Oct 28

New Chevy Runs Deep TV Commercials

 

[ad#post_ad]We just recently saw the first Chevy Volt commercial which aired on Wednesday in the World Series. Accompanying that 30 second commercial were three other Chevrolet commercials.

All are narrated by comedian Tim Allen and all evoke memories of this country’s past and how Chevrolet has been a thread that ties the decades together. The advertising tag line “Chevy Runs Deep” tries to remind consumers how much a legacy the brand is for the country, and how it is still alive. Furthermore the brand’s future is exemplified prominently by the Chevy Volt.

The following commercials illustrate these ideas:

1. Babies:

2. Dogs in trucks:

3. Chevy runs deep:

4. That first Chevy:

It is obvious GM has abandoned the ill-conceived memo of former brand director Jim Campbell to not call the brand Chevy, which is good. Whether prompting consumers to remember Chevy’s role in this country’s past will sell more cars isn’t known. The new advertising push is being led by GM’s new VP of marketing Joel Ewanick. The ads were conceived by GM’s new advertising partner Goodby, Silverstein & Partners, who took over after GM severed ties with Campbell Ewald with who was their advertising partner for over 90 years.

“Are we going to wrap ourselves in the American flag? No, we’re not, but we are going to wrap ourselves in the values and the character that has been part of this country for centuries,” Ewanick said. “That’s what we want to be.”

These commercial are reminiscent of previous patriotic campaigns such as “Heartbeat of America” and “American Revolution” that didn’t necessarily drum up a lot of business. Of course back then there was no Chevrolet Volt.

Ewanick believes this strong historic American theme is something Japanese competitors cannot claim, and allows the brand to be set apart. “We have a soul that our strongest competitors don’t have,” Ewanick said. The question is, will it work?

Quote Sources (Reuters)

[ad#postbottom]

This entry was posted on Thursday, October 28th, 2010 at 12:33 am and is filed under Advertising, Brand. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

COMMENTS: 192


  1. 1
    Matthew B

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:37 am)

    WOW up late Lyle.


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    Larry

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:54 am)

    I watched all (4) commercials. They really give you a “warm fuzzy” feeling about Chevy… just hope it leads to more Volts being manufactured and sold.


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    Harrier

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:07 am)

    Nostalgia can be powerful… But it works on people only if they have something to remember. A majority of people interested in the Volt are new to the Chevy brand. I understand the idea of saying “we are different from them”. And “they will never be what we are”. I just think that the brand needs to be patched up a bit more before this effort will be effective.

    It didn’t jump for me.


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    Shock Me

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:13 am)

    Too bad the dogs one is so focused. My dog would just love the Volt.


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    stuart22

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:14 am)

    I missed all the commercials – but that’s OK because I was at the game watching my Giants snuff out Texas.

    I like that this ad campaign has no rah-rah red/white & blue we’re #1 whiff of politics associated with its messages. It’s more thoughtful and personal than either the ‘Heartbeat’ and ‘Revolution’ campaigns and therefore I can see these new ads being a positive step for creating Chevy awareness.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:34 am)

    of the 4 commercials, i would say that #3 is the best of them but the commercials don’t do a whole lot for me. they are clearly chevrolet brand building commercials that are not specific to any vehicle; that’s ok because it seems that they are part of a general advertising campaign so you really need to see more of the campaign before you can assess individual commercials; but these commercials seem to be very directed toward a middle-aged/baby boomer audience.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:41 am)

    i don’t think that it is a true statement that the majority of people who are interested in the volt do not have awareness of the chevrolet brand. as to the nostalgia angle, the appeal is to a particular time, and the people who would remember that time are likely to be middle-aged/baby boomers. when you look at the promotional events that gm has been holding for the volt, it certainly seems that the baby boomer segment is a key target for the volt. the price point for the volt reinforces that impression.

    Harrier: Nostalgia can be powerful… But it works on people only if they have something to remember.A majority of people interested in the Volt are new to the Chevy brand.    


  8. 8
    DonC

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:46 am)

    The Volt commercial sucked. I gave it a 2. I’d give these branding commercials a 10. They are very good. However, I’m just never sure how effective branding is, especially when you have a well known brand to begin with.

    I’m thinking that, if you had to choose, Chevy would be better off with great commercials for the cars and lousy commercials for the brand rather than vice versa, but that may just be me.

    That said I think Ewanick is on to something here. Just wished he hadn’t whiffed with the Volt commercial.


  9. 9
    Unni

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:46 am)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:59 am)

    the volt commercial didn’t do much for me either, but it is part of an advertising campaign, so you really have to see more of the campaign to see how good the advertising is. to a certain extent, what was good about the volt commercial is that it was more suggestive instead of trying to hit you with a lot of facts. in this case, there is the suggestion that there is an electric vehicle that doesn’t limit your mobility. of course, it doesn’t answer the question of why someone would want to consider an electric car in the first place. it’s a new technology, so you don’t want to risk confusing people by hitting them with too much too soon. i think that the approach taken with the first volt commercial a good way to go in general, but we will have to see more to assess what the marketing communication strategy really is.

    DonC: The Volt commercial sucked. I gave it a 2. I’d give these branding commercials a 10. They are very good. However, I’m just never sure how effective branding is, especially when you have a well known brand to begin with.
    I’m thinking that, if you had to choose, Chevy would be better off with great commercials for the cars and lousy commercials for the brand rather than vice versa, but that may just be me.
    That said I think Ewanick is on to something here. Just wished he hadn’t whiffed with the Volt commercial.    


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    Carl S

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:43 am)

    I felt that the Volt commercial and these new “Chevy Runs Deep” commercials do a fine job getting people to think about Chevrolet, which is their purpose in the first place. Although, I did like the the old “Heartbeat” and “Revolution” commercials, too.

    Something else good about the Volt commercial: it’s NOT the EV1 commercial.


  12. 12
    The-grump

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (3:48 am)

    Nostalgia can be powerful, but appealing to the need for freedom, and empowering people to be able to choose – that’s a strong message. Have an image of a waving American flag and a flying eagle in the background during the commercial below, and you have a winner.

    “Chevy Volt: The freedom to choose, electricity or gas (waving Flag). The freedom to go as far as you want, whenever you want (flying eagle). Chevy Volt, the freedom of America (Volt image).”

    Is it “wrapping yourself in the American flag”? No, because the flag is being used to represent the freedom to choose the fuel you will use, not the old “made in America” mantra (because the Volt isn’t 100 percent US made. I can’t name a car that is anymore). While this “freedom” to choose your fuel may drive Al Gore believers crazy, almost all Americans like to have a choice.

    Especially when gas prices are once again climbing, and the government either doesn’t care (probable), or really wants gas prices to go higher (Treason. Any official supporting this should be tried, convicted, and executed by firing squad – on national TV as a lesson to all). When gas prices go up, everyone except the rich suffers – the poor suffer the most. That’s just wrong, no matter who you are.


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    Volt45

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (3:50 am)

    They dumped their ad agency of 90 years? Wow. That had to be a trauma for somebody.
    But it shows, I think, how serious they are.

    I have always wondered why the ads for domestics just didn’t seem to match the verve and creativity of mainly the Asian makes.

    When I saw the spoof ad on HGTV of the show where a (presumably rich) couple shops for a new house/vacation getaway and they comparison shop the 3, and you get to vicariously imagine the possibility, except in the ad they choose between 3 cars… When I saw that ad, I wondered if that could be GM. But I thought no way, it’s too focused, too clever… has to be Toyota or Honda or Nissan… But I’ll be damned, it *was* GM !
    I knew something had changed….

    The Volt ad was a great peek/pique ad… It gave (for most) a good first look, and it piques curiosity, doesn’t give too much away.
    And these ads do a good balance of history, nostalgia and sentiment, without going over the top.
    Finally the Asians have some marketing competition. Keep it up.


  14. 14
    Eco_Turbo

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (4:01 am)

    I liked the third one the best. Can’t wait for a commercial showing the Volt smoking it’s front wheels. I could also get very excited about a GM racing program. But more than just NASCAR. I’d like to see a moon shot type program to build “another” American car that could pull off an overall victory at LeMans. This second or third in class stuff just doesn’t cut it. An overall win with a street legal car would get some attention. Maybe a Voltec Corvette?


  15. 15
    Dave K.

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:00 am)

    There are two more angles I would like to see worked into the Volt ads. One is full blown visual high tech onslaught. With the Volt warping into outer space. Relaying the idea that the Volt is on the bleeding edge of technology.
    The second is more home based. Show the Volt parked next to an Exxon station ground tank refill cap. Have the driver, a 30 year old female office worker, slide a clear hose into the Volt fuel tank. Prime the siphon hose by mouth to start the flow. Then slide the other end into the filling station ground tank. She looks up at the camera and says,”I just don’t much gasoline any more”.

    =D-Volt


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    Dave K.

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:06 am)

    AP Thursday October 28, 2010, 5:40 am

    AMSTERDAM (AP) — Royal Dutch Shell PLC, Europe’s largest oil company, reported third quarter net profit rose 6.5 percent from a year ago as increasing production and a rise in oil prices more than offset one-time charges at its refining arm and its Canadian operations.

    Net profit of $3.46 billion was up from $3.25 billion in the third quarter of 2009. Revenues rose to $90.7 billion from $75 billion, the company said Thursday.

    NPNS


  17. 17
    Dave K.

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:08 am)

    Dave K.: She looks up at the camera and says,”I just don’t much gasoline any more”.

    typo correction on #15:

    ”I just don’t need much gasoline any more”.


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    Mark Z

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:26 am)

    A great grouping of commercials to refresh the memory about the Chevy brand and show the advantage of an E-REV electric car. If it causes the viewer to remember every Chevy they owned or drove, they did their job. The Volt will be the 7th Chevy for me. Well done GM.


  19. 19
    Jdkanga

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:05 am)

    Did you hear on the news! The Government already has made 16 Billion on it’s investment in the car company’s. Sounds like an investment not a bail out and a pretty good one at that!


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    Hodginator

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:06 am)

    I thought the commercials were pretty good. They weren’t using any CGI or other crap to make the cars do things they can’t as most other car manufacturers do. The last video was a good set of shots of their lineup.

    My dog prefers to only ride in American vehicles.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:08 am)

    i think these are terrible ideas for an advertising campaign to the general public. as to the first idea; most people want practical, reliable transportation. the “warping into outer space” idea is a bit too weird in that context. as to the second idea; when it comes to the volt, i would think that what gm does not want to do is to create an association between the volt and filling up at the gas station. rather, they want the visual to be plugging the volt into an electric outlet.

    Dave K.: There are two more angles I would like to see worked into the Volt ads. One is full blown visual high tech onslaught. With the Volt warping into outer space. Relaying the idea that the Volt is on the bleeding edge of technology.
    The second is more home based. Show the Volt parked next to an Exxon station ground tank refill cap. Have the driver, a 30 year old female office worker, slide a clear hose into the Volt fuel tank. Prime the siphon hose by mouth to start the flow. Then slide the other end into the filling station ground tank. She looks up at the camera and says,”I just don’t much gasoline any more”.=D-Volt    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:12 am)

    in reality, the important thing is that the bailout saved millions of jobs that would have been lost had the auto industry had gm and chrysler collapsed. then you would have had a negative effect that would have dwarfed the $16 billion that the government might make on the gm bailout. after all, the real incentive of the bailout was not for the government to necessarily make a profit in the short term, but to save the economy in the longer term.

