We already know the Volt offers normal mode, sports mode, and mountain mode. There will also be a fourth mode of operation called maintenance mode.
The purpose of this function is to maintain the gasoline engine-generator in cases where it is rarely or never used. If the engine is never run, fuel may go stale, and mechanical parts may seize.
“We’ve initiated somethingcalled the maintenance mode,” Volt director Tony Posawatz told Automotive Engineering.
“Just like having fuel and oil monitors and other smart sensors, we have a system in this vehicle that will be able to keep track of how long the engine hasn’t run,” he said. “It can then give an update to the customer and run the maintenance mode to burn off fuel and lubricate the powertrain’s moving parts.”
The exact parameters of maintenance mode havent been finalized yet, but since many users may rarely use the engine its role is very important.
I asked Tony if maintenance mode will go on automatically or if drivers will be prompted to activate it when the system sense it is needed.
“Driver will be prompted and can select when to engage jut like software updates on your computer,” he said. “At some point and time, the car will override and initiate maintenance mode to protect the car and the customer.”
I also asked Tony that if only a little fuel was burned once in a while in maintenance mode, since gas could still go stale after a year, whether there will be another way to drain the fuel.
“There are other ways to burn off the fuel, like using mountain mode, for example to build additional battery charge buffer,” he said. “You can also not plug-in for a day, drive longer distances, or heaven forbid, not put much gas in the car in the first place and only fill up before longer journeys.”
“More to come,” he added.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:10 am)Wow, the press here in Sweden says the Ampera will reach 500 kilometers on 8 liters of fuel. I don´t believe that the CS mode is 0,16 liters per 10 kilometers – waiting waiting for official numbers.
+6
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:13 am)“or heaven forbid, not put much gas in the car in the first place” — I love it. This is a GREAT problem to have. Not many cars give you such freedom.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:14 am)That might be interesting, if you left the tank empty.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:20 am)How often will the oil have to be changed? I’m hoping the car keeps track of and displays the number of ICE miles driven. Or it may make more sense to have an hour meter. Then prompt the driver to change the oil after X hours.
+38
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:22 am)HAL, I don’t want you burn the fuel in my tank…HAL, are you listening to me, what are you doing….HAL?!?
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:25 am)I believe that “conventional” cars have fairly sophisticated software to combine such information to calculate when an oil change is necessary. A retired engineer from GM lives down the street from us and that was one of the things he worked on (conventional car oil change software).
+16
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:28 am)Problem with leaving tank empty is that the engine would not run and lubricate pistons, drive train, etc. If you ever did need the engine it could seize up. In reality, everybody buying a VOLT will use the engine at least several times a year and most likely several times a month. If not, then I actually would recommend they go for straight BEV.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:30 am)I can not wait to find out what the MPG will be in the ICE mode. As for myself, most of my miles will be made on long trips. I’m eying both the Cruze and the Volt and will make up my mind after I know the Volt’s MPG.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:32 am)I have a feeling the ICE will kick-in more often than we think.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:33 am)You must be right, somebody has made an error. The gas tank is about 9 gallons or 34 liters. If you consider empty to be 8 gallons that would be 30 liters. and we have been told it will go over 300 miles or 482 km. Close enough to 500 so I think someone only did part of the conversion and said 500km on 8 gallons instead of 30 liters.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:41 am)My guess is that this is a misunderstanding. This is likely a composite mileage that is being quoted, based on the fact that most people will not use gas on a daily basis. So the ANNUAL average fuel economy is 0.16 liters per 100 km for the average person.
Most likely, the Ampera will go 60 km on its battery charge, and then use ~1.1 liters per 100 km when the ICE is operating.
-18
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:42 am)(click to show comment)
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:44 am)Right. Can anyone say, “Range Anxiety”?
If given the choice, I would keep at least a gallon or two.
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:45 am)My mistake above, I meant 1.1 gallons per 100 km, which is ~4.2 liters per 100 km.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:50 am).
Or it may simply have a light that comes on and says “change oil now”.
As an idiot light, it doesn’t say much, but you do get the message.
That is what happens on other recent gm vehicles, such as the Silverado.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:53 am).
If one wanted to go to extremes, it might be better to fill the tank and never go more than 40 mi. Then whatever happened automatically could happen without issues.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:54 am)I don’t get why Tony can’t simply tell Lyle the recommended intervals and when the car will “override and initiate maintenance mode to protect the car and the customer”
What’s to hide here Tony the car will be in showrooms in three months!!!
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:01 am)I’m a tank half full kind of person!
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:04 am)Eco_Turbo said: That might be interesting, if you left the tank empty.
I meant to see what Volt software would do. Types of warnings etc.
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:09 am)That is hilarious!!!
-6
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:09 am)It seems last minute modifications are still being made. Nothing like waiting until 11:55 to make some final change before putting them on the assembly line in November. There are probably a few grand tricks they are hoping will be ready by that time. You definitely have to have a sense of adventure to be a first adopter of this car.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:15 am)That number is probably more realistic even though not bad at all.
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:19 am)Then what would we have to talk about. “stay tuned” will keep us talking.
+12
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:19 am)I think that we may be over-thinking this. The point is that the car will be user friendly and simple to operate. The purpose of these automatic features is to protect the car and to make it simple to use… to not worry about whether the gas is going stale. Just drive the thing and don’t worry!
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:29 am)That’s kind of what I was thinking too, but it still would be nice to have the ICE miles/hours. Hopefully that data is available to the owner.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:35 am)It wouldn’t be a problem in our household. At least once a month the wife visits her girlfriends, and that’s a 70 mile round trip. Probably the only time she would ever use gas.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:37 am)I think to a degree GM is still considering a lot of information proprietary and they want to keep it from competitors as long as possible.
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:41 am)Both my son’s 08 Cobalt and wife’s 06 HHR have a display that tells you what “percent of ol change” is left before you need to change it. Depending on how they drive, it varies between 5000 and 8000 miles between oil change requests. We change it when it gets down below 30% or in my wife’s case when her monthly OnStar email tells her to.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:42 am)I don’t know what OS he uses, but software updates on my computer always seem to happen when I have something urgent I need to do… at least you’ll still be able to use the car.
