As you may know, I had the special opportunity recently to receive a phone call from GM’s newly permanent Chairman and CEO Ed Whitacre.
We discussed his other role on the board of ExxonMobil, and he gave the clearest picture yet of the Volt’s price and profitability.
Though various bloggers quoting GM spokespeople have attempted to refute Mr. Whitacre’s comment to me about the Volt selling in the low 30s, I still stand by his statement. None of the naysayers were present for the call nor spent time in GM’s boardroom. The $7500 tax credit was not mentioned or inferred. Of course, we’ll have to wait until summer to see for sure.
In addition to those issues, we also discussed Mr. Whitacre’s opinion about the Volt.
“I have driven the Volt,” he said. “I think the Volt has a tremendous future. I think its the way to go, its quick and powerful and large.”
Whitacre also alluded to GM’s plans for other yet unrevealed Voltec vehicles.
“I think you’ll see that (propulsion system) in coming vehicles too,” he said.
“I’m all for it, I’m a strong fan of the Volt,” said Whitacre. “Its really a good looking vehicle…it’s a leap forward.”
And if you were uncertain about whether he is also a fan of reducing petroleum dependence, have no fear.
“I think we have to get off of oil for the future,” he said. ”We’re not going to do it quickly because of infrastructure, but we’re going to make it.”
(Image from Detroit Free Press)
This entry was posted on Wednesday, January 27th, 2010 at 7:20 am and is filed under Volt Nation. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
+23
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:30 am)Lyle, you continually amaze me!
(Quote)
+42
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:30 am)I just thought of a great commercial for the Volt. In our country there are strong opinions on many issues and the Volt is the answer (or at least a start) to a lot of these problems. Getting off foreign oil, global warming, etc. A good commercial would be the Volt driving by people protesting global warming, another group protesting against foreign oil and deficits, and another group against jobs going over seas and at then end saying that the Volt is the first step to solving some of these problems. What do you think?
(Quote)
+11
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:31 am)Glad to hear Ed likes the Volt.
Now to the above picture. I may not be seeing this correctly, but with Ed in the driver’s seat (and I think he’s a pretty big guy), how much leg room is left in the rear seat behind him?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:32 am)P.S. Perhaps if Whitacre could talk the board into using that $100 million (which he hoped could move up production) to further subsidize the price, it could get down to the low 30s. But frankly there will be so much demand for the 2011 model that it’s not warranted.
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:41 am)A first look at a light color interior. Good to see a few inches of headroom in the Volt. Mr. Whitacre is right, good looking car. Weren’t the front seat cup holders front to back? Side by side looks better.
=D~
(Quote)
+16
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:42 am)PS to my comment at the top: Every day, Lyle, you post fresh, timely topics that keep me reading every word …..and most (if not all) of what everyone else has to add. And this has been true for over 3 years now. I guess it’s become an addiction, yet a healthy one —am I right Tag?
Today I find Whitacre’s remark that the Volt is “large” particularly enlightening and even a bit surprising since he looks like a pretty tall guy when standing beside others in photos. Great!
Keep up your fascinating journalistic efforts at GM-Volt.com, Lyle!!!
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:45 am)Very good!
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:48 am)I can’t speak to leg room, but there is a TON of head room. I am guessing that there is adequate leg room (I’ve sat in the Volt).
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:48 am)I hope that after spending a billion dollars and having thousands of people working on this project for over three years, that he would be a “fan”!!!!!!
NPNS
SHTLWLWBUBGM
(Still Hoping That Lyle’s Want List Will Be Utilized By GM)
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:51 am)Terms like large without objective measure tell us very little. A GM manager said he regretted not providing more rear seat head room for the Volt.
But I was pleased that none of Lyle’s sources had apparently told him he got it wrong about pricing.
GCUAPO!
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:52 am)==================
It really does look like the front seat is touching the rear seat, doesn’t it????
And I still would rather have that center touchpad in black…..
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:58 am)Please, please Mr. Whitacre, have mercy on those of us who are not in California, DC, or Michigan. Give us a shot at a Volt, too! Preferably this year or early next year at the latest.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:58 am)Much as I like the idea of getting off of foreign oil, I am skeptical of the assumption that building electric cars will cause that to happen. It is one step in that direction, however.
(Quote)
+5
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:58 am)And even better news – Toyota stops production and sales of recalled of cars.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100127/ap_on_bi_ge/us_toyota_recall
(Quote)
+7
Jan 27th, 2010 (7:59 am)I agree with you about Lyle, but I think is time for me to look for rehab for GM-Volt addiction. When I wake up in the mourning if I don’t see a new post I start thinking ……”What is up with Lyle, is he still sleeping or what?? LOL
Thanks to Lyle and all the people here. I love this place!!.
Luis
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:08 am)There is probably more room than the picture would have you believe, but I did think the same thing. If I’m lucky enough to own a Volt, I should never have to sit in the back seat. My kids might not be too happy about the room, though. But I can probably buy them off with LCD/DVD screens in the headrests (if they have that option).
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:14 am)I still think that if the battery resiliency benchmarks continue to stay consistently achieved or perform better than expected, that a price break that will be revolutionary will occur as Ed suggests.
If Volt comes anywhere close to around $33,000, it’s all over for any skeptics’ doubt. It will just be all over for anyone else’s doubt to buy.
That sort of confirmation will be the very electrifying words from Mr. Whitacre, that will be the twenty first century equivalent of when Alexander Graham Bell first spoke on his first telephone.
Those words stating the selling price of the volt will be starting-line gun fired off, begining the race toward all the good things Voltec means for all of us.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:20 am)Regarding the rear seat – I think that is an optical illusion that it is so close to the front seat.
Also there are probably indents in the backs of the front seats to provide rear seat leg room. The side bolsters make it look squished back there but it couldn’t be that way.
ps. I’m starting to really like this Whitacre fellow!
(Quote)
+15
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:22 am)At least we won’t have to put up with the Toyota-is-great and Asian-supremacy trolls for a while.
(Quote)
-30
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:25 am)(click to show comment)
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:28 am)If you look in the rear seat you can see where i was trying to explain the other day how the seats dont fold down flat. I was kinda bummed by that. Maybe if i put something really heavy on them, it will squish them down more.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:41 am)We know that the Volt is a cruze and therefore we know it ISN’T particularly large. As a “scientist” and given the evidence, you have to interpret his statement as being relative to the Prius, or the expected “golf cart”. But mostly it is what you should expect from a CEO talking up a product, not assume that the car has suddenly grown a class.
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:46 am)There is another issue that may have been talked about here but I haven’t seen it regarding battery reliability. If the battery proves to be more reliable then their initial conservative estimates then they may also start using more of the capacity of the battery. Moving from 30% to even 29% may not seem like much but it is virtually free if testing shows minimal effects on life or reliability. Of course being able to use it down to 25% or 20% would be much more dramatic. I would also guess that this could be done with a software change. I doubt we would see this anytime soon though as the risk/reward of this is kind of high without real world data to back up the change. But wouldn’t that be a nice bonus a couple of years from now when you get a recall notice that there is a software change that is going to give you extended mileage?!
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (8:47 am)I like it – Except I would have all of the protester groups toss their signs and chase the Volt to a Chevy Dealership that has a ton of volts on the lot… Great Idea either way.
If you dont like the console color it is an easy fix… Remove the Plastic Trim – grab a can of krylon fusion in the color of your choice – paint.
I have painted many interiors to my liking and most people dont even realize. In my current car it was black with silver trim – I painted all the silver trim flat black. My Girlfriend of over a year who rides in my car daily saw the inside of another XB and said “hey look their trim is silver.”
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:11 am)Nasaman, it’s like a soap; for can pick up anywhere and not have any problem catching up.