    Jdkanga: Did you hear on the news! The Government already has made 16 Billion on it’s investment in the car company’s. Sounds like an investment not a bail out and a pretty good one at that!    


  23. 23
    Tagamet

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:13 am)

    DonC: The Volt commercial sucked. I gave it a 2. I’d give these branding commercials a 10. They are very good. However, I’m just never sure how effective branding is, especially when you have a well known brand to begin with.

    TOUGH ROOM! (lol) More later – off to work.

    Be well,
    Tagamet


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    Dave K.

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:28 am)

    no comment: i think these are terrible ideas

    You are entitled to your opinion. Have you seen ads from the competition? Very few show real world normal driving conditions. Seems to work for them. Some motorcycle ads cartoon light speed with a rainbow trail of colors streaming behind. Not that it is what the motorcycle does. It’s how it makes you feel.
    Chevrolet shows several old pick ups with a dog in the back. Does this make Chevy more high tech, more advanced, more fun, or more reliable than Ford?
    I like the ad showing the Volt driving into dark conditions with a very long road ahead. Playing on it’s extended range. Another good one is the Volt silently winding down a country road. Recent Internet clips of Volt demo drivers offering their thoughts is another great way to go.
    As the price of gasoline heads North. GM will have an opportunity to effectively work this into Volt ads.

    =D-Volt


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    RB

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:36 am)

    On the back page of the front section of today’s WSJ (print edition, of course) there is a beautiful full page “Chevrolet runs deep” ad that centers on a picture of the Volt. Very nicely done.

    As the Volt is not for sale to readers, I am guessing that this ad is presented as strong advertising for the gm IPO that’s coming up, putting gm’s “best foot forward”, so to speak.


  26. 26
    FME III

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:38 am)

    I think these constitute a great brand-awareness campaign. I especially like the timing of the shot where the dog lifts his head into view from the truck bed just as the voice-over starts.

    The three 30s are more effective than the 60, though. That 60 caught in my craw ’cause I remember the dark years of the 1980s when GM abandoned quality and design and became a non-entity for a whole generation of car-buyers.

    I was among them. But the Volt has brought me back.


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    FME III

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:40 am)

    RB: On the back page of the front section of today’s WSJ (print edition, of course) there is a beautiful full page “Chevrolet runs deep” ad that centers on a picture of the Volt. Very nicely done.As the Volt is not for sale to readers, I am guessing that this ad is presented as strong advertising for the gm IPO that’s coming up, putting gm’s “best foot forward”, so to speak.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Hey, RB, my test drive on Monday in Raleigh is scheduled for 9:15. Did you get one?


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    Dave G

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:41 am)

    DonC: I’m just never sure how effective branding is, especially when you have a well known brand to begin with.
    I’m thinking that, if you had to choose, Chevy would be better off with great commercials for the cars and lousy commercials for the brand rather than vice versa, but that may just be me.

    Excellent point, +1.

    The only thing I tend to associate with a brand is reliability:
    cr_car_chart.jpg

    If it weren’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider an American brand. And if the Volt ends up costing many thousands of dollars more than the competition, GM may lose my business this time as well.


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    Roy H

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:47 am)

    I like the “warm fuzzy feeling”, good ads.


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    Somebody Special

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:53 am)

    I thought “Chevy” wasn’t to be used anymore.. I thought it was “Chevrolet” only….. Remember, the people who were in charge of advertising said they didn’t want to use the slang “Chevy”, as people didn’t assoiciate it with “Chevrolet”.. The good ol’ hippie days. Good commercials though.


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    BillR

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:57 am)

    Get a Chevy Volt and “Run Silent, Run Deep”.


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    VoltGuy

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:12 am)

    Here is another commercial that I had not seen but that my wife found. This is an older one as it uses the concept car. Pretty cool the way it ends with the disappearance for the Gas Station.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ITuKHpWKlQ&feature=related

    Jerry


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    jscott1

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:34 am)

    Thanks for posting that Lyle I missed them all.

    But what we need is not more commercials, but to get the price down to where more people could afford it. And get production up to where more people can buy it.


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    RB

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:35 am)

    FME III:
    Hey, RB, my test drive on Monday in Raleigh is scheduled for 9:15.Did you get one?    

    No, I didn’t. How do I sign up?


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    jscott1

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:45 am)

    RB: No, I didn’t. How do I sign up?  (Quote)  (Reply)

    In Houston, anyone who happened to walk by could get in line and drive. It kind of iritated me that I signed up for a time on line and people walking in off the street were ahead of me in line.


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    MichaelH

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:52 am)

    I liked the “babies” one. “As long as there are babies, there’ll be Chevy’s to bring them home in.” Chevt (GM) is here for the long haul, and Chevy’s are reliable to carry your most precious possessions. Strong message for young couples (or grandparents). :-)


  37. 37
    kdawg

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:56 am)

    103417.strip.gif


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    Nelson

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:07 am)

    I can see everyone who works for Campbell Ewald hating these commercials and everyone working for Goodby, Silverstein & Partners loving them. 30 second Commercials are pretty limited in what they can accomplish. It’s hard to explain a product and instill the urge to buy it in 30 seconds. Guess that’s why campaigns exist where each commercial does a particular thing. I liked these commercials, but would like to see more commercials that show what’s possible with the Chevy Volt.

    At 7:00am clock radio, weather man states cold spell rolled in overnight current temperature 36 deg. F, Volt owner picks up his smartphone changes Volt cabin temperature from 68 to 76 deg. Tagline “Volt possibilities” .

    Woman on PC using Google maps to look for a recommended restaurant finds it and sends directions to her Volt NAV. Tagline “Volt possibilities” .

    Young guy saves his music library on a USB flash drive takes it to his Volt and drives off listening to his favorite tune.
    Tagline “Volt possibilities” .

    Tree branch falls on power line causing a power outage on hot summer day. Volt owner plugs his refrigerator to an extension cord powered by his Volt.
    Tagline “Volt possibilities” .

    You get the picture.
    Show me the possibilities with a Volt.

    NPNS!


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    RB

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:09 am)

    35 jscott1 In Houston, anyone who happened to walk by could get in line and drive,

    Good to know. Thank you. My current understanding is that the stop in Raleigh is only 90 minutes long, so I may have to miss because of a work commitment on a Monday morning, but if possible I’ll be there. I loved the drive in NYC, but it would be nice to have a 2nd look. And if they were to drop some hints as to when sales in NC will begin, so much the better!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:17 am)

    28 Dave G reliability of a brand…,
    .
    The graph (thanks) shows reliability of manufacturers, not brands. Within gm, my impression from personal experience is that the brands vary markedly. For me, Chevy has not been well built or reliable, while Buick has been very well built and considerably more reliable than my Honda cars. Of course, that’s a very small sample, but I have seen it come out that way in aggregates, too. In part it may reflect quality variations between different gm divisions and plants. Some though seem quite good.


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    Fahrvergnugen Fanboy

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:21 am)

    The-grump: (Treason. Any official supporting this should be tried, convicted, and executed by firing squad – on national TV as a lesson to all). When gas prices go up, everyone except the rich suffers – the poor suffer the most.

    I’m with you on the poor — but we can find ways to help the poor without having long-term disastrous cheap-gas-forever energy policies that in the end will hurt the poor even more.

    I think most of the knee-jerk opposition to gas-price increase is not from the poor at all, but from people who just *need* a 6,000-pound, 300-horsepower, 4-wheel-drive vehicle to drive Biff and Muffy across town to soccer practice.


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    wolfdoctor

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:27 am)

    Yesterday I gave a well thought out opinion and I was blasted with negatives. I suspect the regulars on this site aren’t as mature or open-minded as they think they are.


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    Jim in PA

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:31 am)

    The “Runs Deep” commercial would have resounded better with me if the “Strength of America” was not juxtaposed against testing a Canadian-assembled Camaro. It’s a great car, and Canada is a great country, but if you are going to try and pull heart strings you can’t have inconsistencies like that. At least for people who know the details.


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    Jim in PA

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:32 am)

    wolfdoctor,

    wolfdoctor: Yesterday I gave a well thought out opinion and I was blasted with negatives. I suspect the regulars on this site aren’t as mature or open-minded as they think they are.

    Care to re-post for the rest of us?


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    Matthew B

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:33 am)

    Jdkanga: Did you hear on the news! The Government already has made 16 Billion on it’s (sic) investment in the car company’s. Sounds like an investment not a bail out and a pretty good one at that!    

    They are going to attempt to sell $16B in stock.

    Until some one buys it they haven’t got anything yet.

    Usually when someone talks about “made $16B on its investment” that means $16B profit. With $47B in investment, “making” $16B would mean selling $63B in stock.


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    Nelson

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:34 am)

    Dave G: Excellent point, +1.The only thing I tend to associate with a brand is reliability:If it weren’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider an American brand. And if the Volt ends up costing many thousands of dollars more than the competition, GM may lose my business this time as well.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    The flaw with your graph is that it’s ten or more years old. I guess it has to be. It says nothing of current production technology. It assumes nothing changed in ten or more years. I bet Toyota recalls aren’t depicted on that graph. The graph is useless.

    NPNS.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:36 am)

    Dave G: If it weren’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider an American brand. And if the Volt ends up costing many thousands of dollars more than the competition, GM may lose my business this time as well.

    Totally agreed. +1 to you.


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    CorvetteGuy

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:39 am)

    Seeing all of the commercials back to back was great! I’m thrilled that this new agency has fresh ideas and does not rely on has been football heroes and lawnmowers to pitch the Chevrolet name. These are great for “setting the tone”, in the next batch I hope we see a little ‘education’ as to why Voltec is more gas-free and gas-friendly than an old fashioned hybrid.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:41 am)

    wolfdoctor: Yesterday I gave a well thought out opinion and I was blasted with negatives.I suspect the regulars on this site aren’t as mature or open-minded as they think they are.    

    Yesterday, the trolls were running wild. Well thought out opinions are usually debated.
    Perhaps you can re-post it here?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:47 am)

    Here’s what I wrote yesterday:

    “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary. If you buy a volt with the intent of constantly being on the road then you would probably use a lot less fuel if you were to buy a diesel. I don’t get it.”

    I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.

    I guess you have to decide if I was a troll.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:49 am)

    wolfdoctor: Yesterday I gave a well thought out opinion and I was blasted with negatives.I suspect the regulars on this site aren’t as mature or open-minded as they think they are.    

    Yesterday was all about trolls who vote as well. I suspect that the voting was way off of normal.