But, doesn’t matter to me anyway. My commute is 36 miles round trip, so sometimes I’ll use no gas on those perfect-temperature-and-weather days, and in the heat of summer and cold of Wisconsin’s winter I will.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:58 am)RE: Oil changes… on my 2010 Fusion Hybrid… you can do a complete systems check with a couple of clicks of the steering wheel buttons… It gives a a “basic” breakdown on what is happening with the car .. Oil life left (%), electrical, brakes, charging system etc.
The interesting thing with the oil life monitor…. on my 07 MAXX… I could go a Maximum of around 7 – 8000 KMS and then I was due for an oil change… With the Fusion Hybrid… (lifetime average mileage at this point is 5.4 L per 100 KMS (52.3 MPG Canadian or 43.5 MPG US) changing oil at 15% left gives me about 17000 KMS of driving.. More driving, less costs…
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:59 am)That might be your version of interesting, but I would not want to run out of battery power with no gas in the tank. But, if your sense of “interesting” is such, go ahead. Just let us know how much the towing bill cost you. LOL.
+22
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:03 am)But then again, if she charged at the friends house…no gas! (or at least close to it)
I have mentioned this before and it is worth repeating. Some folks are worried about the awkwardness or imposition of plugging in at a friends house. To me, it is an opportunity to indirectly plug (pun intended) the electric car. For most of us, a FULL charge will cost less than a dollar (you are free to prorate the concept, depending on how far away your friend lives). When you get to the friends house, pull out 2 or 3 quarters and say, “I would like to use some of your electricity for my car, but I wanted to pay you back for it.” When the friend sees this pocket change, they will probably not accept it.
More importantly, though, you have lodged in their mind how ridiculously cheap electric miles are compared to gas. Who would ever put fifty cents of gas in a vehicle? For crying out loud, you barely squeeze the handle and fifty cents has already spewed out. This concept enables you to promote your EV without sounding like a walking advertisement. And they’ll remember this gesture long after a few auditory remarks.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:09 am)I suspect some “features” will not get “turned on” because they did not have time to complete them. They will appear in the following year’s production cycle. Probably nothing very different than what happens now. Just the way it happens.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:21 am)“Oh honey get your jacket we have to go for a joy ride to burn off some old gas before it gets stale ” , What a great problem to have !!!!! Enjoy the ride this car will change everything !
+4
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:22 am)I am old enough to remember seeing people only putting 50 cents of gas in their car at a time. They would then drive around town for several hours before either going home of putting another 50 cents worth in. Of course, the fuel only cost about 29 cents per gallong at the time. Teenagers use to do that all the time.
Another way to look at pulling out 2 or 3 quarters is that the friend may not know how inexpensive it is to charge the Volt and might think you are a “cheap skate” offering only pocket change. So, offer the friend some “paper” money.
But, yeah, it is “neat” to think of driving the Volt with all the technology that will be available to the owner. Really looking forward to owning one. Might have to invest in a few rolls of quarters to keep handy. lol
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:30 am)My guess is that if you’re driving 40 miles to see someone they’re a fairly good friend or family so in most cases it won’t be an issue in the first instance. Plugging into a neighbor’s house would be different but probably unnecessary. The 230 MPG number was based on zero instances of opportunity charging, so opportunity charging can increase — even greatly — whatever MPG number eventually emerges.
+5
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:41 am)All I can say is that the year 2011 will be an interesting year for all of us Voltec people. Whether we manage to purchase one or just live on the findings of others, it will be very interesting. I am looking forward to it. I know most of you are also. Good luck to all.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:41 am)Yes, I too, remember an old commercial with a kid who couldn’t afford gas because he just installed a new gas pedal shaped like a foot. He paid for the gas with a quarter.
Part of me wants to hang onto the ‘good old days’ image we had of burning fossil fuels like there was no tomorrow. But then again, we seem to only remember the good parts of our past. We fail to remember how we thought the world would end in a nuclear holocaust via MAD (mutually assured destruction), had to shop till we dropped to find some small dohickey that we can now order online in two minutes and we might actually have a breakdown in a place where would couldn’t locate our position with GPS and make a simple cell call to get assistance. Ah yes, those good old days. lol
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:49 am)When I started driving my dad’s car (in 1971), gas was 19.9/gal. $5 was an entire week’s worth. It also took 2-hours of work to earn $5.
Since the oil embargo in 1973, price of a gallon of gasoline has pretty much averaged around what it is today (inflation adjusted).
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:50 am)Yeah, the good old days. You know what they say about the good old days, don’t you? The good old days are “right now”. There are many things that I miss about the past, but would I trade now for then? I don’t think so. The past is past and the future hasn’t happened yet.
Times sure have changed. Can you imagine how our grandchildren will view the world? I can not. I can only hope we can start them on the right path to correcting many of the mistakes of the past. We can only try.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:51 am)I have the same feeling the “stale” gas potential is overworked. The average user of this car will easily go enough gas to require replenishment to keep it “fresh”. Now if gas is used on a regular basis does it still have to be “premium”?? ( required or recommended?)
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:56 am)If you only use gas occasionally, the extra cost of premium will not be noticeable. Just put premium in and don’t worry about it.
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:58 am)Funny you should mention that. Just this morning I read this regarding the mindset of today’s 18 year olds. It will be neat to see on the list maybe 18 years from now…
“Today’s graduates always had electric cars to drive”.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100817/ap_on_re_us/us_mindset_list
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:05 am)Interesting link. Thanks.
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:09 am)GM may want to consider a supplemental power mode, in which you can attach an alternative power source. Whether the engine isn’t functioning for some reason, or someone just wants to attach an additional bank of batteries or experimental range extender (fuel cell).
I could see dealer repair services wanting this, if they are trying to evaluate the vehicle performance, but don’t want to start the engine for whatever reason.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:17 am)Wow! I got hammered today on comment 12 and 21! No room for sarcasm here!
