Oct 19

My 240-V Chevrolet Volt Voltec Charger is Installed

 


[ad#post_ad]Today I took the next big step towards becoming one of the country’s first Chevrolet Volt owners. So thrilled with the occasion I felt a need to write about it here.

For the first time I am not writing about something happening in Detroit, in China, in California or anywhere else. I am writing about something happening in my own home.

As a member of the Volt consumer advisory board I am scheduled to take delivery of a Chevrolet Volt on or about October 25, a mere six days from now. Part of this thrilling opportunity is getting a free 240-v charger installed in my garage.

Owners will be able to buy these chargers for $495 from GM’s distribution partner SPX, who will either contract an electrician to do the installation fro about $1500, or let the owner do it themselves. There is also funding for 4100 free chargers, that can be obtained from either EcoTality or Coulomb Technologies.

Today an electrician spent the better part of five hours installing the official Voltec charger in my garage.   I was not present, but it seems much of the work involved running about 30 feet of conduit to the new charger and disconnecting the old charger.

I already had 240 volt line there from my breaker panel, which had been used in my previous MINI E Clipper Creek charger. That unit ran on 32 amps. The GM unit only runs on 16 amps and has a maximum output of 3.3 kw. Using it allows the car to charge from empty to full in about 4 hours.

Some electricity during charging could be used to condition the cab and/or the battery.

Since GM is only using the middle band of the battery’s total charging capacity, recharging is linear. There is no more rapid early phase.

Anyway this charger really is a thing of beauty. It is strong robust and attractive. The wire is thick and curled. GM has tested running it over repeatedly with no loss of function. It is also weatherized.

For those who are interested, I have implemented a Volt CAB Forum in the forum section of this site. It is a public place to interact with CAB members. I have invited them all, but cannot guarantee they will participate. They have a private GM-sanctioned forum to use instead. I have chosen not to join that, as I feel the people, the long-standing GM-Volt readers and long-standing fans of the car should be able to see and participate in all the discussion.

Six more days!  Guess I’ll have to move that rack…yeah I know, paint the wall…
[ad#postbottom]

This entry was posted on Tuesday, October 19th, 2010 at 1:18 pm and is filed under Charging. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

COMMENTS: 168


  1. 1
    Matthew_B

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:20 pm)

    “or let the owner do it themselves”

    Cool. There has been a lot said about how people wouldn’t be able to do their own install. It now sounds like GM is backing away from that position.


  2. 2
    CaptJackSparrow

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:24 pm)

    Dude….Lyle….you’re killin us maaan….
    you still haven’t painted your wall?!?!?!?!?

    /PAINTING beer party at Lyle’s!!!! :-P


  3. 3
    mmcc

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:36 pm)

    I’m confident that I could install the charger. I had 2-240V circuits installed in my garage a couple years ago in preparation for the Volt, but I’m not sure I will need the rapid charger at all now. My commute is only about 3 miles each way and my employer has stated I can recharge at work if I want, so I will probably only recharge at home a couple times a week if at all.


  4. 4
    LeoK

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:36 pm)

    Lyle – thanks for sharing. Do us all a favor and catch up on your sleep over the next 6 days – cause once you get your VOLT, I doubt there will be any sleeping – at least for the first few days! Have fun … you deserve it!


  5. 5
    LeoK

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:40 pm)

    “I already had 240 volt line there from my breaker panel, which had been used in my previous MINI E Clipper Creek charger. That unit ran on 32 amps. The GM unit only runs on 16 amps and has a maximum output of 3.3 kw. Using it allows the car to charge from empty to full in about 4 hours.”

    If you already had the 240 volt line run into your garage, what could have taken 5 hours to complete? This must be a pretty complex installation.


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    Larry

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:41 pm)

    Look who got a Christmas present early!

    I’m not jealous, no really. Am… not… jealous… of the… schmuck ;)


  7. 7
    James

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:46 pm)

    Hi Lyle, can you tell us why it took him 5 hours to install it? That seems a bit excessive, especially since it sounds like you already had a system with higher capacity than needed for Volt installed.

    Were you there during the install? Can you give us a short description of what was involved ( tearing out the old system – running new lines, what was done in your 240v box, etc. )?

    Appreciate all the info you can give!

    PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),

    James


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    Raymondjram

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (1:58 pm)

    If I could get my hands on one of those 240V chargers, I can analyze its construction and prepare a set of instructions to install it. I have done several 240 V installations, of which two were energency generator and transfer switch installations, one at my own home ( 5 KW genset with 20 A service) and one for my brother-in-law (a 12 KW genset with 50 A service).

    This charger station is just an “extension” and an outlet except that the outlet part has a special cable and plug. I also believe that the station has a special relay, so that the power cord is not energized until it is plugged into the Volt (or any certified EV) and receives the correct signal. This will prevent any accidents or even any voluntary misuse of the charger.

    It is a good design, but I love to see it up close and in operation. Maybe in two years!

    Ramond


  9. 9
    Chevonly

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:02 pm)

    Congrats on the install, I personally could install the unit myself, but at the present would not really need the capability of a faster charge as I only drive at the most 20 miles a day during the week and about 30 on the weekends. So on the weekend the onboard generator would get some use, especially in the gloomy cold winter months. As most of us will have to wait until 2011 or 12 to get a volt I do expect at that time or shortly thereafter more and more charging stations will be available in metropolitan areas for us to use. I would hope to see in the next 10 years parking lots just for electric vehicles that would use inductive charge. You would simply park your car in the lot over the charger and no electrical connection would be required, park charge and go would be a great idea and simplify the whole process.


  10. 10
    CorvetteGuy

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:06 pm)

    The training I went to recommended “a 30 amp circuit minimum or 40 amp circuit so you can be prepared for future technology”… Was there any mention of that by anyone you have spoken with?


  11. 11
    Raymondjram

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:10 pm)

    James: PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),James  (Quote)  (Reply)

    In addition to all 50 states, add Washington, DC and the five territories (remember the 2009 Quarters?), especially Puerto Rico which has over 3 million vehicles. I love to see at least 100,000 Chevy Volts and other Voltec-powered vehicles here!

    Raymond


  12. 12
    Jason M. Hendler

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:17 pm)

    Lyle, I am excited for / with you! I can imagine just how “real” it all became for you the moment they installed your charger – I can understand how you didn’t want to wait to post this.

    Thanks again for all your time and hard work.


  13. 13
    Schmeltz

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:18 pm)

    I now have charger envy–LOL!

    Don’t feel bad about the un-painted walls Lyle–that makes 2 of us! I have the paint, but just don’t seem to have the time.


  14. 14
    StevenU

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:23 pm)

    Congratulations… I would also like to know what took 5 hours. I have not been an electrician for 25 years (Tech HS) but don’t think it would take me that long, especially with a ciruit already there. Did they rewire with smaller guage wires?


  15. 15
    Dave G

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:24 pm)

    The strenth of the Volt is that most people can do a full day of driving on a single overnight charge.
    Logically, that says most people won’t need to spend an extra $2000 for a home 220 volt charger.

    Most people probably will want to leave their 110 volt charging cable plugged into the wall and ready to go at home. That will save the hassle of coiling and packing the cable every day.

    And for those that regularly drive over 40 miles per day, if it’s possible to charge at work, it might be logical to leave an extra 110v charging cable there as well. That would save the hassle of coiling and packing the cable every day at work.

    And most people will also want to have a spare charging cable in the car in case they want to charge away from home or work.

    So contrary to current GM spin, I believe extra 110v charging cables will be the popular add-on item for the Volt.

    By contrast, the Plug-in Prius requires you to plug-in frequently to get the full benefit of electric drive. So 220 volt charing with the Plug-in Prius would make a lot more sense than for the Volt.


  16. 16
    Tim Hart

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:25 pm)

    Congrats Lyle. It will be great to hear about your new Volt in a few more days. And don’t worry about painting the wall!