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    Fahrvergnugen Fanboy

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:03 am)

    Loboc: Yesterday was all about trolls who vote as well. I suspect that the voting was way off of normal.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    This morning I posted the most rational, sane thing I’ve ever posted here, and I got immediately negativized. I suppose I did indulge in stereotyping Biff and Muffy — mea culpa. As for tradespeople who legitimately need a 6,000-pound truck to do their work — God bless you, and thanks for making this country work as well as it still does: I wasn’t talking about you; let’s cut your taxes in some other way. Other than that, I’d love to know what my negativizer was disagreeing with.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:06 am)

    Jim in PA: The “Runs Deep” commercial would have resounded better with me if the “Strength of America” was not juxtaposed against testing a Canadian-assembled Camaro. It’s a great car, and Canada is a great country, but if you are going to try and pull heart strings you can’t have inconsistencies like that. At least for people who know the details.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    My favorite inconsistencies are the songs that play for some ads. Like Carnival Cruise Lines using Iggy Pop’s Lust For Life. They just played the “lust for life” words over & over, but left out all the dark images that are the rest of the song. Kinda like a religous commercial using John Lennon’s Imagine.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:11 am)

    Those are great ! I am going to go right out an buy a 55.
    Tom


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:13 am)

    the voting thing is pretty stupid in my opinion, and i personally don’t pay any attention to them. i’ve seen posts that seem to have little substance but get big positive votes, and i’ve seen other posts and wonder why they got negative votes. there aren’t typically that many posts that get hidden because of negative votes so it’s easy to open them to see what is in them and make up your own mind as to whether the comments are of any worth.

    wolfdoctor: Yesterday I gave a well thought out opinion and I was blasted with negatives.I suspect the regulars on this site aren’t as mature or open-minded as they think they are.    


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    caldoodlevolt

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:13 am)

    Look at today’s count down (they fixed their 19 delay time a a while ago). It’s less than two weeks to P-Day (Production Day at the HAMD action zone). Cars will be assembled by those Detroit lightning bugs for you and me. Can’t wait to see mine. Tomorrow’s car today.

    BIG BTRY

    P.S. Speaking of GM nostalgia. The biggest hit of the 1939-40 New York City World’s Fair according to many critics (after the hootchy koochy) was GM’s massive exhibit entitled the World of Tomorow in Transportation. They even had a tiny portion of a super highway, at a time when only Hitler knew what this meant. It looked exactly like the Interstate today (right on the nose GM, just like the Volt).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:17 am)

    wolfdoctor: “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary.

    You are correct. My commute, until recently, was 101 miles per day round trip.
    I want the Volt, but it was pointed out to me that I would be better off with something else unless
    I could re-charge at work. That point was well taken by me and still is.

    +1 to you. Yesterday was a very bad troll day. Until Lyle gets serious about these people, they will continue to ruin this site. My suggestion is this: After 20 negative votes, the comment gets automatically deleted.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:18 am)

    wolfdoctor,

    You are correct in saying there are better alternatives to the Volt if you are going to be on the road 24 x 7. I didn’t think the commercial was trying to imply 24 x 7 driving = (“going far, really far”). In fact I thought (“going far, really far”) implies “a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary”.
    I would rephrase as; “an electric car that can go as far as any other car on the road, when necessary”.

    NPNS!


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    flmark

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:19 am)

    Being a fan of all things energy conserving, I am getting frustrated with commercials that do little to sway an uninformed buyer toward greener buying choices.

    Attention GM, watch this ad-
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrGr8-g1cik It is for a heat pump water heater and is little better than your recent offerings. At least this commercial puts you in the ball park of knowing that you are making a energy-conscious, forward-thinking purchase.

    If you need an entire society to rethink its paradigm, you need to do better the visual pleasantry…and if 30 seconds is all you’ve got, make it 60 seconds and run it half as often. Many people call this ‘the information age’, so give us some already. I am getting tired of ad agencies that emphasize style and ignore substance.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:19 am)

    Along similar lines, here is a description of a new Chrysler ad:
    “Rival Chrysler Group LLC is currently playing up an all-American theme in its pitches. A current TV ad for the Dodge Challenger, called “Freedom,” features a novel take on the American Revolution. In the spot, colonists, led by George Washington, attack the British using cars, instead of horses. “Here are a couple of things America got right. Cars and freedom,” the voice-over intones.”

    This comes from an article in the Wall Street Journal on GM’s TV advertising campaign
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304173704575578073119960604.html


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    bookdabook

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:21 am)

    wolfdoctor: “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”).

    I guarantee the commercials for not using gas are coming. This was an intro-mercial.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:21 am)

    Fahrvergnugen Fanboy: This morning I posted the most rational, sane thing I’ve ever posted here, and I got immediately negativized.

    Patience grasshopper. You’re at +1 now. Don’t take a few votes so personally and wait until the afternoon (5pm EDT) when most of the base has weighed in.

    /unfortunately, trolls seem to be on PDT.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:23 am)

    kdawg,

    If you look at some of the campaigns they come up with, that seem true sometimes.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:25 am)

    rhellie: TV ad for the Dodge Challenger

    Being a Dodge fanboi, I love that commercial.

    In the near future, electric motors will make Hemi look wimpy I’m thinking. Chrysler/Fiat needs to get with the program and build the 200C EV. That is one beautiful concept car.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:27 am)

    Larry: I watched all (4) commercials. They really give you a “warm fuzzy” feeling about Chevy… just hope it leads to more Volts being manufactured and sold.    

    I watched these 4 TV ads & realized as each one ended that it had made me smile! It was like test driving a Volt, which made me smile a “Volt smile” …and I’m told that happens to Tesla drivers too! But I doubt, since Tesla’s range is limited, that a Tesla smile is quite as broad as a Volt smile! ;) ;)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:28 am)

    Interesting commercials. Brings back a lot of memories. Fond memories, I might add. I really wish Chevrolet luck. I hope they have huge success all across the brand.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:28 am)

    ,

    kdawg:   (Quote)  (Reply)

    My dad had a gig in the ’50s as a radio station ad guy. On the back of his business card it read: “An engineer is a person who knows a whole lot about very little, whereas a salesman is a person who knows very little about a whole lot”.

    There used to be a joke that German car companies could be personified by three engineers and a marketing guy; Japanese car companies: two engineers and two marketing guys and American car companies: three marketing guys and an engineer who moonlights as a marketing guy!

    What I like about the Volt best – is that, while it’s apparent cost cutting happened here and there, primarily the target was met because it’s a car so heavily controlled on the side of American engineering. So for once, the “American Pie” ad hyperbole actually matches the substance of the car to a great extent. Buick Regals made in Germany, Cruzes largely developed in S. Korea and Europe and Camaros in Australia – not so much.

    PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),

    James


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:29 am)

    Rashiid Amul: My suggestion is this: After 20 negative votes, the comment gets automatically deleted.

    Be careful what you ask for. 20 unique IPs controlled by one crazy troll could wipe out the entire forum.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:37 am)

    wolfdoctor: “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary.

    I don’t think that’s right. The Volt was intended to be a car for every occasion. A car acceptable for a one car family. It does not have to be pigeon-holed as a “commuter” or a “city” car. It can handle every location, event, anytime, any weather. No worries, no anxiety. Just do your thing; the Volt works.

    Plus, for the first 40 miles (or so! Depends on you)) of every day, you use no gas. If you can charge intraday, its even better.

    If you are driving 100-150+ miles a day and can’t charge during the day, then its probably not for you. Seems simple to me.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:43 am)

    wolfdoctor: Here’s what I wrote yesterday:
    “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary. If you buy a volt with the intent of constantly being on the road then you would probably use a lot less fuel if you were to buy a diesel. I don’t get it.”
    I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.
    I guess you have to decide if I was a troll.

    Hi Wolfdoctor. Thanks for coming back and re-posting. I suspect if you got a lot of negative votes yesterday, it was more a knee jerk reaction to the barrage of negative comments being posted yesterday by other very argumentative people. Don’t take it personally. Rashiid is right in saying that normally posts of any viewpoint are normally debated with respect here. I have been coming to this site since near its beginning, and there are some of the most thoughtful, intelligent people on the internet coming here daily to discuss and bounce ideas off of each other. I have personally learned a wealth of knowledge from many here in the time I have been coming. And the site’s owner, Lyle is one of the nicest people you can find. Hope you continue to come back and find this site as welcoming as we regulars have found it to be.

    Now, regarding the commercial, I think if taken in isolation, I agree in that it didn’t cover the myriad of abilities and qualities of the Volt. But I think GM’s thought was to have a series of commercials about the Volt, this being the first, and to express the freedom it can give you vs. its EV competitors. Just my take on it.

    Again, “welcome” if you are new here and look forward to talking with you in the future.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:49 am)

    wolfdoctor: I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.

    See what a difference a day makes! Ha ha.

    A fair number of people thought the commercial did a fine job of distinguishing the Volt from the Leaf but little to sell the Volt to those (99.9%?) not already committed to buying an EV. So yeah, no mention of the EV component or why you want it.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:51 am)

    Rashiid Amul: You are correct. My commute, until recently, was 101 miles per day round trip.

    Nice to see you back posting Rashiid! Let’s work on getting that commute down to 40 miles!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:52 am)

    no comment: the volt commercial didn’t do much for me either, but it is part of an advertising campaign, so you really have to see more of the campaign to see how good the advertising is.to a certain extent, what was good about the volt commercial is that it was more suggestive instead of trying to hit you with a lot of facts.in this case, there is the suggestion that there is an electric vehicle that doesn’t limit your mobility.of course, it doesn’t answer the question of why someone would want to consider an electric car in the first place.it’s a new technology, so you don’t want to risk confusing people by hitting them with too much too soon.i think that the approach taken with the first volt commercial a good way to go in general, but we will have to see more to assess what the marketing communication strategy really is.
        

    I agree in general with your take, however electric cars in fact are not a new technology – it’s just that they have never caught on because all the promise they possess has been nixed by their limitations. The Volt breaks through all the old barriers to redefine what not only what an electric car is, but also what any car can be but has never been before.

    That’s what I think the basis of the Volt message ought to be.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:02 am)

    Jim in PA: The “Runs Deep” commercial would have resounded better with me if the “Strength of America” was not juxtaposed against testing a Canadian-assembled Camaro.I.    

    Hey! Last I checked, Canada is part of America too! :smile:


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:04 am)

    Nelson: The flaw with your graph is that it’s ten or more years old.

    The graph is from April 2010. It shows the frequency of problems vs. the age of the vehicle. For example, the vertical 3 line on the graph corresponds to a 2007 model year.

    Looking at years 1-4 on the chart (2006-2010), we see GM and Chrysler tied for last place:
    cr_car_chart.jpg


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:12 am)

    Dave G: If it weren’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider an American brand.

    Among other things, such as it represents one set of surveys which is inconsistent with other surveys like the JD Powers surveys, I think this chart is too backward looking. Even Consumer Reports now says that the Ford Fusion is a more reliable car than a Toyota Camry. But you’re looking at Ford vehicles from 10 years ago. Hyundai also jumps out at me as horribly misleading or just plain wrong. Hyundai is making very nice and reliable cars.

    FWIW if you changed the Y axis from problems per 100 cars to problems per car you’d barely be able to distinguish the separation of the lines. Though I don’t think this is purposeful it’s a cheap statistical trick that hides the fact there isn’t much difference between the manufacturers.

    Personally I don’t think any of these surveys have much to do with the Volt. The first generation Volt will be the best built Volt of all time. When you make anything you can do it the safe way or the “BP” way, meaning a way which is less safe but less expensive. Knowing that everyone is watching, GM is building the Volt the safe way (ditto for Nissan and the Leaf), which is really no big deal when you’re building such a limited number of cars. This doesn’t mean that the Volt won’t have any problems, but it does mean that it is being built to last. And last. And last. IOW you’re not going to see the cheap parts you now see on a Toyota. (The unsealed gas pedal that was recalled is a good example of what I’m talking about).