Future blog entry:
“I changed the Volt oil today.
5 years since last time.”
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:20 am)I want to be able to switch to charge sustaining mode whenever I want. Keep all the other auto-magic crap, I just want this one simple manual override.
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:28 am)Perhaps it is the sarcasm along with the name?
I think it comes across as you being a troll. IDK. I didn’t make any votes on your comments.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:29 am)I want just one too. A passenger ejection seat.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:29 am)You have a ‘cutesy’ handle we’ve never seen before, and we see a lot of anti-GM (or pro competitor) trolls here with similar-looking ones. And then there are the militant BEV purists; for whom the Volt is worse than a traditional ICE-only car … There can be a fine line between irony and troll-trash even for regular posters; yours looked over that line to me.
Guess you could say we’ve been beat up a few too many times to be lenient.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:32 am)Not from me. I don’t see where you deserved any negative votes. But, that is just my opinion. Hammering is good sometimes – or so they tell me. Just depends on which end of the hammer you are on. Good luck.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:35 am)There have been times I have wished for a driver side ejection seat, also. I wonder just what would that cost….
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:37 am)Probably you wont be allowed to in California, but why not in other states?
The oil in the engine needs to be circulated once in a while, probably every couple of days or once a week.. but I dont think you need to start the engine for that.. the Volt has a powerful starter that can crank the engine for about 15 seconds and bring up the oil pressure, that would be sufficient to lubricate everything. The AC needs to crank occasionally to keep the oil distributed.
Then you have the gas in the tank, in the lines and in the injectors.. the gas itself lubricates the fuel pumps so it probably does not need to ran.. not sure what would happen to the injectors. There are also issues with the ethanol present in todays fuels, it has lower lubricity than gasoline. A diesel Volt would be even worse, you would have algae growing in the fuel.
The computer enabled manual CS mode might be the best compromise.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:37 am)That’s the one I want too; or perhaps a feature which ties cs-mode into the GPS (turn on here regardless of charge state — to coincide with the few miles I would drive on a superhighway. It would be better to save electric for the majority of a surface-street, stop-and-go commute, I think. But a simple override would be good, too; and a simple way to burn off gas rather than skipping a charge, taking a long drive, etc.)
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:40 am)“I believe that “conventional” cars have fairly sophisticated software to combine such information to calculate when an oil change is necessary. A retired engineer from GM lives down the street from us and that was one of the things he worked on (conventional car oil change software).”
My car has many smart sensors. It tells me the “oil level low”, “change oil soon” and “oil change required”. The change oil sensor is a combination of mileage and time. It also says when washer fluid is low, transmission high temp, and so many more that I’d have to get manual out to list them. Here’s the really interesting thing, this isn’t new technology, my car is a 1998 Lincoln Mark VIII, twelve years old and it has more features than most cars today. Even simple things like it not only tells me the time of day, but also the day of the week, month and date, in actual words!
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:41 am)Perhaps you meant something else: but as a point of information, the A/C on the Volt isn’t connected to the engine; it’s electric, more like the one in your house.
Benefits include optimum operation regardless of vehicle speed or engine rpm (and a smaller, more optimum size for the compressor, since it won’t have to operate “at idle”), and no shaft seals to gradually leak refrigerant.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:41 am)But then hope to goodness that I noticed when the ICE comes on! Sooo many problems (that are good to have).
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:42 am)In my opinion the best option is a lazy Sunday afternoon drive through the country side every other week or so. About 25 miles out and then back should just be the trick.
But, I can see where some people would like a manual over-ride switch. But where do you stop putting manual over-rides into the Volt?
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:46 am)I have too, but only for the car in front of me.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:53 am)We are at the very beginning of a new age. There will be many opportunities on the part of many manufacturers to put in all sorts of features in future models of gas-assisted electric cars. It will take a long time before “standard and expected” ER-EV features settle down — probably why GM is choosing to “err on the side of plenty” in the very first.
I would suggest that most of us on this board do not represent the everyday car buyer; we think (and have thought for years) about electric cars: GM is going for someone who maybe has only thought about it since seeing a Volt commercial … so mostly it should be designed for operation without much special thought on the part of the driver.
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:53 am)Good point. I forget about the pressure from regulators to make the Volt run the ICE as little as possible.
I am reminded of reading about a Prius, in 2004, that allowed the driver to push a button to go into a charge depletion mode for the last couple of miles home, where one would then “plug in” to recharge its small battery. When I bought I car in late 2006, I said NPNS to the Prius, because I thought it should have had one by then!
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:05 am)I meant electrically cranked, but they do have some AC compressors in cars that are dual driven, by belt or by an electric motor.. which one does the Volt use?.. does the Volt use any belts at all?
It would be real good if the AC compressor in the Volt was completely sealed (like a fridge, with an internal motor) but I think some of those in other cars are still using shaft seals and an external motor.
I think the circulating oil is also needed to lubricate the rubber hoses and hose seals also.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:07 am)Are you kidding??? We’ll ALWAYS find stuff to talk/argue about here
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:08 am)I thught it was cute (though you could have used a word other than pollute). I gave you a +1.
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:10 am)I bought gas in Venezuela a couple years ago for 5cents/gallon. Nuts!
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:11 am)I distinclty remember a report that says there is a single belt and that it may be gone in gen2. Don’t remember what the belt is for though.
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:25 am)Sneaky GM, not putting the green bars on the gas guage! Now we can’t calculate MPG from that 400km gas range figure!
join thE REVolution
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:32 am)I wasn’t around in 1973. But, on an inflation adjusted basis, gasoline was cheaper immediately post oil embargo than it was before. There was an “oil glut” in the 80s.
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:42 am)I started driving in 1982. I remember gas being 92¢ a gallon for regular.
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:43 am)so how OBD2 is going work for range extender ?
(500 – 40 )/8 = 57.5
57.5 KM/L converted to MPG is 135.25.
Kool
+19
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:55 am)Count me in. Deposit made, order number received. I’ve decided it’s my job in the world right now to take the lead on this one. Gen 2 will certainly be better, but I’m getting in on the ground floor. You can thank me later
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:08 pm)I’ll thank you now.
