Recently I traveled to GM’s Milford Proving Grounds for the opportunity with many other journalists to test drive the company’s entire fleet of production cars which were all laid out across a large swath of pavement called back lake.
To our surprise, in the middle of the event, suddenly Frank Weber pulled up in a pre-production Chevy Volt integration vehicle fresh off the assembly line. Presently there are about 30 of these IVers built out of a total of 89 that will be completed in roughly 6 weeks.
Though we were not permitted to drive the car, nor experience the generator mode operation, Frank did give some journalists test rides.
I was afforded the shotgun position and had two additional riders in the back seat including Sam Abuelsamid from Autoblog.
The experience of actually sitting in a bonafide running fully functional and operational Chevrolet Volt was an absolute pinnacle of the incredible long 2-1/2 year journey I’ve been on since this site began in January 2007.
To all those thousands of naysayers who said it couldn’t or wouldn’t been done, I guess you were wrong.
Below you can enjoy my high-def video of the experience.
First of all the car was sharp and sleek, and the interior was dazzling. The LCD displays were bright and high definition. There was plenty of room on the passenger side, and Frank Weber at about 6’4″ seemed to fit into the driver side without difficulty. The two journalists in the back were comfortable as well. As Sam put it “The Volt is considered a compact, but in spite of the sloping roof-line, it still felt surprisingly roomy. Both leg and headroom were more than adequate for this journ’s long-torsoed 5’10″ frame.”
Acceleration was startling. The car took off like a rocket even with all four of us in it.
Amazing as well was the absolute silence. Clearly the final design and soundproofing has had remarkable results compared to the mules. This was simply the quietest electric car I’ve ever been in.
It was smooth and nimble and did not feel weighted down.
It took quick turns with certainty.
Frank even said there was a bit of a delay programmed into the instant torque so that the final production cars would be even quicker, and would have better ride and handling. Hard to believe.
All I can say is no one will be disappointed with this car, destined to become, if it hasn’t already, the next American icon.
This entry was posted on Friday, August 14th, 2009 at 6:06 am and is filed under Prototypes, Test drive. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
+10
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:10 am)Wow!
Lyle, You are the man…….
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:12 am)Now lets start the theories about the Engine running at 4500 rpms and startling the driver when it kicks on with no muffler and how GM is baffled at how to make this a smooth transition from battery to generator.
Discuss…
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:19 am)Cool stuff, where’s statik now…. look it’s real
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:21 am)This is exciting! I hope the excitement is still there Lyle the day you have one in your driveway.
+8
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:21 am)Triple digit mpg #s on the window.
Tire Chirping take off with sports car torque
Super quiet ride with HD displays.
Quick and nimble turns.
Sharp looking interior with room for adults.
This car is going to be worth the $35K that many will spend on it after rebate.
Go GM!!!!
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:22 am)Cograts, lucky dawg! Pixie dust and unicorn horns no more.
LJG(More)VWOTR! NPNS!
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:25 am)How does the Volt compare to the Tesla S?
+9
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:27 am)I saw the autobloggreen video earlier today and thought I recognized you with your video camera up front! Your reports have much more passion (for all the naysayers I guess you were wrong!!! hahahaha)
Thanks for the great reporting Lyle
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:28 am)4500RPM would only be neccesary in two states:
1. You’re doing a sustained 100mph. I would expect noise. Who knows, myabe i’d back off to 80 at this point…(at 100 you are drawing the full 53kw from the genset, at 80 you’ll need more like 34kw, so much lower revs)
2. You are accelerating VERY hard, and the car believes you’re going to continue doing so (rather than supplying your peak power from the battery and keeping lower revs for once your power requirement levels out – which seems like a more elegant solution)
Yes, it’s a problem to make the transition smooth and pleasant, but not insurmountable. i imagine at the moment the IVers are logging large amounts of real world data to shape the final software design. at the moment there probably are some unpleasant changes, but they will be gone by, or shortly after, release. In fact, i hope that the Ampera will have no issues due to them being ironed out in Volts, so win-win for me
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:29 am)koz,
Amen! What a thrill for Lyle and through him for us too!
Be well,
Tagamet
LJG(More)VWOTR! NPNS! (nice touch, koz)
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:30 am)Look up there, that’s a Volt. Try and find a picture of the Tesla S. You won’t (i.e. it doesn’t exist yet).
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:31 am)OK – It meets all our expectations!
