[ad#post_ad]There are a few times in life when one’s hard work is rewarded, when one can get to see the fruits of one’s labor and the stuff of one’s dreams come true. Such was the day I drove the near-production Chevrolet Volt in both EV and charge-sustaining mode.
After nearly three full years of following each and every development, after discovering and discussing every detail imaginable, I drove for the first time the fully production-intent car that emerged from the back of Jon Lauckner’s and Bob Lutz’ proverbial napkin in 2006.
I may not have been the first to drive it nor the first to write about the experience, nor the least biased, but my voyage was the deepest of all.
The car was in its full production glory, with every gleaming detail full sculpted and bathed in its signature paint. It appeared far more aggressive and athletic than any show model I’d ever seen, gone the roughness notable in its integration vehicle brethren.
This car was also one of the 80 hand-built pre-production models assembled over the summer. It had reached a late stage of refinement though according to lead engineer Andrew Farah, some units were actually further refined than this one.
The refinements this car was still lacking had to do with acceleration, generator behavior, handling, and graphics and driver interface functions.
I found the egress and ingress very open and inviting. The driver’s seat was well situated and I had ample shoulder, leg and knee room; it was a very generous seating area. I drove the car with three other people in it and all had plenty of room and looked comfortably spaced. The interior was bright and cheerful and seemed very spacious including head room.
The driver’s seat position was manually controlled. Levers allowed forward and back movement, up and down positioning, as well as recline. Farah said a motorized system was left out to reduce mass.
The dashboard displays were beautiful. The screens were bright, vivid, crisp and conservatively artistic and looked to be in high definition. There were several display menu configurations on the driver dash that could be scrolled through and chosen with a dash button to the left. The center display was touch sensitive. The ipod-like white center stack had interestingly unique capacitive finger-sensing buttons that gave audio feedback in the form of a slight subtle chirp when the touching finger was detected. There was no tactile feedback, nor was it needed. The buttons were a little unreliable, something Farah said still needed work. The green leaf eco display was also not yet operational. For my task I found that I could set the display to show MPG. I reset it at the start of my drive. It read >500 MPG while in EV mode.
To start, the keyfob simply has to sit anywhere in the car and then the start button is pushed while the brake pedal is depressed. The screen then comes to life letting you know the car is on.
The test track was a 0.4 mile winding pylon flanked path set up on an uneven parking lot surface, so some slight grades were included, but nothing steep.
And so with one small step for me and one large step for all of us I hit the accelerator.
The car accelerated precisely and assertively and felt very spirited. There were two modes of operation. Normal mode offers 90 kw peak power and felt to be in the 9 second 0 to 60 range. Sport mode delivered noticeably more intense acceleration below a 9 second 0 to 60. I was not permitted to time 0 to 30 or 0 to 60. It was not an outright sports car feel, but definitely sporty. Clearly it would outrun a Prius, Insight, or Fusion hybrid all of which I’ve driven. It’s top speed of 100 MPH would also easily top the Nissan LEAF’s 85 MPH.
I did bring a decibel meter as requested, but this too was not allowed by the team. Beyond any doubt however the car was extremely quiet in EV mode. Even the whine of the electric motor that can be heard in the MINI E or Tesla was very dim and muted by what seemed to be excellent sound insulation.
I spent about 50 minutes continuously driving, but did not have enough space to go beyond about 50 MPH.
I started out with about four miles of EV range and I watched intensely for the changeover to generator mode. The only change that coud be observed was the disappearance of the battery graphic on the driver’s screen which became replaced by a fuel tank symbol. With intense critical straining I could detect the slight muted whir of the gas engine but did not find it at all unpleasant. After all we must realize the car is burning gas, that’s its advantage over pure EVs, limitless range when needed. Combustion engines make noise. Period.
Once the car enters charge sustaining mode there’s no turning back to EV mode until the car is plugged in again. The car’s central processor continuously monitors battery state of charge and the rate at which it is being depleted. It will turn on the generator whenever the low point is reached. It may go on at one of several different RPMs depending on the car’s momentary requirements and depletion rate. The engine will turn off again when no longer needed, and when the car comes to a stop.
I found that when I drove reasonably and moderately I didn’t hear the generator go on at all. When I suddenly floored it, the generator revved for a couple of seconds. I did not find the need to use the words jarring, disconcerting, or off-putting as other journalists did. My word is appropriate. You floor a gas burning car, it makes noise.
The car felt very solid and well balanced. The uniquely low center of gravity due to the four hundred pound battery in the center gave a notably beneficial hugging of the ground. Yet the car felt light and spry, the power steering was perfectly tuned and the car handled wonderfully. Farah all but admitted the car weighed 400 pounds more than a Cruze, or about 3500 pounds. He wants it to be lighter and there are plans to make it so for the next generation.
When the car switched into generator mode, I reset the MPG meter.
After about a half hour of driving with the generator the reading was between 32 and 36 MPG, and would increase if I was gentle with the accelerator. Farah claimed this wasn’t a true number and that the display wasn’t accurate, so take it as you may. He instead explained to me about how when he used it for a weekend, driving a total of 200 miles and charging the car every time he came back home with it at 240V, he used a total of .2 gallons of gas for an overall efficiency of 1000 MPG. And in fact, this is the better way of looking at it. We should not be focusing on the generator mode MPG but the car’s overall fuel consumption over time, because that’s what practically matters as it determines how much gas you will burn.
In the end, I found myself delighted and excited about this highly refined, competent and wonderful car. I would take it home as it is right now if I could. But we’ll just have to wait those 11 months and let the engineers do their final tweaking.
There is really nothing to complain about here. GM has taken a great idea and made it into an even greater reality. And our dreams are starting to come true.
This entry was posted on Tuesday, December 1st, 2009 at 7:09 am and is filed under Test drive. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
+19
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:22 am)Yay! Good for you, doctor. Good for us. Good for GM.
+7
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:27 am)What a great “car guy” feeling you must have had.
Congratulations Lyle on such a great, detailed report, seeing and experiencing a dream come true.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:27 am)Thanks for the review Lyle. This day marks a strong step forward.
=D~
+7
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:29 am)Good Job Lyle.
I am glad to hear about the headroom being sufficient.
It is also good to hear that the engine noise was reasonalbe to you. I am also sure it will be in the production car. Typical automotive journalists like to make mountains out of mole hills. I am sure they will harp more on this but your review is more in line with what I expect the average driver will experience.
I think we should all get used to the fact that mileage in gas mode will be in the 30-40 range. After getting over the fact that it is not 50mpg as we thought, I think this type of mileage will be good enough. The gallons of gas difference for the typical driver who plugs in each day and takes the occasional long trip will be minimal.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:31 am)Thanks Lyle. I want one. After you of course!
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:32 am)Im sure it was a day to remember Lyle. This car will be remembered in the history of electric cars and how they helped changing the world in a greener and better place.
+15
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:40 am)Your story, along with the Volt, will make a great movie – how about ” Who DIDN’T kill the electric car ? ” for a title ? Congratulations, and I’m knocking on wood in hope of keeping the good news rolling !
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:41 am)Just awesome, Congrats and smiles all around.
+12
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:45 am)Lyle, your very intuitive, excellent review. The CS mpg will only get better, 1-2 people vs 4, second gen. vehicle having more advanced ICE, etc.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:55 am)Not sure it is purely him or an aura from the experience, but Lyle looks barely old enough to be out of high school.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:58 am)Lyle, do the rear seats fold down to get an extended cargo area?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:58 am)Now we all wait for the big moment tomorrow when we find out which lucky markets will see the first gen Volt. My instinct tells me that if the Volt sells well then the second gen is probably the one that gets a nationwide rollout.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:58 am)Very good article, I would say it was a very accurate discription of what you saw, I felt as though I was there. Good point to make, push any ICE Lexus or otherwise it will make noise and you will hear it.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:02 am)I’m very disappointed with the MPG for the charge sustaining mode. If not 50 MPG, how about at least 45 MPG. The new Prius is reported to get 50 MPG. My honda accord gets 32 MPG! Why is it so low. I hope that Farah is right in saying that those figures are inaccurate.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:03 am)Lyle,
Thanks for your review of the Volt; your report has been long awaited and I feel very comfortable about the Volt based on your driving experience. I’m a little disappointed about the MPG in the CS mode, but happy with the overall average MPG. Keep the updates coming!
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:05 am)Awesome job Lyle and congratulations. I wish I were there. I take your opinions with more weight as you have been so involved in this project than many others who have written about the Volt. Great article.
Hey who takes your photos by the way? A tripod?
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:11 am)Thank you for the review.
It seems to be a wonderful car.
I’m sorry we will never see one in our part of the country.
+18
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:11 am)It’s nice to hear an optimists view point rather than the ‘car & driver journalists’ who always seem to be pessimists. I like the fact that you pointed out that gas engines make noise….dah.
Other reporters make it sound like GM isn’t doing their job right if the ICE makes any sort of sound in an EREV vehicle. Silly fools. On the other hand, your report seemed quite honest, straight forward, and understanding of the progress yet to be seen on the final production Volt. I’m in line waiting to buy.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:14 am)Hi Lyle,
Congratulations. From the tone of your writing, it’s like falling in love again
Reminds me of the feeling when I finished a big project.
Anyway, thanks for the update and the details. amazing car!
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:14 am)Thanks for the review Lyle. Everything sounds good to me.
Is there a video so we can try to hear the generator? What was the MPG after electric driving before you reset it?
Did you try to push to be one of the early adopters next year (you know the 500 or so they said they’d put in the general public’s hands for testing)?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:17 am)WOW! I can’t wait to get my hands on one of these units. Thanks for the great information and all your hard work keeping us informed.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:17 am)Way to go Lyle! Way to go GM! Great job to both of you!
+13
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:19 am)Lyle, Congratulations on a well deserved life-time experience – and THANK YOU for sharing it with us. Your words exude excitement and a quite confidence that GM is about to bring a game changing technology to market. We have all been fortunate to have enjoyed front row seats to your ongoing documentary.
The next year cannot go by fast enough, but I suspect the anticipation will only grow as more and more consumers begin to understand exactly what the VOLT is and what it could do for them. Somehow, the loyal readers and contributors to this site should be rewarded for fanning the fire that kept GM on task through some very challenging times. Without Lyle Dennis and GM-VOLT.com, I really wonder if and/or when the VOLT would actually have seen the light of day. I have no doubt that GM had the technology, the capability, and the desire to execute a car like the VOLT. But without this site, I don’t know that GM could have mustered the URGENCY to keep on such a tight timeline.
So Congratulations again to Lyle for his first CS drive; and THANK YOU to every contributor on this site (yes, I’ll even thank the trolls…) for maintaining your passion for the Chevy VOLT.
Go GM. Go VOLT. Bring it on!!!!
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:24 am)Way to go! Long time coming! Thanks for the great review and as always, the greatest site all things Volt!!!
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:24 am)Fantastic Lyle. Thank you so much for flying all the way across the country to do this review!
Question: You say, “To start, the keyfob simply has to sit anywhere in the car and then the start button is pushed while the brake pedal is depressed. The screen then comes to life letting you know the car is on.”
Does the brake pedal have to be depressed to “turn on” the Volt? I can start my ICE car just fine as long as the gear shift lever is in “park.”
Does the Volt have to be “on” to listen to the radio? Most cars have an accessory mode.
Did you have a chance to use the air conditioning or heating during your test drive? Any impact on MPG from using the AC?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:25 am)Great report Lyle, thanks for the work. I’m happy to read it’s even quieter than a Mini-e or Tesla Roadster in EV mode.
It’s one of these things that tend to prove our wait (and mine for the ampera will be a bit longer than yours -US citizens- for the Volt) is not useless!
Doesn’t the central screen feel too big and roomy? It usually seems as empty as a windows screen after startup on most pictures.
LJGTAWOTR
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:26 am)An intoxicating experience, Lyle and thank you! Now if they’d only offer different body styles. Perhaps a two door coupe and a little utility so, please, PLEASE an El Camino!
-40
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:27 am)(click to show comment)
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:34 am)Was there any talk with the engineers during this test drive regarding the “final” overall range in pure EV mode? Also, for GM’s sake I hope this puppy comes in at price sub $30k. I really hope that $40k price is false. I’m pulling for them!
Good read.
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:37 am)Lyle, very well stated. Not sure where all these new demands for noise, then no noise, then noise … are coming from. The only thing that matters, as you say, is overall fuel consumption.
-1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:38 am)Most likely you are not going to be able to buy one whether you wnat to or not, as none will be available to you. So it does not matter if you want one or not.
Really, the Volt is exciting technology but it is a low volume specialty car to be sold in only a few dealerships. For most of us it is an exciting demonstration of what can be done developmentally, but Volt is not a car that realistically is available for purchase by most people in most places. It is as if you wanted to purchase your own Saturn rocket from NASA
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:41 am)Thanks a lot Lyle, you deserved this drive and we enjoy your report.
I’m now trying to figure out which one of my cars I’ll change for the Volt (or Ampera).
This one great milestone, several are still left before the car will be available worldwide, so long life to gm-volt.com.
JC
NPNS
+28
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:42 am)Sir, The Leaf will be $30k + and you will be leasing the battery…..and after 80 -100 miles you are done. The Volt is more expensive but I think it is a much better interim solution until batteries improve to the 200 mile range for the same amount of money. The Leaf is a city car, the Volt is an anything car that has few compromises for the average driver. Neither one is that affordable to the average person. They are both exciting developmental exercises that will lead to more affordable mainstream electric vehicles going forward. Be happy they are available at any price.
+54
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:42 am)So, here’s my problem. Why should I buy a Prius over a Cruze? Somebody explain how this car is going to change anything due to the huge retail price difference. This is where Toyota has lost touch with the people that are most likely to make a difference.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:45 am)It’s awesome that you finally got this opportunity to drive the Volt Lyle. Your report answers a great deal of the questions flying around about the car. I need to re-read this a few times more to digest all of the material you shared. Thanks for sharing with us!
Thanks also to GM for the openness and transparency, and well done.
+38
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:48 am)Jerry -
You won’t have to pay $40,000 for the VOLT, but you’re right – the ‘class of folks’ you refer to will likely not make the judgment that the Gen1 VOLT is their best choice. But stop and take a look back at history – this same ‘class of folks’ could not afford a Gen1 Prius either. The Prius sold at a premium for several years as a ‘niche’ vehicle before it reached mainstream acceptance.
I suspect that the VOLT will have some of those same hurdles to overcome, but I expect mainstream acceptance will happen much faster and that Gen2 and Gen3 versions of VOLT or other Voltec models will be considered affordable by the masses. But there will be more than enough consumers who will make the judgment that the Gen1 VOLT is right for them to make the VOLT a market success for GM. This will accelerate further development and refinement for future generations.