When I looked at the picture of the Volt in front of the Prius at the auto show, I thought that the Volt did look large. Ed Whitacre appears to have good head room from this picture. The Volt is slightly longer than the Prius ( 177 vs 175.6): slightly whider ( 70.8 vs 68.7); slightly shorter than the Prius ( 56.3 vs 58.7).
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:14 am)To me it looks like that rear seat is about three or so inches back from the front seat’s side bolster. Could be just an illusion created by light and shadow, and we don’t know how far the front seat has been pushed back on the rails. The cars were behind ropes at the auto shows, so no hands on results yet either.
Are the black and green color options still being offered, have any more choices been announced?
(Quote)
-31
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:17 am)(click to show comment)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:18 am)First thing I noticed was the rear leg room, but then I started thinking about the picture.
I think they leaned back the seat and also fully extended the drivers seat so that the picture got a good shot of him and the dash. Like someone said he’s got tons of headroom, I’d also look at the room between his legs and the steering wheel.
I’ve been in lots of small cars where my legs would be touching the wheel, but he’s got inches for sure. he’s not quite as big as I am, but he’s not a flower either.
All-in-all I think the picture is a positive image for me.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:23 am)Van, in comment #26, I give the dimensions of the Volt and the Prius. The Volt is slightly longer than the Prius. This may not be a true indicator but I wonder what a Prius owners comment on leg room while sitting in the rear would be. Anyone out there?
It would depend on the placement of engine and other components of course. One claim for the Volt is its storage size.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:24 am)Exactly right. Don’t expect that low a price : they don’t need to discount when the production is only 10,000 units. They will price the Volt to move them out the door quickly and at launch time, they would move out quickly even at 40,000$
My bet is they will try to make it close to 30K after govt. rebate. 31,5K maybe, which is not bad for a brand new technology.
They will sell like hot cakes.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:28 am)+1 on both counts
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:30 am)I envision solar panels on the roof of every house. And an EV in the garage and no tail pipe to be seen on any car as I drive all through the neighborhood. I’m an optimist and can easy see the transition to electric transportation getting us off of oil. I’ll agree it is one step in that direction.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
-12
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:30 am)(click to show comment)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:38 am)For now I will keep my glass half full concerning the price not including the tax credit. I don’t think any manufacturer should include tax credits when stating the vehicles price. It’s obviously a good idea to mention the availability of tax credits, but since tax credits are temporary and not part of the purchase it should not be considered part of the price. I hope Mr. Whitacre will clear this point up soon. Thank you
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:40 am)The photo shows he has OK headroom but not a lot. Having sat in it, I’m not sure I’d describe it as “large”. It was a bit narrow actually but perfectly adequate for most purposes. My guess is that his reference frame was a golf cart, which is what most people think of when they think of an EV, in which case he’s right to say the Volt is quite large and very powerful. Compared to an S class Mercedes not so much.
The Prius comparisons people have suggested are apt based on my short experience.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:45 am)The temporary closing of the U.S. plants will have a detrimental effect on the local economies. I would rather see Toyota find a better way of handling the problem. I wonder if they advised their existing customers driving one of those 8 models to stop driving their vehicle!?! We all hope that they solve the problem quickly.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:48 am)Right that. We should do this right after we drop the “Evolution” hoax and the “World Revolves Around The Sun” hoax and the most recent “Smoking Causes Cancer” hoax. My God science is responsible for so many hoaxes!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:52 am)I agree what about the unsafe Toys running around with all of us? We should all hope they find a fix soon. If they stop sales they should tell everyone to stop driving them.
A few years ago when GM had a problem with the front hub on the Trailblazer they told owners to stop driving them and towed and fixed them. Toy should do the same.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:56 am)wonder what a Prius owners comment on leg room while sitting in the rear would be. Anyone out there?
We have a 07 Prius. I am 5′-7″ and can sit comfortable in the back even with the seat all the way back. Others taller than me also say they are o.k. with the seat all the way back, though I usually split the difference. The head room is great in front but alittle low in the rear but not a problem.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:57 am)Having a high-level advocate helps any project. Without one, your project can be cost-cut out of existence.
I wonder what Ed’s personal ride is?
(Quote)
+9
Jan 27th, 2010 (9:58 am)Why would this be good news?.. its horrible news. If Toyota/Honda had not showed us the way, Detroit would still be making the junk cars of the previous generation and there would not have been a Prius either.
Competition is good.
(Quote)
+5
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:00 am)Here’s a shot I took at the Detroit Auto Show.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:01 am)I love the HUGE ‘beer tap’ shifter, but when Ferrari and other makers have nearly eliminated the ’shifter’ in favor of tiny levers or push-buttons, I gotta know Lyle, “What reason did you see for such a big handle just for choosing “P-R-N-D-S” ?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:02 am)With Ed being a lot bigger than I am the Volt likely will feel fairly big to me!
I’m not so much concerned about the colour of the interior but of the quality of the bits. PLEASE resist the temptation to use that terrible hard plastic for the trim bits, use good materials that exude quality.
A reasonably good review of the Volt integration model from “Automobile” magazine.
http://www.automobilemag.com/green/reviews/1001_2011_chevrolet_volt_integration_vehicle/index.html
(Quote)
+12
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:07 am)Wow – for firing Rick Wagner, and then Fritz Henderson, Ed Whitacre sure seems to be thrilled with the results that THEY were responsible for !
I realize their may have been financial issues that these two weren’t able to deal with ( like stiffing all those creditors via CH 11 and bitch-slapping the UAW like him and the Feds were able to do ), but it really grates at me to see Whitacre stepping in front of all this great new product from GM ( not just the Volt ) and acting like HE was the guy who finally straightened GM out and got the pipeline fixed.
At the very least, I think he owes Wagner and Fritz Henderson some kind of acknowledgement for their roles in GM’s turnaround. I think most people would respect this – at least I would ( and I don’t work for GM, btw ). Of course, Maximum Bob deserves a share of the credit as well !
GO GM ! GO VOLT !
(Quote)
+9
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:09 am)I just woke up to this news about Toyota “suspending sales” till further notice!? Wow! I’ve heard of recalls on 1 or 2 models, but to totally stop sales? That’s a biggie!
“Begone Ye Trolls!”
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:11 am)I received this today. Basically information we already know, but like the analogy AF uses.
—————–
Chevy Volt Engineers Continue Tweaking as Production Start Nears
Andrew Farah, chief engineer on the ’11 Chevrolet Volt, says his team is close to completing validation work on the industry’s first extended-range electric vehicle, but engineers continue to tinker with items such as noise, vibration and harshness.
“It’s like refinishing your bathroom at home,” he tells Ward’s. “You know where every flaw is. You neighbors would never see them, but you do.”
“This car is that home-improvement project. We know where all the flaws are, but I’m almost satisfied,” Farah says.
One sticking point remains NVH (Noise, Vibration and Handling) issues that arise when the car switches from full-electric mode to its internal combustion engine. The Volt is designed to travel 40 miles (64 km) under electric power. After eclipsing that range, a 1.4L gasoline engine kicks on to generate electricity to propel the car another 250 miles (402 km) before a recharge or fill-up is needed.
But engineers continue to wrestle with exactly how much feedback they think passengers should hear and feel when the Volt transitions between those operating modes. Too much NVH would alarm passengers, Farah says. But if the ICE (internal combustion engine), starts too slowly in an effort to optimize NVH, engineers run the risk of depleting the 16-kWh Li-ion battery too far.
A Li-ion battery likes to keep a constant state of charge, never reaching full charge or depleting its charge completely. And a happy Li-ion battery performs better and lasts longer. GM wants its Volt batteries to last 10 years.
“So it’s these finer points we’re working on,” says Farah, who has been using a production-type Volt as his daily driver for several months.