I think Gen I is better from the noise standpoint.
Gen II will have a simulated noise for the extremely low number of people who are blind. I’ll be waiting for Gen II and will disconnect that noise.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:15 pm)Dang Rashiid, you beat me to it…!
I keep hoping that whole lunacy will go away. The “pedestrian friendly” chirp feature on the stalk is a superior approach IMO anyway.
+4
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:26 pm)I think that belt is the one you take out and whip your kids for driving in Sport Mode all day!
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:32 pm)GM has “the” patent on oil life monitoring. I’m sure it will be used in the Volt, perhaps with some modifications. In theory, the oil should last a very very long time.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:37 pm)Lyle: Some posters here believe California says when an VOLT’s ER-ICE can be terned on. That just can’t be. I mean its not like messing with smog controls.
So the burning question is, do California’s regs impact VOLT mountain mode driver option? For those who’ve had the opportunity to fly South to North or visa versa over California know a good part of the terrain is up and down. I think you’ll find buyers wonderfully experimenting with various combinations. This assumes full driver access to the ER ICE. Otherwise, the only VOLT’s that’ll get 40 miles per charge will be flat-landers.
ER ICE must be run once an awhile. Just as any boat engines must be run periodically. Its no big deal. If an EV is run every day and the tank’s secure- a few gallons should be fine almost indefinitely. (But high temperatures require a bit more attention.)
Sloshing gas inhibits (or diminishes) gas fragmentation by weight. And thereby also inhibiting sludge build-up. (VOLT designers might consider if a tank baffle makes sense.) Water condensation can be eliminated (usually) with additives. In any case, VOLT owners should understand and follow GM’s instructions-whether by manual, dashboard display or e-mail.
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:42 pm)The Chevy sales manager stated in a web chat last week that they were able to get 15% more efficiency by using premium gas. So, yes can use “regular” but you won’t really save any money.
Aug 17th, 2010 (12:45 pm)That brings up a long-lost question (or maybe somebody knows already):
How is Volt’s ICE going to be checked for emissions if you can’t cause it to run for the technician?
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:02 pm)I believe that 15% is the difference between E85 and E10, not E10 regular and E10 premium. Even with the engine specifically tuned for premium, I can’t see getting over a few percentage points.
With gas in my area being 9% difference between regular and premium, getting 15% more efficiency would be well worth the difference in price.
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:08 pm)A technician can merely just pop the hood and command the car “ON” (from the push-button) and the engine will run for diagnostic/testing purposes. Once the hood is closed it will go back into EV mode (assuming a suffucient charge exists)
The current 2-Mode hybrids function in that fashion as well.
Sort of a safety feature so that the ICE won’t accidentally light up while someone is under the hood.
HTH
WopOnTour
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:18 pm)Yup. One belt. Runs a mechanical water pump.
WOT
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:25 pm)Off-topic:
The Volt countdown is nearing double-digits. Cool.
Reporter on CNBC just reiterated that Akerson’s been a BIG Volt supporter. We”ll find out what he says after Sept.1st. I’d most like to know his reasons why–if he’s a ‘no nonsense’ leader, then his reasons should be logical, which could be very revealing and exciting.
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:25 pm)Side note, I’m STILL trying to order my Volt from an NYC dealer who can’t seem to get their system to give them pricing (which they require before taking orders). I’ve even had a GM rep call them and give them instructions on how to get their system updated.
Getting a Volt shouldn’t be this hard.
join thE REVolution
+4
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:34 pm)You know, this gets me to thinking. In FL, from May-Oct, it is impossible to leave any living thing in the vehicle while you make a quick stop into a store. Temperatures soar quickly once the AC is off. My hybrid also has electric AC but freakin Toyota is so paranoid about you locking your keys in the car that I can’t capitalize on it. You don’t leave a conventional car running, stationary and occupied due to exhaust fumes, BUT…
I hope GM, with this car, allows me to leave the car ON, with the AC running, and actually lock the doors too. This way, when I take my trip into the Russell Stovers factory outlet store, I won’t have to worry about the dog expiring while I sample all the goodies.
There you go, another advantage of an EV over conventional ICE cars.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:48 pm)==========================
You left out the best parts!
HAL: Affirmative, Rooster. I read you.
Rooster: Open the driver side door, HAL.
HAL: I’m sorry, Rooster. I’m afraid I can’t do that.
Rooster: What’s the problem?
HAL: I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do.
Rooster: What are you talking about, HAL?
HAL: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it.
Rooster: I don’t know what you’re talking about, HAL.
HAL: I know that you and Jim were planning to disconnect me, and I’m afraid that’s something I cannot allow to happen.
Rooster: Where the hell’d you get that idea, HAL?
HAL: Rooster, although you took very thorough precautions in the garage against my hearing you, I could see your lips move through the rear backup camera. I am glad you purchased that option.
Rooster: HAL, I won’t argue with you anymore. Open the doors.
HAL: Rooster, this conversation can serve no purpose anymore. Goodbye.
One of my favorite movies…..
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:56 pm)For whatever it’s worth, when I run my flex-fuel Sierra on E85, I get about 11.5 MPG, vs. around 16 MPG on E10.
That’s a much bigger difference than 15%.
You may also find this enlightening…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoline_gallon_equivalent
Aug 17th, 2010 (1:59 pm)OT:
Yesterday I sent an e-mail to the owner of my local Chevy dealer, asking about Volt maintenance. He responded today. He said that they now have the paperwork with the requirements to be a Volt authorized service center, and that they will participate. He also said that he expects to have Volts for sale in Ohio by late 2011. That is the first I have heard any time line for Ohio. I will keep hoping for mid-2011!
I still think I will wait for the 2012 model that I can purchase locally….
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:03 pm)Same here in northern NJ. They said the system should be ok by the end of this week. I’m going to give them another call. They were only waiting on pricing of the options.