  17. 17
    Schmeltz

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:37 pm)

    I still think Inductive Charging is the way to go. Just drive over a pad, flip a switch, and your car starts getting re-charged via induction. No plugs or any of those “icky” things to contend with. My wife would really get behind this idea since she wouldn’t have to bother handling a dirty plug and chord being drug around our garage or in some public charging point. Shoot, she hates to even pump her own gas, let alone mess around with electricity during a rainy day. I could just see her “loving” dragging a chord and plug through the mud puddles next to the curb at a public charging post while in dress clothe. Now that I think about it, those battery switch stations that Better Place are starting to deploy are sounding better and better.

    For anyone interested, here is a link to inductive charging:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plugless_Power


  18. 18
    Dave G

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (2:59 pm)

    Schmeltz: I still think Inductive Charging is the way to go. Just drive over a pad, flip a switch, and your car starts getting re-charged via induction.

    In order for inductive charging to be reasonably efficient, the coils have to be very close, probably an inch or less.

    Note that the EV1 used an inductive “paddle” charger that fit in a slot. The coils were only separated by two layers of plastic, and from the size of the paddle, it looks the the coils were fairly good sized.


  19. 19
    jscott1

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:01 pm)

    I assume when you say “Let the owner do it themselves” you mean the owner contracts with a licensed electrician who will likely charge $1,500 to install it.

    Oh I’m sure that some people might be able to do it themselves, but I’m also sure that would be illegal and void their homeowner’s insurance.


  20. 20
    Van

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:02 pm)

    Only six more days to actually getting information. One nice piece might be steady state EV mode mileage at say 25, 40, 55 and 70 MPH. I think it would make an enlightening graph.

    My expectation, based on speculation rather than facts, is 7 MPKw @ 25, 6 MPKw @ 40, 5 MPKw @ 55, and 4 MPKw @ 70. Lets find out if I am too optimistic about Volt performance.


  21. 21
    Loboc

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:07 pm)

    Schmeltz: I now have charger envy–LOL!Don’t feel bad about the un-painted walls Lyle–that makes 2 of us!I have the paint, but just don’t seem to have the time.    

    I don’t even have drywall, so, you guys are ahead of me!


  22. 22
    Loboc

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:18 pm)

    jscott1: Oh I’m sure that some people might be able to do it themselves, but I’m also sure that would be illegal and void their homeowner’s insurance.

    As long as you get a permit, it should be ok for the homeowner to do their own work. However, being a belt *and* suspenders kind of a guy, I recommend that a licensed electrician be involved.


  23. 23
    Bob

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:21 pm)

    jscott1,

    “…but I’m also sure that would be illegal and void their homeowner’s insurance.”

    Not if you get the proper permits and inspections. Electrical permits can be obtained by a homeowner.


  24. 24
    Raymondjram

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:27 pm)

    jscott1: I assume when you say “Let the owner do it themselves” you mean the owner contracts with a licensed electrician who will likely charge $1,500 to install it. Oh I’m sure that some people might be able to do it themselves, but I’m also sure that would be illegal and void their homeowner’s insurance.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    If you pay me that $1,500 to install it, I will do it!

    Actually, it should cost much less. If a local, licensed electrician charges $50 an hour, a 5-hour job comes out to $250 in labor, and I estimate that the materials, depending on the distance to the distribution panel, could cost about $150 more. That gives a total of $400. Say that it is for a new American car that runs on electricity, and you may get a discount.

    In my own case, the 220V outlet I can use is at my inline water heater in my garage. I can add a second feed from my panel to the same outlet, add a new 2 x 4 box and cover, some connectors, and all the wiring, for less than $50. Plus free labor! (I’m an EE)

    Raymond


  25. 25
    Loboc

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:28 pm)

    Schmeltz: Shoot, she hates to even pump her own gas, let alone mess around with electricity

    Inductive charging is still not there yet. Wireless electricity is getting some traction though.

    My wife is the same. I gotta fill her gas tank up every month. It’d be way nicer to just plug her car in.


  26. 26
    JohnM

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:30 pm)

    Wow! this is really great Lyle. When is the party?


  27. 27
    Dan Petit

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:33 pm)

    Thanks for your comments yesterday, Tag and James.

    There is still a Volt in my plans, but in about 8 to 10 months instead of January to March. (I have a hunch that it will be only five months after initial sales).

    This site is always so much fun and contains more Volt educational materials than anywhere else, and, since I was so extremely fortunate to have had been provided the opportunity to drive Volt on March 13th, (which was so astounding, it still seems like yesterday), I am very contented to be patient further for when it is my time to buy.

    ************************************************
    *** The Volt drive is *THE* ultimate luxury. ***
    ************************************************

    The peacefulness and total absence of the ICE harshness (that all of us have always never been able to sense (because it has always been a baseline-part of all of our driving) was always there in the first place,) this harshness being totally absent in Volt,
    is the luxury I will not do without.

    When you drive Volt, you will immediately know what I have been talking about.


  28. 28
    bookdabook

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:33 pm)

    “Anyway this charger really is a thing of beauty. It is strong robust and attractive. The wire is thick and curled.” -From the summary at top.

    Typical super-fan speak. Congrats! We are all envious.

    I just had a garage sale last Sat to clear space next to my CRV to park the Volt. I still need about 2 ft of width and have to rearrange a row of boxes. So finding an open space on the wall for a charging system would be a true challenge for me since my walls are covered with boxes and shelves.

    Having more space in the garage is helping to nudge my wife in the direction of Volt acceptance. She still freaks out about the money but the $350/mo lease plan seems to be nudging her along as well. I am hoping the test drive tomorrow in SD will take her over the top … if I can get her to go. She is a proud woman which is one of her strong points and why we’ve been together 30 yrs.

    -Book


  29. 29
    Loboc

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:34 pm)

    From the post:
    “Owners will be able to buy these chargers for $495 from GM’s distribution partner SPX”

    Questions about this Lyle:

    1) Can you buy one if you’re not an ‘owner’ yet?

    2) Does GM sell them via their dealer parts distribution?

    3) How much does an extra 110v charge cord cost?

    Thx.


  30. 30
    Robert Becker

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:35 pm)

    Matthew_B,

    Congratulations Lyle. As a fellow Volt CAB member, my charger is scheduled to be installed tomorrow. Since your fuse box was in the garage, it is hard to understand why it took 5 hours. My fuse box is in my basement which is the complete opposite side of my house from my garage, so the installation may be a marathon event. Hopefully, Mr. Electric (the installer) does have any problems.


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    jscott1

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:39 pm)

    In my own case, the 220V outlet I can use is at my inline water heater in my garage. I can add a second feed from my panel to the same outlet, add a new 2 x 4 box and cover, some connectors, and all the wiring, for less than $50. Plus free labor! (I’m an EE)Raymond    

    Oh I’m sure I could do it myself too, but I looked into it and in my City/State it’s illegal for non-licensed electricians to do this type of work. I looked into what it would take for me to get a license and they have that locked down too. I would have to put in so many hours with a master electrician that I would have to quit my day job. It’s ridiculous that you can’t work on your own house, but true in many places.

    Still the $500 or so doesn’t sound so bad.


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    larry4pyrro

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:40 pm)

    My local utility says you can offset some of the cost through a Federal tax rebate.

    Take a look at IRS Form 8911 Alternative Fuel Vehicle Refueling Property Credit, which states in part; “For property of a character not subject to an allowance for depreciation placed in service at your main home (personal use property), the credit for all property placed in service at your main home is generally the smaller of 50% (30% for hydrogen refueling property) of the property’s cost or $2,000 ($1,000 for hydrogen refueling property).”


  33. 33
    Matthew_B

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:41 pm)

    jscott1: Oh I’m sure that some people might be able to do it themselves, but I’m also sure that would be illegal and void their homeowner’s insurance.

    It is only illegal in very strong union states.

    In most states you are allowed to wire in your own home with a permit and inspection.
    Some states don’t even require a permint nor an inspection.


  34. 34
    Jackson

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:42 pm)

    Loboc: 3) How much does an extra 110v charge cord cost?

