It is no secret that the words ‘affordable small car’ and GM are rarely heard in the same sentence these days, much less with the word electric added to the mix. I believe in India when those same words are formed as a sentence, and spoken in Hindi, it triggers earthquakes throughout the region…but don’t quote me on that.
To rectify this situation, on Thursday GM India announced that it had formed a partnership with electric car maker Reva to produce a small affordable electric car for the Indian market.
Although not a household name, the Reva Electric Car Company (based out of Bangalore, and operating in more than 20 countries) can lay claim to currently being the largest purveyor of electric cars worldwide with production hovering around 3,000 cars. Later this year, Reva expects a much larger second production facility to come online, increasing their capacity to over 35,000 units per year.
Reva will develop and produce the electric drivetrain and control systems to be put to use on GM’s Gamma II small car platform, which is the foundation for the Chevrolet Spark.
According to Karl Slym, GM India’s President, the two companies have been working together for over 10 months, and have already completed functional prototypes.
GM’s goal is to gear up commercial production over the next 12 months, and to roll out the all electric Chevy Spark in India in late 2010, about the same time as the Volt debuts in North America. No details on the specifications or the price of the vehicle have been released.
When GM-Volt asked Rob Peterson (GM spokesperson) about the possibility of seeing this project come to the United States, he responded that it was “strictly limited to India at this point.”
Source (GM)
This entry was posted on Saturday, September 26th, 2009 at 9:11 am and is filed under BEV. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (9:23 am)As several posters have said before, the more the merrier!
And this move would hopefully give GM a profitable presence in India. I’m convinced growth in car sales in India will soon become HUGE, though sales will likely not ramp up as fast as in China!
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:29 am)Unions, Smunions. This baby will be coming to the U.S.A.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:31 am)Absolutely, nasaman, options are good!
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:34 am)Those Indians get EVERYTHING.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:36 am)While the volt cannot be successful in area’s like india, GM can easily leverage it’s partnerships like this to lay the groundwork for electric vehicles worldwide. I actually think international plays like this and the recent announcement of the new generation of Fuel Cell engines bodes very well for GM’s future. If than can continue to innovate and do so at least a little bit faster than the rest of the industry, their success is almost guaranteed. To bad it required a huge donation from US taxpayers.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:53 am)For the EV to be low cost, one would expect a smallish battery, and for the USA, a limited range. But there might be a market in Europe as well, because their average commute distance is much less than in the USA.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (10:21 am)India has more people living on about a dollar a day (456 million) than the U.S. has in total population (305 million).
/Should be no problem keeping the labor costs down.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poverty_in_India
http://www.google.com/publicdata?ds=uspopulation&met=population&tdim=true&q=u.s.+population
//Another kick in the nuts to the American tax payer whose dollars are taken taken to (supposedly) retain U.S. jobs while GM simultaneously cuts production in the states and expands production in India.
/// Any bets on how long the “we won’t import the Indian produced products back to the U.S”. holds out?
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:34 am)I drove an E- REVA last february in Brussels, while the exterior of the car let me think of a remains of East-German style under the communist regime, the impression changed when driving it. Perhaps I got the “Tesla grin” because the person that was with me (the Belgian distributor of REVA cars) said to me : “You look happy”.
It was a perfect car for urban use but impossible to drive it on the highways because its maximum speed was 80 km/h.
regards,
JC NPNS
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:40 am)From the NYT, April 2007: G.M. Says It Will Make More Vehicles and Buy More Parts in India
————–
“Mr. Wagoner said G.M. planned to take advantage of India’s high-quality, low-cost supply base “to source more parts out of India.”
In a statement issued after his presentation, Mr. Wagoner said the sourcing increase could be “as much as fivefold over the next two years.”
Analysts said that might translate into G.M.’s buying as much as $1 billion worth of car parts in India annually, which would be the most spent by a foreign automaker in India.”
—————
G.M. Says It Will Make More Vehicles and Buy More Parts in India
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/18/automobiles/18auto.html
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-2
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:47 am)Watch now as Big Dan T (aka GM) gives a couple of American tax payers an advanced tutorial:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDd_ryixqyA
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:55 am)Y’know an all-electric Spark would be an interesting play for the American market. It would be simpler and probably cheaper than the Volt. I know the buyers aren’t quite the same, but 99% of the time I travel alone with maybe a laptop and almost never 60 miles in a day. Ford may be furthest along this path with the all-electric Focus, but they don’t seem to be as serious about bringing that car to market as GM is with the Volt.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (11:00 am)I worked in Manaus Brazil in 2003 and there were tons of very small very affordable GM cars everywhere.
In Scandinavia I have seen lots of small affordable GM (Opel) cars from the 1980s thorough 2009.
Are we getting a little provincial here? Just because small cars have not been profitable for GM in the US doesn’t mean they don’t make them in big numbers where people are, um, smarter.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (11:55 am)Amen, brother!
