to try to shut it down. That didn’t seem to work, but sitting in the car, wrapping the key fob in aluminum foil, and then pressing the power button did allow me to successfully power it down.

A flatbed came this morning and extracted Evey from my garage. It was not fun driving across town with a brand new Volt on the back of a tow truck. We will see what the dealer has to say today. I know my experience so far is very different from that of most of you on the forum, so I am hoping this can be resolved quickly and I can get back to enjoying my new car!

5374

sorry to hear about your problems mixedpixel, hope you get it resolved really son. I know this doesn't help much but every once in a while all cars makers may produce a lemon. This is the first I've heard of this situation so keep the rest of the Volt family informed of your progress and results...

As everyone else said, problems with new cars seem to happen. However, I would look at your states Lemon laws just to familiarize yourself with what the dealer should be doing. In the meantime I would ask the dealer for their Demo volt until they fix all of your issues.

I have 6300 miles, had the battery enhancement completed and had a drop of coolant leak the first week that required a new coupler, other than that everything has been golden (touch wood). Oh, I do have the annoying shock absorber creaking/low level thumping noises but wont get that fixed until they come out with their redesign (which is apparently in the works)

Looks like you've got a little ways to go yet before you quality for Utah's lemon law. But you're well on your way.

Myself, I've had 2 minor unexpected problems in the last 5-6 months. Had to get the fuel door sensor replaced and I have a rarely recurring issue with my volume switches (probably) that has yet to be resolved. I'm ok with small stuff like that. That's what the warranty is for, in my opinion. To catch the small imperfections that are likely to crop up. Your situation is pretty frustrating, though. I hope you either have no more issues or a bunch more issues so you can just get a new car quickly. :)

If there is a battery or bms problem I wonder if popping the hood to start the engine would just run the engine or would it bypass the battery system and alow the car to drive?

If there is a battery or bms problem I wonder if popping the hood to start the engine would just run the engine or would it bypass the battery system and alow the car to drive?

Nah you're not going to be able to bypass the battery system to get your car moving. It's not engineered that way. But it would be nice if it were. If your gas engine goes tits up, you can still drive on your battery. It'd be great if the reverse were true.

I had a big issue with my dealer early on that I wrote about here, including a chain of events that involved having to get the big T battery swapped out. While frustrating, all has been good since. Hopefully this will just be a blip for you in an otherwise joyous ownership experience,

How frustrating! Based on how well GM has worked with dealers in the past to resolve issues others have had, I expect your current issue will be remedied even if they have to send a tech from GM to assist.

Just for the record, but I've had mine almost a year now and going on 15k miles. I haven't had any mechanical or electrical issues. I had the dealer adjust some trim alignment (a minor, aesthetic issue only). I had the painless, two day battery tunnel and coolant sensor enhancement last week, but that was voluntary on my part.

Please keep us informed.

I had a big issue with my dealer early on that I wrote about here, including a chain of events that involved having to get the big T battery swapped out. While frustrating, all has been good since. Hopefully this will just be a blip for you in an otherwise joyous ownership experience,I remember that! You're a poster boy for the "head-spin" from the despair of an early serious issue and eventual elation with your Volt.

When you are producing an innovative vehicle with a powertrian as ground-breaking as the Volt, certainly there can be a few mis-steps here and there, but I'm happy to report generally these have been very few and far between. This situation is unfortunate.
But hopefully the OP will get his Volt back very soon and can get back to enjoying and (hopefully) rebuilding confidence in his Volt.

THAT HAS BEEN THE GENERAL THEME FROM THOSE FEW WITH EARLY ISSUES- ZERO to HERO!
:D
WOT

PS> It would be nice to know the actual DTCs, but I'm thinking if it WAS a cell temp sensor issue it just might be getting an entire new pack. Also ,I've never heard of a Volt not receiving a charge of R-134a from factory.(the way that "works" on the assembly, it would be difficult) The dealer was likely just speculating here as it was a new car. So actually I would think it may have just leaked due to some sort of sealing issue. Glad it's fixed!

PS> It would be nice to know the actual DTCs, but I'm thinking if it WAS a cell temp sensor issue it just might be getting an entire new pack. Also ,I've never heard of a Volt not receiving a charge of R-134a from factory.(the way that "works" on the assembly, it would be difficult) The dealer was likely just speculating here as it was a new car. So actually I would think it may have just leaked due to some sort of sealing issue. Glad it's fixed!

I didn't get the codes when I first spoke to the Volt Advisor last night, but he said that the the temperature in the battery is supposed to rise by a rate of 1 degree C per minute immediately following start up. That rate wasn't being seen in one of the battery packs, either because of the temperature not rising fast enough or because of a faulty sensor. But the entire battery being taken offline later last night makes me think that there is more to it.