Volt engineers also are in the middle of what is called a “match check” at GM’s Detroit-Hamtramck, MI, assembly plant. The auto maker invested $336 million to renovate the 24-year-old, 3-million-sq.-ft. (278,709 sq. m) facility last year to accommodate production of the Volt. Now the car’s engineers are making sure all of its body panels match to specifications. “We want perfect fit and finish,” Farah says.
GM will begin production of the Volt in the fourth quarter, with plans to put customers behind the wheel of the first units by late November. Farah says his team should wrap up validation this summer.
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:11 am)Herm,
It’s good news because it’s likely to take some of the Toyota rose coloured glasses off and more people will quite likely actually look at the car itself rather than just the sticker on the outside of the car.
This is good for the entire industry. (and yes I’m getting a good chuckle from Toyota eating a little crow!)
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:12 am)“Global Warming” hoax is more like the flat earth hoax, Y2K Hoax and the Moon is made of cheese Hoax.
It kills me that people belive something they can see with their own eyes is not true.
Record cold everywere last year and again this year.
Example My inlaws have lived in Florida for 30 years last year their water pipes froze for the first time. This year was even colder, many Manitees have died due to the cold, not just one day of cold but weeks of far below normal cold.
Example I have fished in lake Huron all my 54 years. This summer was the coldest ever. Lake Huron is a very large body of water and takes a lot to heat it and cool it. Every year in about 100ft of water in August the temp will get to about 72 or 73F on my electronics this year it never got over 63F.
These are just 2 examples of things I can see with my own eyes.
When people belive something they can see is not true that’s is one big hoax.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:13 am)“I think you’ll see that (propulsion system) in coming vehicles too,” he said.
I can’t control the urge to post this………
http://www.rasertech.com/motors-and-drives/products/drive-systems/series-phev-drive-system
There, now I feel better.
If patience is a virtue. I’d like to be less virtuous.
(Quote)
-9
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:15 am)As far as pricing:
Corvette – 48,930
Impala – 24,290
Camaro – 22,680
Malibu – 21,825
Cobalt Sedan – 14,990
It’d be pretty silly for Volt to ’start at’ 35,000 considering the pricing of other Chevrolets. That would position it in Corvette territory.
I realize that these ’starting’ prices are about 10k below what you can actually get an equipped version for. Even so, Volt needs to be positioned somewhere between Cobalt and Impala to make sense.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:15 am)OT, but this was also interesting. More room for efficiency improvement on the ICE’s. Maybe we will see some of this in Volt 2.0?
——————————–
GM Receives Grant for Engine Development to Boost Efficiency
New technologies expected to deliver 25 percent better fuel economy
The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) is awarding General Motors a $7.7 million grant to accelerate development of four technologies to improve the fuel economy of light-duty vehicles by at least 25 percent while meeting strict future emissions standards.
The GM project integrates technologies including lean combustion, stop-start, active thermal management and an innovative passive selective catalytic reduction (SCR) after-treatment system that collectively push the efficiency of conventional propulsion to its upper limits.
“The DOE grant helps accelerate our efforts in bringing breakthrough technologies to production that optimize fuel efficiency, emissions and vehicle performance,” said Dan Hancock, GM vice president of global powertrain engineering.
While the benefits of lean combustion have been known for years, commercial implementation of lean combustion requires an affordable emissions “after-treatment” system capable of meeting stringent U.S. environmental standards. The funding from the DOE offered under this project enables GM to further develop cost effective and novel lean after-treatment technology.
In addition to a “passive SCR” after treatment, the advanced engine development project will also employ a stop-start subsystem. Stop-start subsystems eliminate fuel waste during idle, and reduce hydrocarbon emissions, thus reducing demands on the after-treatment system. An active thermal management system will also be developed to further improve both fuel economy and emissions.
The DOE funded project will involve the 2010 Chevrolet Malibu with an advanced Ecotec direct injected engine and six-speed automatic transmission. Successful project implementation will enable GM to rapidly deploy this technology because Ecotec engines are globally used in a wide range of light-duty vehicles.
Work on the project will be conducted primarily at GM’s advanced engineering center in Pontiac, MI and will begin immediately.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:17 am)kdawg @ 43:
Great shot. So, unless the front seats in that picture are all the way forward, rear seat leg room looks to be no problem.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:28 am)Where is Dagwood55? Come on you lurker, step up and take your lumps. Your vaunted Toyota has just screwed the pooch as of this morning, just on the heels of the Prius braking problem. Yea, something I want to hear about my car: faulty brakes, runaway acceleration. Kind of like pilot+drunk.
(Quote)
-1
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:29 am)Science shows that Mars polar ice caps are melting. Other planets in our solar system are undergoing dramatic climate changes in the past 40 years as well. It’s something else I think. Not to say we shouldn’t turn to better energy sources and stop polluting. I’m sure we can all agree on that and put the debate of man made climate change to the side and just do the right thing.
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:33 am)Does any past or the current Corvette have maximum torque from 0 rpm, instant, strong, totally smooth acceleration available at any time and luxury quiet (in AER)? No, it doesn’t.
You are comparing a new halo to an increasingly tarnished one.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:37 am)Its obviously great that the CEO of GM is so enthusiastic for the Volt. Its also obvious that the car vastly exceeds people’s expectations once they actually drive the car. And that will be the case with virtually everyone when they actually drive the car. The sky is the limit with this magnificent machine!
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:44 am)I find it interesting that some people think that by looking out their window that they can accurately describe global trends. Whatever happened to empiricism?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:46 am)Your right this is big. But more important is why have they not told the current owners to stop driving them? If these vehicles are unsafe then Toy is putting US ALL at risk by not telling all current owners to stop driveing them.
Clearly this is a very big problem or why would shut down?
Noone should be happy about this. Toy is putting us all at risk. Anyone of us could be in front of one when the pedal sticks.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:49 am)Ed Whitacre is 6′ 4″ in height. His nickname is ‘Big Ed’.
http://blogs.wsj.com/deals/2009/06/09/the-411-on-ed-whitacre-gms-new-chairman/tab/article/
If he says the Volt is ‘large’, that’s a huge compliment to the designers.
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (10:56 am)Since I’ve been following this forum, perhaps a year and a half, there has been a steady stream of positive Volt milestones accomplished meeting and exceeding expectations and this in spite of it being a new technology, an ambitious time line and amidst corporate financial problems and executive shakeups. Quite a remarkable story really and exciting anticipating each next step! I have always been very intrigued with the series hybrid EV approach and am very confident in GM’s voltec push–can’t wait for the launch of the Volt and seeing it prove itself!
It’s good to hear about Ed Whitacre’s positive view of the Volt too. One more reassurance of the Volt’s imminent launch and a big step in the right direction.
Here’s hoping the price comes in as a good surprise too!
Have a good day everyone!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:04 am)It is very difficult (impossible actually) to extrapolate global trends (like 30 years of data) on a single or multiple local observations.
The whole point of climate change is that some places could be colder and the global average temperature could still increase.
That said, I firmly do not believe that mankind is causing global warming. The opposite is also possible (global cooling) with the same data. Global pollution is another matter.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:05 am)You are absolutely right. even if we all drove electric cars, oil is still used for ship fuel, aviation fuel, as a feedstock for the plastics industry, and as a primary feedstock for fertilizer. So the discontinuation of petroleum cannot come from just automobile eletricification. These other applications must also be displaced by an alternate liquid fuel such as biodiesel. GM also knows this, which is why they have taken part ownership of a company that is currently pilot testing a facility to produce cellulosic ethanol.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:15 am)I’m kinda fond of the Scientific Method, myself. And the “Keeling Curve lessons” scare the bejeezus out of me, especially page 4. Makes me wish the Volt was much smaller, lighter, that we had decent mass transit…PS love this Volt site!
http://scrippsco2.ucsd.edu/program_history/keeling_curve_lessons_4.html
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:19 am)You (and many others) are letting your Chevy perception of low price interfere with your value judgment of the Volt. The Volt is unique to itself, and really ought to be judged as that when considering it’s value.