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Sep 26th, 2009 (12:01 pm)India has REVA for 14 years and they are making EVs , GM is going to take advantage of the production capabilites of REVA (get a REVA and put chevy badge ( some times put under a sparc hood ) and sell it. Its not going to be a hit because EVs are not popular at all, REVA sells only mostly in bangalore and i didnt see a reva anywhere else. And power sector is one secotor which is going to be benifitted in near term.
GM is a biggest benifitter becase they get a cheap powertrain for low cost countries ( a 40 k volt may max sell in thousands (below 5 ) – not more than that ) but a econobox sells in 100 thousands (Suzuki annually exports more than 50,000 cars and has an extremely large domestic market in India selling over 730,000 cars annually where still GM sells in thousands which is countable in fingers )
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Sep 26th, 2009 (12:06 pm)GM must include the American market for this vehicle. If they say they want to include all segments, this will be a winner!
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Sep 26th, 2009 (12:30 pm)And forgot to add , they can add a range extender config from the learning from volt and using software developed for volt. so they can have a range extender also for developing countries.
For entering in US market – to be true – the saftey or quality of these cars are just above a golf cart. to run on US roads they cannt push. They need volt like power trains for US ( min 1.5 ltr where the mass selling car in india is only 800 cc )
another example is honda CRV is a big SUV in india, sx4 is midsize car in india, corolla is big car in india, Civic is a big car in india – now you know how big will be REVA because its a small car in india.
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+2
Sep 26th, 2009 (12:32 pm)Most of the “VOLT-bashing” trolls that favor an all-electric BEV can now rejoice! You have something else to save up your coin for.
I think the Chevy Spark will be a very cool little car and will sell very well. I hope the styling turns out to be more like the REVA above. Since I always drive less than 60 miles a day, it will be the perfect work commuter, and I can save my Vette for the weekends.
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-7
Sep 26th, 2009 (1:00 pm)GM has to stop calling itself a US car company. They build much more outside the US and provide a much better selection of cars/products to non-US customers. They only sell their most expensive crap (and I do mean crap), to the US consumer. GM is not an American car company and needs to stop lying about it.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (1:25 pm)I’m glad I unloaded my GM stock a year ago while it was worth something.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (1:31 pm)Nice to hear that! Electric drive is just great. I even like driving a little maintenance EV ’cause of the instant torque. I’m sure a full-sizer will be even more fun.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (1:38 pm)Prior to the Government takeover, I would say GM employee distribution was roughly 1/2 U.S. and 1/2 foreign. After the takeover it will work out to about 1/3 U.S. and 2/3 foreign.
/Just a rough guess. Maybe somebody else has a source with up to date numbers?
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+2
Sep 26th, 2009 (1:39 pm)“To bad it required a huge donation from US taxpayers.”
_______________________________________________
You should realize that without the tax payer assistance, GM wouldn’t be in the position it is now becoming a profitable company again and able to hire back 1,000’s of employees. This is good news and a good indicator that they will be able to pay back the loans from the government.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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-2
Sep 26th, 2009 (1:40 pm)Not smarter, they just pay the real cost of driving, or something closer to it in gas (well, suppose besides the fact that diesel in Europe is taxed less and ethanol in Brazil is subsidized). If Europe had cheap gas I doubt they would be all that different from Americans in their car preferences. Perhaps they’d have a bit smaller cars because they’re not fat lazy louts like Americans, but I think we can be safe in attributing preferences mostly to costs.
Sincerely,
A Californian
(I claim this as my nationality among foreigners to avoid condescension, but need to do the exact opposite when I encounter people from the rest of the US. I think the people from the rest of the US have a bit more accurate perspective of Californians, imho.)
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Sep 26th, 2009 (1:42 pm)Yeah, I expect this car to be introduced to Europe first, like everything cool. Sigh. Although I can’t blame GM if they do, because it could sell very well. Imagine, say, France with it’s mostly nuclear power mix and thousands of these small EVs. What a great reduction in pollution and oil usage!
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+4
Sep 26th, 2009 (1:57 pm)You may find, you want to buy GM stock again after the U.S. government unloads it shares to the public. So far the bail out looks like a worthwhile investment in the future of America. This is a global world now and America and GM have to play in the markets where-ever they can. GM had an opportunity to partner with REVA in India and improve it position there in a very large market for automobiles. I look forward to GM working out new partnerships that will insure their future. If you are an investor look forward to the day new stock in GM is for sale.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (3:59 pm)The GM partnership will certainly help Reva.
Their current model lacks any notion of American or even European ’styling’. Go to their website: http://www.revaindia.com/index.htm
Their “REVAi” model looks much like the car Crusty the Clown drives on ‘The Simpsons’. Updating their designs should boost sales worldwide.