The first time I took Evey in, I was told that either refrigerant wasn't added at the factory, or there was a very slow leak. I should have them check the system pressure again now that a couple of weeks have passed. .

We can categorize Volt issues as two types.

The first type is issues with the new ground-breaking drivetrain such as controls, control logic, sensors, battery, charging cords, cabin heating, regenerative braking, etc. These are relatively rare and to be expected. Most of us understand these, are tolerant when they occur, and are patient while these issues are being addressed.

The second type is issues with systems that are not new. These unfortunately are more common and tarnish the image of GM and the Volt. Such issues include engine emissions, suspension rattles, rear hatch rattles, brake pad rattles, forgotten A/C refrigerant ?!?, missing cabin air filter (by design or omission, the result is the same), chipping or swirled paint, hard interior plastics prone to rattles and to being scratched, etc. There are no legitimate excuses for these issues whether they are found on a Spark, a Cruze, a Volt, a CTS-V, or a ZR-1.

The days of good-enough, or the user won't know or care about the difference are over.

THAT HAS BEEN THE GENERAL THEME FROM THOSE FEW WITH EARLY ISSUES- ZERO to HERO!
:D
WOT



Agreed! That was the issue with me. I had a serious Battery Management System issue (http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?7106-Tried-to-buy-a-Volt-couldn-t-even-drive-an-inch&highlight=move+inch)with my Volt the day I leased it, but only one minor issue since*. For the first month, I did worry if my Volt would start, but I have now driven 10,000+ miles now without a serious issue. I am totally sold on this car, and really wish I had purchased instead of leased it.

I agree with those who advise going back to GM to see what they can do. Mixedpixel's Volt sounds like it should never have left Quality Control.

http://mysite.verizon.net/~illo/my_volt2.jpg
From Zero......

http://mysite.verizon.net/~illo/volt_spx.JPG
to Hero!

Those with a keen eye may notice that I have my bicycle in the back of my Volt. A member of my bike club, who owns a Mercedes convertible, has been asking me about my Volt. When he saw me putting my bike in without having to take off the wheel, I could see the 'Volt lust' in his eyes!

* My only small problem happened when On-Star and Bluetooth communications became completely unavailable a few weeks ago. Dealer got it fixed in a day. Interestingly with help from a Volt advisor, they first beleived that they need a new 'On-Star head unit', but after talking with a Volt advisor on the phone they were able to 'reboot' the whole system and get it working.

Another Volt Advisor recommended that I walk 200 feet from the vehicle with the key fob, and then walk back to try to shut it down. That didn’t seem to work, but sitting in the car, wrapping the key fob in aluminum foil, and then pressing the power button did allow me to successfully power it down.

What is up with the Aluminum foil? Was there some communications between the fob and the car that was causing a problem? I understand the foil shields the RF signal from the fob to car and car to fob, but is that really part of the problem?

What is up with the Aluminum foil? Was there some communications between the fob and the car that was causing a problem? I understand the foil shields the RF signal from the fob to car and car to fob, but is that really part of the problem?

The fob was apparently preventing the car from shutting down. Every time I pressed the power button, it would just repeat the same initialization cycle and never shut down. I don't know why the presence or absence of the fob made a difference, but being able to power down allowed me to keep the 12 V battery from draining over night.

Thanks Mixedpixel-

I am glad it worked and the 12 v battery did not drain overnight. I'm sure your car will get sorted out and not take too long. I am curious, though about the actual failure more. What went south and why? Maybe WOP or others closer to the actual internals of the Volt will have some insight...

I just talked with the dealer, and no solutions yet. They are working with GM to try to figure out the problem. I have the sense that it is going to be a while...

The only time people on the forum can agree the 12 volt battery is beeing charged IS when the car is on.
If the car is on and in a safe spot at home - should be no problem overnight.

Unless the fob has a super cap inside just remove its 3 volt battery. You don't even have to remove it from the key ring to open it up.

The only time people on the forum can agree the 12 volt battery is beeing charged IS when the car is on.
If the car is on and in a safe spot at home - should be no problem overnight.

If the traction battery is disconnected, then there's nothing to charge the 12 V battery. Since the charge level was not showing in the instrument panel (grayed out), my assumption was that everything was running of the 12 V battery.

@ mixedpixel,

Sorry to hear about all the issues you have had so far with your Volt. I see you have been in contact with one of our advisors, Melissa. We will definitely be keeping an eye on this and will work with the dealer to you back on the road enjoying your Volt!