The key for all of us and for GM is that the VOLT is quickly becoming a reality – and, naysayers aside, the car represents a quantum leap forward. The VOLT is the first vehicle that will allow a consumer to drive 40 miles per day, 365 days a year (that’s 14,600 miles per year), and NEVER burn a drop of gas. Even at 50 mpg, a Prius will burn 292 gallons of gas over that same time – and at $3.00 per gallon, that’s $876 per year.
Many versions of this math have been done before on this site and others – the bottom line is the VOLT is a giant step toward getting us off foreign oil; while the Prius is just prolonging the agony. The Gen1 VOLT will not cure all our ills, but it represents a quantum step forward.
+10
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:49 am)Great write-up, Lyle. Thanks for sharing your test drive.
If only we could wave a magic wand and replace all the cars on the road today with the Voltec system, we could kiss the Arab oil good bye. I think that day will come!
Go GM go!!
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:51 am)Thank you Lyle for all you have done here. You have earned this wonderful experience. I think it is telling that you didn’t think that the engine noise was much of an issue, since you have been driving an already quite Mini-e. It does seem that many are overly interested in worst case scenarios. Unfortunately GM has earned that attitude from consumers. Hopefully the volt will change that.
#B~D
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:53 am)I’m a little worried about the capacitive buttons. Maybe they’ll be fine, but I have an LG Chocolate 2 cellphone, and those capacitive buttons eventually seem to not work well.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:54 am)Good article. I am very excited for the first batch to roll out. I am sure the general public will welcome it and lets hope the price is reasonable. I am either going go get an alternative fuel vehicle, and this may be the choice I make. Lets see how this final development goes and what is put out for sale next spring!
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:00 am)Great job Lyle! The excitement in your written word comes through 100%.
It’s going to be very interesting for the next 11 months. We are starting to get some real meat instead of speculation.
As I’ve been saying all along.. pure CS mode mileage is a small slice of overall gasoline usage picture. Take the 500 in EV mode and average it with the 36 of CS mode and you get a very good number indeed!
Onward to EPA certification and getting some production models in real driver’s hands!
+14
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:02 am)You mention the Leaf as being a viable car for you. If I’m correct, in the projected price of the Leaf, the battery is excluded. When all is considered, the Leaf will cost just as much as the Volt and will have limited travel distances. For an all around car, I would never own a pure electric car with no range extender—no way!!!
+23
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:04 am)Could it be that these same evil GM buying SUV drivers have the same (could give a rats ass) attitude as those (Obviously smarter) Toyota and Lexus owners who buy the luxury V8 vehicles with mpg ratings in the teens?
Sequoia 14/19 mpg
Land Cruiser 13/18 mpg
Sienna 17/23 (pathetic for a Van)
Many of the Lexus models are similar.
The big Chevy Tahoes 21 mpg number looks good in this crowd of gas hogs.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:06 am)It’s already in the works – http://green.autoblog.com/2008/09/27/altcar-2008-chris-paine-talks-who-killed-sequel-coming-in-2/
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:06 am)I agree. I have a Samsung TV with these and it is starting to be a pain in the xxx to turn it on. Takes a few tries sometimes. That would not be good in the car as I am driving.
What’s wrong with a button?
-39
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:07 am)(click to show comment)
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:11 am)The series-hybrid configuration is responsible for the relatively low MPG. If the drive motor is 90% efficient and the generator is 90% efficient, the series combination will only be 81% efficient (at most), and this represents a 20% loss, reducing a 50 MPG engine to 40 MPG overall performance. I suspect the generator is MUCH less than 90% efficient, typical industry numbers are more like 60-75% efficient (and I hope GM can better this through engineering).
I’d be happy with 35 MPG, which is much more than I get on my Subaru. Furthermore, car lifetime is an important factor in the price. I have over 144,000 miles on the Subaru, all the American cars I’ve ever owned were junkheaps at 70,000 miles. The Subaru has lasted twice as long as any of my American cars, and it certainly didn’t cost twice as much.
Given that I would only use the IC engine four or five times a year, IC MPG is not that big a factor for me.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:14 am)Lyle,
I have been following this web site for three years waiting for your first hand report on the Volt drive. Great review, thank you. CW
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:14 am)Thank you Lyle for an informative and well-balanced review.
My take from your review is that the Volt will have good performance (but not sport’s car performance), good handling and feel, and a quiet cabin. CS mode works well, however, there will be times when the ICE will rev and the occupants will hear it.
The big question still remains, what will be the mileage in CS mode?
Obviously you were on a closed circuit with many turns, and this consumes more energy than driving in a straight line. Also, did the gas tank contain gasoline or E85? These factors have an effect on the mpg.
Although GM may not feel that the mpg in CS mode is important, I and many others do. Especially those who have long commutes or frequently take long trips (like traveling sales people).
The other big factor I see is relative energy prices. Last summer I mentioned on this site that gasoline prices would not hold at $4 per gallon, and they didn’t. I can forsee a time when (at 50 mpg in CS mode) it would be less expensive to buy liquid fuel than use electricity. Let me explain.
If the world continues to reduce the use of petroleum, and we continue to develop alternate fuels like E85, the price of fuel could actually reduce let’s say $2 per gallon. At the same time, carbon taxes will increase the price for fossil generated power, and renewables will also increase the cost of power. The CEO of American Electric Power (Ohio Utility) states that wind power costs $0.18 per kWh.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20602099&sid=aqWp6x5uih8M
So with mandates for more renewables and the implementation of a carbon tax, our electric rates will increase. I looked at my recent electric bill, and the price worked out to 16 cents per kWh. It won’t take much to increase this to 20 to 25 cents.
If this is the rate I pay, with the Volt getting 5 miles per kWh, the Volt’s energy cost in EV mode becomes 4 or 5 cents per mile. This is equivalent to $2.00 to $2.50 for gasoline at 50 mpg.
Therefore, I can see a time in the future when many consumers will not bother to plug in, as it will be just as cheap to buy fuel at the pump. This will actually favor hybrids like the Prissy if the mpg in CS mode is not competitive.
So, to use one of GM’s own phrases, “May the Best Fuel Win”.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:17 am)i’VE Wondered about this also, it may be quite awhile till it sells in Ohio if we wait for Gen 2. I’ve been planning 2H 2012 purchase of the best EV/EREV technology available.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:26 am)Think your prices are way off. Many folks can get wind systems at home for .03kwh over life span. Folks can make any numbers they want especially for wind because the cost is mostly upfront with no fuel expense.
Generally wholesale electricity is:
Coal-electricity is $0.03 kWh
CNG is $0.03 kWh currently but that can change quickly.
Wind-electricity $0.05 kWh at MOST.(more like $0.03 kWh best case/best sites/newest tech).
First Solar has been able to install solar at $0.075 kWh (without subsidies).
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:26 am)I’d actually go the other route. Remove most of the buttons (some are not practical to remove) and replace them w/a 10″ touchscreen. This would allow unlimited buttons, on unlimited screens , all kinds of room for data display (trending..etc) , and even user configurable screens. The possibilites are endless and you are not tied to one setup.
I design controls systems and I notice when dealing w/older customers they want the buttons, while the younger customers want everything to be on the touchscreen.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:31 am)Great job Lyle! I want one of those Volt tee-shirts. Where can I get one?
Also, I like the PRNDL shift pattern. Reminiscent of the old 2-speed Powerglide Chevys I grew up with.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:35 am)I recently went to a technical presentation on the Leaf and (knowing about wind resistance) asked a question about range vs speed. It appears that these range claims are made in a primarily city mode. Hence I expect far lower range in battery mode. About once a week I drive 40 miles at 60-70 MPH with the AC on. I would not be surprised if hafway there and all the way home I would be on the ICE. Several times a year I drive 250-500 miles somewhere, and would expect to be on the ICE all the time. That’s not an issue for me as long as the design plans for that kind of use.
Steve
+11
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:36 am)Don’t forget that Lyle was essentially bombing around a parking lot. That’s very bad for fuel efficiency. Drive a Prius in the same conditions and you would not see 50 mpg. Far from it. I expect that 32-36 mpg is actually a bit lower than what you would achieve driving around in the city, which may be why Farah was trying to deflect the issue as best as possible. It’s certainly not a true number in the sense of standardized city/hwy ratings that people see and use as a basis for comparison.
Certainly not ideal conditions for a mpg test, so I would take those numbers with a few grains of salt. We will still have to wait and see.
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:37 am)I think I speak for all of us when I say, “Kyle you lucky bastard!” But hey, you earned it!
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:39 am)Wow, I just can’t wait till I can get my hand on one of these! Congratulations!!
+9
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:41 am)Perfectly captivating experience Dr. Lyle! An outstanding example of the editorial differences between your deepest levels of commitment to our new philosophy of clean electric motoring, and, highly externalized (not by thier own choice) journalists who have far far too many other duties that prevent their deeper intellectual commitment to any other new philosophical change in progress.
Now a thousand miles per gallon, that’s more like it to describe the likelihood for the immediate disuse of gasoline for most drivers!!
And, eliminating all dispensable mass, like electric seat motors, switches, and drive assemblies, and on and on (carbon also/had to get that in here), is, for many, a “luxury” for not wanting to be concerned about optional equipment and (carbon) costs.
The new GM processes is producing a masterpiece of technological artwork which is nearly finished! And, Lyle, it’s breathtaking as editied with your high definition scholarship.
******************************
* THANK YOU LYLE!! *
******************************
AND
***************************
* THANK YOU GM!! *
***************************
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:42 am)Great job, Lyle! I’m SOOOOOO jealous! I hope GM gets it right and goes into full production. My only concern with the car is the start-stop mode of the ICE. Most gas engines run most efficiently when at an elevated temperature. If in traffic in Green Bay Wisconsin, will the ICE constantly start full rich, lowering mileage? Will the onboard computer determine operating conditions to maximize efficiency?
What a great concept GM has and I really look forward to plugging mine in!!
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:45 am)Terrific report, Lyle! I’ve read them all since Sunday & yours is the best ….the most comprehensive, balanced and optimistic of them all (yet critical and objective —e.g., “the (center display) buttons were a little unreliable”). I really felt like I was in the driver’s seat!
Your comment, “….refinements this car was still lacking had to do with acceleration…..” leaves me hopeful that at least “passing-gear-like acceleration” when crossing the center line of a 2-lane highway to pass another vehicle from 40-80 mph will be incorporated for safety reasons. I’m sure Volt owners would also be delighted if 0-30 & 0-60 acceleration times could be enhanced by flooring the pedal to engage a “down-shifting-like” effect as a part of the “acceleration refinement” effort.
These enhancements would make Bob Lutz’ public remark that the Volt would “have a transmission unlike any other” a reality & should be a major talking point as a technical breakthrough by future Volt reviewers.
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:46 am)Lyle,
Thanks for all your work on this site and congratulations on your test drive and all that it means.
/question, … is the “sport mode” available in CS mode, or is that a CD mode only function?
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:51 am)for those of you who keep harping on the Volt’s projected initial price of $40,000, The US government is going to pay $7500 of that.
So, the initial cost will be around $32,000. A Prius can run you that much. And the Volt will use NO gas at all for its first 40 miles – something the Prius will never achieve.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:52 am)agreed. Great Job Lyle.
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:56 am)The BIG fuss about the noise level of the ICE is quite humorous.
A different breed of car enthusiasts pay extra to increase the noise level of their ICEs. I do understand the concern of a sudden increase in the noise level that might startle the driver. GM could limit this phenomenon with a gradual increase in the throttle.
-7
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:58 am)From the article: “He (Farah) instead explained to me about how when he used it for a weekend, driving a total of 200 miles and charging the car every time he came back home with it at 240V, he used a total of .2 gallons of gas for an overall efficiency of 1000 MPG.”
Sweet. I can drive from Chicago to Boston on a gallon of gas.
In other words, the charge-sustaining MPG DOES matter and GM should tell us what it is. 1000 MPG is bogus. Farah knows it, too.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:00 am)Good job Lyle…..
May your next drive in the Volt be in some real world conditions .
Then we can see the true results
My 2010 Fusion Hybrid…. 11,000 KMS… It is now cold here in Central Alberta Canada….. still averaging around 5.8 – 6.1 L/100 KMS ( around 40 MPG US) combined city/highway.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:02 am)I guess you never owned a Ford. 3 Tauruses over 170,000, Windstar 190.000 with very low maintenance. Not bad for those “junky” American Cars, huh?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:04 am)I’m thinking the Cruze may be the way to go. Low cost + good mpg.
I am dissapointed in the volt’s mpg in ice mode.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:04 am)Being driven by an electric motor will negate any need for a “passing gear”. Electric motors have relatively constant torque, so even during a passing maneuver, most or all of the torque will be available with no need to shift gears.
Electric vehicles are notorious for thier excellent passing power. Have no fear.
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:05 am)Let me add an amen to what many others have said, well done! It was not your fault GM elected not to allow an independent evaluation of Volt performance. So the question we must ask ourselves is will Toyota be more forthcoming when the Plug-in Prius hits the fleet market next month.
+9
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:07 am)With the federal tax credits, you’ll be able to get the Volt for around $32,500. I’ve read that in some states like Texas, you might be able to buy a 2011 Volt for in the $25-30K range.
I bet there will be other perks you’ll get with the Volt too. Things like free parking in big cities, HOV lane access, free charging in some places, lower or no vehicle taxes, etc. That stuff adds up you know. Money saved, time saved, less stress dealing with traffic. That’s huge in places like Los Angeles and other big cities.
Think about all the money you are saving on gasoline. If you drive a full 40 miles per day, it will only put 80 cents on your electric bill. Around $24 a month. $24 to go 1,200 miles in a month is pretty darned cheap. Some people spend $24 in a WEEK on expensive coffee.
If you have a 24 mpg car right now with gasoline in 2011 at $3.50/gal, going 40 miles per day for 30 days will cost you about $175 per month. Imagine the money you save if the world economy starts booming in 2011 and gasoline goes well over $4 again.
The Volt is going to be a POWERFUL weapon to throw at the fat cat Middle East oil sheiks and petrodictators who want to get rich by gouging people at the gas pump like they did in 2008. It’ll be a very satisfying feeling for 40 mile per day commuters to buy their Volt if gas prices go sky high again. You know they will too.
The world economy IS going to recover again. China and India are going to be wanting more and more gasoline as their economies continue to grow. Lots of new middle class people around the world will be getting their first cars. That means gas prices will inevitably go UP, UP, UP.