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-2
Sep 26th, 2009 (4:12 pm)We’re not getting paid back, it was a gift.
http://michiganmessenger.com/26096/report-loans-to-gm-chrysler-unlikely-to-be-paid-back
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-4
Sep 26th, 2009 (4:28 pm)Currently, Ford is only pissing away money they made from selling their profitable brands off and mortgaging their future so I don’t care how many all electric magna-focii they don’t sell. Kudos to them for realizing they need to put little green leaves on x% of their cars so the brainwashed masses will think ‘ford-good’.
GM will be back to the trough for more of China and Japan’s monetary gifting so they can develop little POS ecomobiles that won’t sell at a profitable volume.
Does anyone here besides myself think that propping up failing companies so they can continue to fail may not actually save the economy? I know it seems counter intuitive, but when banks take risk that should sink them, but are willing to do it because they know that ultimately the taxpayer will cover their losses, and GM knows they can keep getting forced funding it is actually counter productive to our economic future. Failure is an important part of Capitalism, the worst economic system in the world except for all the others. Disallowing failure and favoring state sponsored finance and manufacturing is not capitalism. It is not competitive, it will not succeed, and at some point our creditor nations will stop lending us money. At that point, we’ll all be screwed.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (4:32 pm)You think the old GM stock is going to rocket up? Really? Why?
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (4:39 pm)CorvetteGuy,
So now instead of a Towne Car they can buy a Clown Car? (g).
I think I’ll wait for the Volt.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
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+6
Sep 26th, 2009 (5:03 pm)So, by that logic, Toyota should stop calling itself a Japanese Company. Are they liars too?
GM is a US company because this is where their corporate headquarters are, and this is where the worldwide company is run from.
Stop ragging on GM. Get over your outdated hatred. Come up to the present and realize tha GM makes the highest quality vehicles on the planet now. Buick just beat the pants off Lexus in long term quality according to JD Powers, and is the largest selling car in China.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (5:24 pm)Great for India.
Why can we get a simple GM BEV here?
No need for years of testing and development. Just drop a battery in a Chevy Cobalt and lets go.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (5:29 pm)I can’t imagine what Reva brings to the plate. I am sure that GM has much more expertise in batteries, electric motors and controllers than Reva does from EV1 days and the Volt program. Reva is developing these? They should learn from the experts at GM. What’s in it for GM?
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Sep 26th, 2009 (6:24 pm)He’s talking about NGMCO.
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+2
Sep 26th, 2009 (6:25 pm)I think REVA brings low cost offshore jobs to GM’s table and another boatload of jobs that will leave this country.
Everyone wants an affordable “E-car” of some kind, but to get it we lose more jobs to other countries.
If more consumers would buy American, then we would all gain by having a stronger economy.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (6:25 pm)Absolutely right on.
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-6
Sep 26th, 2009 (6:36 pm)Big Mistake. India already has cars that run on AIR. That’s right AIR. They don’t need no stinking battery toys. Perhaps GM has not done their homework.
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-5
Sep 26th, 2009 (6:46 pm)Agree 100 percent. GM is very similar to IBM. American in name only, although they still have HQ stateside they are primarily a foreign-employee corporation. If I was President these companies would be history in about 5 minutes after taking office. Greed will be the downfall of this country. But most empires crumble from within eventually. Our days are numbered that is fore sure.
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+2
Sep 26th, 2009 (6:54 pm)Air cars are a joke.
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+2
Sep 26th, 2009 (7:42 pm)Pls tell me the oil companies are paying back all the money spent securing middle east. Pls.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (8:21 pm)Agreed but the easiest path to BEV production for GM would be to drop the genset on the Volt as a BEV option “deduct”.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (8:26 pm)I like the looks also, hope it shows up! Would be nice to have it made here also…
I would be willing to spend my GM rewards points on that one.
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+4
Sep 26th, 2009 (9:12 pm)Far from being greedy, American is the most generous nation on Earth. We give more to help the needy, the oppressed, and the downtrodden around the world than any other country, both privately and through our government.
This will bless us through thick and thin, and for many centuries to come.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (9:42 pm)“I believe in India when those same words are formed as a sentence, and spoken in Hindi, it triggers earthquakes throughout the region…”
Could this be a prayer wheel?
On thing I like about the Indians is they consider spinning wheels a blessing. The faster the wheel spins, the greater the blessing. Just put your favorite or approved prayer on the wheel. Assorted prayers could also be engraved on the armature and other spinning parts…
Good Karma Good Karma Good Karma Good Karma Good Car Ma…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayer_wheel
http://www.tibetanprayerwheels.com/about-prayer-wheels.html
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:19 pm)Air cars are a scam. Compressed air lacks the energy density to power a car for more than a couple of miles.