I just talked to the dealer again, and the lack of details is maddening. The only information I could get is that there is a part that needs to be replaced, and that the part will probably be here on Friday. The service person couldn't give me any additional details on what the problem is or what the part is. :mad:

This sounds like what happened to my wife's Silver Volt, same exact symptom. I called my regional GM rep. and told him since it was my wife's car and she is hearing impaired I could not afford for the car to leave her stranded somewhere. He had them change the entire T-battery assembly and modules. This was to "Kill it Dead", so to speak. The car ran perfect...for nine days, then the same thing happened again. Well, just note my signature now does not list the Silver Volt. As much as it pained me to get rid of it, my wife lost total confidence in it. But, she loves her new Equinox now. Sucks about the gas, but at least mamas happy!

Agggilli, sorry to hear that GM wasn't able to fix the problem with your wife's Volt. Did you sell it? Did GM take it back? I'm starting to consider my options.

Only 577 miles! The car is brand new, they should give you a new one! This is ridiculous and upsets me. You should look into getting a lawyer or writing to your local newspaper/TV station. GM is dropping the ball on this, you should not let it fall on your toes.

Only 577 miles! The car is brand new, they should give you a new one! This is ridiculous and upsets me. You should look into getting a lawyer or writing to your local newspaper/TV station. GM is dropping the ball on this, you should not let it fall on your toes.Bah! I hope the OP doesnt listen to such idiotic advice.
Ease off the throttle there Chicken Little, they sky isnt falling.
(and no real sane rationale for turning it into an international incident , calling newspapers, TV stations, lawyers, congressmen etc) lol
Cars can break. Nothing new.
There's certainly no reason for YOU to worry your pretty little head over it
Something like this can be caused by something as minor as a flaky connection somewhere.
The dealer is sure to get him/them fixed up to their satisfaction...
WOT

@ agggilli,

We are very sorry to hear this but we completely understand. We hope one day your wife's confidence will be restored and we see you in a Volt again some time down the road!

I hope the OP doesnt listen to such idiotic advice.
...
(and no real sane rationale for turning it into an international incident , calling newspapers, TV stations, lawyers, congressmen etc)
...
Something like this can be caused by something as minor as a flaky connection somewhere.
The dealer is sure to get him/them fixed up to their satisfaction...


I agree that there's no need to make an international incident. But I also see this as something much more serious than a flaky connection. I am having 3 separate issues with same vehicle in less than 600 miles. Only one of the issues has (potentially) been fixed, and no one can tell me what is going on with the latest problem. It's the combination of all of this that has caused me to completely lose confidence in owning this car.

When I was at Enterprise today picking up the loaner, two different employees I talked to were really interested in the Volt. We talked about all the great features of the Volt. It was a bummer to have to add that I have had a rotten experience with this car.

I agree that there's no need to make an international incident. But I also see this as something much more serious than a flaky connection. .Actually a flaky connection at something like a battery cell temperature sensor CAN TOTALLY result in exactly what you are experiencing. The problem is these sensors are inside the battery box and not serviced seperately. (they are sort of "woven" into the cell structure) However the VITM interface with the temp sensor itself (called an Battery Interface Control Module-BICM) techncially CAN be serviced if it's determined the sensor and it's circuitry is OK. (leaving the interface module as the fault)
However, as I've stated previously it is most likely they will decide swap out the entire pack to remedy this (assuming this is in fact the DTC you reported that they are observing is for a cell temp sensor).

Should you be angry? Yes! It certainly is unfortunate that these things have occured so early in your Volt ownership, and obviously a royal PITA. But none of these issues IMO would be catigorized a "serious" to the extent that they shouldn't be able to make it 100% right in a matter of a few days.

Good luck, and please let us know what they decided to do (and if possible the DTC/s they are specifically observing)
Regards
WOT

A flaky connection couldn't have resulted in the A/C not having any refrigerant, and I don't see how it would be causing the brake pedal to vibrate or give a grinding sensation when stopping. Those are the other two problems I have had since getting the car. The A/C is fixed, as long as it wasn't originally added in the factory. Otherwise, there's a slow leak somewhere, and I am currently 0/3.

A flaky connection couldn't have resulted in the A/C not having any refrigerant, and I don't see how it would be causing the brake pedal to vibrate or give a grinding sensation when stopping.Of course not! I am referring to your current condition and the title of this thread
(the buzzing sensation in the pedal is probably normal though, search out numerous threads on it in this forum)
GL
WOT

I really like the Volt and admire what GM did to make it a reality. We all have marveled at its technological ingenuity, have advocated the car with family, friends, and colleagues, have participated in forums, activities, and organizations, and have shared the joy and exhilaration of driving it. However neither GM nor the dealership network should take the Volt owners for granted.

As far as GM and the dealerships should be concerned, the sky IS falling for a customer of theirs, who put a lot of trust in them. They better be working extra hard to remedy that. The least they can do is proactively keep mixedpixel informed of the status of his car and loan him another Volt directly instead of making him stand in line at Enterprise, probably pay extra insurance from his own pocket, and drive crummy rentals.