    This is what I want to know. Plugging in overnight is convenient. Pulling a wire out of your trunk, unrolling it, plugging it in, unplugging it, rolling it up and putting it back into your trunk is not convenient. If I do not get a 240V charger, I will definitely want an extra wire to leave set up in my garage; so that all I have to do is plug into / unplug from the car — if the cost for this part is not excessive.


  35. 35
    John W (Tampa)

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:46 pm)

    Who plans on installing they’re first piece of a renewable energy system when they get their first electric car? I would feel completely compelled to do so. Even if it were one Solar Panel or a small wind turbine I’d find a way to do it even though I live in a townhome. Taking the Earths renewable energy to move me as opposed to oil from the Earth is so appealing. This question goes out to you as well Lyle. Imagine if GM could partner with a big solar or wind company to create a package specific to the Volt. Perhaps even bundle it with the car loan. I think it would be a great P.R. move.


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    Mike-o-Matic

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:48 pm)

    LeoK: If you already had the 240 volt line run into your garage, what could have taken 5 hours to complete? This must be a pretty complex installation.

    Or the world’s slowest electrician! FIVE HOURS??!?

    My apologies to the man in advance, if there really was a good reason.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:51 pm)

    Schmeltz: I now have charger envy–LOL!Don’t feel bad about the un-painted walls Lyle–that makes 2 of us!I have the paint, but just don’t seem to have the time.    

    Don’t feel bad. It’s just naked drywall, no big sin. When I moved into my house, the studs in the (detached) garage were exposed and several were almost chewed through. They used to keep livestock in there many years ago!

    Edit: I have since drywalled it, at least. Not all painted though :-)


  38. 38
    CaptJackSparrow

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:52 pm)

    Dave G: In order for inductive charging to be reasonably efficient, the coils have to be very close, probably an inch or less.

    Note that the EV1 used an inductive “paddle” charger that fit in a slot. The coils were only separated by two layers of plastic, and from the size of the paddle, it looks the the coils were fairly good sized.

    Yup, and if you want to get as close as you can to a 1:1 your coils weight on both sides will be the same. HEAVY AS HE11!

    /no thanks on the inductive stuff. you’ll be essentially relying on an “air core” transformer and that’s the has the worst transmission efficiency and also add variances in coil separation and that just makes efficiency worse.


  39. 39
    Mike-o-Matic

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (3:58 pm)

    bookdabook: … if I can get her to go.

    Three words: “Duct Tape. Trunk.”

    She’ll thank you later!! :D


  40. 40
    Evil Conservative

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:03 pm)

    CaptJackSparrow: Dude….Lyle….you’re killin us maaan….you still haven’t painted your wall?!?!?!?!?/PAINTING beer party at Lyle’s!!!!   (Quote)  (Reply)

    At least his home builder did not skimp on the drywall screws.


  41. 41
    CaptJackSparrow

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:20 pm)

    Mike-o-Matic: Three words: “Duct Tape. Trunk.”

    She’ll thank you later!!

    Dang Mike-0, I didn’t know you were into that “Schtuff”….lol


  42. 42
    CaptJackSparrow

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:23 pm)

    And the chargers just keep coming…
    More Level II chargers: http://green.autoblog.com/2010/10/19/ecotality-outlines-plans-to-electrify-phoenix-metro-area-960-ch/

    GO VOLT!
    GO EV!
    GO TO HELL OPEC!!!!!


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    Mike-o-Matic

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:29 pm)

    CaptJackSparrow:
    Dang Mike-0, I didn’t know you were into that “Schtuff”….lol    

    Now now, Jack, I was just suggesting coercive techniques. Let’s not start projecting. :D


  44. 44
    Paul C from Austin

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:33 pm)

    Awww, come on Lyle! Paint that garage! It’s not like it’s brain surgery…oh wait!

    Congrats though! I cannot afford one anytime soon, but I will get to test drive one this Saturday- I really look forward to it!


  45. 45
    koz

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:38 pm)

    “Today an electrician spent the better part of 5 hours installing the official Voltec charger in my garage.

    I already had 240 volt line there from my breaker panel, which had been used in my previous MINI E Clipper Creek charger.”

    5 hours with existing 240V service in place? Rape! Rape!

    Ohh…you’re in NY, he was probably union. 45 minutes to inspect, 1 hr lunch, 25 minutes to reinspect, 25 minutes to carry tools in, 10 minutes to turn off circuit, 15 minute break, 30 minutes to install, 15 minutes to clean up, 15 minutes to carry tools out.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:41 pm)

    John W (Tampa): Who plans on installing they’re first piece of a renewable energy system when they get their first electric car? I would feel completely compelled to do so. Even if it were one Solar Panel or a small wind turbine I’d find a way to do it even though I live in a townhome. Taking the Earths renewable energy to move me as opposed to oil from the Earth is so appealing. This question goes out to you as well Lyle. Imagine if GM could partner with a big solar or wind company to create a package specific to the Volt. Perhaps even bundle it with the car loan. I think it would be a great P.R. move.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Don’t do ‘small wind’- especially in FL. Look at the graphs and you find that turbines need to be WAY up there with NO obstructions. Most folks just can’t make it pay.

    Now solar OTOH, well you’re preaching to the choir. (5kw home, 13 kw office). All of this makes you a bit obsessive compulsive. Once you realize it actually is within your capability to reduce your footprint to (close to) zero, it truly does get addictive. And you think about waste in a whole new way. For example-

    I just fired off a nastygram to Igloo. I was told it would indeed get forwarded to management. You see I have a 12 year old thermoelectric cooler. It has ONE moving part. Igloo stated they no longer made this <$20 fan (which just went belly up). So I am supposed to toss another 15 lbs of plastic into a landfill over a stupid little fan? I’ll jury rig something first.

    In any case, YES, the Volt, the PV panel, the solar water heater, etc, wherever you start, it will all come together. I encourage you to go with the feeling and in case you haven’t seen my/our videos, I hope I can give you some more ideas (like collecting your rainwater)-

    home-
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMOCPGLqoGI

    office-
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvJGmJ7L2rk


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:41 pm)

    Lyle,
    Is the conduit running across your garage floor?
    Is the charger from SPX eligible for the free installation as you mention about EcoTality or Coulomb Technologies? I was led to beleive that SPX was one of the free suppliers.

    I’m really excited for you, Lyle! My order is in, my status is 3100 and should be delivered by Christmas. Let me know if there is a painting party! The garage will look great in Veridian Joule!! $995 upcharge, of course!!


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:45 pm)

    Matthew_B:Some states don’t even require a permint nor an inspection.

    Yikes! Didn’t know that.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (4:53 pm)

    koz: 5 hours with existing 240V service in place? Rape! Rape!

    Ohh…you’re in NY, he was probably union. 45 minutes to inspect, 1 hr lunch, 25 minutes to reinspect, 25 minutes to carry tools in, 10 minutes to turn off circuit, 15 minute break, 30 minutes to install, 15 minutes to clean up, 15 minutes to carry tools out.

    Paid by the hour too?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:13 pm)

    Lyle!

    I thought you were a REAL Volt superfan.

    If I knew I had a free Volt on the way, my garage would have been painted, upgraded lighting would have been installed (to show off the new car to all the visitors!), and I probably would have put in some type of new flooring BEFORE the charger went in. After all, you can’t expect this car to just sit in some raggy old garage, can you?????

    HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!

    I think it is now official. You have 50,000+ people that are jealous of you!!!!

    ;-)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:16 pm)

    Matthew_B: “or let the owner do it themselves”Cool.There has been a lot said about how people wouldn’t be able to do their own install.It now sounds like GM is backing away from that position.    

    Being able to do it your self is a big win for those that know how.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:18 pm)

    koz:
    Yikes! Didn’t know that.    

    I many cases, it really is Yikes! If you’re buying a house in the country through much of the middle of the country, do hire a good home inspector and have him take a good look.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:26 pm)

    CaptJackSparrow: Paid by the hour too?  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Was that intended to be a “?” or a “!”?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:34 pm)

    koz: Was that intended to be a “?” or a “!”?