There are no air powered cars on the highway, and none for sale.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (10:32 pm)lol…
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-1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:36 pm)Totally agree. But if Honda moved HQ to the US, wouldn’t that make them “American”?
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-4
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:39 pm)They will not because they don’t care to make money because we the tax payers are going to foot this integration with REVA as well as probably outsource to India other manufacturing of small parts to be re-imported back to the US.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (10:40 pm)If you want to see a very nice EV do a GOOGLE search on the P I N I F A R I N A B L U E C A R, to be delivered by June of next year.
An exceptional compact design, 5 door, seats 4, electric range of 155 miles.. cute as heck.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (10:41 pm)Check the video and listen to the song..
http://www.bluecar.fr/en/pages-accueil/default.aspx
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-2
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:41 pm)That’s kind of like thinking GM is good but their VOLT still sucks foreign juice. Talk about greenwashing BS. It’s juice sucking dirty polluter IS BY DESIGN!
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+1
Sep 26th, 2009 (10:45 pm)“to source more parts out of India.”
That’s the whole idea. source the jobs away from America by this “American” company just so they can lose money on their Halo product.
“G.M. Says It Will Make More Vehicles and Buy More Parts in India”
And you all are supporting this BS company? WOW!!!!!
Ship the jobs away and you’re happy to support them?
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Sep 26th, 2009 (10:58 pm)Reva has had EV’s for years. GM had an EV-1 for how many? And did they persue it? Nope not till the recent Volt idea. So I think REVA brings more than what GM has in BEV or battery technology.
What’s in it for GM is getting around the damn union for building small simple parts instead of paying Union dues.
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-4
Sep 26th, 2009 (11:03 pm)Good question. It can be done. But the big builders wanted to milk the gas cow forever but that all went ape shit last year and now they’re all scrambling to come out with an unaffordable EV or BEV or even worse, a polluting gas sucker Volt that just greenwashes everyone by making them think it is a 100%EV. Nope, not the case. Once that 40 EV range is gone or if it’s too cold or it needs to run the genset for maintenance it’s nuthing more than a green polluter which will never get the real world numbers in MPG as the new prissy. As a matter of fact, nobody believes the bull shit claim of 230mpg.
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Sep 26th, 2009 (11:19 pm)The AIR cars are kind of deceiving (just like how hydrogen was initially, when there was all this talk about how it was the most abundant element in the universe). It sounds great just to run on air, given how abundant it is, but really it is just running on the energy from compressing that air. In the end, even the very light plexiglass air cars I have seen aren’t much more efficient than a fully crash safe EV. They also have very little power.
Also did anyone notice comments disappearing at gm-volt lately? Is there now a comment limit or something?
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+4
Sep 26th, 2009 (11:42 pm)Helmut,
Read the report and then make a reasonable comment. Your just taking a news article out of context. Most of the Tarp money went to Chrysler and GM as loans. The government also got an equitable positions which further protect the taxpayers money. As a DIP – debtor-in-possession (a term used to describe a lender to the reorganized company), the government investment is secured as preferred in case either company fails. Secondly, it can sell the stock it will have after the IPO’s.
The article you site states, “Treasury Tough Negotiator, but Unlikely to Recover Full Investment”. That’s far from a gift. Furthermore , the report vies that Chrysler or GM may not generate sufficient sales to pay back the loans, and that the government can’t force them to issue the IPO’s within one year of the reorganization: this may have an effect of stck value. The report further claims that the value of the stock will never reach the high level necessary for the government to recover the TARP funds. While this may be true, IMHO, GM will likely become profitable under its downsizing and reorganization internally. The sales of the Volt is only one car, and they have expended a huge amount of cash in the design of the car but that was all part of the Old GM. Overall they are seriously competitive with the current lineup of cars. Initially, the first year of Volt production was set at only 10,000 but there looks like a current demand of 50,000. Not all of those on the want list will actually end up buying the Volt for one reason or another. But this is only a Want List from this site, and may not reflect actual demand upon released to the dealers. In my mind, it would be wonderful to see GM ramp up product way over the 50,000 in the first year.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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+1
Sep 27th, 2009 (12:09 am)You still have time to straighten out your finances which seems to be the problem with the citizens of this country: keep overspending with that credit card and we all will be screwed. The problem is not Government spending, its public spending on credit. The Tarp funding of GM and Chrysler were not give-aways: they were loans made in the hope that an important industry in the U.S. would continue; that thousands more jobs would not be lost in the automotive parts industry would not effect the local economies in the cities involved. I don’t know what your status is, but you are definitely not an automotive worker, saying what you think. Your distrust of the government shows, as is the case with many who speak out against anything the government does. True a lot is messed up in the Executive branch of our government; to many terms of dismantling the regulatory agencies meant to protect this countries citizens. The next year will tell much about America. Can we regain some freedoms we all believe is a right? Will America resolve its financial problems, and gain control over the national deficit through demiished use of foreign oil and the creation of new jobs in the green Industries. Instead of complaining about how our government works, get actively involve along with the government to make this a better place to live. Michael Moore is right about Capitalism: we need to take a stand and demand our representatives truly represent the average citizen or elect someone who will!