Why am I upset about this? Because as Volt owners this situation can happen (and unfortunately is happening) to any one of us. Because my Volt also has had initial quality issues. Because I spent three days going back and forth within a week of delivery, driving an absurd rental called Aveo, and waiting for hours at the dealership. And because these issues have not been resolved yet. Lucky for me the issues are minor and one could live with them (not that they should with a $45k car).

Why am I suggesting that mixedpixel pursue remedies outside of direct communication? Because so far a direct one hasn't worked and because some are more concerned with their image and perception rather than the true merits and quality of this car.

I've said enough and hopefully you get my point.

Mixedpixel,

I had Volt #9161 with a seemingly endless laundry list of problems from the second day I had it. Brake issues, A/C issues, strut/shock problems, headliner problems, charging problems, dealer damage, etc. Out of the first 30 days, 17 were in the shop. I burned up all my remaining vacation time and some sick time (don't tell my boss!) on the damn thing. Lots of cheesy "old GM" rental cars. You know the drill.

Long story short, GM stepped up and replaced my car. They didn't even make me to go arbitration to do so. They made the situation right in a big way and really took care of me.

If your problems persist I certainly hope you get the same kind of treatment that I did from GM. Be politely persistent to get this situation resolved to your satisfaction. I've bought a lot of new cars and have three duds out of the mix, one VW, one Honda, and now one Chevy. GM dealt with the problem better than I could have imagined despite me completely flipping out on the dealer at one point.

Hang in there, be pragmatic, and unless I'm an anomaly GM will take good care of you and make the situation right. My replacement Volt, for what it's worth, is excellent, with none of the issues I had before (yes, the brakes feel normal now!).

-Drew

After reading this thread, I realized that buying a Volt was actually a very risky move. I have no problem so far. But the technical complexity of this car may be a bit too much for existing production methods. Apparently, Tesla has been suffering a lot of quality issues too. There are so many sensors and computer components that the likelihood of having the weakest one break down early is actually high.
And I have the feeling it will take years before the mechanics at GM dealers start to master the knowledge to properly diagnose such a car. The problem will be even worse at dealers with low Volt sales volume.

Agggilli, sorry to hear that GM wasn't able to fix the problem with your wife's Volt. Did you sell it? Did GM take it back? I'm starting to consider my options.

Actually, they were very good to me. They bought it back just like it never happened. They gave me all my money back, plus made the first payment that was due. They offered to get me a new one exactly like the one we had and that was really what I wanted, but my wife was too leery of it then. She had an Equinox a few years ago and decided she wanted to go that way instead, so that is what we did. I still have my black Volt and would not part with it for anything, even if I had it in the shop every other week. I love my Volt.

After reading this thread, I realized that buying a Volt was actually a very risky move. I have no problem so far. But the technical complexity of this car may be a bit too much for existing production methods. Apparently, Tesla has been suffering a lot of quality issues too. There are so many sensors and computer components that the likelihood of having the weakest one break down early is actually high.
And I have the feeling it will take years before the mechanics at GM dealers start to master the knowledge to properly diagnose such a car. The problem will be even worse at dealers with low Volt sales volume.

I respectfully disagree with this assertion.

-The Volt platform (basic electronics, switchgear, suspension, safety systems, vehicle structure) is shared with other GM cars and is pretty common stuff.

-The Volt's gas engine is likewise commonplace and well understood in the GM ecosystem. Nothing groundbreaking there.

-The Voltec transmission/power split device is sharing much of the technology developed years ago in GM's "two mode" hybrid system. Most of its manufacturing and repair knowledge is likely to have already been disseminated through the company and dealers.

-The Volt's place of manufacture and assembly methods are shared with other GM vehicles.

The only major new systems in the Volt involve the battery pack and its associated cooling and charging systems. I don't think the Volt is an inherently risky buy given that the bulk of it is well understood by everyone involved.

The special Volt bits will require a little hand-holding, as we've seen, but there's 20,000 of these things out in the wild (sold + inventory) and it won't be long before repair and maintenance methods are second nature.

The bulk of problems with this car are the same sorts of things that happen with any car. A factory improperly charging mixedpixel's A/C system or a supplier putting lousy shocks and struts on my car are not Volt specific in any way. We are prone here to picking over the minute details of every problem that crops up with this car but, if you look past the very rare problems with the Volt's battery pack or drive system, the same sorts of problems are on every car forum from every make.

-Drew

Reading recent threads I am having the same feeling about the Volt. I have sort of been wavering about getting one but enough issues have been brought up recently on these forums, often with brand new owners to make me believe they have some fine tuning to do to iron out some of the quality problems. Other problems besides this traction battery problem are the 12 volt battery failures, leaking coolant, and failed LCD displays. I still want one, but it is getting harder to justify trading in my current Prius which is highly reliable, and paying additional money to role the dice on a new car which could end up giving me more problems than the older car I already have. I hope they sort these issues out, and in the meantime GM should do everything it can to make this particular problem right by their customer. What a bummer having your brand new Volt fail like that.