Compared to other electric cars available to buy, the Volt at $40K is a steal.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:24 am)Are you smarter than a 5th grader ? Do you confuse weather and climate ?
BTW, in Seattle we are having the warmest January on record. We also had the hottest day records in summer. Last december we had record snows. Just as forecast by Climate Change models we are having more and more extreme weather.
“If It’s That Warm, How Come It’s So Damned Cold?”
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2010/01/2009-temperatures-by-jim-hansen/
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:31 am)I still think all the new-age junk in the console and the fancy displays should be options. Drop 2 grand on cost with run-of-the-mill controls and then you’ve got the car I want. I don’t need a big bright display blinding my night vision that could just as well be a few buttons on the steering wheel.
I’m for more the Honda Civic Hybrid model of approach. The car is exactly like the other Civics, not “futuristic” or with extra bells and whistles. Just better technology. It’s simple, and that’s what makes it great!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:34 am)Hmm….
That’s not much leg room. I can see the backrest may be folded down but it still looks like leg room is “Honda Insightish”.
Doesn’t look comfortable at all.
(Quote)
-1
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:39 am)I agree with most of your statement except the Insight stuff. The leg room for the rear was for Umpa Lumpa’s….
But I highly agree with just give me what I need, not all the extra mumbo jumbo. To me a car is a car and I only sit in it 20 minutes one way at the most on a regular daily bassis. I still think they should sell a stripped down version.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:41 am)+17 and counting, Good Commercial.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:43 am)Then have him sit in the backseat and let us know how it is.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:46 am)I noticed that too and in some past photos too. Also, noticed there is a lot of headroom left even for Ed. Perhaps they kept a little extra headroom for a more roomy feeling but it does add to the A in CdA.
/good to see Lyle get his back up a little re first hand experiences
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:47 am)#64
You talk about discontinuing use of petroleum, I don’t think that is anyones short term goal. The short term goal is to stop IMPORTING OIL. And that can be achieved partly through the electification of the automobile.
Of couse we also need to drill more oil ourselves (job #1 is to save our economy), while replacing home heating oil and also working to use other energy sources for truckers.
I dont care if shipping oil is expensive, that just will help bring back manufacturing jobs to our continent.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:48 am)That’s the job of all CEO’s…. DUH!
How many have you seen criticize their own product and be completely negative of it? That’s their job. The fact that they say it’s a great product means jack sh|t, it’s all PR bull crap, dontcha know?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (11:53 am)I love it today when ever someone has no good argument to support their point they call the other person dumb.
I am all for cutting polution but global warming is a hoax.
Emails show bad faith, fake data, unwilling to release all data, admitted false info, exclude the dark ages. Give me a break it is a lot more then just looking out the window. Global warming is a hoax!
You got to love how they try to change it to Climate Change from global warming.
Models based on fake data give fake output.
We need to stop importing oil that should be our goal and the Volt and other electric cars can help. When you try to use the golbal warming hoax as a reason for electric cars it makes electric cars look like another far left wacko idea.
We need electric cars to help reduce importing oil, thats it.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:02 pm)Oy vey. The human influenced climate change skeptards are here in full force. Just shows that we, as a species are doomed, these ‘tards will be the death of us.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:03 pm)In the picture above, it looks like they really widened the center console. Compare to previous pictures.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:05 pm)I’m all for gettin off the OPEC juice.
Plus, I’m a lazy bastard an want to fill up at home or work. Everything else will fall into place. Global warming is fine, it makes the women wear less……
/The right women, not the ones carcus1 thinks/dreams of.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:07 pm)Totally agree! IMO, people shouldn’t be disagreeing with Lyle on what he heard in a phone conversation.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:07 pm)That’s so we can watch the full 16:9 aspect ratio of Avatar while we drive!!!!
Or Playboy.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!
/Need more Kahlua ‘n’ Cream in my coffee.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:08 pm)Took many photos at the LA Auto Show 09′. A fellow was allowed to try the back seat. He is about 6′ tall (maybe 6′ 1″). Looked like his knees fit in okay. With about 2″ of headroom. I have two photos. Not going to post them. He may not want his photo shown worldwide. A man has got to know his limitations.
=D~
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:10 pm)Maaaan, cal me an old fogie but that’s a sh|tload of buttons on that console.
Sheeeeeesh.
KISS DAMNIT!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:12 pm)Jus blurr his face using MS Paint or whatever, it’s all good!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:16 pm)You can never have enough buttons! (actually i’d opt for no buttons and a big configurable touchscreen)
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:18 pm)In other news…
————————————————————————————————————–
General Motors Baltimore transmission plant to build electric motors
A day after announcing that it would invest $246 million to start building electric motors in-house, General Motors made a second announcement about the issue: Baltimore would be home to that production. The Baltimore transmission plant, which is actually located in nearby White Marsh, MD, has been building the two-mode hybrid transmissions used in GM’s full-size pickup trucks and SUVs since 2007.
————————————————————————————————————–
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:21 pm)Someone commented yesteday that a salesperson at a Toyota dealer said don’t drive any of those models.
There is room for debate. That’s how most of us tards (Homo Sapiens) eventually get it right. If we don’t all die first from inaction due to the debate anyway.
Is that debateable or have you decided it once and for all for us. Either way thanks for all the work you’ve put into this important question.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:26 pm)I don’t think that’s very bright. How can they maintain credibility that way?
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:26 pm)There seem to be a few people that seem to think NOBODY wants to eliminate petroleum, just imported petroleum. These people are a bit naive regarding the nature of the global petroleum markets. Petroleum circles the globe in its various stages of refinement, and is bought and sold as an interchangeable commodity. You’ll notice that oil is listed at a global per barrel price that changes daily. So if the US reduces it’s oil use by 50%, we will still be importing oil, just less than before. Of course our exports will also rise if we keep up with production and consume less. But we’ll still be funding Osama and friends. Keep in mind that these “American” oil companies have fields and refineries all over the world, and that oil/gas does not come with a “Made in the USA” tag every time you go shopping for it as a consumer.
Also, elimination of petroleum overall would have environmental benefits beyond the global warming debate. For example, replacing diesel and gasoline with cellulosic ethanol and biodiesel would take out of the fuel supply chain huge amounts of carcinogens such as benzene and similar aromatic organic comounds that are lacking in ethanol and biodiesel. These compounds are particularly pervasive in groundwater contaminated by petroleum spills. (I assume that everyone here believes in the basic irrefutable science that certain chemicals are carcinogenic.).
But THAT, friends, is why the Volt is such a winner. It appeals to lefty environmentalists as well as global warmining deniers and military hawks. It’s that broad based appeal that will make it such a homerun.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:28 pm)Toyota stock is down 8.2%.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:39 pm)A complete PHEV drive train for light trucks and SUV’s… great news! Electric trucks and SUVs will save 2x or 3x as much fuel as the same number of electric cars since the mileage is so much lower to begin with.
I also saw a press release that Delco electronics also has a full electric drive system available. I’m a Volt fan, but I also can’t wait for the whole automotive industry to go electric as well.
Finally, I love the quote: “What if this is all a hoax and we improve the air and climate for nothing?”
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:48 pm)There are a lot of people who do believe that global warming is occurring and that man is partly responsible. That is there opinion and you have your opinion. You those individuals that believe in global warming, the advantages of an EV are welcomed. Using it as a reason for adopting electric cars looks wacko to you because you claim it is a hoax. You can have your opinion and express it and attack them for believing it. It’s a free country. I, for one, believe we are influencing global claimate and also global warming.