    I really meant !?!?!?!?!?!?

    /I have a friend who’s an electrician, paid /hr and is Union. He tells me all kinds of “Regulatory” practices they have to meet for OSHA on the job.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:37 pm)

    Jim I: I think it is now official. You have 50,000+ people that are jealous of you!!!!

    I’ll drink to that!!!!!


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:48 pm)

    koz: jscott
    5 hours with existing 240V service in place? Rape! Rape!
    Ohh…you’re in NY, he was probably union. 45 minutes to inspect, 1 hr lunch, 25 minutes to reinspect, 25 minutes to carry tools in, 10 minutes to turn off circuit, 15 minute break, 30 minutes to install, 15 minutes to clean up, 15 minutes to carry tools out.

    $1500 / 5 hours = $300/hr. Wow, I get $25/hr. maybe I should become an electrician. Would love a 12 times increase in wages.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (5:53 pm)

    I was hoping/thinking that inductive charging was further along then it is. If you read the few articles that talk about it, a few manufacturers were supposed to be ready for prime time with inductive chargers by this Fall…in other words, now. No shows. Oh well, there’s still time I guess.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:25 pm)

    Will not do anything until I hear back from the free 240V charger program. Will most likely go with the standard 120V and dedicated Edison tier 1 meter.

    $1 per day recharge + Sport Mode = fun

    NPNS


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:27 pm)

    What was the cost of the extra 120V charging cable?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:29 pm)

    kdawg: What was the cost of the extra 120V charging cable?

    Been asking. No one knows at this time.

    =D-Volt


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:36 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:38 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:38 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:41 pm)

    Lyle, are you going to put an ammeter on the wires leading to your charger so you can keep track of power used to charge the Volt?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:53 pm)

    Dave K.: Been asking. No one knows at this time.

    Man, I could have sworn it was posted at one time. Let me do some digging.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:54 pm)

    Lyle – are you going to go w/the time of day charge rate, a flat monthly rate, or just stay as is?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:57 pm)

    Matthew_B: In most states you are allowed to wire in your own home with a permit and inspection.
    Some states don’t even require a permint nor an inspection.

    I was working on a 67amp 575VAC circuit this afternoon. I would do this wiring myself in a heartbeat. I’ve never bothered w/permits before and wired many things in my home. I just dont really see myself speding $500 for this, or the time to wire it in. I will charge at 120V at night. (Now if I got a FREE one, that would be a different story).


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (6:59 pm)

    Looks great, Lyle!

    You wrote: ” It is also weatherized.” Are there specs? For example will it withstand a serious snow storm? Will it withstand 30 below?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:01 pm)

    Mike-o-Matic: Or the world’s slowest electrician! FIVE HOURS??!?
    My apologies to the man in advance, if there really was a good reason.

    Well, he was paid by the hour, and by a big company, not an individual. So he may have milked it.

    What’s that murphy’s law.. work expands to fill the time allowed. He probably “finished” just before Lyle was due to be home. :)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:09 pm)

    All I can say is .. you lucky dog.

    And I do think inductive charging is the best. You will not need to do anything just drive over the thing or dive up to it on the wall.


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    Eco_Turbo

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:12 pm)

    67 kdawg,

    In my state you are allowed to repair or replace an existing circuit, but adding a new one is a different story.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:12 pm)

    How about a video when you get your Volt and plug it in for the first time? It’s been awhile since we’ve seen a Lyle Dennis Production.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:17 pm)

    usbseawolf2000,

    Most people will not run the ICE on the VOLT but this is a rating for the ICE running which is totally wrong …. I would like to know the way they came up with this pollution rating.
    I average less than 25 miles a day… I will not use the ice except for trips which is maybe once a month less than 100 miles . But all the hybrids who run the engine daily will have the rated pollution. This rating for the VOLT is totally wrong.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:35 pm)

    Sweet Lyle!

    Hey, can you use that level on the rack please LOL buddy!


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:41 pm)

    If it took an electrician 5 hours to do the install, thirty feet from the breaker box, he must have taken a four hour lunch break. I installed a 240V outlet 20 feet from my box and it took about 15 minutes. And I wasn’t in any hurry. It’s a quick job unless you have to go thru walls and ceilings.
    The electrical connections couldn’t be any simpler.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:43 pm)

    CaptJackSparrow: Dude….Lyle….you’re killin us maaan….
    you still haven’t painted your wall?!?!?!?!?/PAINTING beer party at Lyle’s!!!!     

    Make sure that the party starts *after* Lyle’s Volt arrives! I’ll bring the rollers.

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:44 pm)

    Loboc:
    As long as you get a permit, it should be ok for the homeowner to do their own work. However, being a belt *and* suspenders kind of a guy, I recommend that a licensed electrician be involved.    

    If the inspector comes in and finds out your work is deficient, it could become very expensive for you to do it yourself. And the bit about the insurance on your home; I wouldn’t want to discover my insurance policy is voided after a fire results because I did it myself incorrectly. Even if it didn’t void the policy, I wouldn’t do it myself because one little mistake might cause that fire.

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:46 pm)

    The charger looks a bit different than the concept. I’m p!ssed now and will not buy a Volt ;)

    volt_charger.jpg


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:47 pm)

    Shaft: Looks great, Lyle!You wrote: ” It is also weatherized.” Are there specs? For example will it withstand a serious snow storm? Will it withstand 30 below?    

    I’d like the same answers. Can I mount it to a pole near my driveway?

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:47 pm)

    Is a ground fault circuit breaker recommended in the installation instructions?

    Since bedrooms require ARC fault breakers, don’t plan on sleeping in your VOLT unless you install one of those!


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:55 pm)

    Raymondjram:
    If you pay me that $1,500 to install it, I will do it!
    Actually, it should cost much less. If a local, licensed electrician charges $50 an hour, a 5-hour job comes out to $250 in labor, and I estimate that the materials, depending on the distance to the distribution panel, could cost about $150 more. That gives a total of $400. Say that it is for a new American car that runs on electricity, and you may get a discount.In my own case, the 220V outlet I can use is at my inline water heater in my garage. I can add a second feed from my panel to the same outlet, add a new 2 x 4 box and cover, some connectors, and all the wiring, for less than $50. Plus free labor! (I’m an EE)Raymond    

    Back in the ’70′s, I had some additional work done to install a kiln in the basement. The electrician I hired said that the formula he used to calculate the price was three time the cost of materials. The price he charged me was a little lower than other quotes form licensed electricians. Take it for what its worth!

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (7:56 pm)

    It really *is* getting to actually feel “REAL” – even vicariously.

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:02 pm)

    LRGVProVolt: If the inspector comes in and finds out your work is deficient, it could become very expensive for you to do it yourself.

    How so? I’ve been on many walk throughs with an inspector on equipment installs. Even with licensed electricians the inspector often finds things. If the inspector has a good rapport with an electrician they’ll just mark the permit “approved after noted changes” otherwise they’ll tag it “reinspect.”

    With a homeowner they certainly would mark it “reinspect.” You make the changes, call back and it’s done. Not that I’ve had experience there… every time the inspections go very quick once they see quality work.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:03 pm)

    Dan Petit: When you drive Volt, you will immediately know what I have been talking about.

    I will have to wait for the dealers in this area of Texas to get their demo and allotments. Can’t wait! Sitting on my hands so I won’t bite my nails. :)

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    Texas

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:10 pm)

    Lyle, It might be time to get a nice video camera and start making Youtube moments to post here.

    You can do one of you painting that wall and moving that rack. Oh, they sell levels at WalMart for a few bucks. Great investment for any homeowner. ;)

    A few videos that might be very interesting:

    1) You showing us the charger and plugging it into the volt.
    2) You going to the garage on a very cold morning and going to work – the preconditioning phase.
    3) Driving out of the garage – The unplugging, and prep. The sound going out, etc.
    4) The Volt parked and you capturing peoples’ reactions and them asking questions. Do you have business cards to give people to direct them to this site? Your going to need them.
    5) Introductory video for new visitors to this site. You can introduce yourself and show your Volt. Talk a bit about it and so on.