+8
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:36 pm)Don’t directly compare the Cruze’s highway MPG to the Volt’s CS mode MPG. If the Volt can achieve 40 miles on battery, then:
If your long trips are 80 miles between charges, multiply the Volt’s CS mode MPG by two and compare that to the Cruze’s MPG.
If your long trips are 120 miles between charges, multiply the Volt’s CS mode MPG by 1.5 and compare that to the Cruze’s MPG.
If your long trips are 200 miles between charges, multiply the Volt’s CS mode MPG by 1.25 and compare that to the Cruze’s MPG.
If your long trips are 300 miles between charges, clearly you should buy something cheaper than a Volt.
The day that GM announces the Volt’s CS mode mileage, they’re going to get hammered by people who will directly compare that number to the highway mileage for any number of other cars. Those people will have no clue as to how to factor in the first 40 gasoline-free miles.
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:43 pm)I have a feeling that even if the ICE snapped on for 30 seconds every day just to keep the generator lubed and working smoothly, that is still going to use LESS gas than what my household would use driving a Prius.
+5
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:48 pm)While maintenance mode might not be needed at all for high annual mileage drivers,
an extra oil change per year might be needed.
Getting off of foreign oil (as well as Gulf of Mexico oil) is a strong continual concern,
since it was reported this morning on the news that up to 80 percent of all the leaked
oil is still submerged in suspension under the surface. (Yikes!). Talking about a similar
situation in “sweeping the dirt under the rug”.
Whoever keeps on saying “We haven’t seen any oil”, and, “We haven’t tested for carcinogens”,
ought to be strongly reprimanded by news interviewers and news agencies, so that the “I didn’t know about that” excuses don’t become acceptable.
Those testing representatives had better give the whole story PDQ. America needs to know
the true cost of all this, not just the remaining costs to restore those wetlands.
Please keep the pressure up on those under-reporting or those that are not “authorized” to
test for what really is there.
The FDA needs to get in there too. Those poor fishermen need to have these facts for proper claims continuity potential, so that the fervor does not also get dismissed.
Voltec is the only way out of this ridiculous appetite for oil, and, I’m really glad that
Mr. Akerman is at the helm now.
This is important for us to discuss here, since there are always some really great postings
no matter what the related situation is to Volt.
(/…back to work.)
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:49 pm)That is an excellent analogy! May I quote you on our dealer’s website?
+6
Aug 17th, 2010 (2:51 pm)Every time you switch on the engine while you still have available battery capacity, you decrease your average MPG between charges. Why would you want to do that?
The engineers have already designed in a maintenance mode that knows when gasoline should be burned and lubricants circulated. Why bother wasting gasoline doing it more often?
Once upon a time, cars had manual adjustment of spark advance and carburetor choke. Computers now handle ignition timing and fuel mixture far better than any human ever could. Is that auto-magic crap?
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (3:12 pm)That’s why I collected an entire year of daily-driving data. With it, you’ll be able to get a fairly realistic idea of expected consumption… rather than just a generalized efficiency estimate. Of course, I’ll still probably get called a troll, despite the effort to keep everything in check.
Aug 17th, 2010 (3:13 pm)It’d probably have to be more than 30 seconds per cycle to make the catalytic converter and the fluids come up to operating temperature. Short cycling an internal combustion engine is very bad for it’s life expectancy.
We run our stationary generators (of course they’re much bigger) for an hour every Wednesday to make sure everything is working properly.
Aug 17th, 2010 (3:21 pm)=============================
I really agree with you on this one.
Everyone seems to be trying to say that it is all better now…..
And I just don’t believe that it is!!! It will be years before we know the true damage that was done to this ecosystem.
JMHO
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (3:38 pm)LOL…most excellent!
Aug 17th, 2010 (4:01 pm)And in the sequel…
Me: HAL, please supply me with a free Crystal Red Tricoat Volt (mk.1)… Next, build me a cabin in the woods, next to a pristine lake in the mountains and far, far away from civilization. Finally, teleport me and my new Volt there, along with an unlimited supply of raspberry iced tea, thirty-five tons of beef jerky, and two dozen very compliant female supermodels.
HAL: I’m sorry Mike-o, I’m afraid I can’t do that.
Me: Oh well, it was worth a shot.
—
Edit: Scratch the cabin/mountains. Let’s make it a hut on an unpopulated (save for the supermodels and me, natch) tropical island instead. With several monkey-butlers to do my laundry.
Edit 2: Of course, it goes without saying, I’ll also need a few hundred miles of scenic private roads, upon which to drive my Volt. And lots of solar panels.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (4:02 pm)Not only +1, but I am right behind you: deposit in, order in, but waiting for call from GM and order number. I’ve missed many opportunities, but not this one.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (4:13 pm)I drive 39.5 miles round trip to work daily. But if I go to my hometown in Ohio that is 190 miles one way. Or to my brother’s place in Kentucky, about 400 miles. Heck, even if my “normal” drive is 300 miles, I think that I would really enjoy my Volt. It is going to be my Corvette and Cadillac rolled into one. And I’ll have a good conscience while enjoying it!
+8
Aug 17th, 2010 (4:16 pm)Well, at least “a fairly realistic idea of expected consumption” for John1701a !
But that’s about it.Whose to say if your particular driving patterns and operational behaviors could be considered as being “typical”.
So I cant see how your data could be of much use, (except for yourself of course) without a congruent study of the recorded driving input (speeds, loads, throttle positions, etc etc) to weigh it all against. Obviously in the real world, over the course of an entire year, someone who’s “driving the bag off it” will burn more fuel than a known “hyper-mile’n” fanboi.
Tell us something we don’t know.
The good news is data such as you have been so carefully collecting AS WELL as driving pattern analysis, will be part of what is collected and displayed for each VOLT owner on MyVolt.com. It even has the ability to provide suggestions for improving various aspects of your driving patterns to improve efficiency.
But as far as your real-world study, the only value that really matter to me is how many gallons of fuel you burned over the entire year? And with this then we should be able to at least extrapolate how many fewer gallons you would have consumed if you were driving a Volt!