Eh, read through PriusChat and you'll find people with their issues too. Engine banging/rattling on startup on new Prii with Toyota stonewalling intake manifold replacements to rectify the issue comes immediately to mind.

Car makers build lemons. My money, personally, would be on Toyota building fewer of them than GM, but I doubt there's any reason to avoid buying a Volt based on what you've read on a forum set up to distill the problems out of a vehicle.

If I didn't check Consumer Reports I'd assume that all Gen III Prius models have defective engines, lots of rattles, and all Prius V owner get crunching/graunching suspensions. Gen Is all have defective steering racks and dying battery packs. Gen IIs have bad PSDs.

Of course those are the few and far between and most of the cars are shockingly reliable, but internet forums are deceptive that way.

Reading recent threads I am having the same feeling about the Volt. I have sort of been wavering about getting one but enough issues have been brought up recently on these forums, often with brand new owners to make me believe they have some fine tuning to do to iron out some of the quality problems. Other problems besides this traction battery problem are the 12 volt battery failures, leaking coolant, and failed LCD displays. I still want one, but it is getting harder to justify trading in my current Prius which is highly reliable, and paying additional money to role the dice on a new car which could end up giving me more problems than the older car I already have. I hope they sort these issues out, and in the meantime GM should do everything it can to make this particular problem right by their customer. What a bummer having your brand new Volt fail like that.

This is the same with every car forum, 10% of posters post about their problems/Rants and resolutions and then dont come back, if you add them all up it isnt much of anything really.

Reading recent threads I am having the same feeling about the Volt. I have sort of been wavering about getting one but enough issues have been brought up recently on these forums, often with brand new owners to make me believe they have some fine tuning to do to iron out some of the quality problems. Other problems besides this traction battery problem are the 12 volt battery failures, leaking coolant, and failed LCD displays. I still want one, but it is getting harder to justify trading in my current Prius which is highly reliable, and paying additional money to role the dice on a new car which could end up giving me more problems than the older car I already have. I hope they sort these issues out, and in the meantime GM should do everything it can to make this particular problem right by their customer. What a bummer having your brand new Volt fail like that.

You have to remember that people with problems will seek out a forum and post to discuss them; people without problems may not go looking for a forum, and won't post "day 399, and all is well with my car." very often - makes people bored.

FWIW, I've never had any issues with my Volt in 6 months of ownership, and I'm pretty sure that's true of 99% of the Volts out there.

From what I can tell, the issues we're seeing are random one-offs, which happen with most any production product as complicated as a car. The important part is the GM and their dealers are making a strong effort to fix or replace the cars with problems - we've seen a couple dozen times the "it was just this little part, but GM had us replace the assembly to be sure" comments.

Ironically, each generation of Prius I believe has had at least one systematic recall for a problem that is serious and covers the whole fleet, unlike the production issues you're seeing here that affect only individual cars. (little things like catching fire, and the current car's exhaust actuator recall discussed here today.)

But as always, your money, and your choice. Caveat Emptor.

OK. That's fair. I suppose it is true that the individual problems will get amplified on a forum out of proportion to what the real incidence of the problem in the fleet is. There were a few other things holding me back on the Volt anyway. I don't like the center stack that much and the cheap backup camera bothers me and I found visibility to be less than in my current car, so there would be some compromises involved in the trade. I will try and keep perspective, though, about these problems that show up in the forums.

I definitely compromised on visibility (ended up adding quarter-bubbles to control the blindspots) and headroom (it has barely enough, but then I'm not small...) This car even has an annoying welded on roof... ;)

But in my opinion it's totally worth it. Have you driven one? The test drive tends to be most impressive - and some (many? most?) dealers are happy to let serious prospects keep their demo for a day or two to really understand how it'd fit into your life.

Joshilli,
Since I own both a 2007 Prius and a 2012 Volt that has had several problems, I think I can weigh in. My Prius has been very reliable. It is a decent car to get from here to there on a small amount of gas. But I wouldn't call it "fun to drive" by any stretch of the imagination. The Volt is a blast to drive. It is quieter than any car I have owned. I can drive it using no gas most of the year, which is important to me. There are definitely a few compromises (e.g. 4 seats, a little worse visibility), but given the choice of the car I want to actually drive, the Volt wins hands down.
As for reliability, for me the jury is still out. I don't think my car is typical. Honestly, having gone what I have gone through the last three weeks, feeling the way I do right now, I might not make the same decision to buy. But I think anyone in my situation would feel the same way. The difference will be if GM stands behind their product, tells me what is going on, and gets my problems fixed. There are several here who have raved about how GM has stood behind them 100% to get their issues resovled. I haven't seen it yet, but I hoping in a few more days I can be very happy again about my decision to buy a Volt.