    Anyway, It’s great to see your dream come to reality through long hard work. Well deserved!


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:27 pm)

    Texas: A few videos that might be very interesting:
    1) You showing us the charger and plugging it into the volt.
    2) You going to the garage on a very cold morning and going to work – the preconditioning phase.
    3) Driving out of the garage – The unplugging, and prep. The sound going out, etc.
    4) The Volt parked and you capturing peoples’ reactions and them asking questions. Do you have business cards to give people to direct them to this site? Your going to need them.
    5) Introductory video for new visitors to this site. You can introduce yourself and show your Volt. Talk a bit about it and so on.

    #6 Driving by a gas station & waving


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:37 pm)

    I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!

    sorry, my pet peeve, and when in a restaurant I have on several occasions had to get up and straighten paintings/mirrors.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:45 pm)

    BTW:

    Is that Dora the explorer wrapping paper? Looks like someone got an early birthday present :)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:50 pm)

    I am so jealous of you guys in the US – we in Australia (among others) will have to wait at least another 2 years before we can even dream of purchasing a Volt, let alone installing a charger (though we are on 240v standard already so we probably wont need one).

    Lyle, thank you for posting your Volt adventures. I’ve been following this blog since somewhere during mid 2008. The journey for you has been long, and although it will be even longer for us outside the US, through your work on this blog I still feel like a contributor to the revolution. I’m sure I speak for many when I say thank you.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (8:57 pm)

    JEC: I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!sorry, my pet peeve, and when in a restaurant I have on several occasions had to get up and straighten paintings/mirrors.    

    Sorry, that’s not a pet peeve, it’s a disorder (g). Freud didn’t get much “right”, but he sure nailed OCD. I have a T-shirt that says “I’m CDO, that’s OCD – in the right order…” Not to worry though, channeled correctly, it can be a real strength.
    I’ll bet your cars are *squeeky* clean!

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Eric Rotbard

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:05 pm)

    I got mine installed today (was supposed to be yesterday, but got bumped). It took about 2 hours, mostly because my fusebox cover deceived the electicians- it looked like the panel had a lot of unused space, but when they removed the cover, lo and behold, it had nothing to spare. So they had to run back to the office to get a fuse to double up to make room for the Volt one. Btw, forgive the newb question, but is there a way to insert photos from my pc? It asks for a URL- is that the local path for the pic?


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:08 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: Volt’s Exhaust Emission:
        

    Where did you find this? This makes no sense at all. It looks like someone created it in excel.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:11 pm)

    Eric Rotbard: Btw, forgive the newb question, but is there a way to insert photos from my pc?

    Create a photobucket account and upload your photos there. Then you can use the links from photobucket to post here.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:14 pm)

    Eric Rotbard: is there a way to insert photos from my pc? It asks for a URL- is that the local path for the pic?

    I put photos that I want shown here on photobucket.com (free). You upload them from your PC and then put *that* link in the comment framed by [ img ] place link here [/img]
    Then it shows up here. *Note* that the letters img must be lower case.

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Red HHR

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:17 pm)

    The orange cord nicely matches the orange wires under the hood.
    I would have no problem installing that in my garage, It would match.

    One of these would be cool in the driveway, but I bet it would be a bit more than $500.

    Tagamet:
    I’d like the same answers. Can I mount it to a pole near my driveway?Be well and believe,
    TagametLet’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS    

    WattStation-large.jpg


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    Rooster

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:17 pm)

    Tagamet: Sorry, that’s not a pet peeve, it’s a disorder (g). Freud didn’t get much “right”, but he sure nailed OCD. I have a T-shirt that says “I’m CDO, that’s OCD – in the right order…” Not to worry though, channeled correctly, it can be a real strength.I’ll bet your cars are *squeeky* clean!Be well and believe,TagametLet’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS  (Quote)  (Reply)

    JEC, I think you owe Tag $150. You get a new patient discount for the first session.


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    EV Engineer

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:22 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:22 pm)

    Red HHR: The orange cord nicely matches the orange wires under the hood.
    I would have no problem installing that in my garage, It would match.One of these would be cool in the driveway, but I bet it would be a bit more than $500.
        

    You can have that neat charger if *I* can have the VOLT!

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:23 pm)

    Rooster: Tagamet: Sorry, that’s not a pet peeve, it’s a disorder (g). Freud didn’t get much “right”, but he sure nailed OCD. I have a T-shirt that says “I’m CDO, that’s OCD – in the right order…” Not to worry though, channeled correctly, it can be a real strength.I’ll bet your cars are *squeeky* clean!Be well and believe,TagametLet’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS (Quote) (Reply)

    JEC, I think you owe Tag $150. You get a new patient discount for the first session.

    I’m a recognized Blue Cross/Blue Shield service provider, but I also take plastic (lol).

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Tagamet

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:28 pm)

    EV Engineer: Its a real shame that the Volt doesn’t offer Rapid Charging like the LEAF and many other true electrics. Four hours is a long time too wait before you can go on that 40 mile journey. Maybe the next generation will step up to the plate and offer what most other 1st gen models offer. One can only hope.    

    LOL, the Volt doesn’t take 16 hours to charge the way the Leaf “stepped up”. Where exactly are these Rapid Chargers placed, *exactly*? Maybe next Gen the Leaf won’t need to charge after every 2 hours of driving – maybe they’ll step up to the use of a range extender…

    OOPS, please ignore this. I thought that you were serious (g)
    Be well,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    kdawg

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:30 pm)

    EV Engineer: Its a real shame that the Volt doesn’t offer Rapid Charging like the LEAF and many other true electrics. Four hours is a long time too wait before you can go on that 40 mile journey. Maybe the next generation will step up to the plate and offer what most other 1st gen models offer. One can only hope.

    You have the Volt confused w/the Leaf. You don’t need to wait w/the Volt. It has an onboard generator. The leaf is dead in the water until you charge the battery.

    Its a real shame you keep posting FUD. Maybe the next day you will stay on priuschat.com. One can only hope.


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    Tagamet

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:32 pm)

    kdawg: Its a real shame you keep posting FUD. Maybe the next day you will stay on priuschat.com. One can only hope.

    LOL, we posted at the same time (and in the same manner).

    I have work calls for the next 2 days (yippee). Off to bed.
    Night all.

    Be well and believe,
    Tagamet

    Let’s Just Get The VOLTS ‘ Wheels On The Road!!****NPNS


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    Loboc

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:34 pm)

    JEC: I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!

    There’s a level right there in the pic. Use it!


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    Jackson

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:51 pm)

    Jackson:
    This is what I want to know.Plugging in overnight is convenient.Pulling a wire out of your trunk, unrolling it, plugging it in, unplugging it, rolling it up and putting it back into your trunk is not convenient.If I do not get a 240V charger, I will definitely want an extra wire to leave set up in my garage; so that all I have to do is plug into / unplug from the car — if the cost for this part is not excessive.    

    Having not read any reply since #34 (above), I’ll add that perhaps future electric vehicles will have an inboard retracting reel for it’s charging wire, perhaps in a front fender. If someone has already thought of this — never mind!


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    Paul Stoller

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:58 pm)

    LRGVProVolt,

    This isn’t uncommon remember when you’re paying a HVAC tech, Plumber, Electrician, they have to cover their overhead in what they are charging you. They have to account for things like vehicle maintenance, time spent obtaining materials, licensing costs, training costs, healthcare etc into their costs. Even using a formula such as the one above it’s not like these folks are making nearly as much as it might appear at first blush.


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    Raymondjram

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:59 pm)

    flmark:
    For example-I just fired off a nastygram to Igloo.I was told it would indeed get forwarded to management.You see I have a 12 year old thermoelectric cooler.It has ONE moving part.Igloo stated they no longer made this <$20 fan (which just went belly up).So I am supposed to toss another 15 lbs of plastic into a landfill over a stupid little fan?I’ll jury rig something first.    