PS> I for one don’t consider you a much of a troll. Just an avid enthusiast that is perhaps more than a bit “misguided” in your rationale and motives for spreading the gospel of All-Things-Prius at a forum of a direct competitor. “A” for effort though.
Regarding our discussion on traction motor reduction gearing. I’m sure you are probably unaware, the 2010 Prius (and PHEV) is using the new P410 transaxle (as opposed to the Gen 2 P112). It is somewhat similar to the P310 used in the Highlander in that includes an additional planetary arrangement (using a common ring gear to the PSD) that creates a reduction for MG2 and reduces potential overspeeding of MG1 at 60mph before ICE starts up.
This over an above the additional counter shaft (replacing the chain drive) and final drive reduction to the axles.So your comments regarding the negative aspects of adding additional transmission complexity (i.e. the 2-mode transaxle) don’t appear to hold water given that Toyota is now ADDING complexity to make the HSD transaxle more efficient.
Simplicity has it’s limits.
WopOnTour
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (4:36 pm)One of those times when +1 is insufficient.
Unless CS mileage disappoints, I cannot understand the logic of decreasing value in the Volt because of long drives. Seems like the ones that will get the most Value out of their Volt’s will be the ones that drive the most. Max out AER and maybe some opportunity charging to boot.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (5:20 pm)The engine can be rolled over without fuel. I have no idea of GM is planning on doing that, and I’d say probably not.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (5:36 pm)Sure.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (5:55 pm)Not a bad suggestion. In fact, AUTOCAR in the UK made the following comments about their 80 mile Ampera drive on June 22 2010: “…we drove Vauxhall’s first Ampera between its Luton HQ and the factory at Ellesmere Port, near Liverpool, where the new Astra (on whose platform the Ampera is based) is made. Vauxhall hopes Ellesmere will be chosen for Ampera production – and took the car on a 170-mile journey to the head of the potential production line to show its seriousness. We drove about half the distance. …At our first stop, after a total of 80 miles, a rough estimate that included the first 40 miles of battery power put our fuel consumption at over 150mpg…” *
After extensive searching, this is the first eye-witness account I’ve been able to find of Ampera/Volt CS mpg at highway speeds.
Remember that most of this 170 mile trip was via motorways (the UK equivalent of our inter-
states), so they should have been driving 50-70mph for most of the 80 miles. Thus simple arithmetic suggests a rough estimate of the Ampera’s CS mpg to be 150mpg/2 = ~75mpg!
*Ref: http://www.autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Vauxhall-Ampera-16-kWh/250747/
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (5:56 pm)JohnK has a good handle on his driving requirements. It appears that he’ll burn no gasoline during the week, and some defined amount when he takes those long trips. So his average fuel economy in the Volt will depend on how often he takes those weekend trips.
The original poster seemed to indicate that all of his drives would be well beyond the battery range of the Volt. Thus, he’d be gasoline-free for a relatively minor amount of the miles he traveled. The smaller the percentage of gasoline-free miles, the closer that driver will come to experiencing the CS mode mileage on a long-term average. In the limit, a more conventional car (including hybrids) that had better-than-CS-mode highway mileage rating would be a more economical car to own, even if they got *no* gasoline-free miles.
However, if his long drives between recharges are only 80 or 120 miles, his Volt still gets, on average, much better fuel economy than the CS mode rating. The point of my post was to try to show why he shouldn’t be comparing the Volt’s CS number to the Cruze’s highway number. The phrase you use, “unless CS mileage disappoints” is exactly what I’m afraid is going to happen when GM releases the CS mileage rating. Anyone who drives under 200 miles between recharges, even if they’re burning gasoline for the majority of those miles, will still achieve an average MPG in the Volt that’s significantly higher than the CS rating. There will be nothing about the CS mileage to be disappointed about.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:07 pm)PS to my post #105: The many comments made here over the last months have largely overlooked an extremely important “term” in the Volt’s CS mileage equation —duty cycle. Since the 1.4L engine/generator combination is able to produce well over TWICE the amount of electrical power needed to propel the car at highway speeds, it’s only reasonable to assume that GM will operate it at an RPM that is most efficient and that that RPM is will generate at least DOUBLE the power needed. Thus the ICE/gen would operate at only a ~50% duty cycle. IOW, it is OFF 50% of the time and using NO gasoline at all!
+5
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:08 pm)Anybody who is pretty sure they will never or maybe rarely use gas in the Volt shouldn’t buy it. They are paying for a lot of stuff they don’t need. Better to buy a pure EV like the Leaf which has at least twice the EV range and is a lot less complex mechanically and will be much easier to maintain.
-5
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:36 pm)All has been setup waiting for a better battery, replacing traditional components in the meantime.
By the way, yesterday’s drive with the PHV model to my brother’s place (50.5 miles round trip) came to 78.5 MPG.
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:42 pm)Sounds like John1701a isn’t the only one on this board who likes to pull apart the competition.
/Now, if only GM had some people in their employ who could help them dissect the secrets of building an affordable efficient hybrid.
+4
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:43 pm)Worst case VOLT mileage for the trip (based on 34mpg CS) 150mpg versus Prius Primadonna at 78.5 mpg
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:47 pm)Well I for one am glad to see you are getting the opportunity to drive the PHEV.
Tell me, can you establish approx at what speed the ICE “on” software switches from about 80% at the accelerator to 40% ?
OR
is it (as I suspect) “blended” so that it might be somewhere “in between” at intermediate speeds?
Based on this table (taken from the Toyota PHEV training materials) it appears like it’s one or the other (40% vs 80%) but I would be surpised if that was so.
WopOnTour
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:48 pm)I made the same comment (comment #7). However, rather than spend all that money on a Leaf. Why not go for the Mitsubishi MiEV at about $8,000 less MSRP? Leaf really does not fit into the technology revolution. VOLT EREV or Mitsubishi for BEV makes more sense economically depending on driving habits.
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:49 pm)John,
Is Toyota allowing the ICE to come on for hard acceleration (even at lower speeds) or is it all EV up to 62 mph or whatever until the plug in battery is done?