Buy yourself a Volt, and gasoline prices will be something you no longer think much about at all. If gas goes over $5/gallon, you’ll probably be encouraging people you know to get a Volt so that your grocery prices will go down more. Gasoline and diesel affects the prices of just about everything. Products have to travel in 5 mpg trucks to get to the stores you know.
+6
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:08 am)______________________________________________________
Lyle said:
“…I drove for the first time the fully production-intent car that emerged from the back of Jon Lauckner’s and Bob Lutz’ proverbial napkin in 2006…”
———–
I give Lutz & Lauckner credit for hatching the Voltec Project but Lyle’s super human efforts behind GM-Volt.com significantly contributed towards the Voltec Project not ending up in the GM Projects Graveyard. That is an important contribution Lyle has made especially when considering the wider impact of the Voltec Project in terms of how it has forced the hands of the other large automakers to step up the efforts of their respective EV Projects.
I also give the talented and dedicated Voltec Development Team huge credit for keeping up with a very aggressive development schedule that most industry analysts/experts (including you Statik?) had predicted could not be accomplished…way to go Voltec Development Team!!!
GM GUI Display Team,
Based on the display GUI photo in Lyle’s review, make sure to kick up the GUI a couple of notches (but keep it simple and elegant). Do consider developing the GUI interface to be open to allow 3rd parties to offer custom skins…there is a lot of free hobbyist talent out there that would gladly come up w/ better looking GUI options than you (or any other automaker) will.
Excellent honest review Lyle!…thanks.
The Volt will be a mega home run for GM!
I wish I could go out and buy one today.
______________________________________________________
+6
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:12 am)It’s not bogus, it just depends on how often you are able to recharge. The more often you can plug in, the higher the effective mpg number will be. It’s just math, the problem is that the the final result is heavily dependant on the particular circumstances of each car/owner. Farah knows this better than anyone, which makes the discussion of mpg difficult, especially to those who latch onto one inadequate measure of performance and base all thier decisions and opinions on it.
The reality of an EREV is more complex than just mpg.
+12
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:15 am)Lyle, I’ve always believed that the hit film “Who Killed the Electric Car?” actually raised public awareness about EVs and helped GM decide to pursue the Volt concept. I also firmly believe, Lyle, that you and gm-volt.com have greatly increased public awareness in the Volt’s EREV architecture and its important advantages over ordinary EVs.
As I’m sure you know, “Who Killed….” director Chris Paine has a sequel-in-progress tentatively called “The Revenge of the Electric Car”. I’ll be contacting Chris (and Chelsea Sexton, who was featured in the original film) to encourage them both to interview you, Lyle, for a segment on the Volt as well as on gm-volt.com and the site’s 50,000+ want list. [For anyone here who wants to do the same, both Chris & Chelsea can be reached thru Facebook.]
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:16 am)Questions. Does the second row of seats fold down? Do we have cargo space measurements? I know these may sound dumb, but now that we are close to reality I find my mind switching to “buyer evaluation mode.” Will this particular configuration work for me, or will I be happier waiting for a different E-REV model? Which of course brings up the next question. When will another E-REV model be officially announced?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:18 am)The better example is “Hummer Bad” and “Range Rover Good”.
+6
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:18 am)He is never going to get good CS Mode mileage under those conditions of stop and go slow twisting driving.. when you change direction 180 degrees in one of these courses you have to shed 100% of your kinetic energy, and then build it back up fully. To that add the 3 passengers and all that extra weight. The ICE genset stops every time the car stops and has to start again, never reaching a low fuel consumption steady state condition.
It was very good news that he got that mileage, under proper conditions I think the CS Mode mileage will be INCREDIBLE.
I say it again, time to start the 60/60 Club.. for those discerning Volt owners that can achieve 60 miles in CD Mode and 60mpg in CS Mode.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:23 am)Great report Lyle. I am sure it was a very exciting day for you as it was for those of us who follow your passion for this new technology.
A few side notes:
The photo showing the profile view makes the Volt look much more muscular and aggressive than it has in the past.
Also, I saw the charge cord storage in the trunk. Has anyone said if Volt will have one or two charge cords? One that stays in the garage and one in the trunk for charging while away from home.
I am a bit disappointed at all the people who are expecting this first version of VOLT to be the be-all, end-all solution to the world’s problems and the perfect car. Come on folks, this is just the BEGINNING of this technology! Go back and look at your first digital watch, calculator, computer, refridgerator, TV, Apollo Space Craft, and on and on. Somebody has to build the FIRST ONE! It looks like GM has done a remarkable job with this first generation and they readily admit there’s much more improvement to come.
I for one and delighted with the progress and very proud that our own GM is now the world leader in electrification of the automobile!
Lyle, get some sleep, man.
-15
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:24 am)(click to show comment)
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:25 am)The back of the rear seats are carpeted and have cargo tie down hooks.. so most likely they can fold. The center console in the rear will intrude on the cargo space.
You could probably work out the rear cargo space dimension from the many published pictures on the net.. it looks pretty spacious for a compact car.
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:29 am)Way to gooo
, congrats Lyle 
so looks actual MPG in CS mode is between 32 -42 mpg
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:30 am)Are you suggesting that GM makes decisions on what cars to build or not build based upon someone’s website on the internet?
If so, that is an interesting and somewhat fabulous claim, if it can be supported with fact — and I would certainly be interested in learning the facts.
As for the Volt itself, I wish it, and GM the very best: this type of technology is long overdue in coming.
Respectfully,
Dr. Ibringdoh
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:30 am)You could drive to the local gas station, buy a slurpee (diet) and chat with the people buying gas.. mention that you are worried about the gas in your gas tank since the last time you bought some was 14 MONTHS AGO.. dont giggle or you will ruin the intended effect.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:32 am)At this point we have a lot of test drives and they all agree that the Volt is moving along nicely. Slightly different opinions on one issue or another but agreement on all the basic points such as handling, acceleration, ride, and so forth.
The only real difference is that the journalists who had the drives last week mentioned that the engine revving to very high RPMs at seemingly random times proved disconcerting. The drivers this week didn’t experience this phenomenon at all — the RPMs seemed to follow the throttle. Not sure why this is the case. It could be that GM tweaked the cars or that the car used this week was different than the car used last week, with a different level of refinement. It could be that Milford was more challenging and presented more opportunity for the disconnect between the engine revving and the immediate driving situation. Or it could be that different people experience the same basic event differently. My guess would be that it’s the second — a flat course doesn’t require the battery to drop any significant amount below the depletion point so you won’t find the engine suddenly revving to recharge the battery back up to the depletion point.
Obviously there are many things to do, but GM seems on its way to starting production either at the end of next year or, at worst, Q1 of 2011. That has to be great news.
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:34 am)Lots of fingerprints if they go with a touch screen.. you could wear one glove and look like Michael Jackson.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:35 am)This isn’t going to happen, period. – It’s a car – With potential HUGE liability concerns/costs if something goes wrong in the control systems.. GM might release “additional skins/GUIs” (at an additional cost, Im sure) – but they are NOT going to open it up – NEVER going to happen in a car..
Same thing for folks that want to do firmware updates over Onstar – Not going to happen, ever – it’s going to need a trip to the dealer, just like today – Heck, Linksys and the OpenWRT folks don’t recommend flashing routers over wireless (which is what Onstar is) – They want a hardwire..
So for folks that want an open API, or OSS GUI, etc – That’s not really likely to happen – They are heads down on basic control issues (engine reving), and not going to burn the cycles “opening” the SW, and creating lots of liability issues for themselves – I can’t think of ANY car manufacturer that has opened SW, skinable interface in a car. Heck the Japanese don’t even open up the ODBII diagonistic codes (other than what the US gov’t requires) and most charge your $$$ for a map update for a factory installed GPS. – All in an effort to generate more trips and revenue to the dealer…
Now folks may start reverse engineering stuff, and I doubt GM has had enough time to think about encrypting FW (like locking down an XBOX) – So if may be more “hackable”, but you playing with a $40K car, and not a $100 router/ $250 XBOX, so “voiding” your warranty is something I would think most folks would reconsider…
If you think the current status quo is going to change ala access to SW, dealer updates, even open APIs, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I could sell you…
All IMHO…
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:35 am)This is fantastic. Could you describe the lumbar support of the seat. My back can not handle any lumbar so a straight back is best for me. The fact that it is a manual seat is even better if I have to replace it with a custom seat. Thank you so much.
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:37 am)I would like to see a performance model that uses the gas generator full time to maintain full charge of the battery for short duration high performance bursts of acceleration and speed. Range on battery would not be an issue on such a car, but hyper performance in short bursts should be possible. Call it a Z-23, and use the turbo 3 cyclinder engine GM first specified.
+7
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:39 am)Yes, rear seats fold down for storage.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:40 am)I agree, I am impressed the Volt was able to maintain such a high mpg figure under those conditions. Fuel efficiency at an autocross event, which is similar in setup to the conditions Lyle drove in, is typically pretty dismal, even for compact 4 cyl. cars that normally achieve pretty decent mpg. Like I said, even a Prius would have a hard time posting decent mpg figures under those conditions. It’s too bad there wasn’t a decent benchmark there to compare to, which might give us a decent idea of how the mpg figures would stack up. Alas, the waiting game continues.
Make my slurpee non-diet. As bad as high fructose corn syrop is, aspartame is pretty bad for you too. If it’s going to kill you anyway, you might as well enjoy it.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:41 am)To #49 BillR:
On last night’s panel discussion in Los Angeles that was streamed live here at Chevy-Volt.com, the president of the California utility commission indicated that with the advent of the smart electric grid and smart meetering (already being installed in millions of California houses), that target pricing could be done for those recharging their cars at night at home. He even mentioned the price at 6 cents per Killowatt hour as being reasonable – even in California. It would be do-able since the charging would be during off-peak usage and it would be priced as an incentive by the state to get more people to use EV and E-Rev cars.
Other states and utilities could use this same technology and “carrot” to promote more usage of electric vehicles.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:47 am)Agreed.
$0.18/kWh is a price from the early 1980′s. Over the last 20 years, utility-scale windpower costs have come down 80%:
http://www.awea.org/faq/wwt_costs.html
Cost is affected by size of turbines, size of windfarm, average wind speed at the site, and the cost of installing (e.g. on mountains is more expensive than on plains). State-of-the-art wind power plants can generate electricity for less than 5 cents/kWh.
The National Renewable Energy Laboratory (NREL) is working with the wind industry to develop a next generation of wind turbine technology. The products from this program are expected to generate electricity at prices that will be lower still.
This is why a “carbon tax” might actually lower electricity prices in the decades ahead – grabbing $0.01/kWh from oil and natural gas power plants, and investing that money in improved wind turbines, will bring down the cost of windpower just as oil and natural gas prices, controlled by other countries, shoot up in cost. And windpower is close in cost to coal – $0.01/kWh “carbon tax” on that centuries old technology would likewise vastly speed up wind and solar R&D and economies of scale.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:48 am)Congrats Lyle! It was a long time coming. Next up, production model test drive. For now, I have a couple of questions from this drive:
-Were you driving in D or L mode or try both? If L ( I think L is the higher lift-off regen mode), where you able to drive with one pedal?
-Did you have to hit the brake pedal a lot while completing the .4 mile course? Does the brake pedal only engadge the friction brakes or does it combine additional regen with friction?
-Was there any opportunity to cruise at speed on the course or was it pretty much just accellerate, brake, accellerate, brake?
-Was the AC running during your test?
-You mention the genset turning on and off in CS mode. Approximately how long did these cycles last.
-The pictures on Autoblogs site make the rear legroom look pretty limited. Was it adequate with the front seats in a position for good sized adults? Also, you mentioned the head room was good but is that accurate for the rear seats too?
-There is a gap between the rear seats in the photos. Is this production intent? When you fold down the rear seats for more cargo space, is the rear center console exposed or covered?
-Will it always start in the last mode driven (normal vs sport and D vs L) or does it reset each time?
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:49 am)Nope. As discussed in a couple other posts, the conditions of the test drive were very unfavorable to fuel efficiency. We still have no idea what the official figures, or “real world” mpg will be like.
Patience.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:01 am)Incorrect. Physics does not tell us that you’ll lose all of your kinetic energy in a 180 degree turn.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy
/Lyle’s driven plenty of other cars for mpg (i.e. see all cars electric for hybrid reviews), I think he well understands driving technique and it’s results on mpg. I doubt that Lyle’s going to go out out there and “hammer” the volt around the track and report back a terrible mpg (he is the Volt’s #1 fan, by the way).
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:02 am)Thanks Lyle,
I could not help grinning while I read and as I picture you driving the grin turns to a smile.
One year of finish touch and GM has a winner!
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:05 am)Congratulations on the thrilling test drive! No one deserves it more.
Inside of a year to the birthing of your baby. The test drive was a little like seeing the first sonogram.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:06 am)You took the words right out of my mouth! I couldn’t have said it better.
The Volt estimated starting price of $40,000 may be lower; we just don’t know yet what GM will finally price GEN ! at. The current tax relief is $7,500 and there has been talk about it being raised to $10,000. And then there will be assistance by states like Colorado where they are giving a $6,000 rebate. If the states do subsidize the Volt or other EV/hydrid, then the Volt will be the better buy by far. We don’t need to be reminded what is happening in the world with Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, North Korea, or the high jacking of tanker and ships off of Africa. Even without these conflicts, the demand for petroleum by China and India will definitely hit us in two to five years. Its all relative to whats happening. At least, we will have the opportunity to buy an EV hopefully before this happens. Anyone that thinks this will be a niche car is myopic.
GM had the right idea and has delivered the best technology for today. Watch as the Volt evolves into a full BEV over the years.
GM doesn’t have to expend huge sums of money on research and development from now on; small incremental expenditures will enhance the Voltec technology, and GM will recover its huge initial expense for the developing the Volt as it broadens the use of Voltec technology to other models.
Dr. Lyle , how exciting it must be for you to be in the middle of this technological development. I wish that I were in your shoes experiencing it all first hand. But GM-Volt.com has been an inspiration for me and I thank you for making it possible for me to be this closely connected to it all.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:06 am)Perhaps one of our GM-Voltites that lives in the area can go
Very well said and Lyle should get some sleep immediately after answering my previous questions (just joking).
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:07 am)Nice write up!
I’m happy to hear the head room is good.
That could be important to a Neurosurgeon…
Waiting for Volt 2.0
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:09 am)bingo,
Tough to tell much from the PM video, but from what I see, there’s not a lot of turning on the course, and it’s definitely flat.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:11 am)If gasoline dropped to the point where gasoilne was stable at $2 a gallon, we would also see a lot of gas stations going out of business. Which would mean gas would be a lot less convenient than it currently is.