    You can use a fan from a CPU cooler setup or from a power supply, probably from an old PC. They all operate on 12 volts DC. The thermoelectric cooler is very efficient. I bought one of those coolers at eBay for one dollar plus shipping, because the hot/cold switch was broken. I fix it in a few minutes and it is working. GM could add a thermoelectric cooler/heater to the Volt cargo area for heating small meals or for cooling a few cans of your favorite beverage.

    Raymond


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    Kdawg

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (9:59 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    LEAF Geek

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:05 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:10 pm)

    @ 107 Kdawg… There can be only 1, and I was here first. Oh wait.. that is prob. one of the resident trolls trying to impersonate.


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    Moe Skeeto

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:11 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:15 pm)

    LEAF Geek: You do realize that in the 4 hours it takes the Volt to charge a rapid charging leaf will be more than 700 miles down the road. Do the math you people!
    Nissan LEAF Rapid Charge < 30 minutes = 100+ miles
    Chevy Volt Fastest Charge = 4 hours = 40 miles
    See you at the finish line you yellow belly Volt maniacs without any math skillz evah .
    Oh and don't forget to fill up your ICE !!! LOL

    I’d take that race. We’ll go across Canada in January. You will go 40miles in your Leaf and have to recharge. I will go 40 miles in my Volt… and then… keep on going. I’ll tell the people at the finish line to look for an angry person in a catfish car showing up sometime the following week.


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    The REAL kdawg

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:20 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:23 pm)

    (click to show comment)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:30 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: The link to the original PDF was provided in post #61.

    That link goes nowhere.


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    Fiddy Sense

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:31 pm)

    Wondering how fast can that thing charge my Apple gear. I roll with 2 iPads, 3 iPhones and 1 iPod and it would be very nice to hook them up to the Volt at the same time.

    BTW this gear is needed to keep my clients and suppliers coordinated during distro hours in the hood. The brothers do not tolerate inefficiency in today’s economy.

    Hoodwink :-)


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    Texas

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:31 pm)

    kdawg:
    #6 Driving by a gas station & waving    

    Just waving? ;)


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    LRGVProVolt

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:32 pm)

    kent beuchert: And I wasn’t in any hurry. It’s a quick job unless you have to go thru walls and ceilings.

    Where did you run the cable – outside? For my house the electrician would have to get in the attic; it’s not easy crawling around up there. Yah. Easy like he11.

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
    P.S. I’ve seen a lot a jobs where the cabling is along the eve and it looks downright crappy.


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    Mother of Kdawg

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:42 pm)

    kdawg:
    I’d take that race.We’ll go across Canada in January.You will go 40miles in your Leaf and have to recharge.I will go 40 miles in my Volt… and then… keep on going.I’ll tell the people at the finish line to look for an angry person in a catfish car showing up sometime the following week.    

    Sorry but the race would be over in less than 4 hours and you would still be stuck in your converted garage waiting on you 1st charge !! ROTFLMAO :-)


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:54 pm)

    Matthew_B: otherwise they’ll tag it “reinspect.”

    My whole point is based on you not being a licensed electrician. I’ve worked alongside a Master Electrician while building several houses. In most cases, I did most of the construction myself with an assistant. I know how the system works. Yes, if the inspector knows the licensed electrician, the process goes a lot smoother. But doing it yourself can lead to a lot of wasted time, and maybe additional cost depending on what error you make. If you want to take that chance go ahead. I won’t stop you – for sure! Depending where you live it can make a big difference as many have posted here. I am sure that many of you who are not licensed electricians would be able to do the job right and according to code but unless you are experienced working with electricity, it is not something to mess with. The best option is to befriend a licensed electrician and work alongside him.

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    Oct 19th, 2010 (10:56 pm)

    Mother of Kdawg: Sorry but the race would be over in less than 4 hours and you would still be stuck in your converted garage waiting on you 1st charge

    4 hours! Wow, I didn’t know the top speed of the Leaf was 1000miles/hr. Or maybe you have no concept of geography. Hey.. how much does a Snickers bar cost? $100?


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:00 pm)

    kdawg: #6 Driving by a gas station & waving

    Can I amend that to waving to the Prius owner talking with the Nissan Leaf owner about using gasoline. :)

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:02 pm)

    JEC: I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!sorry, my pet peeve, and when in a restaurant I have on several occasions had to get up and straighten paintings/mirrors.    

    You have an obsessive compulsion. ;)

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
    P>S> ON occasion, I have done the same.


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    Paul

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:08 pm)

    I’m really happy for you, Lyle. It’s going to be very exiting to live the Volt with you.
    Sadly, in my country we have to wait till Volt Gen 2 (if we’re lucky), but I already have a 220V line ready!


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:17 pm)

    Paul Stoller: LRGVProVolt,
    This isn’t uncommon remember when you’re paying a HVAC tech, Plumber, Electrician, they have to cover their overhead in what they are charging you. They have to account for things like vehicle maintenance, time spent obtaining materials, licensing costs, training costs, healthcare etc into their costs.Even using a formula such as the one above it’s not like these folks are making nearly as much as it might appear at first blush.    

    My post was just an accounting of an experience I had back then. You aren’t telling me anything new that I didn’t already know; I have two brother-in-laws who are plumbers and I hear about it all the time. The electrician that I spoke about found his formula easier than keeping attract of how much time he spent and how much was spent on parts, etc.

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:24 pm)

    Moe Skeeto

    Trash Mouth!


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    James

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:26 pm)

    LEAF Geek: You do realize that in the 4 hours it takes the Volt to charge a rapid charging leaf will be more than 700 miles down the road. Do the math you people!Nissan LEAF Rapid Charge < 30 minutes = 100+ milesChevy Volt Fastest Charge = 4 hours = 40 milesSee you at the finish line you yellow belly Volt maniacs without any math skillz evah .Oh and don’t forget to fill up your ICE !!! LOL   (Quote)  (Reply)

    I think this “LeafGeek” guy is some kid in Tokyo. Any true geek would have done his homework and realized there is no 480v Leaf charge adapter available at this time, or the time of first Leaf delivery. Dealers in my rollout city say there is no set standard for quick charge yet, and when set, they will have to attach an adapter to the car, not in the nose, but apparently on the rear fender. I don’t see in any way how that makes a Leaf superior to it’s competitors.

    At any rate – I’m trying to decide if a Volt/Leaf rivalry of some kind with fanboys insulting each other ala: Mustang/Camaro; Dodge/Chev/Ford pickups, etc. is really only sophomoric and pointless – or just plain idiotic.

    I hope to have a Volt and Leaf, or Leaf and MPV5 in my garage in a couple years. Everybody wins when we kiss Venezuela, Saudi Arabia and Iraq goodbye. Maybe except this guy, who’ll be looking for someone to argue with that pepper is better than salt.

    PUMP OUT THE VOLTS! ( in all 50 states ),

    James


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    LRGVProVolt

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:27 pm)

    kdawg:
    That link goes nowhere.    

    I know what you mean! As for myself, it evaporated right in his post. ;)

    Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.


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    koz

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:28 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: I made the charts with the data from CARB. The link to the original PDF was provided in post #61.There are more information posted at: http://priuschat.com/forums/gen-iii-2010-prius-main-forum/64518-emission-comparison-prius-hs250h-insight-civic-hybrid-jetta-gas-tdi-wrx-sti-2.html#post1198893  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Ah, ha, ha, ahhh, ha, ha, oh, oh, aaaah, ha, ha…

    Prius Troll sleys me. Too friggin funny. Links to his own bogus chart on Priuschat as source.

    Ah, haa, haa , ha

    num…friggin.nuts


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    JohnK

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:30 pm)

    jscott1: It’s ridiculous that you can’t work on your own house, but true in many places.