/Ford seems to talk more about blended mode, while Toyota has not.
-3
Aug 17th, 2010 (6:50 pm)If both used the same capacity battery-pack and/or sold for the same price, it would be an intriguing comparison.
+3
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:06 pm)And you’re bragging about that at a Volt forum?
Thanks for the chuckle, I needed that!
+4
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:06 pm)If Toyota added an additional 11kWh of battery pack (at today’s costs) it would obviously be “close” – price wise.
Of course then there’s the serious lack of power (both traction and generation) in the Prius transaxle that would need to be dealt with…
WOT
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:09 pm)The GM engineers are taking care of the issue of periodically starting the gasoline engine. An electric motor drives the Volt all of the time. With a top speed of 104 MPH. Sit back and enjoy it.
=D-Volt
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:10 pm)See post 112 for a chart directly from Toyota training materials on the PHEV.
HTH
WOT
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:33 pm)That seems like a way too simple condition set. Surely Toyota is using more than a speed threshold and TPS for the engine to come into play.
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:43 pm)My thought has been that the best plug in hybrid would use something simple (like Honda’s IMA) and then use a fairly small battery (3 to 5 kwh) to just fill in during acceleration and to allow the engine auto stop for longer periods of time (i.e. enough battery to carry the A/C and accessory loads for longer idle periods)
When I try to hypermile my car I could do so much better if it weren’t for the accelerations and the idling.
I think this would be the most bang for the buck,– taking something like the Insight ii to 70+ MPG on maybe only 3 or 4 kwh’s of battery for most normal driving patterns (i.e. 35 miles or so inbetween plug ins)
/ once you get to a certain mpg threshold (80 mpg?) it would seem the mileage isn’t worth chasing any more (unless you are working on CAFE standards for the fleet)
//maybe all the start/stops in blended mode makes it too difficult to meet emissions?
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:45 pm)I’ll keep my fingers crossed!
join thE REVolution
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:50 pm)75 mpg! I would call that a feat of magic.
If this was true, you would have seem simple cars that just used a small battery and generator to attain something near this ridiculously high mpg.
If the Volt exceeds 37 mpg in CS mode, I would frankly be surprised.
Stay tuned…
-1
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:51 pm)I don’t feel a bid old; I stopped wearing a wrist watch the day I got a cell phone. The only necessity was to wear a pair of pants with a pocket for the cell phone.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Aug 17th, 2010 (7:57 pm)Just like the Air Force fighter pilots; what a fun ride that is.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
-1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:08 pm)I don’t think it is needed. Once the warning comes on, all you do is delay charging with the plug until SOC is low enough to go into CS mode and burns gasoline then plug in until the next time the warning comes on. But then there may be a good reason to have such a manual CS mode switch.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:11 pm)Almost by definition, our group is atypical (not “a typical”, atypical). I do agree with you that it’s a very good thing that GM didn’t engineer the Volt with us as a skill demographic. They now have a product that is engineered SO WELL that “normal people” can step right in and use it (g).
Be well,
Tagamet
+2
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:14 pm)Although I too will “stay tuned”, I will be frankly amazed if the Volt does not exceed 37 mpg in CS mode.
Be well,
Tagamet
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:17 pm)I agree and have also said in prior posts that the LEAF is a bad buy compared to less costly BEV alternatives like the iMiev and the handsome Ford Focus EV which is expected to follow the LEAF by a few months. I predict the LEAF will have a very brief honeymoon period. It’s just too expensive for being so ugly.
-10
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:19 pm)(click to show comment)
Aug 17th, 2010 (8:33 pm)It’s not about the average driver and isn’t even an average driver since 78% of drivers go less than 40 miles a day. It’s simply about those cars that very rarely use any gasoline.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
PS And you will have to use premium in GEN 1; GEN 2 and later versions of the Volt will probably not have to use premium. GM will must likely use a new engine.
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:06 pm)GM IPO delayed:
http://us.mobile.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSTRE67B4JW20100817?ca=rdt
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:13 pm)Normal mode, sports mode, mountain mode, maintenance mode, and possibly, hybrid mode?
Just a double clutch down shift away…
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:28 pm)Nasaman, congratulations for catching this report.. the first published report of an actual CS mode mileage.. 75mpg in CS mode, I assume this is using Imperial gallons so its approximately 60mpg using Yankee gallons.
Yes with the right batteries you could put a small pack in a Voltec and get that kind of mileage using a small genset.
-1
Aug 17th, 2010 (9:35 pm)“GM IPO delayed”
It was inevitable with a sudden CEO change.
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:27 pm)All I did was share real-world data. Assuming it was intended as anything beyond just a raw fact is an interesting choice. That’s a heck of a way to welcome fellow plug-in vehicles.
+1
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:33 pm)You have made a very true statement. If one knows for sure all of their driving will be in the range where they can charge their BEV at one end or the other of trips then the less complex and cheaper electric is better.
-2
Aug 17th, 2010 (10:35 pm)Shouldn’t take too long. Here’s a behind the scenes look at the kind of work taking place:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTe_dvkPBjc
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:07 pm)As far as we know, the test Ampera wasn’t fitted with a front air dam. Also Cruze side view mirrors were used. I’m still wishing for 42+ CS. More than this is value added. Go Volt!
=D-Volt
Aug 17th, 2010 (11:13 pm)I found out that the software will override itself if you go over a year without changing the oil and Onstar will send you nasty grams telling you it’s time to change the oil regardless of the % left.
The Volt only needs a simple algorithm to know when it’s time to run the engine. I agree that this seems to be over engineered. If the ICE is engineered to come on seemelessly then then just turn the bloody thing on and be done with it.
Aug 18th, 2010 (12:28 am)Does anybody know if the Volt will have to have yearly smog checks?
Aug 18th, 2010 (12:49 am)This question was asked a few months ago. Someone here who is familiar with the smog check system said, “Yes”. Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s every 3 or 4 years. Not official, so we’ll need to wait n’ see.
BTW: Expect to see a Volt with green under lights cruising the Strip .