To say that the huge additions of co2 to the atmosphere is not contributing to global warming ignores logic and science.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:53 pm)And what happened to the idea of always taking the high road ?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (12:58 pm)LPGVProVolt @ 29, you have got to be kidding.
Is the four passenger Volt larger than the 5 passenger Prius? Does the Volt have the rear seat headroom of the Prius? What is comparison of storage volume or interior volume?
The Volt is not a minicar, but it will not offer the interior room of the family sedan grouping, i.e Ford Fusion, Chevy Malibu, Ford Taurus, and Chevy Impala.
It is what is called a small sedan, similar in size to Chevy Cruze.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:00 pm)I agree mostly but I also think it is naive to think we can eliminate petroleum. We can not, at least not any time soon. (like the next 50 years or more) If our exports equal our imports that would be just as good as not importing any oil to me.
I also think if GM runs ads useing “global warming” a lot of people will just tune out.
Getting off imported oil is one thing we can all agree on is a good thing.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:01 pm)Nick D #24 Says:
“If you dont like the console color it is an easy fix… Remove the Plastic Trim – grab a can of krylon fusion in the color of your choice – paint.
I have painted many interiors to my liking and most people dont even realize. In my current car it was black with silver trim – I painted all the silver trim flat black. My Girlfriend of over a year who rides in my car daily saw the inside of another XB and said “hey look their trim is silver.”
=======================
Do you think the touch surface of that center console will still work if you take a can of spray paint to it????
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:02 pm)Off-Topic:
Don’t know if anyone else has posted the Automobile Magazine article about the Volt. Go to their website to read it. Very interesting. Here’s part of it:
Business Game Plan
To build and sell 60,000 Volts per annum, GM invested $336-million in its Detroit-Hamtramck assembly plant, originally Cadillac’s home manufacturing base. While CEO Whitaker would love to see GM’s can-do car on the road as soon as possible, there is engineering work left to be done, orders for the initial demonstration fleet to fill, and a production ramp-up to accomplish before you’re likely to see Volts gracing Chevy showrooms. Unless you’ve got a deposit in place, you’re unlikely to find one at retail before the clock strikes 2011.
The exact price is still unknown. Our guess-which is no better than the next-is that the sticker will start at $39,995 and a base edition will roll for about $32,495 after the federal government’s generous $7500 tax credit is applied. In this area, the timing could not be better for GM. Toyota and Honda have both exhausted all their hybrid credits so Prius and Insight buyers now must pay full sticker (not counting state or local credits). Likewise, the applicable credits for Ford and Mercury hybrids expire March 31 of this year. This situation is sure to send shrewd green buyers straight to Chevy dealers once the Volt hits the market.
While it’s too soon to say whether the Volt is the homerun GM really needs to buff its tarnished luster, we can conclude that the project is on track with better driving performance than we expected. This is definitely GM’s best opportunity to show the world that it’s alive, kicking, and still able to top the best imported technology.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:02 pm)I agree. While a part of me can’t help being happy that Toyota’s having problems, I’m not happy that they’re putting people’s lives in danger. I don’t want anyone to get into an accident. Regardless of which car manufacturer they chose to support.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:03 pm)That does seem to apply in this case…
http://www.climatedepot.com/a/5064/Manufactured-Science-Another-IPCC-Scientist-Reveals-How-UN-Scientists-talked-about-trying-to-make-IPCC-report-so-dramatic-that-US-would-just-have-to-sign-Kyoto-Protocol
(Quote)
-3
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:06 pm)LOL it was a joke. And driving on the low road is more fun with all the Toys parked. ;>)
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:07 pm)#92. I agree. Negative advertising is not the answer. GM needs to focus on how good GM cars are. Not how badly the competition messed up.
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:08 pm)Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming, CAGW, is now, and has become and been a hoax for almost a decade and a half. It continued from a valid scientific question that was disproved by the mid-1990s. Now the hoax is unraveling as the media finally are looking at the details closely.
First there was Climategate. Then came Pauchurigate, Then Glaciergate, then, Amazongate, then Insurancegate. Toss in NASAgate and NOAAgate. Now it turns out that much of IPCC AR4 and previous quinquennial updates,were written, not by scientists but by political activists for WWF, and Greenpeace among otters. What do you call that WFF-le gate? It turns out that WWF is in turn principally funded by the would be rentiers of Carbon Trading. The scandals pour forth everywhere, and multiply, once the tools of investigative journalism are being used.
It is one thing to have peer-reviewed Science and their scientists, author a document, but it is completely another thing to have gentlemen with possible doctorates in Poli-science and Public Relations, author them, drawing on publicity an fund-raising literature as sources of their authority.
At some point you have to look at the Science, and the quantitative and measurable Science of the 21st century disproves, the qualitative, unmeasured, hypothetical nature of the first alarms. The GHG scientific phenomenon exists, no doubt, but the feared power is one sixteenth or less that originally feared. That makes it minuscule in its effects, and and almost wholly benign, Added CO2 lengthens growing seasons, and fertilizes plant growth, that is observed by the satellites; but it can’t alter temperatures by more than tenths of a single degree, and certainly not by several degrees, as originally feared.
There are valid reasons to seek a replacement and supplemental substitute for the exclusive reliance on petroleum for the Transport Sector use. The VOLT is a fundamental advance. It is making a quantum leap in the acceptability of electric transport. I eagerly await its introduction and market success. But that is for political, military, and economic reasons, and no longer of any concern or fear of CAGW.
Capping transport sector oil consumption via electricity substitutes, has an ability to break the monopolistic, Oil Cartel. The era of wildly overpriced Oil is drawing to to a close,after 40 odd years. Finally and thankfully.
Two of the only beneficial aspects of CAGW concerns, are that it has forced wholesale efficiency improvements to happen sooner, then they otherwise would have occurred. It has also opened up and proved enormous increases in sources of oil supply. to the point that exploitable oil reserves now provably exists for half a Millenia or more. We have also begun to prove that manufactured petroleum is possible for beyond that time with so called Bio-fuels. .
The Oil sands of Canada, now being extracted profitably, under the distorted oil prices, can supply the World’s oil needs into the 2200s, all alone. That is without drawing a single drop from Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Iran, Russia, Brazil, Nigeria, Indonesia, Venezuela, or the US. The US Shale Oil reserves, largely unexploited to date, now proven economically exploitable by Athabsca technology, can be exploited. Alone, they are even far larger than Canada’s tar sands, and would suffice for the world’s’ oil needs for a few centuries, at present demand levels. But demand will likely shrink rather than expand over time, as electricity substitutes, improve and proliferate.
All hail the coming of the VOLT.
The ICEage ends; embrace the VOLTage
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:14 pm)I was under the impression that we haven’t been observing Mars’s polar ice caps for long enough to determine anything other than it’s colder when it’s further away from the sun.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:16 pm)Light trucks are the next step in electrification of transportation. I have cited this link here before. GM collaborated with Raser Technologies on the Hummer porject and the video show a GMC Sierra truck but I do not believe that GM will be using their drive train. Raser Technologies has already leased this series design to a number of Asia truck manufacturers. I also believe that we will see electric trucks in a few years.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:17 pm)Thanks for the info Blind Guy, you don’t deserve a negative vote +1. I don’t agree with Prius bashing myself and I don’t think we need fear it as a competitor to the Volt either. The Volt will stand on its own strengths IMO.
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:18 pm)Interesting read. Thanks.
Hard to believe that common sense cannot stand on this issue. No matter how we call that phenomenom, “Global warming”, “Climate change” or else, it seems to me that waiting for something to happen before acknowledging it’s real is a dangerous proposition.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:29 pm)And when did mainstream science become the far left? Even if I conceded, for the sake of argument, that global warming was a hoax, it wouldn’t change the fact that a huge portion of the middle believe in it. In fact, moderate republicans usually believe in it. The hoax theory is primarily prevalent among the far right. As determined by where believers usually fall on the political spectrum relative to the general population.