    It’s NOT that hard. You first make an arrangement with a licensed electrician. Then you do the work and he comes to inspect it and signs off on all documents that he did the work. He gets maybe $50 and has zero work other than coming over to do the inspection.


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    ChuckR

     

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:33 pm)

    LEAF Geek,

    700 miles in 4 hours?? Man that’s some fast Leaf, even with no recharging, that’s 170+ mph. Buy it.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 19th, 2010 (11:43 pm)

    kdawg:
    That link goes nowhere.    

    CARB changed the file name. Try this:
    http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/pcldtmdv/2011/gm_pc_a0061675_1d4_b4u2_hevge.pdf


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    Voltastic

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (12:15 am)

    usbseawolf2000:
    I made the charts with the data from CARB.

    You should be ashamed of yourself for trying to crap on Lyle’s good news.


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    DonC

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (12:28 am)

    Lyle, you definitely need to get that wall painted. Not sure you’d want CJS and his beer party to do the work though! LOL

    CorvetteGuy: The training I went to recommended “a 30 amp circuit minimum or 40 amp circuit so you can be prepared for future technology”… Was there any mention of that by anyone you have spoken with? 

    You have to think a 6.6 kW charger is in the near future.


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    DonC

     

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (12:33 am)

    kdawg: @ 107 Kdawg…There can be only 1, and I was here first.Oh wait.. that is prob. one of the resident trolls trying to impersonate.    

    Sock puppet alert!


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    DonC

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (12:43 am)

    usbseawolf2000: CARB changed the file name. Try this:

    Cut me a break. The Volt is a zero emission vehicle for 40 miles. What part of “zero” don’t you get?


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    Matthew B

     

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (1:26 am)

    JohnK:
    It’s NOT that hard.You first make an arrangement with a licensed electrician.Then you do the work and he comes to inspect it and signs off on all documents that he did the work.He gets maybe $50 and has zero work other than coming over to do the inspection.    

    No here (Oregon).

    You can wire your own home that you live in.

    But doing the work and then having an electrician claim they did is grounds for the electrician to lose their license.


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    john1701a

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (2:02 am)

    DonC: The Volt is a zero emission vehicle for 40 miles. What part of “zero” don’t you get?

    Regardless of charge-level, in extreme cold the engine will run briefly for warmth. What part of “zero” degrees don’t you get? Also, we know that 40 miles isn’t a given. Use of the heater, defroster, or A/C will reduce range.

    Misrepresenting Volt by portraying absolutes doesn’t helping anyone. Can we try to be realistic… or do I need to point out the emissions from the electricity source too?


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    Oct 20th, 2010 (2:13 am)

    There IS a level, right in front of it!!! 8D

    JEC: I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!sorry, my pet peeve, and when in a restaurant I have on several occasions had to get up and straighten paintings/mirrors.    


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    WopOnTour

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (4:26 am)

    usbseawolf2000: Lyle, feel free to make this your blog entry for tomorrow. Volt’s emission numbers are out. It is rated for ULEV. It did not get SULEV like every hybrid on the market.Source: http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/pcldtmdv/2011/gm_pc_a0061675_1d4_u2_hevge.pdf  (Quote)  (Reply)

    usbseawolf2000: CARB changed the file name. Try this:http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/pcldtmdv/2011/gm_pc_a0061675_1d4_b4u2_hevge.pdf  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Merely voluntary emission compliance documents as submitted by GM to meet minimum ARB requirements prior to initial California sales.
    (ie NOT actual tests results, just a “ceiling” statement)
    Interpret and spin any way you wish over in Priuschat, but they mean very little…
    WOT


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    Tagamet

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (5:32 am)

    Off to work for some Volt funds. :-) , so be good to each other.
    See you later.

    Be well,
    Tagamet


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    Dave G

     

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (5:59 am)

    Do the GM charging cables include a convenience light?
    portable-ev-charger2.jpg
    It seems this would be VERY helpful.


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    Michael

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:16 am)

    Dave G: Do the GM charging cables include a convenience light?
    It seems this would be VERY helpful.    

    Yes. The release lever activates an LED flashlight. See it here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQeVVqP8nGY&feature=player_embedded#!

    at about 3:45 in the video.


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    nasaman

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:18 am)

    Loboc: JEC: I just cannot take my eyes off that metal bracket hanging on Lyle’s wall.
    Please get a level!

    There’s a level right there in the pic. Use it!

    Hey, give our poor friend a break —level use is a tricky topic & they don’t cover it in med school! ;) ;) ;)


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    Raymondjram

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:20 am)

    Dave G: Do the GM charging cables include a convenience light?It seems this would be VERY helpful.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Yes, they do. It is a bright white LED at the bottom of the plug as you hold it. I believe that Tesla Motors was the first EV manufacturer that had a light inside the charging port to help guide the user to plug in the charging cable.

    The SAE standard for the plug and cable is J1772, and the official documentation has no mention of the illumination. For the fellow engineers in this forum, here is the link to that documentation:
    http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/zevprog/stakeholders/infrastructure/finalsaej1772.doc

    Raymond


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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:23 am)

    nasaman: Hey, give our poor friend a break —level use is a tricky topic & they don’t cover it in med school!   (Quote)  (Reply)

    My wife, who isn’t an engineer or a doctor, knows how to use a level. She uses a small 6-inch version to keep our framed paintings level on the walls.

    Raymond


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    nasaman

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:31 am)

    Lyle, one of your fellow CAB members, Chelsea Sexton, is saying on her FB page that she’s having nightmarish problems with her charger installation so far. She says, “In the span of a few hours, my charger install went from incredibly simple to really, really complicated. And not a lot of straight answers involved so far. If someone like me- with access to all the right people- is having this much trouble, I really worry about having cars in showrooms w/in the next several weeks.” I’m sure she (and probably Chevy too) would be grateful for any tips you might offer.


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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:34 am)

    nasaman,

    She must be having a local electrical problem at her home. This is not a Chevrolet/GM issue. Not every home has the correct or even easy access to a 220 VAC circuit. I recommend getting a better electrician or a frendly EE . I would do it but I live too far away.

    Raymond


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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:35 am)

    john1701a: Can we try to be realistic… or do I need to point out the emissions from the electricity source too?

    My opinion:
    Peak oil will hit way before global warming, so energy independence is more important near-term.

    Facts:
    The U.S. has enough coal to last at least 100 years. The U.S. has been called the Saudi Arabia of coal. By contrast, world oil is already starting to peak. U.S. oil production peaked in 1973.

    With large centralized power plants, it’s becomes possible to process carbon emissions using algae bio-reactors.

    The vast majority of renewable energy is harvested as electricity.

    The “well to wheel” efficiency for electric drive is much higher than any gas engine car. Here’s an example:
    http://mysite.verizon.net/vzenu6hr/ebay_pictures/carbon_emissions.jpg

    Conclusion:
    The first order of business is to remove our dependence on foreign oil. Once most passenger vehicle miles are powered by electricity, we’ll already have lower emissions, and we’ll be in a much better position lower emmissions further.


  149. 149
    nasaman

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (6:38 am)

    PS to my #146: I lived in the south bay/beach area of LA for 15 years not far from where Chels and her husband live and I was SHOCKED to see some SCE rates are now as high as $0.55/KWh! :( Sure glad I’m not still there —I’ll be able to recharge my Volt for about 1/5th that near KSC in Florida where I live now.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (8:12 am)

    Voltastic:
    You should be ashamed of yourself for trying to crap on Lyle’s good news.    

    It is what it is. I was giving a heads up for what’s coming and you guys should find out earlier.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (8:18 am)

    DonC:
    Cut me a break. The Volt is a zero emission vehicle for 40 miles. What part of “zero” don’t you get?    

    There is more to a green car than electric miles. On board generator’s emission is part of the pollution. 51% of the electricity in the US is generated from Coal. Majority of the electricity are from other sources of fossil fuel. Those are other part of the pollution.

    I hope you see the bigger picture.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (8:24 am)

    WopOnTour: Merely voluntary emission compliance documents as submitted by GM to meet minimum ARB requirements prior to initial California sales.