There are several here who have raved about how GM has stood behind them 100% to get their issues resovled. I haven't seen it yet, but I hoping in a few more days I can be very happy again about my decision to buy a Volt.

You need to be proactive in getting GM involved to the point of getting great assistance. Get your GM Regional Manager's name and telephone number from your dealer and call him. Tell him what has transpired and that you want results now! You have to get it past the dealership. My dealership is fantastic, but also seemed to be at GM's mercy and was spinning their wheels until I personally got in contact with the higher wheels at GM, then the pace picked up and resolution came about quickly.

Mixedpixel I think I would start suggesting to the Volt advisers and the dealer they should arrange a replacement. Three weeks is way to long to solve any issue. The suggestion for a call to the regional manager is a good one. Try an 800 number search for Chevrolet customer service. Start making a big stink, you really should not have to wait for these kinds of issues to be solved after more than a year of the cars being release to the public.

Mixedpixel I think I would start suggesting to the Volt advisers and the dealer they should arrange a replacement. Three weeks is way to long to solve any issue. The suggestion for a call to the regional manager is a good one. Try an 800 number search for Chevrolet customer service. Start making a big stink, you really should not have to wait for these kinds of issues to be solved after more than a year of the cars being release to the public.

It doesn't look like this issue has been three weeks, he has had a couple of issues since he has owned the car a total of three weeks. This issue came up on Monday of this week. Now, I certainly wouldn't be happy with the way the ownership experience has gone so far but I would request my dealer get me my Volt or refunds me a month of my Loan or lease (if I had one).

The Volt Advisor line needs to step up here and provide some real information on the status of this problem.

My 2012 Volt with 4400 miles died Monday (4/16). Went to start the car that morning and nothing happened (neither battery or gas worked). Car was towed to dealer where they reset the error codes. Car started and ran normally. Went to pick it up Tuesday and just before I got to the dealership - got a call that the car died again.

It's day 4 now without my Volt and here's where I stand:

1) They still can't get my Volt started;
2) They don't know what's wrong with it;
3) They are going to send out a GM engineer to look at the vehicle;
4) I'm now driving a scratched-up, smelly Chevy Aveo (the only small, sedan loaner option); and
5) Don't know when I will get my Volt back.

Here's what I have learned about Chevy:

1) They do not understand their Volt owners. I'm paying $455/month for my Volt. I went from driving one of Chevy's MOST expensive 4-door cars to now driving their LEAST expensive car. Does anyone know how much it costs to lease an Aveo?
2) Communication is very poor. (Please see bullet points above.)
3) They don't value their customers. I was one of the biggest Volt fans. I've posted a number of blogs on forums praising the Volt. But now I feel let down. My neighbors have started asking me why I'm driving an Aveo and why isn't the Volt plugged into the side of my house?

How many other Volt owners have had similar experiences?

My 2012 Volt with 4400 miles died Monday (4/16). Went to start the car that morning and nothing happened (neither battery or gas worked). Car was towed to dealer where they reset the error codes. Car started and ran normally. Went to pick it up Tuesday and just before I got to the dealership - got a call that the car died again.Part of this is that the dealer may not understand the car. You weren't very clear but if nothing works in the Volt it's usually the 12v battery. Now they said they reset the codes but the existence of the codes isn't the problem, the problem is what the codes are identifying. So "clearing the codes" would rarely solve anything.

My point is that they in addition to not understanding Volt owners they may not understand the Volt.

I'd call the Volt advisors and ask them to get involved.

Part of this is that the dealer may not understand the car. You weren't very clear but if nothing works in the Volt it's usually the 12v battery. Now they said they reset the codes but the existence of the codes isn't the problem, the problem is what the codes are identifying. So "clearing the codes" would rarely solve anything.

My point is that they in addition to not understanding Volt owners they may not understand the Volt.

I'd call the Volt advisors and ask them to get involved.

DonC - The 12V battery worked. The radio, door locks, and electric windows all worked but when I put the car into drive - nothing!

Called my Volt advisor twice before I finally got a call back. Said that he would call me back again yesterday afternoon with an update - but have not heard anything from him since yesterday morning.

DonC - The 12V battery worked. The radio, door locks, and electric windows all worked but when I put the car into drive - nothing!So the car powered up normally and you could put the car into drive but nothing happened? And there were no error codes? That's certainly new.

I'd call your Volt Advisor rather than waiting for them to call you.

So the car powered up normally and you could put the car into drive but nothing happened? And there were no error codes? That's certainly new.