Also, from an environmental perspective, from a national security perspective, and from an economic perspective, electricity is by far the superior fuel. That means that if gas ever became cheap enough that people stopped plugging in and started using the ICE all the time, the government would intervene and tax gas so that it reflects its real cost to society.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:14 am)Fingerprints (if any) only show up when the screen is off. Anybody that has an Iphone/Itouch/or touchscreen smartphone can attest to this. Regardless, the center console already is a touchscreen, but only a small (5″?) one.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:14 am)And yet he reports approximate 0-60 times in both regular and “sport” mode. That says to me there was at least 2 full drag starts (or at least as close as Farah would allow) with 4 people in the car. That would wreak havok on mpg. While I agree that Lyle has a great deal of experience with getting the most out of hybrid and electric cars, it doesn’t sound like he was pussy-fotting it around the track.
While you’re comment about physics is well taken, even a light footed Lyle, who wasn’t attempting to test all performance aspects of the Volt for our benefit and amusement, would have a hard time posting decent mpg numbers in such a tight area. It’s not a environment that is condusive to attempting to estimate realistic fuel efficiency.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:15 am)Are there any pictures of the back seat? I can’t find any on the internet and it is unclear what they look. Are they buckets, split, bench, etc.? Thanks.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:19 am)I think it does a disservice to the Volt to say it gets 1000 mpg.
While not an outright lie, its totally misleading.
You need to show how many miles per KWH it gets on battery and combine that with the gas (converted from MPG to KWH) to show how efficient it is. people who are interested in this kind of technology are not retards and you can simply convert a TDI jetta or Prius to KWH for comparison.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:23 am)Watch the video on Edmunds. There’s quite a bit of turning/swerving around cones.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:25 am)Gas stations do not make much, if any, $ on the gas. They are basically like a movie theater and make their $ on concessions.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:26 am)Thanks for your review Lyle.
As usual you have a nicely balanced view of things. It’s a nice drivable car that is about 90% ready for prime time with time to ‘tune’ the last 10%.
32 mpg looping in a parking lot isn’t bad at all, I don’t imagine a “P” car or any other would do any better in that situation.
Those capacitive buttons are an interesting issue, I wonder if they will work with thick gloves on? (-10c here this morning)
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:26 am)“The drive was about what we’d expected, a short spin on a roughly circular and fairly flat course marked off with orange safety cones. Not much opportunity to stand on it, and not enough time to really get a feel for things.”
http://blogs.edmunds.com/greencaradvisor/2009/11/2011-chevrolet-volt-test-drive-informative-but-far-too-short.html
“There was not enough room to test 0 to 60 which GM reports is less than 9 seconds.”
http://gm-volt.com/2009/11/30/edmunds-volt-test-drive-published-and-live-volt-webcast-to-schools-accross-the-us-today/
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:26 am)They’re bucket seats with a wide arm rest in between — complete with cup holder. Similar to business class seats in an airplane but the seats are much nicer.
Following up on Lyle’s answer that the back seats fold down, the cargo area is really large. It doesn’t show up so much in the pictures but the back is squared off and high, so there is much more vertical room that if you had a trunk. It is big back there.
-4
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:28 am)The leaf is expected to enter the market at $23,000+ the battery lease. The battery lease will be less than the cost of buying gas for 1 year, as they explain. They also explain that the reason for the lease is just in case there are issues with the battery they can just replace it without problem. Also, so that as new technology comes along the owner will not be stuck with old ones.
As I was saying, for GM to make this car work, it MUST get the price down to the mid to low $20,000! This is where it will make a difference. IT WILL MAKE NO DIFFERENCE with a price of $43,000. Whether, limited production or not the only thing it WILL do is help push technology along. If GM wants to help itself get back into the market they need to release a good quality hybrid that will be in direct competition with the Insight and the Prius. Both of these cars get great mileage and have a price tag of $20,000 to $26,000 and not $43,000. With all the tax credits in the world it’s still going to be much higher than its competition. If they want to kick it big time, they need to produce a hybrid that will retail for about $17,000 that will carry 4 passengers comfortably, have a few nice extras and get MPG of 40 or better.
It’s no different than GM (or any of them) building trucks and SUVs that sell for over $45,000. I really don’t care that they a few of them get near 20MPG, this is not the point. The point is that most of those people DO NOT CARE about fuel prices because they have no problem dropping $100+ per fill it up.
Leo,
I know where you’re coming from and I understand but the Prius Gen1 Prius did not have price tag of $43,000. I can buy a Prius for about $23,000 as a base unit and an Insight for $21,000. Yes, they do burn fuel as well, same as the Volt (though a lot less). I’m a person that buys a vehicle new then I drive it for 200,000 miles. My Subaru Legacy went 260,000, Subaru Outback went 205,000, my 99′ Nissan Frontier went 245,000 and my 05′ Nissan Frontier just turned 100,000 (I no longer have to drive 75,000 mile per year!). I just don’t buy a vehicle because it is cool or the “in” thing. My truck is my mobile office and I can’t get around that.
The person that mentioned the Cruze, I hope that they offer it in a hybrid or Volt style electric for $20,000. The problem is the, soon to be, production 1.4 turbo is going to sell for $20,000+ making the hybrid/electric version (if they decide to release it at all) $25,000 to $30,000. This is a problem because GM has not done great with cars at this price point. Toyota and Honda kick their asses. BTW, I’m not a fan of Toyota or Honda. I do love my Frontier and a note on that, my Frontier is more American than any of the Chevy trucks that compare. The Chevy’s are mostly Mexico and Canada. My Frontier is US and Japan, engine and transmission Japan the rest USA.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:28 am)My last commuter car, 1990 Chevy Beretta had 260,000 miles and very little maintenance before I sold it. Current car, a 2003 Pontiac Grand Am is at 158,000 now with NO repairs. Looks and drives like new.
These old stereotypes of American cars are laughable these days. It’s doing this country an injustice to continue to use them as somehow relevant to the GM and Ford products of 2009.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:30 am)______________________________________________________
# 86 GuyMan Said:
“…This isn’t going to happen, period. – It’s a car – With potential HUGE liability concerns/costs if something goes wrong in the control systems.. GM might release “additional skins/GUIs” (at an additional cost, Im sure) – but they are NOT going to open it up – NEVER going to happen in a car… If you think the current status quo is going to change ala access to SW, dealer updates, even open APIs, then I have a bridge in Brooklyn that I could sell you…”
———
GuyMan,
I respectfully disagree w/ your comment. My understanding is that the Tesla Model S will have an open architecture GUI interface (that is being jointly developed by Tesla & Google…utilizing the Android OS) that will allow 3rd parties to develop custom GUI skins. I was told by a reliable source of mine at Tesla that Google/Tesla has a running and that a Tesla S owner will be able to remotely interface/communicate with their car vis-à-vis their personal online Google account dashboard…a very far reaching re-think of how to approach the car GUI.
Related Link:
http://androidandme.com/2009/04/news/android-races-to-tesla-motors/
Keep in mind that any open GUI extensions made (vis-à-vis hooks/apis) can be tightly regulated/limited in terms of how deep those extensions impact the car’s core software control.
It’s a new world out there on the horizon.
______________________________________________________
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:31 am)#93 Koz Says:
-There is a gap between the rear seats in the photos. Is this production intent? When you fold down the rear seats for more cargo space, is the rear center console exposed or covered?
-Will it always start in the last mode driven (normal vs sport and D vs L) or does it reset each time?
————
The gap is production intent. That’s where the T-shaped battery is located.
Regarding D & L, the car will start in the mode you put it in. Where ever you move the shifter from the “P” park position. Regarding the Sport or Eco mode. I’d assume it would remember the last setting.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:31 am)Who would have expected a positive review from Lyle? Shocking!
All sarcasm aside, congrats on your test drive.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:32 am)Dagwood knows this too. He’s a Toyota guy. They have to grasp any straw they can when it comes to the Volt. It’s amusing…
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:33 am)I just discovered an excellent 2:45 video of an Edmunds.com test drive of the Volt on the Dodger stadium track in which you can clearly hear the genset stop running after the driver comes to a stop at about 1:45…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndnAvEWyyoI
-18
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:35 am)(click to show comment)
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:36 am)Well, you might think that. Then, you might think that with GM’s space shuttle of a 2 mode hybrid setup would push technology to the masses, but how many years has the two-mode been out and how many hybrids does GM sell now?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:38 am)lol….
Waaaayyyy off topic
OK, I first opened this thread and saw Lyle standing next to the Volt. The first thing I thought of, we need to get the good doctor a nurse to stand by his side…….lol
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:39 am)-3
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:40 am)32-36 MPG in generator mode and 3500 pounds weight is the only real news here. Not very good news I must add.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:41 am)#1
100 comments already when I started up my computer at 7:50 AM PST. Not too bad. If GM isn’t paying attention, they sure as h**l should be. Even so, I have to think that #1 said it all!
That’s one advantage of living on the left coast. By the time I get on the blog in the AM it’s pretty much all been said by you guys. All I have to do is go down the list, put in a few +1s and type in a few amens, and my work is done, LOL.
You go Dr. Dennis!!
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:43 am)Right on, Nuclearboy. Although I will admit that a capacitive button seems a lot more high tech and cool, if the kinks aren’t worked out it could be a big disappointment with people.
I would hate to see the Volt ridiculed because people can’t get the buttons on the radio/center console display to respond just like my LG Chocolate behaves now.
-1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:43 am)With all the additional information which is coming out it’s becoming increasingly clear that the overall combined rating in CS Mode is going to be around 38 MPG. That’s better than a conventional car of this size and weight but I’m not sure I’d say this was incredible. My guess is that the only way anyone is going to get 60 MPG in CS Mode is to be tucked behind a semi going downhill at 60 mph with a tailwind.
On the other hand, Farah’s point about the overall mileage being based on opportunity recharging is not only well taken, it’s the right way to look at it. It matters not what the MPG is CS mode is if you never drive in CS mode. I suspect that in practice people will be very good at finding ways to recharge and that the actual real life MPG number for the Volt will be well north of 230 MPG.
IOW I don’t see the point of worrying about CS Mode — or having a contest based on it — when all the real importance is in EV Mode. So I’m liking your idea of the 60 miles in CD Mode but not so much the idea of 60 MPG in CS Mode.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:44 am)Yikes!! I don’t even know where to start with this…. I think I’ll just pat you on the back and say “Thank you, …. now move along…”
That’s right folks….
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:44 am)That explains a few things, especially considering that it’s been a bit tough for Toyota fans recently. I don’t know for sure, but I’m betting that the Volt will come with properly designed gas pedals and floormats too.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:45 am)-I’ll charge at work and on the road at times and get 25,000 miles a year of AER. So it is possible to displace a lot more than 300 gallons a year and over 10 years of owing the car gas won’t average anything close to as low as $3 (the inflation that is coming alone will make foreign oil way more expensive then we can afford).
- Don’t think it is fair to compare the Volt to the Prius, the Volt ‘seems’ much nicer. Would like to see some specs like cargo area etc.
- Yes the volt is a huge step forward, but to get us to the next step (GEN2) as fast as possible we do need the $7500 credit to be CASH at purchase and it wouldn’t hurt to make it a nice round $8000.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:46 am)As a neurologist, he’s secretly developed a youth tonic. This, after he’s already managed to clone 5 copies of himself. Too incredible to be true? Then explain to me how he DO everything he DOES??!? There must be 100+ hours in a “Lyle Day!”
Seriously though, CONGRATULATIONS LYLE! You’re awesome, Doctor!! Glad to see you finally reap some of the fruits of your labor.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:47 am)I mean the gap between the seat backs that is open to the trunk area. When you fold the seats down, the rear console will be exposed between the seat backs. This makes the storage area less practical to use, albeit not by much, but still I think they should fill the gap between the seat backs to better separate the storage area from the rear seats and protect the console when the seats backs are folded down.
Good point about D & L. I forgot they have a shift lever for this.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:47 am)#104
Actually it struck me that he looks a lot like Dale Earnhardt, Jr. in the photo.
124 comments by the time I read the first 100 and sent in my little one. Looking good boys and girls. Keep up the good work.
-10
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:48 am)(click to show comment)
-12
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:48 am)(click to show comment)
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:50 am)#107
Kinda like the Jay Leno Electric Car Challenge. I wonder if any figures jumped out in your way. George Bush? Bob Lutz? Rick Waggoner?
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:51 am)Boy, that is quite funny. Was it designed and engineered in USA as well? Do profits go to a USA company? I would have to take issue with the source of all the other components on the Frontier. That is fine if you buy foreign, but don’t try to pass it off as American. How much does the Frontier affect the US economy versus a Chevy truck? Lets see the proof that the Frontier has a bigger impact. I had somebody tell me once that Toyota was an American car, because it was assembled in the USA. It is amazing how simple-minded some people are.
+8
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:51 am)Sweet! More of ‘em for the rest of us
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:53 am)Great find! Yes you can hear the generator “buzz”. Doesn’t seem like a big deal to me even at this point.
Then again, all this attention being paid to the CS Mode seems weird to me. You want the Volt for its EV Mode and presumably the CS Mode is just for peace of mind. It’s like buying an iPhone and spending a lot of time fussing about its camera.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:53 am)Chelsea Sexton, star on the hit film “Who Killed the Electric Car?” (and likely a star on its sequel, “Revenge of the Electric Car”) found what she calls “the best Volt test drive reaction (at Dodger stadium) so far: ‘just found a 2nd thing in life that gives me a woody!’“*
*Not Chelsea’s comment, but that of a male test driver
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:54 am)And another mpg observation/speculation:
On the display picture, assuming:
1. The blue display (upper right) is a fuel tank.
2. The tank holds 8 gallons.
3. The 196 miles is the range left on the tank.
4. The tank is 11/12 full.
5. The battery is empty.
Then the mpg would be 26.7.
+6
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:56 am)It’s not very hard to figure out that GM has requested not to record the CS mode experience at this time since no journalist was able to show a video of the experience. And contrary to Lyle, you sir are not a class act.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:59 am)You know, I have to agree. So many times we hear things like “feature X was left out to save mass” (eg. omission of power seats) or “we’re doing Y to help reduce cost.” Yet “normal” buttons would be less risk of being disliked, have a better known track record, and no doubt, would be much cheaper. I’m a little perplexed by ‘em.
However, if I’m stuck with ‘em, I sure wish the panel came in glossy, hard blackest black, like in those Ampera beauty shots we saw a while back. I’m not nuts about either the “bleah” gray -or- the white. Maybe they look better in person.