Happy trails to you!
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Sep 27th, 2009 (12:17 am)Here in the valley near the Mexican border, we see a lot of small cars traveling an the expressway. Even my neighbors went out and bought smaller cars when the gasoline price spiked in 2008. When I first saw some of these little cars, it surprised me to see the GM bow-tie!
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (12:22 am)GM indicated it was considering a BEV. It will probably be the Spark but with some design changes for the American market. And consistent with the commitment to build in the United States; assembled in new GM plant here in America.:)
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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-2
Sep 27th, 2009 (12:24 am)It’s the same old shit. Save the morons who made the wrong choices and screw those that made the right choices.
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-3
Sep 27th, 2009 (12:26 am)The cars you saw were most likely built there and not by US UAW. US UAW built cars cost a shitload more because of the UAW.
As for being a californian, GM and Toyota screwed you all with the NUMMI plant.
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-10
Sep 27th, 2009 (12:30 am)(click to show comment)
Sep 27th, 2009 (12:47 am)We are dealing in a global economy and market. OEM’s make their products in the country where they are selling; cheaper than shipping them all over the world. India and China have much greater populations than the United States.
I did a Google search and found this April 17th, 2007 article at:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18153128/
“GM is building a new plant in western India to more than double its production to 225,000 units annually. That will make India GM’s third biggest production hub in Asia, after China and South Korea, with capacity of 850,000 units and 700,000 units respectively”
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (12:52 am)IMO.. that is one ugly car!
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Sep 27th, 2009 (2:38 am)i may buy or see this car functional in the near future. REVA made its own electric car few years back but that was a flop but now with lithium ion batteries on the chevy spark drivetrain we could see this car getting more miles and it is expected to be a pure electric vehicle and it may probably not come to the united states because spark is already an 50 mpg car
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+1
Sep 27th, 2009 (7:00 am)Me thinks you need to take a physics class…
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+2
Sep 27th, 2009 (7:03 am)Agreed. I will not buy a POS Indian car for exactly that reason. I don’t buy foreign, no matter whose name plate is slapped on it. I would possibly, however, buy a BEV Focus when it becomes available.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (7:06 am)Joe, GM has more US employees than most companies have employees.
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+1
Sep 27th, 2009 (7:09 am)It depends. Would they move most of their engineers here also? People obsess about the nationality of factory workers, but I like to also consider where something is designed. Engineering know-how is just as important as industrial capacity. In fact, the two are inseparable in the long run.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (9:22 am)Agreed!
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+1
Sep 27th, 2009 (2:48 pm)You have no idea what is involved in running a large manufacturing company, not to mention that GM is also a multinational company. Nor any idea of the diverse nature of job classifications that an automotive company relies on. The Volt is not the only car they are selling. All those $billions they were lent went to sustain continued operations and supply product to a downsized dealership core. Correct me if I’m wrong … I believe if you research the topic of TARP funds lent to GM, you will find that they have paid back $1.5 billion. True that represents a small portion of what they were given. In that research, you should also find the dates on which payments are to be made. GM is far from being screwed and have partnered with the electric power industry and are on a track to end the use of gasoline as a fuel for the cars they manufacture.
Happy trails to you ’til me meet again.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (3:20 pm)To be competitive in the world economy, multinatonal companies must seek the best price for the parts. If they don’t they will not be able to make a profit on what they sell. I’ll agree with you that it was not right for GM to shut down U.S. plants and lay off U.S. workers just to increase the profit line. But sourcing parts abroad is not new. Our neighbor to the North has been supplying automotive components for decades.
As far as producing more vehicles in India, the partnership with Reva is for vehicles to be sold in the Indian market. Just as Toyota, and other foreign car makers built plants in their foreign markets (plants in Tennessee, and elsewhere within the U.S.), GM has been doing the same throughout the world. They are not shipping jobs away in this case: they are creating jobs in India. If you want to have those jobs in the U.S., then you will have to accept lower wages! The problems the old GM had were in part do to concessions made to UAW. Now UAW has to renegotiate its contract with GM in order to save jobs. GM has begun to hire back laid-off workers. And the future of GM and the Volt looks promising.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (3:21 pm)From LRGVProVolt’s link above:
But Wagoner said GM’s focus on India goes beyond market share here.
The company operates a research and development center in Bangalore, India’s technology hub, with about 800 engineers and 100 scientists.
“We are going to radically ramp up sourcing from India,” he said.