    No doubt that in each successive generation the engineers will take out costs and at some point the quality of the parts and the design will equal that of standard vehicles. But the first generation is a whole different ballgame.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:23 am)

    All in all I think the ads were well-done. There were a few moments where they were borderline cheesy, sort of reminiscent of “the Heartbeat of America” ads from the 90′s. The tone of the ads seems appropriate given that a lot of Americans are in a dour mood due since we’re in a recession and there is some nostalgia for the “good ole’ days” where everything from salt shakers to electron microscopes were made in the USA verus today where the opinion is that we make absolutely nothing anymore. These have a somewhat careful patriotic feel but they feel more all-inclusive versus the “Heartbeat” ads which felt almost totally aimed at middle America.

    I just saw the soon-to-be-released ad for the Volt on the Chevy Voltage site. It too is well done. But if there’s any ad I’l like to see it would be one that advertises the Volt like any other car. I say this because the sentiment these days- particularly among more conservatives- is that anything that doesn’t run exclusively on gas is a conspiracy and not to be trusted. We definitely see this with the Prius where the car became politicized and anyone who even remotely resembles a conservative wouldn’t touch one with a 10 foot pole. If GM could somehow also do some markting of these cars to middle America, perhaps they would sell more of them. My suggestion would be to market it as an “American car”, designed, engineered, and built in the US of A. Make out to be this vehicle that defies current assumptions that we don’t make anything anymore. A symbol of American ingenuity. Perhaps make one with Taylor Swift driving it. Either way, they cannot go down the road they did with marketing EV1. This needs to be seen as a car that gets you places more than anything else.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:35 am)

    RB: The graph (thanks) shows reliability of manufacturers, not brands. Within gm, my impression from personal experience is that the brands vary markedly.

    Yes, and within each brand, reliability can vary quite a lot as well. For example, the V6 Toyota Camry has had more problems than the 4 cylinder Camry, but both are noticeably better than the Malibu.
    Camry_Malibu.jpg


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:39 am)

    flmark: Being a fan of all things energy conserving, I am getting frustrated with commercials that do little to sway an uninformed buyer toward greener buying choices.

    If you need an entire society to rethink its paradigm, you need to do better the visual pleasantry

    I understand your point, and I liked the GE commercial, but ads are designed to sell a product not get society to rethink its paradigm. That’s going to take a lot more work than a few 30 second ads, even for Don Draper.

    One interesting point if that the hybrid GE water heater uses 1,856 kWh a year. That’s a claimed 62% less energy than a standard electric water heater, but still enough to power a Volt 7,832 miles! I think that once people starting thinking it terms of EV miles — if I switch out those ten light bulbs I can drive 35 miles a week free or, if I get that water heater along with it I get 7,832 free driving miles — a lot more people will be interested in energy saving appliances. I think right now very few people have any idea of even what a kWh is, much less how much they could save if they paid attention.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:43 am)

    Dave G,

    What the graph tells me is that cars bought in the year 2000 had relatively the same number of problems per hundred vehicles the first year bought. That same year 2000 vehicle had more problems in its second year and subsequent years. Basically stating a 2000 Toyota has fewer issues today then a 2000 Volkswagen does. It would be unintelligent to assume a 2010 Toyota will have less issues then a 2010 Hyundai ten years from now based on that graph. That graph is only useful if one were in the market to buy a used 2000 vehicle. If you’re looking for reliability in a used year 2000 car, the graph tells me buy a 2000 Toyota or Honda.

    NPNS!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:47 am)

    The logic of this approach escapes me. Since the Volt is aimed squarely at the conscious-striken global warming hysterics under 40, trotting out commercials attempting to remind them of olden days that weren’t their’s doesn’t seem sensible. But then, since when did advertising agencies
    know anything about target groups, etc.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:50 am)

    I know it will never happen, but it would be funny to see this guy showing off the INSIDE of the 2011 Chevy Volt:

    galaxyquest2.jpg


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:51 am)

    Dave G: Yes, and within each brand, reliability can vary quite a lot as well. For example, the V6 Toyota Camry has had more problems than the 4 cylinder Camry, but both are noticeably better than the Malibu.

    Hmmmmm. What I see is Toyota quality going down and Chevy quality going up. In some ways this shouldn’t be a revelation. You can see that just by looking at the cars for the last few years. (My last three cars have been Hondas so no dog in this fight).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:02 am)

    DonC:….FWIW if you changed the Y axis from problems per 100 cars to problems per car you’d barely be able to distinguish the separation of the lines. Though I don’t think this is purposeful it’s a cheap statistical trick that hides the fact there isn’t much difference between the manufacturers.

    Personally I don’t think any of these surveys have much to do with the Volt.

    You raise two key points that I fully agree with, Don. First, that showing the # of problems/100 cars is a statistician’s means of making the very small differences between cars (and CR’s efforts) seem much more significant. For example, at 4 years the CR chart in post #75 above shows the worst case as Chrysler at about 0.6 problems/car vs Toyota at about 0.3/car (or as shown, ~60problems/
    100cars vs ~30/100cars). And this “statistical trick” as you call it, Don, makes the difference seem to be much more significant than it actually is. I agree.

    Your second point, that none of “these surveys have much to do with the Volt” is also a key point. Why? Because the Volt’s EV drive train is completely independent of its ICE/generator. So if my Volt’s fuel pump fails I can still travel an average of 40 miles as an EV, whereas a fuel pump failure in a conventional car will leave it disabled by the roadside.*

    /*The CR article says, “Starting with the 2010 survey, ‘engine electrical’ now includes hybrid battery and related system in addition to other charging and ignition systems”, which means none of the data presented this year fully applies. Furthermore, CR does not (and IMO probably will not) separate catastrophic failures (those that totally disable a car) from non-disabling failures —even though the Volt has two independent power sources, either of which can propel the car.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:03 am)

    kent beuchert: Since the Volt is aimed squarely at the conscious-striken global warming hysterics under 40

    why not just add jews and gays and insult everyone?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:07 am)

    Nelson: It assumes nothing changed in ten or more years. I bet Toyota recalls aren’t depicted on that graph. The graph is useless.

    I wouldn’t go as far as to say the graph is useless. But it’s not accurate, for sure. For instance, my two previous cars were an Honda Accord and a Volks Golf. Although I did have slightly more troubles with the Golf, it was way more solid and roadworthy after 16 years than the Accord after 9 years.

    So yes, I did have a bigger number of problems but generally I feel the car was better for the long run. So the graph doesn’t say all there is to know.


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    MetrologyFirst

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:09 am)

    Dave G:
    Yes, and within each brand, reliability can vary quite a lot as well.For example, the V6 Toyota Camry has had more problems than the 4 cylinder Camry, but both are noticeably better than the Malibu.
        

    Dave G,

    I usually agree to almost everything you post. But posting Consumer Reports garbage? What a bunch of crap. I believe NONE of it. Opinions by a bunch of self selected people who know little about cars. They need to stick with toasters.

    I do believe though that they are keeping the illusion that domestics are inferior to imports thru their cute little black dots.

    The problem is we have no idea what the difference is between a little red dot and a little black dot; or how that gap has changed since they started this type of graphical representation. It’s just junk. Visual vomit.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:09 am)

    Dave G: but both are noticeably better than the Malibu

    Not the ’08 and ’09 models. They’re essentially tied with Toyota. And the Malibus’ trend is up and Camrys’ are down. But your overall point is, of course, true.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:10 am)

    DonC: What I see is Toyota quality going down and Chevy quality going up. In some ways this shouldn’t be a revelation.

    It’s “The changing of the guards”. It was bound to happen. No “One” company will stay on the totem pole forever. It’s all human nature.
    I’m not mocking Toyota, it’s just the inevitable.

    /im just sayin….


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:11 am)

    Dave G:
    The graph is from April 2010.It shows the frequency of problems vs. the age of the vehicle.For example, the vertical 3 line on the graph corresponds to a 2007 model year.Looking at years 1-4 on the chart (2006-2010), we see GM and Chrysler tied for last place:
        

    Lesson learned here is don’t ever get a Volkswagen. I bought one about 11 years old and it was the worst time of my young car ownership life. They are fine for the first few years, basically until their warranty expires, then you are paying through the nose to keep it going as they charge about $600 for even the cheapest parts from a dealer and often times they are the only ones that make them (by some happy coincidence).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:13 am)

    CorvetteGuy: I know it will never happen, but it would be funny to see this guy showing off the INSIDE of the 2011 Chevy Volt:

    lol…..
    Aw man, I remember that movie, funny as hell. Even funnier after a couple of beers.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:13 am)

    I really liked #3. This decade just might feature the last of the gas guzzlers so we better enjoy them while they last. Or more directly, as long as the cheap oil lasts.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:13 am)

    wolfdoctor: I guess you have to decide if I was a troll.

    You certainly were not. But unfortunately we were sort of under siege and I guess some votes were not well cast.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:14 am)

    MetrologyFirst: I don’t think that’s right. The Volt was intended to be a car for every occasion. A car acceptable for a one car family. It does not have to be pigeon-holed as a “commuter” or a “city” car. It can handle every location, event, anytime, any weather. No worries, no anxiety. Just do your thing; the Volt works.Plus, for the first 40 miles (or so! Depends on you)) of every day, you use no gas. If you can charge intraday, its even better.If you are driving 100-150+ miles a day and can’t charge during the day, then its probably not for you. Seems simple to me.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    ———————-
    I did the math, and you are correct. Assuming a 150 mile commute at 36 MPG in CS mode, you would travel 110 miles on gas. At 36 MPG, that’s 3.05 gallons of gas. 150.00 miles divided by 3.05 gallons = 49.1 combined MPG (with the 40 electric miles factored in). I must admit, I’m surprised.

    If you do commute that far, the Prius would be a lower priced option, while delivering the same MPG overall. Of course, if you commute 150 miles every day, you have both my sympathy and my pity. My 85 mile commute is bad enough. Thank God for Sirius radio.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:18 am)

    Dave G, post #78: Yes, and within each brand, reliability can vary quite a lot as well. For example, the V6 Toyota Camry has had more problems than the 4 cylinder Camry, but both are noticeably better than the Malibu.

    And note that the ’09 Malibu has as many full-red bullseyes as the ’09 4-cyl Camry and MORE than the ’09 V6 Camry, reflecting GM’s recent heavy emphasis on quality & reliability. Also, please note my comments in post #84 (and DonC’s in Post #76) that the differences between brands (as well as individual models) are really extremely small, so CR exaggerates them by multiplying them by a factor of 100.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:18 am)

    Fahrvergnugen Fanboy: This morning I posted the most rational, sane thing I’ve ever posted here, and I got immediately negativized.

    At this moment, you are at +6 for the comment you are talking about. Could it be that the negative votes were not a clear indication of the general consensus ?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:20 am)

    in a subtle way, they are playing to the “range anxiety” theme you will notice that in the commercial they talked up all the stuff about “freedom” and spontaneity with regard to going where you want to go when you want to go. it is one of the basic differentiators of the ER-EV concept over the BEV concept. the “going far, really far” is a subtle way of saying that with the volt you don’t have “range anxiety”. keep in mind that they aren’t trying to give you the whole ball of wax on the volt in one 30 second spot, so i expect that this theme will be developed further in future commercials.

    i will add that i think that you have misinterpreted how gm is trying to position the volt: they are not trying to position the volt as a commuter car – commuter cars are generally viewed as 2nd cars. they are trying to position the volt as a car that can be the only car in your household.

    wolfdoctor: Here’s what I wrote yesterday:“I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary. If you buy a volt with the intent of constantly being on the road then you would probably use a lot less fuel if you were to buy a diesel. I don’t get it.”I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.I guess you have to decide if I was a troll.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:21 am)

    edvard: My suggestion would be to market it as an “American car”, designed, engineered, and built in the US of A. Make out to be this vehicle that defies current assumptions that we don’t make anything anymore. A symbol of American ingenuity. Perhaps make one with Taylor Swift driving it.