I'd call your Volt Advisor rather than waiting for them to call you.

Here are the error codes I recieved from OnStar Monday:

P0D69 Current
P0ABC Milhistory
P0ABB Milhistory
P0AF8 Milhistory
P1E00 Current History

Can anyone tell me what they mean?

So what did you Volt Adviser say when you called this morning?

I was able to get one tiny piece of information from a Volt Advisor this morning. The part that has been ordered for my car is a relay. That's the only information he was able to get.
PeterC, sorry you are having what sounds like a similar problem.

Here are the error codes I recieved from OnStar Monday:

P0D69 Current
P0ABC Milhistory
P0ABB Milhistory
P0AF8 Milhistory
P1E00 Current History

Can anyone tell me what they mean?

PeterC, I found some of your codes on dtcsearch.com:
P0ABC - Generic Type
Powertrain - Hybrid Propulsion - ISO/SAE Controlled
Description Hybrid Battery Pack Voltage Sense "A" Circuit Low

P0ABB - Generic Type
Powertrain - Hybrid Propulsion - ISO/SAE Controlled
Description Hybrid Battery Pack Voltage Sense "A" Circuit Range/Performance

P0AF8 - Generic Type
Powertrain - Hybrid Propulsion - ISO/SAE Controlled
Description Hybrid Battery System Voltage

Mixedpixel - Thank you for the Error Code explanations.

Agreed - Sounds like my Volt is experiencing the same issues as yours. What actions have you taken that have yielded results???

PeterC, I can't really give you any advice on anything that has yielded results. My dealer can't tell me what the problem is. If I ask who I can talk to higher up the chain, they tell me to call my Volt Advisor. The Volt Advisors calls the dealer, but since the dealer doesn't know what is going on, the Volt Advisor is no help. I can't even talk directly to the tech who worked on my car, because he isn't in.

Mixedpixel - I really appreciate your following up and answering my questions.

My status - Got a call from my Chevy dealership this afternoon. They told me that everything mechanical on the car was fine and that I had a software problem. Still not sure when I will get the car back.

Quick note - I'm a huge fan of Salt Lake City. Love the skiing - Alta, Snowbird, Park City, Powder Mountain!

mixedpixel start here
http://autopedia.com/html/ChevyCSI.html

Then try this one:
http://www.chevrolet.com/pages/mds/helpcenter/contactUs.do
Customer Assistance - 1.800-222-1020

If the dealer needs help defining your problem I am sure GM has resources for him, you should not get the run around.

Here are the error codes I recieved from OnStar Monday:

P0D69 Current
P0ABC Milhistory
P0ABB Milhistory
P0AF8 Milhistory
P1E00 Current History

Can anyone tell me what they mean?

Mixedpixel - Thank you for the Error Code explanations.

Agreed - Sounds like my Volt is experiencing the same issues as yours. What actions have you taken that have yielded results???Actually IMO these issues are similar only in the fact that both cars have been rendered inoperative. (really no different that 1 car with a failed fuel pump and another with a burnt iginition coil - different issues, same net result)

One of the somewhat confusing paradigms that comes with EV ownership (or more correctly should EV issues arise) is the fail-safe system responses when certain critical DTCs are set. Unfortunately these can be that the vehicle is rendered completely inoperable for safety reasons. So when any one of perhaps 100 or 200 specific DTCs are triggered for whatever reason, the vehicle either goes into a failsafe behavior that can include "reduced power mode" and once turned OFF may not "restart". Or another scenario occurs when the car is OFF or charging. Since so many diagnostics are routinely monitoring it's systems during OFF periods or during charging a detected error wont let it even get out of the garage.
Unfortunately it often means a lot of owner inconvenience (phone calls, tow trucks etc) for those involved.
Even if after making a repair, the DTCs will need to be cleared and high voltage software latches "reset" in order to put the vehicle into a operable condition. So I suspect these two vehicles are currently within this scenario, althoug very likely for very different reasons...

DTC P0D69: A/C Compressor Motor Voltage Sensor Performance
DTC P0ABB: Hybrid/EV Battery Voltage Sensor Circuit Performance
DTC P0ABC: Hybrid/EV Battery Voltage Sensor Circuit Low Voltage
DTC P0AF8: Hybrid System Voltage

I have personally set this exact combination of DTCs by removing (or not installing) the Manual Service Disconnect (MSD) under incorrect power mode conditions. (the 12V battery is generally disconnected first, before the removal of the MSD, prior to any high voltage service)
An improperly seated MSD, bad connections at the MSD, or worst case a blown main fuse within the MSD can cause it as well. (so hopefully nobody had been tampering with the MSD as unlike some other cars it's removal may not be recoverable without being able to clear DTCs from the factory tool)

In any case the presence of these DTCs (especially in combination) will assist the Volt techncian in the diagnosis towards a root cause.
Hopefully they will get to shis root cause for you very soon, and get you back to enjoying your Volt/s

WOT

WOT, you are correct. Here are the DTCs and the root cause of the problem for my car.
DTCs:
P1EBE
P0D21
P0AF8
P1EC6

Cause: failure in "drive motor battery wire junction block relay"
Repair: relay was replaced

The good news is that the problem is now fixed. I'm still really disappointed with the service I received from the VAs and especially the dealer - I couldn't find out what the problem was until I picked up the car a few minutes ago.