Now when will us mere mortals be able to own one????
Come on Lyle, use that new status you have at GM to get a few thousand of us on your wait list some of the gen-1 Volts!!!!!
Go GM – Go GM Volt Team!!!
NPNS
PS – Can’t wait to be able to play with all the display options!!!!
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:45 am)______________________________________________________
Excellent Volt update & vid Lyle…thanks!!!
______________________________________________________
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:46 am)Dear baby Jesus, Please let me have a Volt! And bring back my smokin hot wife Carly.(along with my new girlfriend)
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:50 am)statik would just say “it’s not for sale yet – if so, (he’d say) where can I buy one? heh, heh.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:58 am)Me stuffs more cash in the buy a Volt pile.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:59 am)Oh he would just post some financial results to cool us down… we miss yeah Statik
Hey anyone else notice the hood design has change since the first reveal?
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:00 am)Janet,
The short answer is “we don’t know yet”. I’m pretty sure there will be a comparison piece here when it arrives though.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:02 am)Jim I,
Let’s try for a few hundred (first)(g).
And yes, I’m excited too (lol), but Lyle has been pretty “big” at GM all along, no?
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:04 am)frankyB
True on the stats thing for statik.
I didn’t notice the hood, but what were the symbols around the tail lights?
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:07 am)I wouldn’t read too deeply into that. Maybe Lyle was just the first guy to yell “Shotgun!” as he ran like a giddy child towards the car. ; )
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:08 am)Ok, posted before I watched the vid. AWESOME! I really liked the last few seconds with the Camaro and the Volt in the same frame. Still not sure about the lack of tactile feel for the buttons on the center stack, love the screen in the center stack, and glad gray is available (don’t like white). Seemed very quiet as expected, now let’s have a ride in charge mode and that will shut up the naysayers. It can’t be that loud, rough, bad…….anyone whos ridden in a caddy knows GM can make an engine quiet.
Thanks Lyle!!!!!!!!!!!!
+15
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:10 am)The Tesla S will be an electric car with no range extender engine/gas tank. The biggest difference is that a Volt owner will never EVER have to rearrange his life around his car charging schedule. You can always fall back on gasoline mode in a pinch. That’s all I need to know.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:10 am)Jim in PA,
If you listen closely there was a woman’s voice directing the car seating. She probably just saw Lyle running toward her (lol).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:11 am)Jesus isn’t baby, ya dang fool! He’s a man! Heh.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:12 am)Me thinks Sam wanted better photo/vid location in the back seat……….I’ve made some good vids in back seats
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:14 am)What’s up with the headlights? They appear to be round; a very different style from the elongated swooping rectangle we’ve all been shown (and shown in the header of this website). Well, it does look like there is a temporary black plastic panel on the front of the car, so maybe they are still fine tuning the headlights. Really? Can that be true? If so, how absolutely bizarre not to have something as simple as a headlight already nailed down. What gives?
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:16 am)If you mean the round headlights, then yes I noticed. But it also appears to be temporary black plastic paneling in that area, so maybe it’s just a temporary thing.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:16 am)Lyle,
Congrats on your first ride. I hope soon you can get in the driver’s seat. Time is getting short – we are almost a year away.
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:17 am)1.) I assume you are being snarky, no?
2.) Didn’t GM already dispell the rumor of the engine running at 4500 RPM under normal conditions?
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:20 am)It looks as if the IVERs are built with whatever part is available without respect to color. The lens does appear to be missing though.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:22 am)Yea, I watched that one last night and swore it was Lyle’s voice coming from the front seat passenger. Had a little chuckle when Lyle’s was posted this morning.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:30 am)Yes,
I have always assumed that GM would have no problem starting and ICE and running it smoothly and quietly as needed to power the generator. With comptuer control, you can do just about anything with an ICE at this point. With a battery as a buffer, there should not be any reason to quickly do anything with the ICE.
In the past, when the ICE has not been used, we have argued over the reasons why and there have been concerns about noise etc. etc. I assumed Lyles comment about no ICE operation in this test drive would bring on this same discussion.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:31 am)What’s different about the hood?
+20
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:33 am)Everything is just right! Big on the inside. Refined on the inside.
Superb looking on the outside.
It’s truly the GM Icon for the next 100 years.
Lyle, that video ought to be saved for historical purposes.