    And show the designers and engineers and builders doing their thing, right here at home. No need to actually state that all those things are done in the US. Just show it and people will catch on. After all, a lot of GM vehicles are sourced somewhere else. Have to tread lightly or the obvious hypocracy will torpedo your image.

    Best approach, though, IMHO, is to just compete using the results–what a great, unique car! And what a refreshing way to market it that would be! And what a refreshing way to develop a business. One of the things I like best about the Volt program is the emphasis on PRODUCT. When’s the last time you could say THAT with a new GM vehicle–well thought out, truly world-class and world-leading. Time to be proud of the accomplishment. People like winners. AMERICA could sure use one (oops–that would be Ford!).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:24 am)

    Dave G: If it weren’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider an American brand. And if the Volt ends up costing many thousands of dollars more than the competition, GM may lose my business this time as well.

    It’s been pretty well documented that Toyota’s quality has declined. They are not making the same quality cars today than they did 10 years ago. Even the CEO of the company admitted it. And with the yen at historic highs–it will be hard to change that while maintaining profitability.

    Also, that chart just counts the number of problems. Personally, I’d rather have to change a windshield wiper than have faulty brakes…And Toyota’s issues all seemed pretty serious…

    http://www.businessweek.com/autos/autobeat/archives/2010/01/toyota_recall_just_keeps_getting_uglier.html

    http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-05-25/toyota-sudden-acceleration-may-be-tied-to-89-deaths-u-s-says.html


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:24 am)

    wolfdoctor: I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.    

    They did show the Volt electrical connection at the home, mentioned “electric car” and displayed the text “electric” and put in small text about the generator. But as earlier posts mentioned, it’s difficult to show much in a 30 second commercial. If it gets people to visit a web site, Chevy dealer, or discuss the Volt with others, more details will be learned and more Volts will be ordered.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:27 am)

    Tall Pete: So yes, I did have a bigger number of problems but generally I feel the car was better for the long run. So the graph doesn’t say all there is to know

    Graphs can never tell the whole story. They can exaggerate differences or hide them, show trends or create them, and entertain.

    Only the best graphs from those who know how to design them and present an unbiased point of view can be helpful to those of us looking for knowledge, and not a justification of our own opinions.

    There is a great book called “The Visual Display of Quantitative Information” by Tufte. Identifies the techniques to show info and mislead as well. Great stuff and worth the read. Everytime I see a graph or chart, I think about this book and how to spot the illusions.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:30 am)

    The Grump: combined MPG (with the 40 electric miles factored in).

    No offense Grump but blending in the EV miles driven in with MPG, I think is just wrong.
    Here’s an example…
    You get home and your screen tells you that you got 89mpg. Your tank has 1 gallon of gas and the next day you have to go 75 miles but you forgot to charge but your screen reads out you got 89mpg. Will you make it?

    OR

    If I were at the top of a mountain in the Sierra Nevada’s and left to go to my favorite “Wild Horse Saloon” in Nevada and coasted for 15 miles downhill in neutral and counted those miles in my ICE car and I get 69mpg, is that right?

    I still think the EPA should NOT “Blend” AER with CS mode.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:32 am)

    after 10 negative votes the comment is hidden but not deleted. if you want to see the comment all you need to do is to click on the hidden comment. i don’t see “trolling” as being the problem that you apparently see it to be; i think that there is a much larger volume of comments that, while positive about the volt, have little to no information value; and some are outright stupid. it’s still not a problem as far as i’m concerned because it is easy to read over those comments. i mean, i don’t imagine that lyle is going to want to invest the time to moderate every posting, although this site does seem to scan for keywords, typically references to what appear to be competing volt blogs, that trigger a moderation screen (in which case it probably will just not be posted).

    Rashiid Amul:
    Yesterday was a very bad troll day.Until Lyle gets serious about these people, they will continue to ruin this site.My suggestion is this:After 20 negative votes, the comment gets automatically deleted.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:32 am)

    rhellie: Along similar lines, here is a description of a new Chrysler ad:
    “Rival Chrysler Group LLC is currently playing up an all-American theme in its pitches. A current TV ad for the Dodge Challenger, called “Freedom,” features a novel take on the American Revolution. In the spot, colonists, led by George Washington, attack the British using cars, instead of horses. “Here are a couple of things America got right. Cars and freedom,” the voice-over intones.”

    Since Chrysler’s now an Italian company, talk about misleading….


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:33 am)

    MetrologyFirst: There is a great book called “The Visual Display of Quantitative Information” by Tufte. Identifies the techniques to show info and mislead as well. Great stuff and worth the read. Everytime I see a graph or chart, I think about this book and how to spot the illusions.

    Reminds me of my dad, an engineer, refusing to look at graphs that did not have 0 as the baseline. How many times do we see the lack of perspective by making a small difference look huge?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:35 am)

    What they don’t show is the first try, where the dogs in the pickup do the Chevy Volt Dance, as the newborn baby comes out to breakdance in the middle (or whatever it was that guy did at the auto show) while the entire board flames me for bringing this up.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:36 am)

    CaptJackSparrow: lol…..Aw man, I remember that movie, funny as hell. Even funnier after a couple of beers.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    “By Grabthar’s Hammer… I will avenge thee!” :)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:36 am)

    nasaman: Because the Volt’s EV drive train is completely independent of its ICE/generator. So if my Volt’s fuel pump fails I can still travel an average of 40 miles as an EV, whereas a fuel pump failure in a conventional car will leave it disabled by the roadside.*

    Sorry to disagree here but if your Volt’s fuel pump fails, you will only discover it while in CS mode. At that time, you don’t have 40 EV miles left.

    I will agree that you still can plug your car and eventually you will be able to run 40 EV miles but that doesn’t guarantee that you won’t be left by the roadside.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:36 am)

    depending upon your point of reference, there were electric drive cars 100 years ago, but when they figured out how to do electronic ignition with internal combustion engines (a sort of “hybrid” for the time), the electric drive cars faded. but in reality, to most of the public, the electric car is a new concept.

    stuart22:
    I agree in general with your take, however electric cars in fact are not a new technology – it’s just that they have never caught on because all the promise they possess has been nixed by their limitations.The Volt breaks through all the old barriers to redefine what not only what an electric car is, but also what any car can be but has never been before.That’s what I think the basis of the Volt message ought to be.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:37 am)

    MetrologyFirst: …The problem is we have no idea what the difference is between a little red dot and a little black dot; or how that gap has changed since they started this type of graphical representation. It’s just junk. Visual vomit

    I’m not sure I fully agree, but your point is well taken as a whole. One of the FAQs CR asks itself & answers is:

    QUES: “What expertise does CR’s survey staff have?
    ANS: CR’s Annual Questionnaire is constructed and implemented by the staff of our National Research Center. The staff of this department includes professional social scientists, some with more than 30 years of experience in constructing, conducting, and interpreting large-scale surveys. The automobile section of the survey is developed in consultation with CR’s automotive engineers and statisticians to ensure that we are capturing the most important aspects of auto reliability. The data is analyzed by professional statisticians and survey analysts.”

    I take from this that CR’s “social scientists” are providing the overall leadership in this automotive reliability survey. My question is, “What in the name of good sense does automobile reliability have to do with social science?!?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:44 am)

    nasaman: The data is analyzed by professional statisticians and survey analysts.

    Now I understand!!! No wonder CR’s stuff is useless!!!

    We have a rule; don’t EVER give your data to a statistician if you want to learn anything useful. :)

    Hopefully no statisticians frequent this board. :)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:46 am)

    MetrologyFirst: We have a rule; don’t EVER give your data to a statistician if you want to learn anything useful.

    I learned how to tweak number in stats calss….. :-P


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:50 am)

    CorvetteGuy: I know it will never happen, but it would be funny to see this guy showing off the INSIDE of the 2011 Chevy Volt:  (Quote)  (Reply)

    How about Tim’s Santa Clause personna for the Christmas sales of Volts?

    Raymond


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:55 am)

    CaptJackSparrow:
    No offense Grump but blending in the EV miles driven in with MPG, I think is just wrong.
    Here’s an example…
    You get home and your screen tells you that you got 89mpg. Your tank has 1 gallon of gas and the next day you have to go 75 miles but you forgot to charge but your screen reads out you got 89mpg. Will you make it?ORIf I were at the top of a mountain in the Sierra Nevada’s and left to go to my favorite “Wild Horse Saloon” in Nevada and coasted for 15 miles downhill in neutral and counted those miles in my ICE car and I get 69mpg, is that right?I still think the EPA should NOT “Blend” AER with CS mode.    

    Nobody is asking you to calculate the remaining range based on prior mpg. The range estimate is constantly displayed by the car. In other words, the Volt will always tell you how far you can go (on battery or on gasoline) despite what the lifetime mpg reading might be.

    From an energy conservation standpoint, you’re correct not to include EV miles in a kWh/mile calculation. But in literal terms MPG could mean “Total Miles Traveled / Gallons of gasoline consumed”. If you’re starting with a full battery and get 40 “free” EV miles, so be it….because we’re being LITERAL.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:56 am)

    Tall Pete: Sorry to disagree here but if your Volt’s fuel pump fails, you will only discover it while in CS mode. At that time, you don’t have 40 EV miles left.

    I will agree that you still can plug your car and eventually you will be able to run 40 EV miles but that doesn’t guarantee that you won’t be left by the roadside.

    You’re right, Tall Pete —a very valid point, and one reason I’ve been “lobbying” GM to provide the so-called “Hold” mode as in Ampera for Europeans (same as or similar to Volt’s “Mountain Mode”). On trips likely to exceed my EV range I could simply engage Mountain or Hold modes long enough to both build up some battery reserve and to verify the ICE/gen drive train is OK.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:57 am)

    Check out the new Chevy Volt windshield graphic that will come installed on the consumer advisory board cars:

    http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?5478-Chevy-Volt-Windshield-Graphic


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:00 pm)

    The Volt ad posted yesterday was very nice. These all sucked.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:01 pm)

    Lyle: Check out the new Chevy Volt windshield graphic that will come installed on the consumer advisory board cars:

    http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?5478-Chevy-Volt-Windshield-Graphic

    Clean, nice simple graphic, Lyle! When will they deliver it? ;) ;) ;)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:02 pm)

    DonC: I understand your point, and I liked the GE commercial, but ads are designed to sell a product not get society to rethink its paradigm. That’s going to take a lot more work than a few 30 second ads, even for Don Draper.One interesting point if that the hybrid GE water heater uses 1,856 kWh a year. That’s a claimed 62% less energy than a standard electric water heater, but still enough to power a Volt 7,832 miles! I think that once people starting thinking it terms of EV miles — if I switch out those ten light bulbs I can drive 35 miles a week free or, if I get that water heater along with it I get 7,832 free driving miles — a lot more people will be interested in energy saving appliances. I think right now very few people have any idea of even what a kWh is, much less how much they could save if they paid attention.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    While I found the GE ad amusing, it is not a success. A successful ad will at least register the product or company in memory and this ad fails quite miserably.