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:01 pm)Is there anything on the display screens that shows “Generator Output” that changes or moves in sync with the ICE revs? When the generator revs up, can we see that the output is increasing? Also, is there an indicator when brakes are applied showing a little juice being picked up from regenerative braking?
Inquiring minds want to know!
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:01 pm)There’s an excellent 2:45 video of an Edmunds.com test drive of the Volt on the Dodger stadium track in which you can clearly hear the genset stop running after the driver comes to a stop at about 1:45…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndnAvEWyyoI
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:04 pm)Congrats Lyle,
This is the best report on the Volt at this level of its development so far! We all know there wil still be some critics. But this car is, remains and will be one of the greates car for GM and for the auto industry. This is a new technology and most important, a new way to built cars. GM is showing its leadership on it and I remain convinced the 2nd generation will even be better!
Thanks Lyle for the report!
Go GM!
Go Volt!
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:06 pm)My GMC Yukon has 140,000 miles. It’s on it’s second set of brakes,
regular oil changes,3 pcv filters, 3 air filters. Everything else is original on this truck, and it all works. I do have have to shop for the 3rd set of tires.
The subaru’s are fine, i’m not crazy about rubber timing belts having to be changed every 50,00 miles though.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:22 pm)LOL. The T-shirt kinda destroys any perception of objectiveness.
But we already know that Lyle (and each of us) is a fan.
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:28 pm)Lyle wrote:
Sport mode delivered noticeably more intense acceleration below a 9 second 0 to 60. I was not permitted to time 0 to 30 or 0 to 60. It was not an outright sports car feel, but definitely sporty. Clearly it would outrun a Prius, Insight, or Fusion hybrid all of which I’ve driven.
and
I started out with about four miles of EV range and I watched intensely for the changeover to generator mode.
So, perhaps he left the Volt in “sport” mode the entire drive. Also, since he drove from Charge Depleting to Charge Sustaining mode, the ICE was just turning on – my Prius gives pretty poor MPG in the first 15 to 20 minutes of turning on, because a cold engine has terrible efficiency. It sounds like Lyle drove about 30 minutes in CS mode.
Yes, I hope the CS numbers next Fall are higher than 32 to 36 mpg, for a proper EPA test.
We shall see.
-7
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:28 pm)Goo and dribble.
Prices for “wind” power is a realistic at $0.18 cents per KWh. The gentleman didn’t even mention that the intermittent nature of wind generation induces wild oscillations in the Grid. To smooth that out, base load conventional generation that is at least 80% larger, must be on-line along with the wind plants, and those costs are NOT INCLUDED in the $0.18 /KWh figure.
Solar is at least 33% higher. First Solar just laid off half its staff, despite the fantastic Subidies that Ed Markey and Deval Patrick arranged to give them. Living in Arizona, we have had the Green wishful, demand the Utilities build solar power and two of the largest Solar plants in the World, are in Arizona.
The operating one, adds a relatively insignifcant few megawatts power at that cost to the grid, when it actually operates, which is infrequently. The other one, and even larger, is a paper exercise that has consumed an extraordinary amount of money to accomplish exactly ZERO. It has swallowed subsidies, magnificient subsidies, as the Plant has been redesigned several times, after “construction” began. Just this past month the builder has thrown in the towel and said the Plant can’t be built. Their technology is insufficient, at upwards of $0.50 per KWh!
That is what hapens when “feel-good” political considerations, by know-littles overide all economic and technical considerations. If you can’t build competitive or even wholly subsidized and still uncompetitive solar plants in the Arizona desert, you can’t build them anywhere. And they can’t.
Thank God, we have the world’s largest nuclear power complex. And lots of hydro-electric generation, the true “renewable”, else we wouldn’t be able to generate and sell lots of electrical power to Californians. Those golden children, Californians, who like the mythical Eloi, are “too good” to have to do gritty things like make power, for thier Lotus eaters.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:29 pm)>>For my task I found that I could set the display to show MPG. I reset it at the start of my drive. It read >500 MPG while in EV mode.
It appears that the computer display does not factor in the cost of electric to show a true mpg equivalent when in EV mode and total average mpg to date.
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:35 pm)Lucky you !!
here in Europe, we will have to wait sooooooo long before we can sit in this jewel like you did.
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:40 pm)Thank you, Lyle, and great job on the write-up. I’m close to 6’4″, so I was glad to hear about the spaciousness of the interior. Not sure how excited I would be about a manually-adjusted driver’s seat – I hope that a power seat is at least an option.
I’m really curious what the driving experience will be with only the driver in the car. If memory serves, every test drive so far has had at least one passenger, and often three.
As far as MPG goes, I went on record here that I felt all along that the Volt would get in the mid-30′s. That will be OK in my book, given the battery-only mode is the real draw of this car. It is sounding more and more likely that 40 miles of battery range will be the exception rather than the rule, as it was measured on a city course where speeds averaged less than 20 MPH. For me, I go about a mile from my house at 25 MPH, and then the speed limit goes up to 50 until we reach a little town, where it falls back to 40. Another mile or so is the freeway, where it is 60 MPH, and that takes us to the major shopping center about 12 miles away. I’m wondering just how many miles one will be able to go on battery power driving under those speeds.
-9
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:43 pm)Nice article. I don’t know how reliable this GM car will be considering the lousy reputation of GM. How long will the battery last? The price will be very expensive which will be beyond most consumers’ reach. Good luck.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:44 pm)It is obvious from what you say Dr. that you were not here when GM-Volt launched, nor were you paying attention when the Volt was introduced in Detroit in January 2007. It was simply a concept and comments by GM brass said as much. It wasn’t going to see the light of day until pressure built from this website and many of us who wrote letters directly to GM.
So yes, the ‘fabulous’ claim of this website helping direct GM’s decisions on what to build and sell can be quite comfortably laid here.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:47 pm)A few comments:
1) I agree with Lyle . . . yeah, it makes some noise when it burns gas. SO WHAT? Gas cars make noise. The noise just emphasizes how we need to keep working on EV technology until we can make AFFORDABLE pure EVs with long ranges . . . something that cannot be done now or in the near future.
2) I like the wind-up charging cord that is always with the car. However, the fact that it is under the trunk is a bit dis concerting. You’ll have to empty your trunk when you need to charge. That is annoying. Oh well, I suspect it will end up riding below the front passenger’s legs.
3) Design looks great.
4) Although all the features are cool. I wish they made a really stripped down model for people who really want an EV but need a lower price.
5) CS mode MPG is a bit disappointing but I always thought the original numbers were too optimistic. If they were really in the 50mph range, we would have been building series gas-electric cars (without big batteries) for years.
6) Looking forward to buying. No plug, no sale.
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:48 pm)Hi,
When the sound of the Internal Combustion Engine is highest, what does the Run Per Minute indicator display ?
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (12:55 pm)Unlike all those that ‘thumbs downed’ your comment, I think these voices need to be heard. Yes, the car is expensive. Sorry, GM is unable to break the laws of physics and economics. This is a first year model for enthusiastic supporters. People with little money will not buy and are not expected to buy it.
But in future models, the price will come down. With mass production of the EV components (motors, controllers, batteries, chargers, etc.), the price should come down.
However, I don’t think they will come down as much as we’d all like. But here is the bad news . . . gas prices will continue to go up. Oil is becoming harder and harder to find and demand continually increasing. In a few years, you will be begging for a $40K Volt because it will be much more economical than driving a gas car. So get used to it.
So go ahead and buy a hybrid. GM makes those too. But I promise, you’ll be back.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:06 pm)1. Not only longer ranges, but the ability and infrastructure to safely recharge within minutes. Until we solve that challenge, EREV is necessary for mass adoption.
2. I expect that many if not most people will opt for a hard wired 240V charger at home, and the wind up cord will only be used when charging somewhere other than at home. For many people, that will be next to never, in which case the cord will live happily in the trunk and out of the way. For those on the move constantly, who often charge away from home, it will likely live in the passenger footwell, like you say, or on the back seat, or on the floor in the back, or on the passenger seat, or in the trunk but not in it’s little cubby.
3. And it’s efficient too! Amen.
4. Not feasible in the relatively low numbers that Gen 1 will be produced. When Gen 2 and 3 ramp up for real mass production, I expect you will see more variation in trim levels. For now, the one size fits all helps keep the price down while attracting the largest possible audience.
5. See other posts regarding this issue. The test drive Lyle took was not conducive to high mpg numbers. I expect that the 32-36 mpg figure is artificially low compared to what the standard city/hwy test cycle would be in CS mode.
6. Amen again.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:10 pm)This is as expected. I keep talking about the built in inefficiencies of the extra mechanical-electrical-mechanical energy conversions but many tune out. It’s simple physics.
The more important thing is that, as Lyle says, it doesn’t matter. The Volt is for the 80 percent of us that don’t drive all day, everyday on the highway (if you do, get a diesel). The marketing should stress this point.
Way to go Lyle. It’s sounds like you had an experience that can only be had though long hours of hard work. Hats off to you and I can’t wait for the Volt to land on the world.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:17 pm)Lyle,
Can you comment on the charge that the Volt is not suitable for the hot, humid Southwest states?
Here’s a link to the story on Dailytech:
http://www.dailytech.com/Chevy+Volt+Cant+Handle+Hot+Southwest+but+Otherwise+is+Looking+Good/article16969.htm
I think there are many Texans and other Southwesterner’s here that would appreciate more clarification on this issue.
Thanks,
Ken
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:20 pm)1. Get with the program – GM/Ford 2009 builds some of the best cars/trucks available; period. Why does this appear so hard for some to deal with? Read some reviews, please.
2. The battery will last longer than you will likely need it to. Lab batteries are over 300,000 miles already. The degradation is not much apparently, certainly not worth the investment of a new battery anywhere south of 200,000 miles I would think. ICE engines need replaced too, at some point, don’t forget.
3. As far as price, look around you. How many cars on the road do you see that are in the 30-40K range, or higher? Let me answer- A LOT. There will be more than enough consumers for the Volt. Problem will likely be not enough Volts.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:24 pm)Actually the VOLT is the PERFECT car for you because you commute 45 miles each way. You will save more money on the volt then anyone. All you need to do is charge at work, then ride both ways gas free. And if there is a power failure, no range anxiety.
+10
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:25 pm)I agree! I’ve read and contributed to this site for well over 2 years. On numerous occasions GM people such as Frank Weber, Tony Posawatz & Andrew Farah have made comments and/or contributions here, as have others in GM Senior Management. In fact, even the fellow who designed the Volt’s final grill made a comment here that he had actually been the one who’d done the grill design (in response to a critical comment I’d made here about the grill design).
There’s absolutely no doubt in my mind, and I dare say in the minds of countless others who have also regularly followed gm-volt.com for 2 years or more, that this site has contributed more to the groundswell of public interest in EVs in general (& in EREVs in particular) than anything else in either the print or electronic media!
That’s why, as I said in comment #74 above, I’ve contacted both a star (Chelsea Sexton) & the Director (Chris Paine) of the sequel to the hit “Who Killed the Electric Car” now being filmed, called “Revenge of the Electric Car” to urge them to interview Lyle Dennis for a segment in this new film slated for release in 2010.
The Volt might never have gotten this far or gone on to full-scale production without Lyle Dennis. Believe it or not ….your choice!
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:30 pm)Maybe that cord is a spare, and you have one always in your garage?
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:33 pm)Jerry,
Allow me to point out the errors of your math: Once again you have overstated the cost of the VOLT – it is not $43,000 – it is likely closer to $33,000 or less. And your Nissan Leaf for $23,000 does not include the batteries! So you won’t get too far. You quote Nissan as saying they will lease you the batteries for about the cost of gas for a year – read ‘estimated $1,000 to $1,200 per year’. Remember that ‘lease’ indicates a perpetual cost for batteries – something Chevy is giving you with your initial purchase on a VOLT.
Now take your self-quoted ‘buy a vehicle and drive it 200,000 miles’ and realize that over 8 years you will spend between $8,000 and $9,600 leasing your batteries from Nissan. Now all of a sudden, your $23,000 Leaf has cost you $31,000 to $32,600 – virtually the same as a VOLT. And I’ll bet you’ll be stranded more than a few times in that Leaf as it runs out of charge and has to be towed. Besides, the VOLT is a much more substantial vehicle than the Leaf, and it should naturally cost more. They are not meant to be direct competitors, though many will compare them.
In the end, its your choice – buying a Nissan Leaf and leasing the battery from Nissan may make more sense for you. Competition is what makes the world go round. But be sure to know all your facts before you make the decision.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:33 pm)“The Volt will be available in all 50 states when it debuts, according to GM.” http://www.dailytech.com/Chevy+Volt+Cant+Handle+Hot+Southwest+but+Otherwise+is+Looking+Good/article16969.htm
This quote seems contrary to our being told its launching in only a few select markets.
Anyone care to comment on this one?
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:34 pm)Thanks for the link nasaman, If that “noise” is all that remains to be “ironed out”, GM is in great shape! That (to my ears) was a VERY modest level of engine sound. I wouldn’t even characterize it as noise.
JMO
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:38 pm)I agree in principle, however I would like to add the following:
A CVT isn’t a lossless device. I’m not sure what the efficiency of the Prius’ unit is, but in general transmission losses can be significant.
I maintain that the testing scenario was unideal for guaging anything resembling real world fuel efficiency. While I’m not expecting the Volt to best the Prius in CS mode, let’s not throw in the towel just yet. 32-36 mpg under the conditions Lyle tested the Volt is nothing to scoff at.
Let us also not forget that hybrids are more sensitive to driving style than normal cars. Push a Prius hard, like bombing around a parking lot, and it’s fuel efficiency will fall of considerably. It remains to be seen how sensitive the Volt will be to driving style while in CS mode.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:39 pm)But if no one bought gas, they would stop carrying it. Or take a loss when the gas went bad. Or at least reducing their capacity. They might start carrying ethanol. Or become a charging station.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:46 pm)I saw a Volt up close, sat in the front seat. The above is accurate. But I did not know for sure that the rear seats folded down. This will do nicely for me.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:47 pm)My guess would be that the couple hundred or so “early models” being rolled out mid next year, in accordance with one of the loans GM recieved for the Volt, will be to select areas. The full launch may then be to teh entire US market.