And, other OEM’s ought to be panic-stricken if they are not on the pathway toward E-REV like GM is doing it (with 10y/150k warranties as well).
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:34 am)Less than a year if we consider the Independence Day 2010 date I keep floating. At the very least the preproduction Volts will be on the road by then (I think).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:36 am)Check the name (Ricky Bobby). Watch the movie.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:38 am)Thanks for the interior shots Lyle. And the silence is deafening. Back seat looked a little snug for the cameraman, but this is a communter car, not a family hauler/family weekend vehicle.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:39 am)Huzzah’s to that, brother!
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:40 am)I’m thinking/hoping there may be more “secret sauce” to the charge sustaining rather than just noise/vibration concerns. Maybe a motorhead could speak to the feasibility. We know GM has worked with modified Atkinson cycle from the two-mode hybrid program. We also know they done active cylinder management. Is it practical to run an I4 with Atkinson cycle and cylinder deactivation? 2 cylinders for up to ~15KW output, 3 for ~25KW, and 4 for more.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:40 am)Lyle:
Awesome that you got the ride in the IVer—congrats!. Thanks to the GM guys too as it is great to see them giving these opportunities to ride and look over the cars. One question I have been wondering: are the IVers performing to spec. in terms of 40 miles range? My hope would be that they would actually surpass 40 miles AER.
sidenote: It is really, really good to have a tangible, actual Volt car in the flesh (so to speak). I can’t tell you how many times I have read, even on this site, that “this car will never be made” and “GM can never make a car like that”, “just vaporware”, etc. etc. It’s a nice vindication to see an actual working EREV buzzing around a proving track. My compliments go to Lyle for being so tenacious for 2 1/2 years, for diligently providing daily topics for us all to read and discuss, and for taking all of the time for this out of his own life to further this cause. Do you ever sleep Lyle??? Congrats and thanks again!
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:42 am)Thanks, yes, definitely us too.
/None of the small details sneak past you.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:42 am)The back seat is a better vantage point. I saw Sam’s video yesterday and he pans back to look at the cup holders in the middle and the trunk space. His video had some interference when it went by the battery. Not sure if that was just a glitch or if it was affected by some EM interference.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:44 am)I like the 2-tone leather seats
I like the capacitive controls.
I dont like/understand the raised areas on the top of the dash.
It seemed quiet in the internal & external videos.
Can we get more shots/info on the LCD screens?
What information can I get from those screens?
Thanks to you Lyle
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:45 am)Reposting from below since this may be more relevant here:
I’m thinking/hoping there may be more “secret sauce” to the charge sustaining rather than just noise/vibration concerns. Maybe a motorhead could speak to the feasibility. We know GM has worked with modified Atkinson cycle from the two-mode hybrid program. We also know they done active cylinder management. Is it practical to run an I4 with Atkinson cycle and cylinder deactivation? 2 cylinders for up to ~15KW output, 3 for ~25KW, and 4 for more.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:46 am)Kudos on the ride !
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:46 am)Jim:
Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but I think I read before that IVers don’t get the actual production headlights. The purpose of the IVer is testing, validation, tuning, etc. For all intents and purposes, mechanically the Volt IVer is in production form. Details like lights will be completed and ready for actual production vehicles to go to customers.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:47 am)Yes, it is amazing what can be done with conviction. Imagine this is only the start. With continued conviction, EREVs will really become something special. Onward to Converj, Orlando, small pick-up, etc.
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:51 am)That was so cool Lyle. And they even new your name and gave YOU the front seat.
This website is important!
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:54 am)MarkinW,
I thought that the back seat looked “snug” too. I thought that they were to be the same as the front seats.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:57 am)Schmelts,
At the risk of repeating myself (and you) Lyle proves that “One man can make a huge difference!”
I hope he gets a good deal on the book and movie rights.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:57 am)WOOOW
looks real good and can’t wait for mine!
White and black
The only problem I saw was the clock was set to
Sunday January 1 2006
at least it was not flashing like my VCR.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:02 am)kdawg,
IIRC the drivers screen is “configurable to allow them to move different info around and choose the data that they want to see e.g. digital vs analog speedometer. Sounds COOL! The middle display will have info similar to the current Prius (I think), except it’ll include AER info..
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:06 am)Deactivating cylinders on a four cylinder engine would have it far, far more prone to ignition knock, especially if anything at all were to become inefficient with practically anything else on the engine.