    We bought this ‘hybrid’ water heater for the office as it was an important factor in reducing our demand charges. In heat pump mode, it only uses 550 watts!!! (in comparison to a conventional electrical water heater which uses 10 times this amount). However, whenever I try to sell one (for GE) to other business owners, I find that NO ONE recalls the product being advertised. About half of folks recall an ad with monkeys lounging in a sauna bath and the rest are completely clueless.

    I know that commercials do little to educate with their limited time exposure, but a commercial does NO good if you can’t remember anything about it 2 minutes after it aired.

    [Please give +1 if you like the following idea- so that GM folks who review this forum might notice]
    GM needs to do something like they did with Dick Clark and the Oldsmobile Intrigue. In that 2003 commercial, Dick walks past an aging doorman (in repeated scenes) while he and his Olds remain timeless. With GM Volt, they could have repeated scenes of a man in business attire unplugging his Volt and driving off to work. He would drive past an attendant at a gas station who holds up the fill nozzle and the Volt Driver just shakes his head ‘no’. This could be repeated until the attendant shouts, “WHEN?” and the driver just shrugs his shoulders. Then, in the final scene, the guy pulls up with wife and suitcases (for vacation) in his leisure clothes to the gas pump and states, ‘Now I’m ready for that drive to Lake Tahoe’ (or wherever). A narrator could then simply state, ‘The Chevy Volt is like no car you have seen before.’ It’s too bad that Dick Clark had his stroke, because he’d be great for the part of the driver and the attendant could be played by one of the fellows who played Tommy the doorman in the Olds ad.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:19 pm)

    wolfdoctor: “I’m a big Volt fan, but I was a little confused by the commercial. The Volt was never intended to be a vehicle that is constantly on the road (“going far, really far”). It’s intended to be a commuter car that can go on the road, when necessary. If you buy a volt with the intent of constantly being on the road then you would probably use a lot less fuel if you were to buy a diesel. I don’t get it.”

    I was concerned that the commercial only mentioned the open road and hardly (if at all) mentioned the EV component of the car.

    Personally, I liked the way the ad started. Something to the effect that you don’t know at 9am what your plans will be at 5. Emphasizing the commuter aspect, but also that you never know when you’re going to want to drive further than you initially planned.

    Basically, they were advertising the range extender. Which includes the open road. As long as it’s not the only ad (which I doubt it is), I’m fine with it. That’s what’s unique about the Volt.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:24 pm)

    my understanding is that hold mode is different from mountain mode: mountain mode has to do with changing the battery SOC level at which ICE turns on to drive the generator; in hold mode the ICE immediately turns on to drive the generator regardless of the battery SOC level. i wouldn’t expect gm to offer the hold mode in the usa because the motive for offering the feature had to do with the fact that in some european areas, drivers can get a break on tolls if they drive in EV mode. so hold mode allows drivers to hold off on entering EV mode until they enter an area where they get a toll break. there is no such thing in the usa. as to the operation of the ICE drive mode, i would think that gm is going to maintain diagnostics for the operation of the ICE system; particularly since it is not necessarily going to be operating all the time.

    nasaman:
    You’re right, Tall Pete —a very valid point, and one reason I’ve been “lobbying” GM to provide the so-called “Hold” mode as in Ampera for Europeans (same as or similar to Volt’s “Mountain Mode”). On trips likely to exceed my EV range I could simply engage Mountain or Hold modes long enough to both build up some battery reserve and to verify the ICE/gen drive train is OK.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:28 pm)

    I’m wrapping things up here at work and will fly out to Baltimore in a couple hours. I’ll be in DC for the Rally to Restore Sanity, but I will also go over to the Chevy Volt Unplugged tour (the one by the National Mall). Hope to see some of you there. Heck, I may even get a chance to sit in a Volt as a walk-on (I forgot to RSVP for a time slot).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:29 pm)

    nasaman: You raise two key points that I fully agree with, Don. First, that showing the # of problems/100 cars is a statistician’s means of making the very small differences between cars (and CR’s efforts) seem much more significant. For example, at 4 years the CR chart in post #75 above shows the worst case as Chrysler at about 0.6 problems/car vs Toyota at about 0.3/car (or as shown, ~60problems/100cars vs ~30/100cars). And this “statistical trick” as you call it, Don, makes the difference seem to be much more significant than it actually is. I agree.Your second point, that none of “these surveys have much to do with the Volt” is also a key point. Why? Because the Volt’s EV drive train is completely independent of its ICE/generator. So if my Volt’s fuel pump fails I can still travel an average of 40 miles as an EV, whereas a fuel pump failure in a conventional car will leave it disabled by the roadside.*/*The CR article says, “Starting with the 2010 survey, ‘engine electrical’ now includes hybrid battery and related system in addition to other charging and ignition systems”, which means none of the data presented this year fully applies. Furthermore, CR does not (and IMO probably will not) separate catastrophic failures (those that totally disable a car) from non-disabling failures —even though the Volt has two independent power sources, either of which can propel the car.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Very true and it doesn’t account for cost or time. Is a loose trim piece counted the same as rebuilding a transmission? Much more expensive and much more time to repair. Even repairing similar items on different brands can be very different in cost. Either way, if I’m apt to see .3 problems versus 1.3 problems in 10 years should I care? How important of a factor should that be in a buying decision?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:32 pm)

    Advertising for vehicles is so limited in impact. Saying that the “Heartbeat” commercial failed to generate a lot of sales, is like saying the commercials for the iPod made it a success.

    Build something well and it will sell! Advertising is useful to a point, but when buying a car, you want real information on pricing and reliablilty, and I doubt you bought your last car because you were impressed by the ability of a car to emulate a bullet….right?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:33 pm)

    Lyle: Check out the new Chevy Volt windshield graphic that will come installed on the consumer advisory board cars:
    http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?5478-Chevy-Volt-Windshield-Graphic

    The picture doesn’t show up in the forum?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:46 pm)

    VoltGuy,

    Here’s the updated version…

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qL8F98-x6rs


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    Nelson

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:48 pm)

    Raymondjram,

    I’d like to see the “Tool Man” retrofit a Volt with a Binford 1000 electric motor and take it for a spin.
    :)

    NPNS!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:48 pm)

    kdawg: Lyle: Check out the new Chevy Volt windshield graphic that will come installed on the consumer advisory board cars:
    http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?5478-Chevy-Volt-Windshield-Graphic The picture doesn’t show up in the forum?

    Nevermind. Once I logged in, it showed up.


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    Mike-o-Matic

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:50 pm)

    Lyle: Check out the new Chevy Volt windshield graphic that will come installed on the consumer advisory board cars:http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?5478-Chevy-Volt-Windshield-Graphic    

    Nice, and simple too. But it should say “Consumer Advisory Board Vehicle” or something along those lines, as well.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:53 pm)

    no comment: my understanding is that hold mode is different from mountain mode: mountain mode has to do with changing the battery SOC level at which ICE turns on to drive the generator; in hold mode the ICE immediately turns on to drive the generator regardless of the battery SOC level…

    Thanks for your analysis and although of course I know it’s hypothetical, I tend to agree. Let’s assume I’m noting the Volt’s instrument panel shows 30 mi remain in EV mode but that I expect to
    have to travel an additional 40 miles & I’d like to do it primarily in EV mode. To check that the CS mode is available, I engage “Mountain Mode”. Assuming it engages at a 45% SOC (or immediately, if so), I would note when the ICE/gen came on, observe that it’s running OK (or not), then re-engage EV (Normal/ECO) mode.

    It may be I want to be able to do this because for 30+ years of my career in the space program I’ve been accustomed to periodically switching redundant subsystems from the “A” side to the “B” side and back again to verify redundancy. (And if the redundant side has failed, I then have time to devise possible workarounds; whereas if I wait until a failure occurs, very few if any workarounds may be available.) So for example, if I learned in advance that my Volt’s CS mode was non-functional, I could find a safe off-road stopping place at a easily-identified cross road/street then phone AAA for assistance. In a conventional car, I could easily be stranded without warning.


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:56 pm)

    Harrier: But it works on people only if they have something to remember.

    Who doesn’t have older relatives around them that have those memories. I can see grandpa sitting next to his twenty year old grandson, seeing the ads and sayng I remember when I had a Chevy *****. Besides it’s like Ewanick said, “We have a soul that our strongest competitors don’t have.”

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (12:59 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:00 pm)

    I don’t agree w/this, but it made me chuckle. (sorry in vacay mode)

    never-give-up-never-surrender-galaxy-quest-tim-allen-star-tr-demotivational-poster-1248602467.jpg


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:08 pm)

    is that a black or blue Volt at the end of commercial #1?


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:13 pm)

    kdawg: I don’t agree w/this, but it made me chuckle. (sorry in vacay mode)

    AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!

    /you guys are killin me maaaan….lol


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:17 pm)

    no comment: depending upon your point of reference, there were electric drive cars 100 years ago, but in reality, to most of the public, the electric car is a new concept.
        

    Yes. For various reasons, those ancient electric cars were considered ‘ladies cars’. That moniker might as well apply to EVs today considering Nissan’s continued reluctance to have its LEAF dissected and hammered by the independent automotive media – just as GM recently did with the Volt. Hey Nissan: what are you afraid of? Time’s growing short -


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:22 pm)

    What I find interesting is what these ads are targeting. The emphasize that GM will be there tomorrow.


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    Loboc

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:30 pm)

    nasaman: phone AAA for assistance

    OnStar is included. :)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:41 pm)

    Loboc: nasaman: phone AAA for assistance

    OnStar is included. :)

    Right! And I have OnStar now, so I’m well aware of it. Guess I was thinking of AAA in the generic sense like saying kleenex when we mean facial tissue. Of course, the Volt will also have roadside assistance like all new GM cars (I think), so 1 call to OnStar should be all you’d need. But whatever the roadside assistance service is, I don’t like waiting an hour for them. So my “workaround” is more likely gonna be someone in my family who’s reachable by cell and is available. :)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:44 pm)

    Thank you all for responding nicely to my little rant this morning. Additionally, I should have thought more about future Volt commercials – that this one was just the first in a series, extolling the benefits of range extension.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:53 pm)

    DonC:
    Nice to see you back posting Rashiid! Let’s work on getting that commute down to 40 miles!    

    lol. Right you are, my friend.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:54 pm)

    EricLeGay,

    More sock puppet interaction again today.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:56 pm)

    my description of the hold mode is not hypothetical; it comes from the explanation that gm personnel gave. you will find videos on youtube that show seminars where gm personnel describe various technical aspects of the operation of the volt. seminars that discuss the drive train system describe the operational modes. one of them is the hold mode, which was put in place for the european markets. thus, it is available on the ampera but not the volt.

    nasaman:
    Thanks for your analysis and although of course I know it’s hypothetical.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:57 pm)

    Loboc:
    Be careful what you ask for. 20 unique IPs controlled by one crazy troll could wipe out the entire forum.    

    True, but I don’t mean IP addresses. Just delete the comments that have -20 votes.


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    EricLeGay

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:58 pm)

    Matthew_B: EricLeGay, More sock puppet interaction again today.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    just sock’n it to the hate puppets, whoever they are


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (1:59 pm)

    Rashiid Amul:
    True, but I don’t mean IP addresses.Just delete the comments that have -20 votes.    

    If one person has 20 IP addresses, then they can vote -1 from each and then delete any comment.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:19 pm)

    Matthew_B:
    If one person has 20 IP addresses, then they can vote -1 from each and then delete any comment.    