(Quote)
+4
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:31 pm)Ok, you might be right about the wacko idea thing. But to state without a doubt (or so it seems when I read you) that global warming is a hoax is certainly not open minded, to say the least.
It could be that the models we have elaborated so far are incomplete. Heck, we have problems predicting accurately the weather 3 days in advance and we have been working on these models for quite a long time. And we have computers far more advanced than in the ’70s. Still, we cannot consistently predict the weather accurately.
What we observe, though, is that we have more hurricanes than never before. Snow in Florida. Here, in Canada, we had rain for the last 2 days. Not freezing rain, plain ordinary rain when usually we have snow. Above 0 C temperatures in january (that’s above 32F in the US).
Actually, we had higher temperatures here in Quebec (+8 C) than in Florida when they were freezing (0 C) and we are north of Vermont.
So something is happening to the climate. No matter how you call it.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:32 pm)Ed’s committment to the Volt is reassuring, and it’s good to see a big guy like Ed characterize the Volt as “large.”
As far as the Volt helping to reduce the U.S.’s dependence on oil, I had read somewhere that if all personal vehicles in the U.S. were configured like the Volt, that the country would be using a staggering 40% less oil, and that it would be off of the Middle East oil completely. Moreover, the U.S. would only need to be able to generate 10% more electricity on the grid in order to support such widespread EV recharging (assuming of course, that most cars are recharged overnight). In such a scenario, the U.S. wouldn’t be off of oil completely of course, but it would be far less dependent on foreign oil–a highly worthy goal.
The lingering ambiguity surrounding the Volt’s precise November launch price is puzzling. When I looked at old 2008 news stories, which announced the government’s new legislation granting future Volt owners a $7,500 rebate, it appeared that around that time already GM executives had been saying that the Volt would initially cost around 39K – 40K (I even recall seeing Lutz also quote a similar price to David Letterman on David’s show in 2009). Yet initially, prior to that, my understanding was that GM execs had said that the Volt would cost somewhere in the low $30,000’s–which is ironically what their CEO is telling us now it will cost.
My theory is that perhaps GM knew all along that the car would cost around $33,000 to build, but deliberately inflated the price when speaking to the government and to the media, in order to ensure that the $7,500 rebate legislation would be passed (and we do know that GM in fact did lobby hard for this legislation).
There may have been other reasons, of course, to low-ball public expectations about the Volt’s launch price and date (e.g., wanting other car companies to think that the Gen 1 Volt would be far too expensive for most car buyers’ tastes). In any event, if GM did mislead the public on this matter, I believe that it was for a good cause so-to-speak. Clearly, the plug-in rebate is one of the better uses of taxpayers’ money in my opinion.
I like Chris C’s ideas regarding future Volt TV commercials. I myself would envision a GM commercial in which a Volt driver is grinning as he passes by a service station where a disgruntled driver is cursing out high gas prices.
In another TV commercial, I could see a policeman who is about to arrest a bunch of global warming protesters, tell the crowd that he’ll “let them off the hook” this time if they promise to consider buying or leasing a new Volt. I could picture the commercial ending with the cop telling the crowd: “put your protest signs down and vote with your wallet.”
In another GM commercial, I could see a very sexy young blond model who is slinking around the Volt and is all draped over the car, telling the viewers how much she “loves men who are concerned about the environment.” Anyways, enough said. Go Volt.
Sincerely, George, Sudbury, Ont., Canada
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:37 pm)You are an old fogie.
I aim to please!
(Quote)
+6
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:37 pm)I love sarcasm.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:40 pm)No I’m not kidding! I thought I had posted them in #25 but it’s not there!?! So here are the quotes from tthe GM and Toyota cites. Note that the Volt dimiensions are larger in all but the height.
“Dimensions “(of the Volt)
“Wheelbase (in / mm):
105.7 / 2685
Length (in / mm):
177 / 4404
Width (in / mm):
70.8 / 1798
Height (in / mm):
56.3 / 1430
Cargo volume (cu ft / L):
10.6 / 301″
“Exterior Dimensions (in.) (for the Prius)
Overall height/width/length 58.7/68.7/175.6
Wheelbase 106.3
Interior Dimensions, front/rear (in.)
Head room 38.6/37.6
Shoulder room 54.9/53.1
Hip room 52.7/51.2
Leg room 42.5/36.0″
Go figure!
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:41 pm)From that angle, the car looks small.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:45 pm)I did some research, and I stand corrected. Mars’s climate is about dust and albedo. And they don’t even know for sure it is getting warmer.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=more-heat-than-light-dim
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2007/04/mars_warming_su/
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:55 pm)Let’s just hope GM doesn’t use the same supplier as Toy did on the accel pedal mechanism. Because they do often use the same suppliers.
That would suck.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (1:57 pm)Lyle, this is a most valuable site. You can bet the farm Whitacre checked it and you out first then contact. Imagine pre-stimulus getting a call from GM’s CEO – odds are it wouldn’t have happened. Anyways by Spring ‘09 prevailing wisdom tied VOLT to GM’s recovery – its future. Things right now don’t seem all that dire. Its not till now we know bankruptcy was wholly unnecessary. (But the bailout most certainly was.) So be that as it may, Whitacre, GM and U.S. as 61% shareholders are now married. Whitacre you can kiss the bride – VOLT. And me dear’s IPO June dowry will soon be full – after paying off the bailout mortgage.
(Quote)
+19
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:00 pm)Mars has no moon (of appreciable size) which would gravitationally force it into the predictable, limited Melankovich (sp?) cycles that we have on Earth. The position of the poles can change as much as 40% from one Martian year to the next.
The sun’s variability does have an effect on Earth’s climate (how could it not?), however most Climate researchers give it an improbably low percentage of responsibility for such change.
The Earth’s climate has changed throughout it’s history, often reaching extremes far greater than any claimed for human-caused factors. The Earth did not die, or we wouldn’t be here to argue the fact.
This is not to say that climate change won’t make it harder for human beings to live here. It’s also not to say that human beings are necessarily causing the change (or can cause a desired change through regulation of it’s activities).
The problem is not so much the Science (which isn’t done yet, regardless of what you may have heard), but how the Science is being (mis)used: as an excuse for social engineering aimed at limiting individual freedom and stifling economic development.
The fact is, the Volt doesn’t need the bludgeon of climate fears for success; I strongly feel we should minimize it in any Volt advertising, although it’s probably unrealistic to think that it can be avoided completely.
(Quote)
+7
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:06 pm)I enjoy most of your posts, Laura, but I think you grossly overestimate the breadth of the belief in AGW. Just my opinion, but based on a lot of sampling – especially after “Climategate”, and then “Glaciergate”. I’m all for renewable resources and a clean environment, btw – but “Cap and Trade” is just another empty-headed ploy by the left to suit their own purposes, IMHO.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:08 pm)How is global warming theory limiting individual freedom and stifling economic development? So far, all I’ve seen is a lot more interest in diversifying our energy supply away from both oil and coal. As well as increasing our energy efficiency. All of which are good for multiple reasons.
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:09 pm)Dang, I didn’t know yall were all climatologists, paleo-climatologists, celestial observers, glacialogists, astro phycisistisisses and Mars rovers.
This sh|ts better than watching NOVA on PBS!!!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:15 pm)CapJack, if GM had a similar problem, I’m confident we would’ve heard reports about it, by now. Just a thought.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:17 pm)Yeah, its not a Malibu. But big enough for me. Another gripe i have (in case GM still monitors this site) is the antenna. It looks like something from the Jetsons. Can you just put the shark-fin antenna on there instead? (wouldnt that have better aerodynamics anywyay?)