/ more food for thought: http://www.outsource2india.com/eso/about-us.asp
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Sep 27th, 2009 (3:41 pm)Unfortunately, for all those employees that were initially laid off, those who you refer to as morons, had to be saved, in order to save the company, so they may eventually be hired back.; so that companies that supply parts to GM can continue in business; so that GM employees, and parts supplier employees can buy groceries, and furniture, cars, etc. from businesses that depend on them to survive. The normal course of business in a Capitalistic society is to let a failing business die. Bankruptcy laws have evolved under chapter 11 to maintain the value of assets which would not return their real value if the company went into receivership and its assets sold at auction: thereby save jobs that would ordinarily be lost. Some of those morons you speak of are no longer at GM.
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Sep 27th, 2009 (3:45 pm)Is it really any wonder that GM couldn’t negotiate with the UAW when Mr. Wagner was raking in an obscene salary (16million+) while the company was going broke????
Ever increasing executive salaries while you try to tell your workers they need to take something close to a 50% cut???? RUFKM????
Wagner was no leader, he was a greedy SOB.
There has to be a balance, somewhere. But to think that American workers can compete with the swarms of super low priced labor in India . . . you might as well stick a fork in it right now. There’s no country loyalty anywhere, everyman for himself, eff you, eff the USA, eff everybody, I’ll get mine! (right?)
/You can’t honestly believe there’s not going to be parts shipped back from India.
// Just what do you consider a reasonable wage for a factory worker in the U.S.?
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Sep 27th, 2009 (4:54 pm)carcus1
Sorry my blog got you so upset. Mr. Wagoner is someone who has been referred to as a moron by another blogger here. He loved the ICE vehicle and probably slowed the move to EV technology. He is gone now. Hopefully, GM will move forward with a new attitude about labor in the U.S.
The labor contracts were negotiated when GM was very profitable.
Concessions were given to UAW without realizing the long term effects. In the restructuring of GM, UAW had to give up guaranteed wages. GM has begun to reopened closed plants and hired back laid-off workers. Lets all hope that the trend continues , and the new business plan will enable them to regain lost business throughout the world.
If you look at the history of the Japanese automotive industry, and compare it to that of the U.S., you find that it took fewer years for wages to reach comparable levels. Japan now has some of the same problems that the U.S. has. Their government is structured to promote their businesses, and they have created new business models that have successfully lead to their top position in the automotive world. Concepts like locating all production facilities near the others, thereby eliminating the need for large warehousing facilities to hold production parts until needed on the line.
India is one of the largest nations to become developed and is a huge market that offers GM the opportunity to make a profit. The new plant they are building will produce vehicles for the Indian market. At this time labor rates favor sourcing parts there rather than in the U.S. But just as with Japan, India’s labor rates will increase rapidly. For now, Reva will become one of the major suppliers of parts to GM. I did not say that GM would not be shipping parts back to the U.S.A.! It is nothing new for GM to source parts abroad. They have been doing for decades now: Canada used to be a large supplier of automotive parts. Then we saw movement to Mexico under NAFTA. Now we see some aftermarket parts from Korea. It would be nice if we all believed in “Buy American” and practiced it! As long as investors are greedy, we can forget that!
For a long time, the U.S. has negotiated trade agreements and very often found lack of reciprocation by the other country. Often foreign companies would make false statements about their exports to the U.S. to benefit from lower or no duty. As long as investors demand the company make a profit, we will find all sorts of maneuvers to increase profits, even marginally. This was the case with GM closing plants in the U.S. and moving them to a foreign country where labor rates were lower, even though they were already making a profit This resulted in increased profits from all the recovered wages made by laying off U.S. workers. This game payed with cheap labor abroad has reached a point of being dis-functional. In order for a company to exist in a country, it must insure employment for its people. In turn they can spend there earnings to support the nations economy. Without this delicate balance, any flutter in the world economy is worsened as seen during the recession we are attempt to end today. Hopefully GM will stay committed to producing large numbers of vehicles here in the U.S.
Heck Carcus1! You got me going. A lot more could and can be said about this topic. In a more positive light, let’s hope that this new venture helps GM bottom line. They need every cent so that they can pay back taxpayers with interest.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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+1
Sep 27th, 2009 (8:29 pm)“They’re better off getting bought by big oil.” says Anonymous Proxy.
One of the advantage of having the govt as majority owner of GM is precisely that big oil won’t be able to derail the electric car revolution from happening this time.
If we are to stop bleeding our money to the middle east, GM must come through with the Volt. They already did great just by moving all the car manufacturers toward the electric car in a form or another.
As for the money lent, Chrysler was in worst shape in the ’70s than GM is now and they recovered and paid back every penny they received. I’m not a bit worried, GM will repay the tax payers.