    Ah, I misunderstood what LOBOC was saying. Thanks for the clarification.


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    mikeinatl.

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:26 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: I am curious why GM is running these TV commercials. When Prius came out, it was sold simply by word of mouth. The same was true for Gen2 Prius, no TV ads.I don’t see Nissan doing these TV commercials, yet it is sold out for the first year allocation.Is GM concern about the demand for the Volt?    

    Just a guess but maybe GM is trying to repair its image after many years of lackluster quality, then steering through a devastating financial situation.

    I will admit to still having a fondness for GM even though I have not bought a new one in decades. It can be that way with institutions, and GM is certainly an American Institution. Harley-Davidsons and Jeeps are two brands known to have less-than-world-class engineering and quality, but they have raving fans and surprisingly good resale value. Institutions.

    Surely GM can win back some old fans and make some new ones with the kind of quality and engineering “engine-newity” they now are beginning to display.

    And to start that process, they have get everybody paying attention to what they are now doing while reminding everyone of their American heritage.

    When you have an Ace, you would be crazy not to play it!

    But again, this is all just a guess.

    GO VOLT!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:37 pm)

    flmark,

    Give them a bit of time. GE’s first ecomagination ads were warm and fuzzy too.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:45 pm)

    this is a stupid comment: a lot of commercials for automobiles appear on television, radio and print. that’s how companies promote their products. you seem to be suggesting that advertising is evidence of a lack of demand. the objective of advertising is to maximize demand.

    usbseawolf2000: I am curious why GM is running these TV commercials. When Prius came out, it was sold simply by word of mouth. The same was true for Gen2 Prius, no TV ads.I don’t see Nissan doing these TV commercials, yet it is sold out for the first year allocation.Is GM concern about the demand for the Volt?    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (2:48 pm)

    no comment: this is a stupid comment: a lot of commercials for automobiles appear on television, radio and print.that’s how companies promote their products.you seem to be suggesting that advertising is evidence of a lack of demand.the objective of advertising is to maximize demand.
        

    “IPO”


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (3:14 pm)

    nasaman: …and I’m told that happens to Tesla drivers too! But I doubt, since Tesla’s range is limited, that a Tesla smile is quite as broad as a Volt smile!

    Best EV smile to date. Very enjoyable video.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nxF0-HQB5I&feature=player_embedded


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (3:19 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: I don’t see Nissan doing these TV commercials, yet it is sold out for the first year allocation.    

    Do Lance Armstrong and a polar bear ring any bells? That’s right, TV commercials for the Nissan Leaf.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (3:56 pm)

    As a conservative-leaning independent I abhor how many people resemble sheep on certain issues. Especially how the Volt is being used as a political football.

    As others have mentioned – many conservatives do follow the biggest media mouths ( Rush Limbaugh – or Glenn Beck ) who have linked the Volt with “Government Motors” and the Wall Street bailouts and government-controlled, single payer health insurance. To me, they just make it harder for us who are conservative-minded because they bunch the Volt and people like me who support sustainable energy practices and “green” mentality as “hippies and commies” – people who want big government and European-type socialism. I’m conservative yet realize the big picture of Peak Oil and global security issues tied to oil – and while global warming isn’t absolutely a given ( not a natural cycle over millions of years of our global climate ) – the proofs are there for all to see ( polar ice caps, glacial melting ) and the air pollution for us to breathe ( and see, in some areas ).

    I’ll speak for us conservative independents who do not believe driving an Expedition or Tahoe is our American right and way of shoving our American liberties down other’s throats. I’m one who realizes these are just political tools and one can agree with the founding father’s ideals and not believe everything you hear.

    I think during this election season we’ve seen how politics really is the enemy of a free America – not any one party or issue. Politics ends at the front door – as this summer we saw James Carville – who some say personifies liberal progressivism – on the shores of his beloved Louisiana Gulf Coast screaming into a CNN camera: ” *&^%$ Obama, get your &^%$ down here, NOW! “…. Showing the most partisan of us still hate politics when it hits us where we live.

    PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),

    James


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (4:27 pm)

    koz:
    Best EV smile to date. Very enjoyable video.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nxF0-HQB5I&feature=player_embedded    

    lol. Ya should warn people about the volume.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (4:29 pm)

    no comment: this is a stupid comment

    Increasing demand on a supply that’s already limited doesn’t make any sense.

    Of course, still to this day people spin Prius history to make it seem as though demand was low even though it was actually just limited supply. Looks like we’ll be able to do the same for Volt now.

    But then again, building up excitement then forcing consumers to wait doesn’t seem like good business.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (4:55 pm)

    flmark: Being a fan of all things energy conserving, I am getting frustrated with commercials that do little to sway an uninformed buyer toward greener buying choices.Attention GM, watch this ad-http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HrGr8-g1cik It is for a heat pump water heater and is little better than your recent offerings. At least this commercial puts you in the ball park of knowing that you are making a energy-conscious, forward-thinking purchase.If you need an entire society to rethink its paradigm, you need to do better the visual pleasantry…and if 30 seconds is all you’ve got, make it 60 seconds and run it half as often. Many people call this ‘the information age’, so give us some already. I am getting tired of ad agencies that emphasize style and ignore substance.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    BTW, have you purchased one of those water heaters? A friend of mine told me I can put a timer on my electric water heater and see savings… I’ve been looking into the solar water heating area as a first step to economical energy saving. It makes a lot of sense since the initial cost isn’t much as opposed to large solar PV arrays and the savings can be quite substantial, esp. with a family of four like mine.

    I agree with your point and think Volt ads need more visual punch and an enviro angle.

    PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),

    James


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:27 pm)

    jeffhre: flmark,
    Give them a bit of time. GE’s first ecomagination ads were warm and fuzzy too.    

    I really like the GE ad where one of the Wright brothers takes off with his biplane, but the plane had a giant GE turbofan mounted, and at takeoff, it blows the other Wright away!!

    Raymond


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:34 pm)

    Raymondjram:
    I really like the GE ad where one of the Wright brothers takes off with his biplane, but the plane had a giant GE turbofan mounted, and at takeoff, it blows the other Wright away!!Raymond    

    I found it! The jet biplane happens near the end, and the last scene is in color.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXqH1q7G3BM

    Raymond


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:44 pm)

    The 60 second ‘Chevy Runs Deep’ spot – #3 – is by far the best and gets current product and a future promise into the spot. I’m all for nostalgia, but the reality is the spots with old footage will only resonate with folks who can remember being in shots like those. For the Gen X and Y folks, those spots wont resonate. They need the flash, speed, technology and images of a vibrant ‘happening’ socially responsible Chevrolet …. or Chevy as the case may be!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (5:51 pm)

    Raymondjram: I found it! The jet biplane happens near the end, and the last scene is in color.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXqH1q7G3BM

    Raymond

    GREAT AD & VIDEO, Raymond!


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (6:03 pm)

    James: I’ve been looking into the solar water heating area as a first step to economical energy saving. It makes a lot of sense since the initial cost isn’t much as opposed to solar and the savings can be quite substantial, esp. with a family of four like mine.

    I wouldn’t think that the Pacific NW is a great place for solar. You might want to look at the AO Smith products. I really like the hybrid gas heater which combines a small standby tank with a very efficient water heater. That way you eliminate your standby losses and get the benefit of more or less endless hot water. Plus install is easy. http://www.aosmith.com/About/Detail.aspx?id=608


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:05 pm)

    Volt spotted in the wild…

    chevrolet-volt-in-traffic.jpg?t=1288310676


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:17 pm)

    GE to Place Order for `Tens of Thousands’ of Electric Vehicles

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-10-28/ge-s-immelt-calls-for-industry-to-make-clean-energy-investments.html

    “will order “tens of thousands” of the vehicles in about a week, Immelt said yesterday in a speech in London, without giving a total or identifying a manufacturer.”

    “An order the size of GE’s probably would come from several vehicle makers, Smith said.”


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:26 pm)

    T 1: GE to Place Order for `Tens of Thousands’ of Electric Vehicles

    CEO Immelt said half of GE’s sales force of about 45,000 will drive electric vehicles. Sounds like a call for extended range electric vehicles. Good news for GM and for Goodyear?

    =D-Volt


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:46 pm)

    RB: 28 Dave G reliability of a brand…,.The graph (thanks) shows reliability of manufacturers, not brands. Within gm, my impression from personal experience is that the brands vary markedly. For me, Chevy has not been well built or reliable, while Buick has been very well built and considerably more reliable than my Honda cars. Of course, that’s a very small sample, but I have seen it come out that way in aggregates, too. In part it may reflect quality variations between different gm divisions and plants. Some though seem quite good.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    I agree with the Buick reliability… but I also have had very good like with my two Chevys and my Chevy truck. My Pontiac was 17 years old when we traded it in with its original exhaust and no major rust… and still looked and ran very good that’s very good for PA. One person at work has a little Chevy Cavalier that has 140K on it and it looks really good all original engine and tranny… that’s pretty good for the low end Chevy. GM has the largest test facilities of any MFR company at Milford with 126 miles of roadway and many indoor test facilities. I think GM should emphasize there superior testing routine for new cars. I’ve had more than a few of GM’s first year models and all were very good with little problems.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:51 pm)

    Was that a political add I saw on this site? The reason to go to this site is to get away from the political adds… don’t tolerate very much of that.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:53 pm)

    These ads WILL be effective because they address a most urgent issue in the United States. That is the debilitating cost of the addiction to foreign oil. Buying U.S. made vehicles – like the Chevy Volt will create local JOBS, grow local ECONOMIES, and strengthen national SECURITY.

    Reminding consumers that the cascading effect of buying domestic products – benefits many many people. If you’re sick of bailouts, foreign conflicts, sending billions overseas – vote with your pocketbook. Buy a domestically designed and manufactured vehicle.

    And if you really want to end the addiction to foreign oil – buy a Chevy VOLT. It doesn’t have to use foreign oil.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (7:56 pm)

    nasaman: Of course, the Volt will also have roadside assistance like all new GM cars (I think),

    That’s what the owners’ manual says. Want the phone number now? ;-)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:11 pm)

    On another note, actually back on topic, it occurred to me at work today (when I couldn’t get near a computer), that the first car I ever owned was a ’59 Chevy, and the first car my wife and I owned together was a ’60 Chevy. :-)

    Now she’s talking about when we get our new car, the Volt . . .
    The only new car we every owned was a 1973 Buick Apollo (Buick version of the Chevy Nova).


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:17 pm)

    This is a vein GM has mined successfully before:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhWFWYQArFI


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    pjkPA

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:33 pm)

    Dave G,

    re: Consumer Reports “dots”

    These dots represent totals of complaints from readers of CU magazine only. That’s a huge Bias right there.
    I’ve written to CU many times asking about how they determine dots.
    They said that they try to get 100 responses for each vehicle. 100 not thousands as a lot of people think. AND they do NOT compensate for the amount of cars on the road. That is.. if a Chevy with 1 million cars gets 10 problems and a Honda with fifty thousand cars on the road gets 5 problems they say the Honda is better .. this is totally wrong… and why I got taken by CU when I bought the Nissan truck I had. It had all red dots but my neighbors Chevy truck still looked like new when my Truck was falling apart.
    JD Powers on the other had does some compensating for the amount of cars on the road and has rated BUICk as the most reliable brand on the road. I do believe that. I have 4 Buicks now .. and not because of the dots in CU magazine.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (8:52 pm)

    pjkPA: re: Consumer Reports “dots”

    These dots represent totals of complaints from readers of CU magazine only. That’s a huge Bias right there.