Glad you are all set.

But as a GM employee, it drives me nuts when customers get the run around. We have got to fix that with our dealers!

Glad you are all set.

But as a GM employee, it drives me nuts when customers get the run around. We have got to fix that with our dealers!

And thats where the problems lay, They are not "your" dealers, they are 100% independent businesses. if GM had corporate owned service centers, then GM would have direct control on the quality of services

I have always felt the dealership method of sales was a jobs program, mandated by state franchise laws .. good for them, not so good for customers

WOT, you are correct. Here are the DTCs and the root cause of the problem.
DTCs:
P1EBE
P0D21
P0AF8
P1EC6

Cause: failure in "drive motor battery wire junction block relay"

The good news is that the problem is now fixed. I'm still really disappointed with the service I received from the VAs and especially the dealer - I couldn't find out what the problem was until I picked up the car a few minutes ago.First of all great news you are back in your Volt.

Did they indicate they needed to REPLACE the battery junction block assembly? or merely repair a poor connection at the unit?
WOT

Glad you are all set.

But as a GM employee, it drives me nuts when customers get the run around. We have got to fix that with our dealers!I agree Dr. Foss. It does appear there were some breakdowns in communication in this instance. But fortunately there have been indications this has been more the exception than the rule, (if you look at other threads where something similar occurred, there appeared to be considerably less dissatisfaction created)

A new breed of car like the Volt can clearly create some all new challenges when it comes to dealing with diagnosis and repair. It's not really that it's all that difficult or too complex, just different. You can take 100s of hours of training on any one system, but when you actually find yourself knee deep in an actual car that wont move, it doesn't always fall into place exactly as anticipated.(and unfortunately there's no magic wands ;) )

I find it very similar to what was experienced in the early 80s as digital electronic fuel injection and DIS displaced carburetors and point ignition systems. The necessary training and skill sets may be there, but the real world experience is lacking.
Given the right circumstances even the most highly trained technicians and engineers can be completely "stumped" (at least temporarily)
It does happen, but not often.

No excuse for not keeping your customer informed and engaged though!

WopOnTour

PS> Now let's hope we hear PeterC is back on the road as well...

Did they indicate they needed to REPLACE the battery junction block assembly? or merely repair a poor connection at the unit?

I was told that the drive motor battery wire junction relay was replaced. I don't know anything about whether that included the entire battery junction block assembly, or whether there is a way to replace just the relay.

When I was at Enterprise today picking up the loaner, two different employees I talked to were really interested in the Volt. We talked about all the great features of the Volt. It was a bummer to have to add that I have had a rotten experience with this car.

This especially catches my eye, in the context of this owner's difficult experience and GM's desire to see things right. I'm not a Volt owner (but reading here begin to wish I would be) but my parallel experience with my first Apple laptop might encourage anyone, here. The computer manifested problems out of the box, and after too many trips back to local service points and central repair facilities I said to the Apple rep, "You know, I teach in the university and my students are absolutely fascinated with the iBook. When they ask me how I like it, can you imagine the frown and my hesitation before answering that come across me, reflexively?"

That conversation and your frown and hesitation with the Enterprise employees is exactly what GM does NOT want to have happening "out there"!

A replacement iBook was ordered to be sent the next day.

FWIW

To me, it all comes down to the dealership and how much they value the customer. In my case I have a great relationship (dealer/customer) with the owner's son and the owner. When I felt after a couple of days that the issue was not being found quick enough by the technician (by no fault of his own) I asked for the GM regional managers telephone number, so I could get some bigger guns involved. The owner had no problem providing me with that number and resolution and complete satisfaction was immediately had. The Volt Advisor's are nice and all but cannot really do too much when it comes down to repairs. It comes down to the fact that the dealer has to really care about their customer. I had engineering on site, as well as engineering by email and parts over-nighted. I highly praise my dealer and GM even after my problems. I was thoroughly, completely and quickly taken care of. That is why I will not buy from anyone else, It would be very difficult to duplicate the relationship I have with my dealer.

The good news is that the problem is now fixed. I'm still really disappointed with the service I received from the VAs and especially the dealer - I couldn't find out what the problem was until I picked up the car a few minutes ago.

+1. I know this felling..
glad to hear you have your car back.