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Sep 28th, 2009 (4:31 am)Check out reva range anxiety and new models NXR AND NXG
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOIKbTTxiLg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tL7msa65nUY
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Sep 28th, 2009 (8:47 am)All I have to say about the picture above is that it is of an UGLY little car. Maybe the Indian market demands ugly. I don’t thing so, but GM and Reva have delivered it anyway. Ugly. Ugly.
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-1
Sep 28th, 2009 (9:24 am)“Most of the Tarp money went to Chrysler and GM as loans.”
Nevertheless, a sizable portion of that money was not given as loans, and regardless, as the article points out, for all of the money to be paid back would require an astonishing turnaround.
The net effect of government intervention in this matter is that people (union and otherwise) continue to be paid more money than what the market will support, in order to continue making products that people are not willing to pay for.
What exactly was “out of context” with respect to the poster’s comments?
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Sep 28th, 2009 (9:29 am)“As for the money lent, Chrysler was in worst shape in the ’70s than GM is now and they recovered and paid back every penny they received. I’m not a bit worried, GM will repay the tax payers.”
Chrysler in the 1970s was bigger company than it is now, and required only $1.5 MMM in loans, paying that back in about three years.
What evidence do you have for your assertion that Chrysler was in “worst shape” in the 1970’s than it is now?
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Sep 28th, 2009 (10:48 am)LRGVProVolt – Excellent points. As American Taxpayers we should all be routing for the New GM to be successful in all corners of the world. The more vehicles they can sell in India or China, no matter where the parts are made, the healthier the company will become. And the quicker they can develop new products like the VOLT for sale here in the US, and the quicker they can pay back the government loans.
It doesn’t do anyone any good to look back – except to learn from past mistakes. The old GM clearly missed many opportunities to innovate – I believe the New GM will not fall into that same trap – they will break away from other auto manufacturers by innovating and becoming a leader in automotive technology from around the globe.
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Sep 28th, 2009 (11:05 am)Your facts are correct – GM does make some of the world’s most fuel efficient cars in other parts of the world – and, believe it or not, they also make them for the U.S. market as well. Its just that consumers here in the US have not moved toward smaller cars in the same numbers as other parts of the world.
Many factors at work here – lower fuel prices (subsidized or otherwise, gasoline costs less in the U.S.A.); greater emphasis on highway safety (no country has the testing criteria that the U.S. does, nor do other countries focus so much marketing and 3rd party information on safety – which results in the ‘bigger car wins’ theory); social ranking (cars in the U.S. are a means of touting ones social status much more than other countries); the need for speed (U.S. highways are more wide open and expansive than other countries – plus people just like to go faster). It all adds up to a country that likes bigger vehicles.
So, it is not like GM does not know how to build small, fuel-efficient cars. The market here in the U.S. just hasn’t been buying enough of them. When sales volumes are lower, and marketing costs are higher, it is very difficult to make any money. Because of the various safety and emissions requirements of the U.S., GM has not been able to sell the same small cars here as other markets. The past couple of years may have finally tipped the scales in GM’s favor. U.S. consumers have learned that $5/gallon gas is painful – and their buying habits have begun to change. The bigger the small car market becomes in the U.S., the easier it will be for the new GM to begin making money selling them.
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Sep 28th, 2009 (7:54 pm)Dr. Ibringdoh,
From what I hear and see, the demand for the Volt is greater than GM anticipated and hopefully they will respond by producing more in the first year. The Volt as you know it is not more of the usual GM product line but a new and innovative type of vehicle. Many here agree that the Volt is a much better type of EV than many other manufactures are introducing to the market in a few years.
What exactly was “out of context”?
Helmut said, “We’re not getting paid back, it was a gift.”
It was not a gift and time will show that the loans will be paid back. Perhapes as the article stated, not in full. Also, would you consider not paying billions for foreign oil, a payback. What GM is doing will effectively end the $billions of dollars flowing from U.S. to OPEC countries. It will have a tremendous effect on reduction of the national debt.
Happy trails to you ’til we meet again.
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Sep 28th, 2009 (11:19 pm)Hello there, LRGV Pro Volt!
You raise some interesting points:
“From what I hear and see, the demand for the Volt is greater than GM anticipated and hopefully they will respond by producing more in the first year. The Volt as you know it is not more of the usual GM product line but a new and innovative type of vehicle. Many here agree that the Volt is a much better type of EV than many other manufactures are introducing to the market in a few years.”
I suspect you’re right, but I doubt that a single vehicle can justify $50 billion in loans to maintain a company that otherwise would not exist. Also, this vehicle has never been produced on large scale, and is largely theoretical. A company the size of GM cannot base its entire existence on one product, especially one that has not been proven in the market.
“Helmut said, “We’re not getting paid back, it was a gift.”
It was not a gift and time will show that the loans will be paid back. Perhapes as the article stated, not in full. Also, would you consider not paying billions for foreign oil, a payback. What GM is doing will effectively end the $billions of dollars flowing from U.S. to OPEC countries. It will have a tremendous effect on reduction of the national debt.”