    I am not willing to throw Consumer Reports under the bus yet. As they have given me great advice with buying microwave ovens and refrigerators.

    Read a very recent automotive rating page generated by Consumer Reports. After having given a “good quality” “recommended” rating on Toyota. They followed it with a disclaimer which read something like: …Toyota has addressed their recent quality issues. CS therefore reiterates a recommended rating.

    Consumer Reports may one day be a friend of GM. Look at the facts. Holding an 8 year grudge against GM. When the recall of 3,000,000 Toyota’s for quality problems and accidents resulting in loss of life is overlooked in 6 months time.

    In two months we will know how CS feels about the electric Volt. Motor Trend, AutoLogic, and 1000′s of demo drivers love the Volt.

    =D-Volt

    voltparked.jpg?t=1288317010


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    UAW hater

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:28 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (9:30 pm)

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    John

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:03 pm)

    greenWin: These ads WILL be effective because they address a most urgent issue in the United States. That is the debilitating cost of the addiction to foreign oil. Buying U.S. made vehicles – like the Chevy Volt will create local JOBS, grow local ECONOMIES, and strengthen national SECURITY.Reminding consumers that the cascading effect of buying domestic products – benefits many many people. If you’re sick of bailouts, foreign conflicts, sending billions overseas – vote with your pocketbook. Buy a domestically designed and manufactured vehicle. And if you really want to end the addiction to foreign oil – buy a Chevy VOLT. It doesn’t have to use foreign oil.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    One more thing to do is consider buying US-made solar panels/inverter and charging your volt with locally-produced solar PV energy. You guys can talk oil all you want, but there is the nagging issue of burning coal or natl gas or other sources here to charge the car. Once you get a Volt you may want to look at “getting off local power” as a next step. The ability drive a car that “you charged yourself with your own solar array” would be one more step in the right direction. Having a local PV installer set you up with a PV system of equipment made nearly entirely in the US would be great for may Volt owners.

    If you buy a Volt and charge it with “the milkshake” sucked out of US soil – you still are not all the way “there” yet.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:15 pm)

    the problem is where you set expectations and don’t deliver on them. gm has stated what their initial markets are going to be and a schedule for rollout – it was not a 5 year rollout. buying a car is not a purchase that you make every day. so people who know the rollout schedule who are planning to buy a car in the next year or 2, and are considering the volt can either hold off getting a new car for a year or so, or they can move up the date for getting a new car by a year or so.

    the reason why it makes sense to promote the volt now is so that gm gets market presence now and can therefore get, not only the people who want to get cars now, but people who are thinking about getting a new car in the near future.

    john1701a:
    Increasing demand on a supply that’s already limited doesn’t make any sense.Of course, still to this day people spin Prius history to make it seem as though demand was low even though it was actually just limited supply.Looks like we’ll be able to do the same for Volt now.But then again, building up excitement then forcing consumers to wait doesn’t seem like good business.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:21 pm)

    i find it ironic how many of the fox new crowd have been convinced to become anti-union in their views. it’s ironic because those same people gladly take the benefits that they have received BECAUSE of unions: the 5 day work week, paid vacations, higher wages, health care benefits, &c. it’s no surprise that as unions have declined, non-union employees have become increasingly squeezed.

    it’s just funny how easy it has been throughout history to find the “useful idiots” who will gladly act against their own interests without knowing it; and all you have to do is to give them an “enemy” to direct their animosity toward while their so-called “friends” (like, for-example-but-not-limited-to, fox news) are picking these useful idiots blind.

    UAW hater: If this shit is made by UAW, it has to be shit!    


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    Dave G

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:26 pm)

    John: Once you get a Volt you may want to look at “getting off local power” as a next step. The ability drive a car that “you charged yourself with your own solar array” would be one more step in the right direction.

    The vast majority of solar systems are “grid-tied”. The solar panels supply power to the grid during the day, and the grid supplies power back to you at night. The power companies love this because it helps with their peak load, which is why they offer rebates.

    If you spend a bunch of money on batteries to store the solar power, I don’t think you’ll get the rebates, which means the system will end up costing you 3 times as much. In other words, off-grid solar systems are typically only used in remote areas where there is no access to the grid.

    John: If you buy a Volt and charge it with “the milkshake” sucked out of US soil – you still are not all the way “there” yet.

    If your goal is energy independence, then electric drive has no problems. The U.S. doesn’t need to import anything to make electricity.


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    Dave G

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:43 pm)

    no comment: the reason why it makes sense to promote the volt now is so that gm gets market presence now and can therefore get, not only the people who want to get cars now, but people who are thinking about getting a new car in the near future.

    While I see your logic, it’s important to note that GM has admitted several times on this site that they intend to use the Volt as a “halo” car. GM believes people will be interested in the Volt, and that will bring them into showrooms, but many will end up buying another Chevy model instead. Classic bait and switch.

    I don’t think this will work, but its obvious that GM does, since they’ve said so on more than one occasion. So given that GM intends to use the Volt as a halo to sell other cars in their line, it makes sense to advertise the Volt toward that end.


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (10:59 pm)

    what you described is not a “bait and switch”; it’s vehicle line marketing. many auto makers produce “halo vehicles”. typically a “halo” vehicle is a car that is priced so high that it is expected to be sold in very limited volumes, so the car isn’t specifically made for revenue as it is for image. for instance, the mercedes benz slr mclaren is a $500,000 car. do you really believe that mercedes benz expects to sell many of those cars? do you think that people who are considering a c-class are potential customers for an slr-class? do you therefore accuse mercedes benz of “bait and switch”? i assume that you would not, because such an accusation would be ridiculous. you will find that other car makers have equivalent offerings, although not necessarily offerings the cost $500,000.

    Dave G:
    While I see your logic, it’s important to note that GM has admitted several times on this site that they intend to use the Volt as a “halo” car.GM believes people will be interested in the Volt, and that will bring them into showrooms, but many will end up buying another Chevy model instead.Classic bait and switch.I don’t think this will work, but its obvious that GM does, since they’ve said so on more than one occasion.So given that GM intends to use the Volt as a halo to sell other cars in their line, it makes sense to advertise the Volt toward that end.    


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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:01 pm)

    pjkPA: I’ve written to CU many times asking about how they determine dots… AND they do NOT compensate for the amount of cars on the road. That is.. if a Chevy with 1 million cars gets 10 problems and a Honda with fifty thousand cars on the road gets 5 problems they say the Honda is better .. this is totally wrong…

    You may be right, I don’t know.

    But I do know that the Toyota Camry is the best selling car in the U.S., and has been on the top 10 list for many years, while the Malibu has not. That means there are a lot more Camrys on the road than Malibus. So if you’re right, that means the Malibu has worse reliability than the chart would indicate.


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    nasaman

     

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    Oct 28th, 2010 (11:15 pm)

    Dave G, post #180: GM believes people will be interested in the Volt, and that will bring them into showrooms, but many will end up buying another Chevy model instead…

    It’s not quite as “black & white” as we may assume GM’s intentions to be. Two of the three new GM cars I’ve purchased since 1994 were brand new models at the very beginning of their model year and were in extremely short supply. In both cases I placed an order with the dealer, who ordered the car from the factory equipped exactly as I wanted it, requiring me to wait up to 4 1/2 months in one case. There was no pressure —I wasn’t “baited” and I didn’t “switch”! So I see nothing wrong (and everything right) about GM advertising the Volt NOW. Those who really want a Volt will simply order it from the factory, and I’m certain GM will expand their production volume as needed to satisfy all such factory orders. They’d rather manufacture cars to firm orders rather than speculatively, as I’m sure is true of most dealers as well. Volt is by no means strictly a “halo” car!

    /Of course, customers too impatient to order a Volt can buy another model if they care to; but if they test drive the Dealer’s demo Volt, I believe that, by itself, will go a long way toward increasing their patience enough to order one from the factory.


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    Matthew B

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    Oct 29th, 2010 (12:04 am)

    Dave G: The power companies love this because it helps with their peak load, .

    No, power companies do not love it.

    The solar peak happens at noon. Noon is not the peak of the demand, it is later in the day. Solar is also not dependable so the power companies have to have the generation to cover the load anyway.

    Dave G: which is why they offer rebates

    No again. The offer rebates because the law says they have to. There are no utilities that offer them out of the goodness of their hearts.


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    Matthew B

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    Oct 29th, 2010 (12:09 am)

    no comment,

    My anti-union views have come from personal experience and observation. At one time unions had their place. But they are killing themselves through their own behavior.

    During college I worked in a union shop. That was the start of it. I saw that seniority was the only basis on how people were treated. Hard work was ignored. Incompetence was ignored.

    Since then I’ve been in multiple UAW plants. I can verify that many of the allegations about make work and laziness are true.

    I also note the vicious cycle between democrat politics, public employees and public employee unions.

    Thank you no. If I can chose between union and non-union I’ll pick buying from the non-union shop.


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    Oct 29th, 2010 (1:29 am)

    you can have abuses that can occur in any situation; especially on the margins, so that it is always possible to find some instances of abuse – then people like you blow it up to make it appear as though it is some pervasive and systemic problem when in reality it isn’t. but just because of the possibility of abuse does not mean that you can reasonably denounce the whole institution; if that were true then you would denounce the capitalist system because it was abuses by the “leisure class” that gave rise to unions. as far as your comments go, when you denounce the benefits that you have derived as a result of unions, then you’ll have more credibility. on the other hand, you probably don’t have to worry about that because the way things are going, you’re likely to gradually lose those benefits anyway.

    Matthew B: no comment,
    My anti-union views have come from personal experience and observation. At one time unions had their place.But they are killing themselves through their own behavior.During college I worked in a union shop.That was the start of it.I saw that seniority was the only basis on how people were treated.Hard work was ignored.Incompetence was ignored.Since then I’ve been in multiple UAW plants.I can verify that many of the allegations about make work and laziness are true.I also note the vicious cycle between democrat politics, public employees and public employee unions.Thank you no.If I can chose between union and non-union I’ll pick buying from the non-union shop.    


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    Oct 29th, 2010 (4:20 am)

    Dave G,

    re: CU graph
    CU obviously did not include the million trucks Toyota bought back that were not drivable after just 6 years… or the many millions of other Toyotas that were recalled because of safety defects by far more than any other manufacturer.


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    Oct 29th, 2010 (4:39 am)

    Dave G,

    re: CU graph

    Remember this graph was created by using a flawed Biased response from CU magazine readers only.


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    MichaelH

     

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    Oct 29th, 2010 (6:10 am)

    no comment: people like you blow it up to make it appear as though it is some pervasive and systemic problem when in reality it isn’t. but just because of the possibility of abuse does not mean that you can reasonably denounce the whole institution

    Really? It seems to work for you in comment # 178. :-|


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    Oct 29th, 2010 (9:10 am)

    I do not denounce the benefits that unions brought 50+ years ago. They’ve just outlived their usefulness and our now hurting our country.


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    GM lover

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    Oct 31st, 2010 (3:09 pm)

    #3 is a great commercial about time they start making quality commercials again


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    Oct 31st, 2010 (4:36 pm)

    Matthew B,

    You are a moron