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:19 pm)@Jackson, post 116,
Man, I would +5 this post, if I could.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:19 pm)Lol. I’m not. Which is why I usually don’t try to argue it. The only thing I will say is that, worldwide carbon limits would help the US economy in the long run. If everyone agreed to them. We have numerous relative advantages.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:19 pm)And we are a fan of Ed Whitacre. Very encouraging to hear his enthusiasm for Volt and it future. And the statement on weaning off foreign oil – pretty substantial coming from a director of Exxon.
As such Ed is positioned to broker a few changes that can speed the transition away from oil and toward electrification. His background at AT&T is a plus in understanding that PHEVs and EVs can be marketed like consumer electronics – something he knows well.
We welcome Ed to the fold and wish him great success in leading the USA and the world into the electrified future. Go GM!
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:20 pm)Mainstream science is not far left. I am part of mainstream science. The global warming scientists who have the worlds attention are far left.
I think what you will find if you do the research is that the people who are pulling the leavers on the Global Warming data and getting the bulk of the funding are activists. The Climate emails proves conclusively that the IPCC process is full of activists who know the answer and show only the results (made up if necessary) to go along with their theories. The scientists are activists and the delegates at the climate conferences are left wing activists. Remember, these people cheered for Chavez and Castro at Copenhagen. They see climate change as a way to re-distribute wealth.
Read through some of the emails and you will see that those associated at the heart of the UNs IPCC climate report are way left of center.
http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/reprint/climategate_analysis.pdf
NASA here in the US is similar. Jim Hansen is a total Flake and their website has been publishing BS. Consider the recent himilayan glacier scare. The UN said they would disapear by 2035 based on a WWF (left wing activists) report. Real scientists later noted that it would take centuries for these things to melt even if the global warming continued. NASA, in order to scare us all, moved the date up to 2030 on their website.
Hansen gave several thousand press interviews and then claimed Bush was muzzling him. His Nasa boss disagrees and said he was free to speak. He recently agreed with a book that argues that humans are the real danger to the earth. He has been locked up trying to block coal plant construction. He is an activist plain and simple and very far to the left.
Al Gore. Need I say more…
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:21 pm)I agree, gave em a +1 also.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:22 pm)I think all the auto companies throw some green leaves in there to show lack of pollution more so than lack of global warming. Have you seen the Toyota ad where everyone is holding their breath?
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:23 pm)#47 Excellent. Thanks. +1
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:24 pm)Worldwide carbon limits are a tax on our most abundant source of energy (coal). If C02 is not the issue, then we could try to burn coal and clean the pollutants out without a wasteful fixation on sequestering the C02. Taxing domestic energy sources in this way is not a help to the US economy in the long run.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:26 pm)#52
You’re on a roll today for sure. So much the better. +1
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:26 pm)I think we should make a sticker with the universal “Not” symbol of a red circle with a slash through it with a picture of an oil rig in the middle with a turban on top of it.
Whaddaya think? Too politically incorrect? I care…..
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:34 pm)#64
Scripps? What the ____ do they know? I can look out my window right now and see that the world is flat. As my Dad always used to say, “My mind is made up. Please do not confuse me with facts.”
They’ll still be denying when the water closes over their heads for the last time, LOL.
Oh, BTW, +1
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:36 pm)What do you call carbon trading if not a draconian taxation scheme which stifles economic health (based on assertions which are at least questionable in terms of quantification, if not qualification)? We’re talking about electrifying automobiles and raising the cost of electricity in almost the same breath. This is only one example.
One could also talk about world taxation in order to support undeveloped areas supposedly at risk from coastal floods (coincidentally taking from the rich to give to the poor, in most cases). Is this a real response to an actual emergency, or just more guilt-fueled Socialist-inspired welfare (on a global scale)?
Whatever the specific, with less economic growth, there is less individual opportunity, or freedom.
What do you call government mandates which outlaw light bulbs, plasma TVs and limit the square footage of homes; or social pressure intended to shame anyone from stepping outside of a sort of minimalist, Euro-socialist-ideal lifestyle? I’ve heard straight-faced dissertations in the media in recent years of how Christmas and Valentine’s Day are “killing the planet.” This is a case of limiting freedom (or at least bullying it into submission) which has a direct negative effect on the economy.
In a real sense, economic success and individual freedom are tied together with a short rope. An improvement of one bolsters the other.
It’s hard to dissuade me that much of the more hysterical Climate-mongering is actually motivated by the Leftist assertion that “You’re not Helping unless you’re hurting.” I find it suspicious that much we must do to “Save the Planet” results in less-powerful individuals which are more easily controlled through central planning. It reminds me of something else in history, which has precious little to do with climate, or Science. It tends to support the popular notion of certain environmentalists as “watermelons;” green on the outside, Red to the core.
First, I do not extend this observation to all environmentalists, nor do I find all which is being done in the name of Climate to be morally repugnant. We do need the energy diversification that you alluded to, but could easily justify it solely on the basis of energy independence, “good old fashioned” pollution (real air and water quality issues which ignore climate change as a political force), and general cultural self-interest.
We run the risk of losing these good works (Volt included) in a possible outraged backlash against this kind of fake-social/political-environmentalism, if we associate too closely with it.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:39 pm)#76
My Dad was also fond of saying, “Too true to be funny”. +1
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:45 pm)#81
It looks to me like the Volt has about the same rear seat legroom as any other car its size. My wife HAS to have a 4 door car. Somebody actually sits in the back seat(s) about twice a year. So I’m not really too worried about this issue.
Thanks. +1
LJGTVWOTR!!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:47 pm)#82
Right on brother! +1
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:51 pm)Everything is debateable. I think only Gore and his bunch like to run around saying the debate is over.
Let me put it a nice way based on all the “gates” and wrong and fake data and you all know what I’m talking about.
“Global Warming” sure looks like one of the biggest hoaxes ever.
I am old enough to know, if it looks like a duck and it walks like a duck and it quacks like a duck, it’s a duck!
People don’t need to make up fake data if they are dealing in the truth.
I am done ranting let’s get back to the Volt.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:51 pm)Jack, I dig this idea. Heck, if the Freemasons, Ducks Unlimited, and “Golf” can have specialty plates, why not “use less oil.”
And that’s just a handful of them, from my home state:
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/vehicles/personal/special/index.htm
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:52 pm)#96
Nice. +1 Thanks. I’ll drink to that!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (2:57 pm)I think space is a real issue in the Volt for some. The large center consoles on the newer GM cars do create a cramped cockpit feel for some (like myself). This is my principle concern with the Volt and will not be addressed until I can sit in it. I hope it does well but there is a chance that I will have to wait for a larger EREV. I am currently driving an Equinox because I had to lay the seat down to keep my head from hitting the ceiling in the cobalts. The malibus are similarly small but power seats can rectify that (since they lower). I assume the Volt will have power seats. I am curious how much room there will be in the cockpit…
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:01 pm)How’s this for irony. The supplier for the problem part is a US company CTS Corp based in Elkhart, Indiana…ouch….and the manufacture actually occurs in Ontario (a plant owned by the same US company)……not good – none of it….well except for the part about the Toyota trolls being completely shut down
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100127/ap_on_bi_ge/toyota_recall_6
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:03 pm)#105
You got that right. +1
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:09 pm)#107
My son just sent me some aerial photos of the dried up reservoirs up and down the Sierra Nevadas in CA. I dunno if the drought here is national news, but it is one of the hottest topics in the state. So there’s another example. +1 to you for stepping so resolutely into the snakepit, LOL.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:13 pm)#109
LOL Every laugh helps. +1 Of course I agreed with him, so I guess that makes me one too. That’s OK, I can deal with it.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:17 pm)Changed Ticker Symbol
GM is no longer valid. It has changed to MTLQQ.PK.
And that is trading at: 0.6560
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:21 pm)And I thought it was just me!