Another interpretation would be that the entire US may have access to the Volt in theory, but with such limited quantities initially avaliable, the reality of the distribution and the timing of actual cars arriving on lots will be heavily skewed towards certain areas.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:49 pm)Toyota’s reputation is taking quite a beating lately…I don’t see that impacting Prius sales.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/26/business/26toyota.html?scp=2&sq=toyota&st=cse
http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-toyota-cost26-2009nov26,0,2914702.story
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:50 pm)Sorry there ol boy. Like I said time and time again, when you go sign the purchase papers and or the loan papers, you are paying FULL price right there and then. There is no place on the purchase price/papers/loan where the will be -$7500 and when YOU drive off the Lot, you have paid FULL price for the car.
So his guestimate is closer to correct.
Also, I think the Leaf has an option to buy or lease the batt pack.
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:59 pm)______________________________________________________
#82 Dr. lbringdoh Said:
“Are you suggesting that GM makes decisions on what cars to build or not build based upon someone’s website on the internet?…If so, that is an interesting and somewhat fabulous claim, if it can be supported with fact — and I would certainly be interested in learning the facts…”
——
Dr. lbringdoh,
YES.
Lyle’s GM-Volt.com project successfully generated significant grass-roots public support behind the Volt during the early stages of GM introducing the Chevy Volt as a “concept” car. An absence of that early public support of the Volt…followed by the continuing momentum of further growing support…would have made it impossible for GM’s executives to follow through with developing the Chevy Volt.
With regards to proof:
Go to Google analytics to see the relative traffic weight of GM-Volt.com to the word terms “chevy volt” during the period 2007-2008. Even today, GM-Volt.com is the Chevy Volt cheerleader champion.
Google Fight (GM-Volt.com vs. Chevrolet.com/volt):
http://www.googlefight.com/index.php?lang=en_GB&word1=Chevrolet.com%2FVolt&word2=gm-+volt.com
Related Links:
http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/20080813/electric-chevrolet-volt-car_all.htm
http://www.hybridcars.com/hybrid-drivers/chevy-volts-1-fanboy-0813.html
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122143673862434189-email.html
______________________________________________________
Dec 1st, 2009 (1:59 pm)I keep seeing the curb weight of the Volt put at 3500 lbs. But I do not understand the basis. The curb weight of the UK version of the Cruze is about 2830, and if you add 400 you get 3230. Now the Cruze may weight more than the UK version, but other than that speculation, where is the 3500 vice 3200 number coming from??
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:00 pm)These people @ dailytech are IDIOTS!!! They OBVIOUSLY don’t know that GM explicitely tested the Volt in DEATH VALLEY on purpose…………:)
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:03 pm)Better yet, how about “The Doctor who Delivered the Electric Car.”
-13
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:05 pm)(click to show comment)
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:10 pm)Your report’s a welcomed milestone – congrats.
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:11 pm)The gap between the seats may be useful for backing up. Looking inbetween the seats and thru the vertical window of the hatchback, would give a great rear-view of whats behind you.
It may also come in handy for access to items in the rear. Sort of like a trunk pass-thru.
In the picture i posted above, it appears that back of the seats, when folded down, would be flush with the rear center console. Would be nice ot have a photo of the rear seats folded. Wasnt there one with flowers or something in the back of the Volt?
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:12 pm)Thank you DonC.
CS mode mpg is a useless data item for an (mostly) electric car. Whether CS mode driving is more noisy is also irrelevant.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:12 pm)Any company that wants to make money has to pay attention to what consumers want to buy. Corporations collectively spend billions on market research so that they can make decisions on that basis. And this website told GM that there was a market for the Volt.
So why is it a “fabulous claim” that they would decide what car to build based on that information?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:14 pm)Check out the forum section, George Bower just duplicated the setup with his Prius.. way to go George!
http://gm-volt.com/forum/showthread.php?p=33337#post33337
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:22 pm)Agreed. My 2000 Ford Focus has over 120k miles on it and I haven’t had a single mechanical probelm, not one and I plan on driving it an additional 80k miles before I can buy my Volt.
My old Chevy 1500 had over 230k miles on it, not a single problem.
+4
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:22 pm)This is such gratifying news. My biggest fear when this project started was that GM wouldn’t be invested into the project enough to put out a solid, reliable, bullet-proof car. With each new report, I’m convinced their engineering team has gone all out to make sure there’ll be no reason for this car to fall on its face.
Another fear was that GM got too far ahead of the game, particularly with regard to the battery technology. After all, Toyota was saying that it was far too soon to go forward with a plug-in hybrid. I think the maturity of the battery technology may have (pleasantly) surprised GM – they’ve said on numerous occasions that they haven’t run into any hiccups in this department.
The result: GM is *way* out in front of its competition, which will give it a further advantage as new battery technologies come into play (e.g., Lithium Sulfur, Lithium Air) . I’d also expect to see an introduction of some ICE technologies that may prove to be better suited for turning generators (e.g., microturbines, RadMax, Dynamic Wave Engine, etc).
One piece of advice to GM: you were able to capitalize on a technology at just the right time – not too early, not too late. Fantastic! Now, don’t waste your lead by being complacent. I’d like to see you go from strength to strength and lead the industry indefinitely in this next wave of automotive technology.
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:23 pm)Thanks. I wrote my earlier comment that triggered yours before reading about the video later on. We don’t hear that much on the video and mostly we don’t hear that revving up we heard about that was supposedly disruptive. So maybe GM had some sort of veto. It would be understandable since this is still only an IV.
From what I hear in the video, the sound the generator (ICE) makes is very acceptable already. Less is better, of course, but still that level of sound wouldn’t be a deal breaker for me.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:31 pm)You have a point. If it was possible to have a compartment on the side of the trunk complete with a door, like in some SUVs, it would be best.
Unless this charging cord is only there as a backup and your main cord is always at home, hooked up to your main charger. Then it would make sense to hide it that far since you won’t use it much.
But still…
-5
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:38 pm)At $40K + it’s not good for anyone but the elite few who can afford it. So we peasants are left with low MPG vehicles. When his lordship Obama enacts Cap and Trade and fuel prices “necessarily skyrocket” (his words) what then?
+5
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:40 pm)Now that’s what I’m talkin’ ’bout!
For those who don’t follow the link, the result for the Prius under similar conditions to Lyle’s test are: 27-34 mpg.
Well done George!
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:41 pm)I understand your anger. But I don’t think it’s the same GM. Not after the press they had for killing the EV1 program then, not after the Ch. 11 episode, etc.
They are still in a learning process right now but my understanding is that they will beat the competition this time around. At least, that’s how I feel.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:45 pm)I noticed the cord location too and was a little concerned. There are side compartments in the trunk area that would be more practical or it looks like there is some open space between the front seats’ leg area and under the dash. It would be convenient not to have to go into the trunk every time for those that regularly plug-in at work or in parking areas.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:52 pm)GREAT movie title ….it could even be the subtitle with the current working title as the main title….
THE REVENGE OF THE ELECTRIC CAR….
A true story of the doctor who delivered the electric car
Dec 1st, 2009 (2:59 pm)I thought you were going to say it was music to your ears.
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:03 pm)200 miles and charging the car every time he came back home with it at 240V, he used a total of .2 gallons of gas for an overall efficiency of 1000 MPG.
Just to check the math:
200 miles traveled on 0.2 gal = 1000 MPG. However, it was 200 miles traveled on 0.2 gal + xKWh electricity.
Based on the estimate of 25 kilowatt hours/100 miles (http://gm-volt.com/2009/08/11/chevy-volt-gets-230-mpg-city-epa-rating/), we should use the formula of 200 miles traveled on 0.2 gal + 50 KWh electricity= 230 MPG (marketing lie) or 30 MPG under generator mode + 50 kwh from grid
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:06 pm)You commute from Chicago to Boston every day? That sucks.
I know people like to think they know everything, but there are people whose life’s work is to figure out the financial consequences of every action a corporation takes. If they find that leasing the battery makes the most sense in terms of financing and servicing then so be it. Unless you believe they should disregard calculations and risk future backlash “because Doug Korthof said so.” Failing battery means very little with the warranty. It’s just like any other part on your car that has a chance of failing. Make 500? You need to read up more on this. I don’t even know how many people are still around in GM since 1996, 13 years ago, so I’m not sure what the arbitrary statement “it’s the same GM” means.
If you can’t afford it then quit reading. You think you are entitled to everything for free, or for $15,000? Nice, I’ll pick myself out a nice Lambo when that happens. They’re already losing money on every car at $40k. What you think this is, an econobox? This is groundbreaking, cutting edge new technology. I’ll never understand people who don’t stop whining about the price. If you can’t even afford $2.65 for gas then don’t buy a car.
Btw, sorry, but the center stack is still hideous.
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:18 pm)That would have been more clever and just as accurate (g).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:18 pm)OT.
Very interesting MIT spin off:
“WiTricity’s record so far is 3,000 watts — enough to fully charge an electric car, so long as it’s in the same room (or garage).”
http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/24/smallbusiness/next_little_thing_2010.fsb/index3.htm
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:40 pm)Sigh
You know. In the press release GM made about the 230 MPG they very cleary and very specifical state the “estimate” of 25 kWh/100 miles. And very clearly say AND
Now, I know every reporter at the event didn’t jump all over this, instead the 230 MPG number was picked over like crazy instead, but now your holding GM responsible because people didn’t listen to them. Seems a little unfair.
Breaking down “200 miles traveled”, GM expects the average driver to use
.87 gallons of gas and 50 kWh from the Grid during city driving
Since Farah used only .2 gallons of gas
.2 gallons and 55-60 kWh from the grid is more likely
Either way, traveling 200 miles the way Farah did would have cost me
20+ dollars in my current car (~25 MPG lifetime Winter Average)
10+ dollars in a 50 MPG car OR
<6 dollars in a Volt
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:42 pm)Which model Prius?
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:47 pm)This is a great point. The Cruse is going to be a very big seller.
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:51 pm)Multiple electric motors (traction, generator, p/s, a/c etc.) plus the heat sinks, controls and wiring for same. 300lbs difference seems like too little to me. The traction motor alone has got to weigh ~150lbs. You save a little on the transaxel, but, still 3500 is a good number imho. I have seen estimates (speculation) as high as 3750 curb weight.
Dec 1st, 2009 (3:59 pm)Thank you, Lyle.
What an awesome article. I bet your heart was pumping really fast.
You did a great job at reporting.
I rode the Prius once, and there was no mistake hearing when the ICE came on. I’m very glad the Volt is quiet. I do realize the all ICEs make noise.
Thanks again.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:07 pm)Congrats to you Lyle…we fans (yeah – fans not only of the Volt but of you, the man, Dr. Lyle Dennis as well) really enjoy the fact that you have finally been able to experience the closest thing to the final product !!!!
Great report.
For all of those who keep arguing about the cost factor…and stating things like why wouldnt I buy a Prius or a Leaf??? …. I for one would like to express how great it would be for you all to please, please, PLEASE go out and do what you say….buy all available forms of these personal moving contraptions that use more electricity and less gas/oil !!! …kudos to you all !!!
I’m still looking forward to getting a Volt because I like the technology over any of its competition, it fits my needs better (106mi round trip commute w/ hopes of charging at work).
There is a reason that ice cream comes in both vanilla and in chocolate flavorings.
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:26 pm)OT Fritz resigns all I know
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:38 pm)Congrats Lyle!! Getting there!
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:50 pm)Just right to recharge an electric car overnight without using connectors or electrical extensions.. just perfect for parking lots also.. automatic wireless charging.
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:55 pm)I was responding to you comment on gas prices stabilzing on $2/gallon causing gas stations to go out of business. I think a lot of ppl would buy it at that price.
Dec 1st, 2009 (4:57 pm)Surprising news out of GM’s Board meeting….. must have been a power struggle over decisions relating to Opel and the breakdown in sale of Saab… Fritz Henderson to step down, Ed Whitacre Jr to take over as interim CEO….
http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSTRE5B04ZS20091201
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:02 pm)#195 hayley
——
NKAWTG: At $40K + it’s not good for anyone but the elite few who can afford it. So we peasants are left with low MPG vehicles. When his lordship Obama enacts Cap and Trade and fuel prices “necessarily skyrocket” (his words) what then?
——
If you can’t afford it then quit reading. You think you are entitled to everything for free, or for $15,000? Nice, I’ll pick myself out a nice Lambo when that happens. They’re already losing money on every car at $40k. What you think this is, an econobox? This is groundbreaking, cutting edge new technology. I’ll never understand people who don’t stop whining about the price. If you can’t even afford $2.65 for gas then don’t buy a car.
—-
LOL
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:09 pm)What’s the efficiency?
-2
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:21 pm)Yeah, and in twenty years the money you saved on fuel by not buying and driving a Prius or comparable high mpg hybrid will finally cover the up front cost premium of buying the Volt… and you’ll only have 520,000 miles on her.
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:31 pm)Thanks for the test drive review, Lyle. Even from some of the other more negative bloggers and journalists, I got the feeling GM finally has the range extending mode down. It sounds very exciting.
As far as MPG: In constant-driving range extending mode, I doubt the Volt will perform much better than 40MPG. It’s good you reset the MPG and posted this. I have a feeling that the number is accurate.
The capacitive console was a spiffy idea- but I have a feeling that it will be something that will break. I also don’t favor polished surfaces on dashboards- because they become fingerprint magnets unless you pick white. I’ve seen the black version, and I couldn’t imagine what that would look like after a week of normal use. GM should consider a matte-finish version. Don’t make the same mistake that the consumer notebook industry is making.
GM should also consider making the console easily replaceable because I have a feeling this will be the number one part to fail outside of the powertrain components.
Also, put a damn 5th seat in future models. Or at least allow a carseat to sit on the battery hump.
And finally, make it cheap. I want to buy one.
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:32 pm)I find it interesting how EMISSIONS aren’t being mentioned anywhere in any of the comparisons.
That’s a clear benefit of a hybrid like Prius over a traditional vehicle like Cruze. It’s something Volt will likely offer as an advantage too.
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:33 pm)I was really busy at work today, so I am late to the party….
I have read some of the posts, and I see we have a new batch of trolls. I am not surprised by that. Every time GM does something that proves the Volt is real, they seem to appear.
I think the report by Lyle is really good. He is not some reporter for a magazine with an agenda or required to hash up old GM failures. It seemed to me to be a really honest report of his time in the car.
And as far as the CS mileage, even at 38 MPG, my YEARLY gasoline consumption would still only be about 100 gallons per year. Compared to the 650 gallons I use now, that is a reduction of almost 85%. I can live with that…………..
Go GM! Go GM Volt Team!!
NPNS
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:42 pm)I’ve always wondered how they will test it for SMOG……lol
Hmmm.