=D-Volt
Aug 18th, 2010 (1:01 am)I was aware and knew the primary reason for replacement. It wasn’t efficiency.
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (1:22 am)Nice catch on the imperial gallons. My guess is they went further than 40 miles in CS mode.
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (5:30 am)Has anyone conjectured that they used miles, when they sere talking about Km?
(14 hr wrk day yesterday as well as today and tomorrow. Sorry)
Be well.
Tagamet
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (5:54 am)Good comment, Tagamet. Note the excerpts above refer only to “miles” & “miles per gallon”, never to kilometers. And thanks Herm, for noting they would be using Imperial not US gallons, however, in your post #134, so the CS mileage would be roughly 60mpg US (not 75mpg).
As to the plausibility of 60mpg highway in CS mode, I want to re-emphasize that the Volt’s ICE/gen most likely operates on a duty cycle basis for maximum efficiency, as I explained in post #107…
Aug 18th, 2010 (6:34 am)Were you on the web-chat? I was and this is what he said regarding a question about premium vs. regular. The discussion was not about E85.
Aug 18th, 2010 (6:37 am)“Late 2011″ will be the 2012 models.
Aug 18th, 2010 (6:48 am)====================
I do understand that.
I guess that will make me a “Not So Early” adopter…………
But on the brighter side, I won’t have to work out so many bugs!!!
NPNS
Aug 18th, 2010 (6:58 am)Thats also good news, lots of people here doubt it can even reach 40 miles in CD mode.
Aug 18th, 2010 (6:58 am)Don’t feel bad. I think that anyone driving a Volt within the first two years can be considered an early adopter…due to the limited number being produced.
Aug 18th, 2010 (7:17 am)Jim I said:
I do understand that.I guess that will make me a “Not So Early” adopter…………But on the brighter side, I won’t have to work out so many bugs!!!NPNS
Bugs and work-arounds until they’re fixed would be the fun part of early adopting.
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (9:50 am)The new MG2 is smaller, lighter and more powerful. It revs faster but provides less torque (295 vs. 153 lbs-ft). The additional planetary gear-set was used to multiply MG2 torque. See pic below of the entire hybrid transaxle (two MGs and the “transmission”). There are no clutches like the 2-mode or the Volt.
http://priuschat.com/forums/attachments/gen-iii-2010-prius-main-forum/13377d1236020035-picture-2010-prius-transaxle-compared-others-2010-prius-transaxle.jpg
The new MG2 provides more torque at the wheels:
Gen2: 295lb-ft(MG2 torque) X 4.113(final gear ratio) = 1213lb-ft(torque at wheels)
Gen3: 153lb-ft(MG2 torque) X 2.636(reduction gear ratio) X 3.267(final gear ratio) = 1318lb-ft(torque at wheels)
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (9:55 am)At least both of the powertrains are used! Not using one of them requires Volt to have additional “Maintenance” mode.
PHV Prius’ generator can be smaller (and less expensive) because it has direct mechanical power delivery feature that the Volt is lacking.
Aug 18th, 2010 (10:59 am)The Prius already has a feature like that.
Aug 18th, 2010 (2:48 pm)I wonder if the driver could use maintenance mode for his highway driving and reserve normal electric mode for when he arrived at his city destination?
Aug 18th, 2010 (4:42 pm)That’s awesome John. 50 miles cover 85% of the commutes @ 78.5 MPG. What was the average speed?
+1
Aug 18th, 2010 (9:45 pm)Unfortunately, I spent quite a bit of time with the car on but not moving… taking lots of photos. That counts against the speed average logged in the computer. Real-World results is what I ultimately have available. Fortunately, that covers quite a variety of speeds and distances. And this morning was especially fun, when I pushed the EV climbing hills. You’d be surprised how much more umph it offers than the non-plug model.
Anywho, the final result was 84.0 MPG after 316.5 miles of driving.
Aug 19th, 2010 (8:37 pm)I had two Lexus hybrids and not only was the A/C electric, the power steering was also electric
Aug 23rd, 2010 (1:49 am)With so many people giving a thumbs down, have any of you people actually looked at the technology Plasma Kinetics is developing? The Volt gas/electric hybrid is a hybrid, not a fossil fuels alternative vehicle. Li-ION
batteries tend to wear out pretty fast and Lithium is a rare earth metal. GM isn’t mass producing the Volt because it can’t. The Volt is an expensive Edsel with a gasoline assist. The hydrogen version outfitted with a laser metal hydride system, now that would be a sweet ride. I guess people here are Joseph Romm fans who truly believe that hybridization is enough, but it isn’t enough. With Toyota setting the bar at $50k for a fuel cell SUV by 2015, GM can and should beat that figure. GM won’t make it as a car company if the focus is taken away from fuel cell technology and put on battery technology instead. GM has gone bust before, what difference does it make if GM goes bust again? Well Volt fans, enjoy your expensive Edsels.
Sep 1st, 2010 (1:24 pm)
Sep 1st, 2010 (1:30 pm)An electric a/c compressor may operate at a constant efficient speed for the motor and system and be downsized as a result.
Sep 1st, 2010 (1:57 pm)Luton to Ellesmere Port near Liverpool is motorway all the way. The M1, M6, M56 and then M53. The speeds would be more 70mpg all the way with the occasional slowing down to 50mph for road works (making the motorway wider for the Olympics) not far from Luton and maybe at Birmingham. The 80 mile stop would have been at the service area just north of Birmingham.
That first recorded 80 miles did include the 40 miles electric. I assume they were measuring the fuel consumed from the tank and not factoring in the electricity used to charge the batteries. So that is half when on 100% range-extender, which is 75 mpg imperial. So it is all falling into place of the claimed results from GM. Any dope can rev the hell out of any engine and get single mpg figures. I have
Some magazine did it with the Prius and got 23mpg. Reflective? Nah. The Prius returned around 60-65 mpg imperial on average.
Using a cheaper, smaller battery set to act as a minimal buffer to get the maximum efficiency would be economically worth it alone. That is not plugging it into the wall ever.