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:29 pm)LauraM:
As promised, the report on countries of origin of my “hand-me-down” Oakley wardrobe:
2 – Nicely designed outer rain/snow parkas, different models – China
1 – Zip in fleece inner liner for one of the above – China
1 – Long sleeved T-shirt – USA, cheers, cheers, cheers
I did check out the American Apparel website, and there is one fairly close to where we live. I will go by and take a look at their products.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:29 pm)True they do not fold down flat, but I would say based on what I saw at the Detroit auto show, that they folded down flatter than our Saturn Vue seats do. I can’t wait to see if my bike will fit.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:42 pm)Hey Noel, did you notice the water release at the Dams increased? lol…
Man first they say we’re in a friggin drought, then a series of bigassed storms come in and they let more go?
And yes, the previous release was acceptable for all aquatic life up and down the American and Sacramento River.
Next their going to say we need to catch up and ration water.
/Got inside info from a DWR friend of mine.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:44 pm)A CEO’s job is to improve shareholder value.
HOW they do that is by promoting their products/services.
Go Ed Go!
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (3:47 pm)In fairness, Zero had a recall last year over a different “unwanted acceleration” (jumping at start, but not sticking) issue for different reasons, which they promptly and successfully dealt with, by all accounts.
My model year was not affected by the recall, as I had purchased an older, most bone simple configuration I could get from them, figuring I could do whatever after market modding I wanted from there.
This kind of problem is hardly unique and has surfaced from time to time for pretty much every motorized vehicle manufacturer over the years, although I very much feel for folks who have been on the receiving end of it. It must feel like your vehicle has suddenly been taken over by Jeremy Clarkson.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704094304575029261182532010.html?mod=WSJ_latestheadlines
(Quote)
+7
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:11 pm)Well, since AGW seems to be the hot topic of the day, I might as well join the fray.
Global Warming is a “theory”. It is not proven science, otherwise everyone would agree. That said, there is no evidence to conclusively dispell the theory either. Therefore, we have believers and disbelievers. At this point, I consider neither to be right or wrong.
So maybe CO2 levels lead to GW, and maybe it is just an indication of the sun’s activity level. But since neither “theory” can be proven beyond doubt, I find it best to be objective, and need more conclusive data before I can make a judgement.
The problem is that we know CO2 levels are rising, and have been for 150 years (since the industrial age began). I don’t remember exact numbers, but I believe atmospheric concentrations of CO2 were 280 ppm around 1850, and are now hovering near 380 ppm. With the emerging economies around the world, some projections put these levels between 500 and 1000 ppm by 2050.
Whether you believe in glacier melts, rising sea levels, severe weather events, and other catastrophic events as a result of AGW, it seems to me that we shouldn’t want these high levels of CO2 in the atmosphere. Supposedly they also increase the acidification of the oceans, which upsets that ecosystem.
Therefore, from a pure logical perspective, regardless of whether CO2 levels are causing global warming, I believe it is in our best interest to curb CO2 emissions and stop the rise in atmospheric CO2 levels (not to mention, if the AGW pundits are correct, we save the world).
So put me in the “I don’t know” category, but common sense says that we need to curb CO2 emissions and stabilize atmospheric CO2 concentrations.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:21 pm)So would I. +5
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:26 pm)Tall Pete: Ok, you might be right about the wacko idea thing. But to state without a doubt (or so it seems when I read you) that global warming is a hoax is certainly not open minded, to say the least.It could be that the models we have elaborated so far are incomplete. Heck, we have problems predicting accurately the weather 3 days in advance and we have been working on these models for quite a long time. And we have computers far more advanced than in the ’70s. Still, we cannot consistently predict the weather accurately. What we observe, though, is that we have more hurricanes than never before. Snow in Florida. Here, in Canada, we had rain for the last 2 days. Not freezing rain, plain ordinary rain when usually we have snow. Above 0 C temperatures in january (that’s above 32F in the US). Actually, we had higher temperatures here in Quebec (+8 C) than in Florida when they were freezing (0 C) and we are north of Vermont. So something is happening to the climate. No matter how you call it. (Quote)
The problem with those pushing the Man-made Global Warming agenda is (precisely) that something is ALWAYS happening to the climate. That is a fact. Just because it is, it doesn’t necessarily mean that their theory is valid. Likewise, you can be a sceptic (and recent events keep fueling increased scepticism), but you can’t outright dismiss the possibility that we may be negatively influencing the earth’s climate.
(Quote)
+2
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:26 pm)Laura M and Noel Park:
I noticed your dialogue about US-made stuff. I always buy US-made New Balance and they are easy to find. The last two pairs I bought at Dicks. The secret is that New Balance has wisely seemed to keep their core products (i.e. good running shoes) US made. And for some reason, I think more of the mens than womens are made in the US.
Regarding your Chinese fleece; as soon as Malden Mills (the inventor of Polartec) went belly-up in Boston, we were doomed to have some of their production go overseas (but much is still made in the US). If you look for fleece with the Polartec label you have a much better chance of finding a USA made garment.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:38 pm)We do not have more hurricanes than ever before. That is hyperbole from the warmists. The rest of the stuff you mention is called weather.
(Quote)
+3
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:42 pm)Awesome post. +1
It is clear that we know so little about the issue, we don’t even know how much we don’t know. For some people, this means we stop looking, for some it means we don’t. AS a scientist, I am in the “keep looking” camp. The job of science is to destroy ignorance, not to foster it.
However to make definitive statements about this issue either way at THIS point in history, is just plain embarassing.
I just hope my kids (and their kids) don’t look at our generation someday with disdain.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:44 pm)A lot of the discussion (off topic) on climate change here is extremely US-centric. In the US today everything has to be categorized as ‘left’ or ‘right’, whether it has anything to do with those cultural distinctions.
The National Academies of virtually every scientifically advanced nation on Earth (all but one of which don’t give a rat’s patootie about the Democrats and Republicans) have stated unequivocally that CO2 from human use of fossil fuels is altering the climate.
Please look into climate-gate etc. in some detail and you will find they are nothing. Or, consider that skeptics would have you believe that there is a worldwide conspiracy involving thousands of scientists, tens of thousands of publications and millions of pieces of data generated from all over the world. Not only that, but these nefarious conspirators have all maintained perfect silence about their sinister plot.
Does it seem odd that every political leader on the planet takes climate change seriously? Including the leaders of Russia, China, India, Brazil, the UK, Germany, … well there is no one who is not on this list.
In any case, mother nature doesn’t care about US politics and climate change will be obvious even if you don’t live in Alaska, or near a glacier.
(Quote)
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:47 pm)I’m sorry, I was quoting somebody else. I’m not a global warmist; my point (at the end of the post) was that it is very hard to definitely say yay or nay about global warming. You can’t honestly justify by poinitng to changing (or even unusual) weather. On the other hand, is it possible that we may be negatively influencing the earth’s climate? Sure, it is. Does it justify everything that the warmists want to do (such as cap and tax)? NO.
(Quote)
+1
Jan 27th, 2010 (4:48 pm)The problem as I see it is that you have been made to believe this is a problem. Consider this.
C02 levels were higher in the past (and apparently during an ice age).
Going from 280 to 380 is like taking 10,000 air molecules and changing 1 more to C02. C02 is a trace gas.
C02 is wonderful for plants. They love it and thrive in it as they turn it into O2 for us.
C02 levels in new buildings is set to about 500 – 1000 ppm for human occupation.
C02 is not a poison. I am breathing it out right now. Before I am forced to pay high $$ to fight this issue, I want to know the truth about what it might do. Right now, it is clear that the UN has had to hype (read LIE) the data to try to get people to cut down on carbon use. The truth is, from the UN perspective, is that this is a way to have the rich countries (mainly the US) pay a tax to the small countries for our carbon use. It is mainly a wealth re-distribution pla