You make two interesting points in your paragraph: one, that the loans will be paid back over time (we’ll have to see), and two, that this new vehicle will somehow eliminate imported oil.
With respect to your first point, what the article indicated is that it would take an incredible growth in the value of GM’s stock to make payback a reality. The odds are reasonably strong that the taxpayer is now providing welfare for large corporations that have collapsed under their own largesse.
With respect to imported oil dollars, creating one vehicle that uses comparitively little gasoline will not stop the flow of oil. Oil is used for a vast number of things besides making gasoline, such as vinyl panels covering the exterior of houses, ladders, fire helmets, automobiles, airplanes, buildings, and even bridges. Granted, the Volt is a very small step in this direction, but it IS a small step, and definitely not a pay-off for all the loan money being given to GM.
In all likelihood, the devaluing of our dollar as result of these loans will increase the sum value of imported oil, and possibly far more than the reduction achieved via the Chevy Volt.
I believe that I read somewhere that GM only plans on making about 10,000 of these vehicles per year in the foreseeable future? Is this true?
If my information is correct (???), I percieve no means by which that the reduction in oil achieved by these vehicles will offset the inflation created by $50 billion dollars in loans. Your thoughts?
I look forward to reading your comments on the matter.
Respectfully,
Dr. Ibringdoh
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Sep 29th, 2009 (6:19 pm)Dr. Ibringdoh,
Thank you for your courtesy.
Just on this site there is a want list for 50,000 Volts. There is a lot of material here to digest. Next to GM’s own Volt website, this website may be the definitive source of info on this vehicle. GM battery pack assembly plant has a capacity to product approximately 75,000 battery packs. That would likely be the first production limit. GM will need to build another battery pack assembly plant or add additional assembly lines for the following year. Although I refer to this “Want List”, it appears many potential buyers are not aware of the coming availability of electric vehicle. I judge from not seeing any post on this blog by you, that you are new to this blog. There is increasing publicity about EV’s and the Volt seems to be gaining in popularity. No one can estimate the total demand for the vehicle at initial opening Just because it hasn’t been produced on a large scale doesn’t mean that it is theoretical.If you look back at the more recent articles, you can see actual Volt cars being displayed: this are production grade vehicles that are being tested in the field to verify laboratory testing and and make final changes to programming of the vehicle before sales to the public.
Obviously, GM does not base its existance on one vehicle. But this is its flagship offering of its first electric vehicle. many on this blog believe it is better technology than its competitor are offering. The pro and cons of this can and are being debated.GM elected to offer an Extended Range Electric Vehicle to address possible road rage while still giving most drivers who travel less than 40 miles an electric vehicles; this technology is named the Voltec drive system. GM is considering employing it in the Converj and possibly other designs.
Provided when the company can become profitable again will determine how fast the loans can be paid back. GM cash flow will determine that when its sales start to pick up again. A separate means of recovering the taxpayers loans would be through sale of the stock owned by the government. Granted the stock would have to reach an unpresidented level for this to happen. But it was never intended for the bail-out money to be recovered only from sale of stock. As recent as August 11, 2009, testimony by Bloom before the Congressional Oversight Plan was made that it “was possible but unlikely that taxpayers would recover ‘all’ of the money they had invested in Chrysler and General Motors. I have enclosed all in parenthesis for emphasis. He acknowledged that “likely scenarios involve a reasonable probability of repayment of substantially all of the government funding for new GM and new Chrysler, and much lower recoveries for the initial loans.” Again note the word all! The report by COP is 221 pages long. I have not read all of it yet but intend on taking sufficient time to understand what points they are making.
Your point about foreign oil used for other products is correct. However, domestic supplies of oil will cover most of these needs. The majority of foreign oil is used for transportation. GM has started the push toward Electric Vehicles with the other OEM’s following in rapid succession with offering about 2011. With huge percentage of people traveling under 40 miles a day, EV propulsion offers us the means to significantly reduce our consumption of foreign oil. The figure I’ve seen is anywhere from 60% to 78% of the driving population. Those people will only need an ICE for longer trips. Most of the time they are transporting by electricity and wont be consuming gasoline. This will save $billions which will be spent in the local economies to develop new businesses instead of throwing the money away to countries who don’t support the U.S. All that money spent in the United States will result in greater taxes being collected without any consideration of raising taxes.
My whole point is that everything so far indicates that GM will survive and that its produce line is one that will sell well. The payback to taxpayers will come from a variety of sources which I have delineated above; i.e., payment of the loans out of profits, sale of stock, reduction in foreign oil usage, and increased taxes from rising wages and profits by new and existing companies.
I hope, I have answered all of your questions.
Happy trails to yo ’til we meet again.
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Oct 21st, 2009 (10:08 am)