    Are you suggesting GM submitted those numbers without actually testing it? That is huge.

    I presented data “as is”. It appears you are the one trying to spin.


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    john1701a

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (9:32 am)

    WopOnTour: Merely voluntary emission compliance documents as submitted by GM to meet minimum ARB requirements prior to initial California sales.

    Remember all the begging & pleading to study Two-Mode history? This is why.

    Supporters of it also anticipated a cleaner emission rating than other vehicles in that same class; instead, the hybrid actually turned out to be dirtier. Be thankful Volt ended up being the same.

    SULEV wasn’t a realistic expectation anyway. Besides lower emissions, it also needed to be certified for 120,000 miles rather than just 100,000 like ULEV. And since we already knew the warranty…

    Can’t take the next step until acknowledging the outcome of this one.


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    Raymondjram

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (11:27 am)

    Dave G: The first order of business is to remove our dependence on foreign oil. Once most passenger vehicle miles are powered by electricity, we’ll already have lower emissions, and we’ll be in a much better position lower emmissions further.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    Well said (or written)!

    Raymond


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    john1701a

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (12:14 pm)

    john1701a: rather than just 100,000 like ULEV

    Looks like the distance criteria for ULEV has been extended to match SULEV. Gotta like the Tier increases over time. Of course, that makes them moving targets for upgrades later.

    Whatever the case, it’s good to hear from GM that they are indeed pursuing the AT-PZEV rating for next generation design. (Acknowledgement for the next step came quickly!)


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    Oct 20th, 2010 (1:36 pm)

    usbseawolf2000:
    It is what it is. I was giving a heads up for what’s coming and you guys should find out earlier.    

    What it “is” is a low class move even for a Troll.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (2:04 pm)

    Voltastic:
    What it “is” is a low class move even for a Troll.    

    When Cab Driver revealed the Volt’s transmission patent, he wasn’t called out as a “low class move by a troll”. Your statement is really a low blow.

    There is a lot more to a green car than the EV range. Gas saving is just one dimension.


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    WopOnTour

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (2:50 pm)

    usbseawolf2000: Are you suggesting GM submitted those numbers without actually testing it? That is huge.I presented data “as is”. It appears you are the one trying to spin.  (Quote)  (Reply)

    You obviously understand very little of the regulatory compliance process. But then again how could you, your just some guy who drives a Prius.

    Manufacturer’s routinely submit there own test results initially when new cars or powertrain combinations come to market. Providing they are performed to specified criteria CARB accepts them, and records them but doesn’t actually perform the tests. Often the primary goal is to achieve EPA emission status (Tier/Bin) and achieving various STATE compliance is somewhat secondary. When new vehicles come to market there are normal time limits for various aspects of this paperwork to be filed. When detailed emissions results necessary to satisfy STATE ONLY compliances (such as CARB states) manufacturers often initially provide “ceiling” documents and then refine them after further testing which could take up to a year. (and still stay within timings as outlined by CARB)

    I haven’t looked but Toyota may have done the exact same thing in 2009 with the launch of the Gen3 Prius. The point is it is NOT unusual and meets the terms of CARB compliance necessary to begin selling the vehicles into the State of California.

    So as I said feel free to “spin” it any way you wish, take it to the New York Times for all I (or GM) cares. It’s essentially a normal part of the process and hardly news worthy.
    WopOnTour


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    john1701a

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (4:00 pm)

    When it comes to smog-related emissions, I suggest study of diesel support. They’ve got the greenwashing mastered. For example, calling ULSD the new “clean” diesel… even though it barely helps reduce emissions down to a level compliant with regulations. That’s no even as clean as the typical gas guzzler.

    Or you can just chose to support a Volt next time around that’s cleaner.

    Haven’t you noticed that most “+50″ hopefuls have ended their insulting and simply set focus on the future instead? A response that both belittles & downplays really paints a bad picture. Why continue down that path?


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (5:15 pm)

    WopOnTour:
    You obviously understand very little of the regulatory compliance process. But then again how could you, your just some guy who drives a Prius.

    You are welcome.


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    Voltastic

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (9:01 pm)

    usbseawolf2000:
    When Cab Driver revealed the Volt’s transmission patent, he wasn’t called out as a “low class move by a troll”. Your statement is really a low blow.There is a lot more to a green car than the EV range. Gas saving is just one dimension.    

    This blog entry was about Lyle’s good news about having his charger installed and you trolls have crapped all over it. You just couldn’t leave one blog alone could you. Low class and bad manners – ie a Troll.


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    JayMan

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (9:58 pm)

    Help me understand this.

    You’re bringing home a brand new Volt, and housing it in a garage with unpainted walls?

    With this special occasion, it would seem appropriate to sand those ‘mud strips’, finish the surfaces smooth, prep the walls, and tastefully paint. Use a soft color to compliment your new car.

    At least you have drywall in the garage instead of bare studs, but . . . really! Naked drywall next to your new Volt?

    For shame.


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    greenWin

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    Oct 20th, 2010 (11:13 pm)

    CaptJackSparrow: koz: 5 hours with existing 240V service in place? Rape! Rape!

    Ohh…you’re in NY, he was probably union. 45 minutes to inspect, 1 hr lunch, 25 minutes to reinspect, 25 minutes to carry tools in, 10 minutes to turn off circuit, 15 minute break, 30 minutes to install, 15 minutes to clean up, 15 minutes to carry tools out.

    This is problematic. Tesla’s much more expensive Roadster charges directly from a 220V 40A dryer connector. No wall mounted charger. No purchase extra dodads. No installation fees from union guys. Just plug it in!!! The charge process is handled by the onboard electronics.

    This probably should be the case for Volt too. Although the opportunities for third party accessories are tempting – we should be sure we NEED them. Tesla does sell a fast charge optional wall charger. It requires a 70A 220V circuit and so needs heavy duty wiring from the house panel.

    I hope I am wrong on this. That there is a bonafide reason to have to buy the wall charger to get Volt topped up in 4 hours. We’ll be interested to hear GM’s discussion on this.


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    Oct 21st, 2010 (9:08 am)

    CorvetteGuy: The training I went to recommended “a 30 amp circuit minimum or 40 amp circuit so you can be prepared for future technology”… Was there any mention of that by anyone you have spoken with?  (Quote)  (Reply)

    CorvetteGuy,

    According to my resources, for the 240-V Voltec Charger, the requirements are as follow:

    20 amp minimum
    30 amp recommended for Volt
    40 amp so you can be prepared for future technology.

    If you already have an existing 20 amp circuit, that will be fine. However, if you are running a line, I would encourage you to consider making the circuit bigger. Often times, the biggest expense stems from the electrician’s time, especially if you are running the wires under dry wall. While we currently do not have anything specific in mind for 40 amps, as products develop and technology increases, so may our energy needs.

    Thanks,
    Angie – Chevrolet Volt Advisor


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    Eric Rotbard

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    Oct 21st, 2010 (10:28 am)

    The charger reminds me of a Cylon from the old Battlestar Galactia series :)

    - Eric


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    Kyle

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    Oct 21st, 2010 (10:54 am)

    I am a bit confused about the price. It seems high for basically and extension cord. Is $495 due to having a relay to control current until it is plugged in? Still seems expensive. Any insight would be appreciated. Maybe some engineering folks on this site have some thoughts.


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    usbseawolf2000

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    Oct 21st, 2010 (12:42 pm)

    Voltastic:
    This blog entry was about Lyle’s good news about having his charger installed and you trolls have crapped all over it. You just couldn’t leave one blog alone could you. Low class and bad manners – ie a Troll.    

    Thank you. I found his email address and sent the information directly. You were being very helpful. Although, I don’t think it came out the way you wanted.


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    storm

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    Oct 21st, 2010 (6:56 pm)

    It isn’t nearly correct to call this unit a charger. A controlled outlet would be a better description. Catering to the 240V paranoia would be more accurate. Most of the world plugs their toaster into 240 without a second thought.