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:44 pm)Quite interesting to see George’s simulation with the Prius, and how it when applying a similar driving pattern actually yeilds lower MPG than the Volt. Prius 27-34 MPG vs. Volt 32-38 MPG. Is this the new or the old Prius?? – Perhaps someone else with a new Prius could try simulate the “parking lot test” with strong acceleration vs. semi-economy acceleration from 0-50, several turns and with two full stops per round too?
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:47 pm)WORK
That’s a 4 letter word man!! Stop it!
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:51 pm)Viridian Joule picked as winner of Chevy Volt Paint Color Contest
See ABG
Sh|t man, I still dont see the green. Whatchyall smokin?
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:53 pm)One thing our wonderful media, regressive status quo seekers, and other skeptics fail to realize is that:
Even of a buyer sees absolutely no value differentiator between 2 cars other than MSRP and operating cost, the total cost of ownership is not just SALE PRICE + OPERATING.
It is SALE PRICE + OPERATING – RESIDUAL VALUE (opeating costs including fuel, maintainance, financing, etc). The sale price differential does not evaporate when the car is purchased. Ownership cost savings need only overcome the SALE PRICE – RESIDUAL VALUE differential if one sees no other other value differential.
Buyers seeing the Volt as better looking, quicker, more refined, with newer technology, and a signicant leap forward in the efforts to reduce gasoline consumption as well as reduce polluton will not consider a Prius as an equal product solely differetiated by costs. Even if some do, they may envision a world with increasingly challenged gasoline markets that adds more value to the Volt.
Dec 1st, 2009 (5:59 pm)I thought you are a doctor:)
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:09 pm)Clever isn’t code for trite, is it? You said it just fine.
It seems like GM has a few tidbits to iron out but nothing major and as long as their condensed testing extrapolates properly over time, they are hitting the high notes with the Volt (mini-pun intended).
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:11 pm)Fritz Henderson?
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:21 pm)Nancy P.?
She can be the hooker that pops out from the side!!!!
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!!!!!
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:25 pm)I’m not quite sure that’s true. The majority of the Volts R&D expenses were paid for by pre-bankruptcy debt.
GM decided to market the Volt under the Chevy brand. It really should be affordable.
Of course, affordability is relative. Gas prices need to come up, or vehicle prices need to come down for any EREV to survive in a free market. If gas costs $5/gal, a $40,000 Volt will be cheaper in the long run compared to a $15,000 gas equivelent. But at $2.50/gal, the Volt may very well attract the same numbers as the EV1. GM needs more than just “green” to attract buyers. It needs to make sense to buy one economically. Range extender, batteries, computer programming- these challenges are nothing compared to the challenge of mass consumer acceptance.
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:40 pm)Oh. Absolutely. But my point is that the only way gasoline would stabilize at $2 a gallon would be if demand fell off a cliff. To the point where gas stations had stopped carrying it. Sorry if I was unclear.
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:43 pm)When I went to “The Business of Plugging In” conference they had a Voltec drive train sitting fairly close to a Volt. One guy was dedicated to talking about the Voltec. I SWEAR that he said that the charger was in the car and that it could take ANY power source, 120, 240 or ANYTHING INBETWEEN. That tells me that the only “cost” for 240 volts is putting the line in with an appropriate plug. I kind of feel lucky that I had a 240 volt breaker box put in my garage (it was going to be for a compresser).
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:44 pm)“My word is appropriate. You floor a gas burning car, it makes noise.”
Yep, I’ve said it a couple of times on earlier articles. Where the disconnect for some is that flooring of the volt doesn’t immediately result is the engine revving high. But don’t anyone think that the rules of physics go away. If you ask for full power out of a gasoline engine, it’s noisy, hybrid or not.
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:55 pm)OT about the Toyota gas pedal thingy…
———————————————————————————————————
“It is important to note there is no risk of pedal entrapment in vehicles in which the driver-side floor mat is compatible with the vehicle and properly secured. The question of unintended acceleration involving Toyota vehicles has been thoroughly investigated by NHTSA’s engineering experts without any findings of defect other than an unsecured or incompatible driver’s floor mat.”
——————————————————————————————————–
From: http://autos.aol.com/article/runaway-toyotas
So it sounds like third party aftermarket mats were the issue.
Dang, guess I better not buy those Kragen or Target matts.
Dec 1st, 2009 (6:57 pm)Time for another “guest commentary” by statik with Fritz stepping down?
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:01 pm)Loved the article and glad you finally got your due.
I wish you would please explain to me (I’m sure there is at least one other person out there) why the insane idea of deriving miles per GALLON from the use of petroleum and electricity continues-It simply makes few, if any, accurate comparisons. I guess it’s my failure to understand how seemingly intelligent people haven’t found a more realistic unit of measure for this. Miles per therm (100,000 btu’s), per Kilowatt, cubic amps per fortnight: Any thing but MPG. If you never put a single gallon in the tank and drove it 100,000 miles over the lifetime of the vehicle, marketing would claim 100,000 MPG or maybe even infinite MPG- Why not?
Thanks for allowing me to whine.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:03 pm)That’s one twisted mind, right there.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:06 pm)Lyle I’m worried there is no legroom in the back seat. With such a cavernous cargo area, I don’t see why they have to scrimp for the passengers when you could lay the seats down if you really needed the cargo area.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:14 pm)I enjoy the debate over future petroleum prices. Drill, drill, drill our own home grown oil won’t work: U.S. consumption of petroleum outstrips our production requiring us to use 65% of the world’s production while we have only 3% of the world oil reserves. We can drill all we want but it won’t do any good. The only solution is conservation and utilize other forms of energy. This must be done beginning in this decade; peak production was reached in July 2008.
http://www.theoildrum.com/node/5395
China probably will surpass United States and become the largest car market for the whole year of 2009. The top eight car sellers for the first nine months of 2009 are General Motors, Volkswagen, Hyundai, Chana, Nissan, Chery, BYD and Toyota.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry#China
I suggest reading the following link on oil price and outlook:
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/energyexplained/index.cfm?page=oil_prices
You knock GM for what they have developed but they are clearly part of the solution you suggest with high tech. Take a good look at the Natural Gas Act of 2009; we have tremendous reserves of natural gas locked up in vast fields of shale. We are developing wind power, and solar power is becoming more competitive with conventional means of electricity generation.
The Volt represents a technological development which will enable us to stop using the dwindling supply of petroleum. The solution to the problem is not drill, drill, drill and use up what is left but rather to shift over as rapidly as possible to an alternate fuel. I have said before and will again: the Volt’s destiny is becoming a BEV! For now, it offers the best path to lowering our consumption of petroleum. It might just be the one factor in saving our economy if gasoline’s price hits way above $4.00 per gallon.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:19 pm)On efficiency in CS mode
So we have some numbers
We have a picture showing 42.2 mpg
We have pictures showing Range and “Fuel Tank Fullness”
We have Lyle reporting 32-36 and higher “if he lays off a bit” from the Computer
Unfortunely none of these numbers means a thing
.
#1. Conditions: Fast driving in a parking lot with alot of turns
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/
Hrm. It takes the same energy per mile to travel 10 mile per hour as 30 mile per hour -best case senario-. Slower than 10 mile per hour and you start getting pretty ridicolous.
Point, A few laps around a parking lot is clearly -not- the EPA testing cycle and is not for good reason.
#2. Farah specifically states the Car is “thrown together”
I have yet to see an IVer with the Headlights and proper bumper panels. Nor would I think software etc is finalized. In new car development, it would not be uncommon to have a 5% or greater swing from early production IVers to final product in fuel economy. The Volt is the first EREV car, so its hard to get an estimate, so I will defer again to the Telsa Roadster experience
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Graph_Evolution_of_Tesla_Roadster_Efficiency.PNG
50-60 MPG is like the June 2006 example. Possible in theory, but in application no parts get there. This 35 mpg business? More like the August 2007 example. Real world parts being refined.
I stick by 40+ MPG on both City and HWY EPA cycles. (and a 6 gallon or less fuel tank)
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:21 pm)Ya know, I was looking at that pic above of the rear seat area. Seems rather cramped. The only upside I can see to this is the kids will be closer to me so I can smack them around while driving.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:23 pm)Head room. The sloping back of the roof requires a certain placement forward of the seats. The Prius has “enough” rear head room, but is eclipsed by many other C-class segment offerings. Increasing leg room in the Volt will decrease head room. A “happy” medium is probably the goal. Something that hopefully is comfortable for at least 1 hour to a 6′ Tall, 200 lb male. (Lets face it, no C-segment class car’s backseat is comfortable to anyone significant larger than this or for significantly greater time periods)
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:26 pm)Awesome. I like how the trunk isn’t seperated. It looks like I’ll be able to fit my surfboard inside pretty easy.
+2
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:32 pm)I have not seen anyone else call attention to one of the things about the Volt that is important to me.
The Volt is also a kind of insurance against a repeat of the gasoline shortage of 1973-74.
I am motivated by the memory of October 1973. Most to you young’in have only read about it, but I lived through it. Suddenly, in the Washington DC area, gasoline became scarce. (as it did in most of the country)
……………………………………………………………………………………..
Memories of the oil embargo that started in October, 36 years ago …..
Waiting in long lines to buy fuel….when available…
Stations closed with no gasoline to sell…
Following tanker trucks from the storage tank farm to wherever they were delivering… (and hoping you didn’t run dry before you got there)
Oil prices doubled +…
Even- odd license plates days…
Maximum purchase allowed -8 gallons..
…………………………………………………………………………………….
Essentially there is only one source for the oil that is refined into gasoline.
It only comes from under the ground (plus small amount from plant sources) and most of those sources are outside the USA.
But electricity can be produced from hundreds of different energy sources.
The Volt is a car with two “fuel tanks”.
I will fill up the gasoline tank at the local station, then fill up the electric “fuel tank” (battery) from any electric outlet.
Electric fuel is the insurance policy against the next oil crisis.
If we have another oil crisis (Oh yes it could happen again) I will always have at least 30-35 miles of electric fuel in my Volt.
And, if necessary, I can make the electricity myself. I cannot do that with gasoline.
Insurance is protection against unexpected events.
One (of several) reasons I will buy the Volt is that it will be my insurance against fuel scarcity.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:36 pm)Toyota and other manufacturer’s discovered that it was more profitable to maufacture vehicles in the U.S. rather than export them from Japan because the total duty on the parts they import into the U.S. factories was far less than that for the whole vehicle. This concept works across the board for foreign car makers. Even GM manufactures in regions around the world for this vary reason. Just as the Japanese lowered overheads by having parts plants located near the assembly plant, the idea of manufacturing where the car is sold, eliminates many overhead expenses. They have been successful in getting huge tax relief from the local municipalities where they have set up shop. We benefit from the employment within the state so not all is bad. I still hold that the Buy Made in U.S.A. should be followed by every American citizen, or at least Buy as Much American as Possible. GM offers us all a great opportunity to do so with the Volt.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:45 pm)Pretty sure it’s big enough to pick up strippers (when you don’t have your kids, of course).
Here’s how it goes down in a Prius:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0NSl9OXixA
/and if it’s too tight (room in the car, that is), you could always downsize the hooker
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:52 pm)All good points LeoK. Hmmmmm. I wonder what price Nissan will lease the battery for if the price of gasoline goes way above $4.00 per gallon?
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
Dec 1st, 2009 (7:54 pm)AHAHAHAHAHAHAAA!!!!
Dude shudda had a Suburban fo her!
UANUT!
Dec 1st, 2009 (8:14 pm)This is how I roll.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fM8cCsvDsjc&NR=1&feature=fvwp
/Can’t have too much room when you’re out and about with full figured call girls.
//mpg takes a bit of a hit, though
Dec 1st, 2009 (9:54 pm)I believe the Volt is a great idea that was seriously compromised in its execution. It is built like and looks like a standard internal combustion engine car. It settles for an EV range of 40 miles and an MPG of 30 to 40 in generator mode. I am disappointed by these numbers. Of course, compared to the car I now drive, I’d love to own a Volt, but I doubt I’ll ever be able to afford one. I’m holding out for an Aptera.
+3
Dec 1st, 2009 (10:55 pm)Air Bags, Anti Lock brakes, air conditioning, the list goes on and on. All made affordable by “elitists” that few could afford in their day. Now everyone can afford them. Next time you meet an elitist, hug him and thank him for your air conditioning.
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:05 pm)Thanks for replying, both Herm and Lyle. I’m looking for space to haul a bike, so the center console is unlikely to be an obstacle for me, though it might be a minor inconvenience. If Chevy really wants to be ahead of the curve they should get specs out to Thule and Yakima so that they can start working on the rack configurations.
I love the rear seat photo that kdawg put in too. I hope the speaker set up is standard. That looks like a whole lotta sound! I also love how the cup holder is on the bettery console. Might sound dumb to some, but when my (then) five year old kicked off the cup holder in the back of my (then) brand new Vibe, I cried. On the bright side, she has earned the learning experience of having to hold her cups ever since. Always a silver lining!
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:20 pm)Dadgummit – Dan Petit was right again
+1
Dec 1st, 2009 (11:42 pm)That doesn’t explain the rust issue with the recalled Tundra trucks. (And they’re only recalling the ones sold in certain states. So if you live in Florida, and want to drive to New England, you’re out of luck.)
http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/25/toyota-is-recalling-tundras-for-rust-problem/?scp=1&sq=toyota%20tundra&st=cse
And then there’s the fact that they got zero picks by the Insurance Institute of Highway safety.
http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/11/19/toyota-says-safety-report-is-misleading/?scp=4&sq=toyota%20safety&st=cse
It also doesn’t excuse how they handled the floor mat situation. And they’re redesigning the gas pedals, so I’m not sure I believe it was just about the floor mats.
http://www3.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/11/25/us/AP-US-Toyota-Floor-Mats.html?scp=5&sq=toyota%20safety&st=cse
Dec 2nd, 2009 (1:45 am)You can disprove that in a simple experiment. Get going 25 MPH and make a slow U-turn in a parking lot. If you shed 100% of your kinetic energy making a U-turn, you’d be stopped when the turn was done.
You can actually make several circles from 25 MPH before you’ll stop. The energy isn’t lost because the force applied by the tires redirects most of the kinetic energy into a new direction.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (1:54 am)Where do you get those numbers from? (Specifically citing “industry”)
I would expect somewhere between 85% and 90% with losses about equally split between the motor and inverter.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (2:24 am)If you have the 240V home charger it comes with its own cord so the wind up cord would only be used when you were “charge sipping” away from home.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (2:33 am)I’m in the “maybe I can afford it” category. But I have no intention of quitting this website! I wish the Volt to become a massive success and the inevitable price reductions that will lead to. I agree with the sentiment of STFU about the price. It is what it is, and I don’t think it’s a deal killer for the program.
I worked on the EV1 as a subcontractor and I wish that had not been killed. At the time I was convinced that it was only a matter of 10-15 years for battery technology to advance and they’d be back.
-3
Dec 2nd, 2009 (3:56 am)I JUST HOPE GM DOES DO THE SAME THEY DID WITH THE EV 1: IN 1990 THEY PUT IT ON THE AUTO SHOW AND SAID THEY WOULD SELL IT BY 1995. 1995 CAME AND WENT AND NO EV 1 FOR SALE. IN 1996 THEY LEASED THEM ONLY TO A SELECT FEW. GM LATER REALIZED THAT THE MARVEL OF THE EV1 COULD COST THEM MILLIONS / BILLIONS IN LOST REVENUE FROM HAVING THEIR DEALERSHIPS SERVICE AND SELL THE MANY PARTS AN INTERNAL COMBUSTION VEHICLE CONSTANTLY REQUIRES. SO THEY CANNED THE EV 1 WITH A SMOKE SCREEN STORY THAT THE BATTERIES WERENT GOOD ENOUGH. BS. THE TESLA SPORTS CAR PROVES THAT THE “NOT GOOD ENOUGH BATTERIES” WAS JUST A FABRICATION TO MAKE THE PUBLIC BELIEVED THE FAIRY STORY AS TRUE. NOT ONLY COULD GM NOT AFFORD TO HAVE A NEARLY MAINTENANCE FREE VEHICLE, NETHER CAN THE FEDS OR STATE GOVERNMENTS WHO FEED ON US AT THE PUMP IN THE FORM OF TAXES PER GALLON. IF TESLA MOTORS COULD PUT OUT A SUPER ELECTRIC CAR WITH A FLEDGLING BANKROLL, WHY COULDNT THE MOST POWERFULL AT ONE TIME CORPORATION OF THE WORLD PUT OUT AN ELECTRIC VEHICLE ? SIMPLE: THEY DIDNT WANT TO MISS OUT ON THE $ FOR SERVICING AND SELLING PARTS FOR THEIR INTERNAL COMBUSTION DOGMA AND SINCE WE KNOW BIG CORPS BUY OUR GOVERNMENT ELECTED OFFICIALS, NO VIRTUALLY MAINTENANCE FREE ELECTRIC EV1. OUR GOVERNMENTS DIDNT HAVE TO BE PAID OFF TO MAKE THE NOT GOOD ENOUGH BATTERY BS STORY FED THROUGH GOVERNMENT LICENSED MEDIA CAUSE THEY KNEW THAT IF NO ONE BOUGHT GAS THEY WOULD BE HIT IN THE POCKET HARD AND CANT AFFORD AND DONT WANT TO LOOSE THE BLOOD THEY SUCK OUT OF US AT THE PUMP. THE ALL MIGHTY SAUDIS WHO BOUGHT A BUSHIT PRES PUPPET TO GET RID OF THEIR ARCH ENEMY AND OIL COMPETITOR SADAM INSANE OF IRAQ AND OTHER OPEC NATIONS DONT WANT TO LOOSE THEIR BILLIONS FROM BENDING US AT THE PUMP EITHER. SO AS LONG AS WE ALL KNOW THAT THE TECHNOLOGY HAS BEEN AVAILABLE TO DELETE THE DINOSAUR FART DRIVEN VEHICLE, BUT CAR MANUFACTURES, OUR GOVERNMENT AND THEIR OIL BUDDIES DONT WANT US TO FOR SAKE OF THEIR OWN CONTINUOUS ECONOMIC GAIN AT THE EXPENSE OUR THE WORLDS HEALTH AND WALLET, WRITING THIS MAY OF BEEN WORTH IT. HERES THE FOUR WORDS ALL OF THE ABOVE MENTIONED DONT EVER WANT YOU TO HEAR ABOUT: PHOTO VOLTAIC ELECTRIC VEHICLE. WHY ? NO DINOSAUR FART DRIVEN UPKEEP OR PART SALES, NO TAXES AT THE PUMP , NO REVENUE FOR OPEC. ANYWAY, LETS HOPE THAT ITS NOT ANOTHER EV 1 TEASE AND GM ACTUALLY SELLS THE VOLT. IF THE VOLT DOES IN FACT GO FOR SALE TO THE PUBLIC, DINOSAUR FART PROPELLED VEHICLE MANUFACTURES, OUR GOVERNMENTS AND OPEC SHOULD START SHAKING IN THEIR SHOES CAUSE WE THE PEOPLE WILL FINALLY BE LIBERATED FROM THE CARCINOGENIC DINOSAUR FART INTERNAL COMBUSTION VEHICLE AND COMMIE KALEEFORNIA CAN STICK ITS NO MORE TEMPORARY REGISTRATION STICKERS FOR CARCINOGENIC DINOSAUR FART VEHICLES THAT DIDNT GET A CERTIFICATE CERTIFYING THAT THEY POLLUTE BUT NOT AS MUCH AS THEY COULD EVEN THOUGH WE THE PEOPLE DIDNT OPT FOR OR DESIGN ALL THOSE BS ANTI SMOG DEVISES THAT WHEN THEY FAIL MAKE THE DINOSAUR FART DRIVEN VEHICLE POLLUTE EVEN MORE THAN IT WOULD OF HAD IT NOT HAD ANY OF THE SO CALLED ANTI POLLUTION DEVISES UP THEIR CONSTIPATED HOLES. THANK YOU.
+1
Dec 2nd, 2009 (7:36 am)But GM should be thinking ahead for those that can’t charge at home or do frequently charge on the road. There are much more accessible places to stow the cord and this little change will mean a lot to those people.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (7:40 am)/salute to Bobby Bowden
+1
Dec 2nd, 2009 (7:44 am)Yo JO! Quit screaming at us, leash the caps man.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (7:53 am)Don’t forget there are 2 motors, an inverter, and power electronics (sometimes the inverter and power electronics may be skipped under certain circumstances but this is still unclear). Don J is assuming an industry norm for industrial generators but he doesn’t realize AC Induction motors like the Volt and the Tesla Roadster are using have peak efficiencies in the mid 90′s.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (8:57 am)Yeah, I had a brain fart due to lack of coffee.. what I was thinking of is you lose lots of your aerodynamics when you are turning.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (9:09 am)After sending a suggestion to improve the gas mileage I was a bit disappointed in your number of 36 MPG. I thought the car went 40 miles at any speed on electric and then a small generator would kick in to continue charging the batteries and continue your jouney for a 200 + MPH on a long trip. I was also disappointed in seeing your final version compared to your concept version. That one was really sporty. That really made me want one. Going out to get a 50 mpg prius now. Good luck with the Volt.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (9:44 am)Volt is 400-500 lbs heavier then others-also has electrical losses others don’t. It is what it is!
Dec 2nd, 2009 (10:35 am)You just bought a Leaf in 2010 and got a 2 year lease on the standard pack.. but Nissan brings out a new battery in 2015 with twice the capacity (they made a recent announcement).. boy arent you lucky your battery lease was only 2 years?.. but maybe you will just keep your existing pack at a substantial discount, maybe you will buy it outright. Lots of options is good!.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (12:20 pm)No, its not just about the floor mats.
Most companies Gas Pedals are designed with an “emergency disengage” feature if it somehow gets stuck. Typically this is accomplished through a double linkage.
The Toyota/Lexus pedals in question are single linkage, and can get suck relatively easily on a variety of things (passenger introduced to be sure such as after market floor panels, but still not something other companies suffer from)
Dec 2nd, 2009 (1:35 pm)What’s your thinking on this? I would say that driving around in a parking lot at lowish speed is just about ideal conditions for maximal MPG in my Prii.
Dec 2nd, 2009 (3:56 pm)Great review Lyle! And great work you do here. Electrification of transportation is a key step to our transition to a petroleum free energy profile. This product along with the vision of Silicon Valley entrepreneurs, Bob Lutz and Rick Waggoner is a major move to that future.
Though it has been a long and somewhat rocky road to this point – the tide is definitely turning. We know now that we do not need the myth of climate change to pursue energy independence. Growing our domestic energy resources back to 80-90% of consumption will strengthen industry, national security and grow jobs at home. All things we need now.
The next benefit is the US will lead the rest of the world in adopting electrification as a key to a sustainable planet. And we will do it all without the hoax of climate change. That is real progress, real sustainability and real old-fashioned innovation. Congratulations!
-2
Dec 2nd, 2009 (6:40 pm)this car will never make it to the northeast part of the country so FAIL keep it gas or diesel (diesel is actually cheaper to make than gas)
-2
Dec 2nd, 2009 (9:37 pm)kgurnsey: “It’s (1000MPG) not bogus, it just depends on how often you are able to recharge. The more often you can plug in, the higher the effective mpg number will be. It’s just math, the problem is that the the final result is heavily dependant on the particular circumstances of each car/owner. Farah knows this better than anyone, which makes the discussion of mpg difficult, especially to those who latch onto one inadequate measure of performance and base all thier decisions and opinions on it. The reality of an EREV is more complex than just mpg.”
Driving from Chicago to Boston, I’m really going to enjoy stopping every 40 miles to recharge for 6 hours to get that 1000MPG. After driving for 35-40 minutes, I’m usually ready for a nap, anyway. Why, the whole trip will take less than a week! Sweet!
In other words, 1000MPG is bogus. If Farah wants to say, Y miles on M hours of recharging and then X miles on N gallons of gas, that would be perfectly reasonable. 1000MPG is a lie unless I can put a gallon of gas in the tank and drive from Chicago to Boston.
If the electric mindset is what’s important, then GM is perfectly free to say, “40 miles on electricity after every charge” and leave it at that, there’d be no arguing it. But, curiously, they’re not all on fire to say it that way, either.
Dec 3rd, 2009 (1:05 am)I was responding specifically to the claim that the motor would be something from 60% to 80% efficient. I would expect something close to 90% for both the motor and inverter. That would lead to a combined 80% for the whole shaft to shaft efficiency in CS mode.
-2
Dec 3rd, 2009 (3:07 am)40 miles per charge?! Give me a break! In 1996/97 GM started leasing the EV1 (which got over 100 miles per charge), and then forced the leasers (who LOVED these cars) to give them back so they could go crush them all in junk yards, claiming a lack of demand. More like a lack of advertising! I will NEVER buy a new gas-powered car again, especially from GM, after what they did. The only new car I will ever buy will be a plug-in electric. I’ll keep buying used cars from private owners until then….which will never be in my lifetime (I’m 40 years old). And I know many people who pledge to do the same. The technology has been here for at least 15 years. Earlier this year, the Tesla got 313 miles in one charge, for God’s sake! Too bad ordinary people can’t afford one. GM can go ahead and pretend the Volt is some breakthrough car, but they’ll never get a cent from me or many of the people I know.
Dec 3rd, 2009 (5:59 am)Chuck, you come through loud and clear. I share the same slow burning anger with the greed and gouging by the oil companies.
I would like to make one point in defense of GM and the Volt. True, the Volt could provide 100 miles pure electric distance as it is right now.
Only 50% of the battery is being used. By charging to less than full and discharging to far from empty. This battery will perform at 100% for the first ten years. And 80% for a time thereafter. If we lived in a country that could care less what manufactures sell to their citizens, then car makers could toss a 3 year life battery at us.
It is very likely that a similar size longer range battery will be available for the Volt long before the 10+ year life of the original battery.
=D~
Dec 3rd, 2009 (11:10 am)I’m not as nice as the last poster, but Chuck, pull your head out. The EV-1 was a great experimental car. It showed the world that it’s possible to make an electric car. It was never going to be successful in the market place. It cost too much, didn’t last long enough, had too many problems statistically and would never have been bought by the public in numbers to make it worth it.
The world owes GM a huge hug because they spent the money and gave 100% toward developing the EV-1. They pioneered a lot of the core technologies that run in the Tesla, and other EV’s.
You’re mistaking what you want, and the theme of a movie for what actually is. If you want to buy gas guzzlers then you’re hurting the EV tech. GM has done nothing but good for it.
Dec 3rd, 2009 (6:57 pm)Too bad Lyle couldn’t drive it in real world conditions instead of a parking lot. I seldom do jackrabbit starts, but I occasionally have to accelerate hard from 40 to 65 on freeway entry ramps. Just to keep up with traffic, at times I need to cruise at 70-75. How the car manages those conditions would have been very informative.
Dec 5th, 2009 (9:50 am)I like the quote:
“The Doctor who Delivered the Electric Car.”
Lyle certainly deserves credit here. However, I think the most credit should go to Martin Eberhard, Elon Musk, J.B. Strabuel, et. al. for delivering the Tesla Roadster.
GSP
Dec 6th, 2009 (11:50 am)I too, drove the Volt last wk in both modes, and can confirm that CS mode is underwhelming (in a good way). I also watched 5 former EV1 drivers get to see and drive the Volt, and spend some time with some of the team. While there is still some tweaking to be done, each of them came away impressed in his/her own way. (One of them has already blogged about it here: http://ifmagazine.com/feature.asp?article=3616).
I saw the EV1 comments made earlier in this thread- not surprisingly, I agree w some and not w others. But the salient point is this: not to minimize the engineering feat of the Volt, but building a good car- even a good plug-in car- has never been GM’s biggest challenge (least not for a few decades now). It wasn’t with EV1, and it’s not with Volt. Skeptics remain because we lived through the last generation of actually having a variety of EVs to put on the road and still had it all go south. This is the piece that GM has not yet proven it “gets”- while the Volt folks we all know seem to, I’m not yet sure that Chevy does. Time will tell; the fact that they’ve re-started the conversation with arguably their most skeptical audience is a good thing- I hope they continue to engage and learn from the knees that have already been skinned. But either way, there’s still a huge amount of work to be done on stuff that has nothing to do with the car itself.
I do find the debate about credit for the Volt interesting…but counterproductive, imo. There is no question that Lyle and his site have contributed to the enthusiasm for the Volt, by both the public and GM. But there are many others who have been working for this moment too, some very quietly and for years. Not all of the contributions are equal, but that doesn’t matter- this site wouldn’t be what it is w/o the 50,000+ folks who’ve put their fingerprints on it. I know that much of the internal support from the Volt stems from the fact that so many folks in the company have taken ownership of it- one of the jokes among the senior engineers is how many people in GM think the Volt was their idea. The same needs to happen externally as well- each snowflake in the avalanche needs to feel responsible to perpetuate the movement.
The exciting thing to me is less figuring out who made it happen, and more the fact that it *is* happening.