You see, the angle of leverage of the crank is not adequately angled during combustion for a four cylinder engine to have any cylinders deactivated. The minimum you could use is 6, and, 5 cylinders also being quite “chancy” for pre-ignition and other ignition-angle problems.
Even a good V-6 ought only do cylinder deactivation within a higher rpm range-band.
Very impressive things happen in the GM V-8 to protect the catalytic converter if there is a cylinder firing malfunction. (E.g., that same cylinder fuel injector is deactivated, preventing a big gulp of raw fuel going into the catalyst at each misfire).
But for VOLTec, all these historical advancements of all other technologies has already been considered, with the very best of the very best technologically-proven designs already integrated into Volt.
That’s what’s really exciting to me also. GM’s engineering departments represent the “environmental selection process” in human form, whereby, “the very best environmentally-friendly designs succeed to survive”. Volt is the winner of the natural selection process.
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:07 am)I regret that I have but one plus to give to this.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:10 am)“Though we were not permitted to drive the car, nor experience the generator mode operation, …..
.
.
.
“To all those thousands of naysayers who said it couldn’t or wouldn’t been done, I guess you were wrong.”
=====================================================
Lyle, did they happen to slip you some of that GM coolaid whilst you were there?
Until you get to experience the EREV portion of the drive, all you have done is experienced a BEV. While the Volt interior may be cool, it in no way should or will decide on the success of this vehicle.
You are currently riding the proto mini Cooper, which is a BEV. So, tell me is the torque and ride of the Volt really that much better? Maybe I am missing the point of what your saying, but I just hope your keeping your journalistic neutral side in the game.
WHY does GM keep hiding the EREV experience? Some things do come to mind.
1) The noise at specific rpm’s may be higher than GM wants
2) Imagine experiencing that high torque, off-the-line take off with the battery at full charge. Now, imagine the same experience when the Volt is in SOC. Might, this be very disappointing, as well as dangerous? If you hit the gas and expect to accelerate out of a dangerous situation, but the acceleration is just not what you expected, would this be a problem?
3) Cycling between running off battery only and starting the ICE to run the generator is more difficult than it appears on the surface. Their are so many combination’s and factor to take into consideration. The firmware may just not be ready?
I have heard SO LITTLE about the generator used on the Volt. This is a major component of the Volt, but why so little discussion or tech. information on its operation?
/just another day…
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:15 am)I’m glad the ride was good enough to impress Lyle. It was notable that Mr Weber said that some of the parts were still prototypes, that is, not production intent, so they must still be revising something. That’s good, because every problem that is identified and removed before production makes even the first customer get a more nearly perfect vehicle.
My guess is that the intended audience for the present-day 230 mpg PR and driving demos is not us or the buying public. There would be no point in that, as there is nothing for sale right now. The intended audience is the federal auto czar and his minions on gm’s board — gm needs to keep the bread crumbs dropping to keep the federal dollars flowing in. There are several more billions still available, perhaps. Following the WSJ theory of the Volt as existing as bailout bait, it has been immensely successful. What’s there now should be good enough for some more cash flow, it seems to me.
The problem for gm with completing the Volt is that when the Volt is finished they don’t need any more federal money to develop the car —- right now the sizzle is more valuable than the steak. That is, for federal support it is better for development to be “just a little more help needed” for a long, long time. Maybe someday there will be a real car for sale —- looks like it will be a good one if/as/when it happens.
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:28 am)RB,
I think that GM has other vehicles to use as crumbs for the govt money. No need to hold up the Volt. ON the contrary, getting IT out will show just how well they can implement Voltec and grease the skids for larger infusions.
JMO.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:32 am)CNN Money has a quick vote on when you will drive an EV like the Volt… right now the numbers are bad 30% say never.
how about we skew the numbers a bit and vote “As soon as they’re available” …
http://money.cnn.com/
and scroll down to Quick Vote.
1. When do you believe you will drive an electric vehicle such as the GM Volt?
As soon as they’re available 7%
In the next 5 years 22%
Sometime in the future 41%
Never 30%
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:32 am)This may be the super-neat “transmission” that Lutz referred to months ago. Under-promise, Over-deliver! Although I’m definitely not a Gear-head, I HAVE been called a crank-case (g).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:36 am)Fine.
But you need some fairly deep pockets to be one of the first. I think realistically it will be 3-5 years before most “common folk” ever have a chance for EREV/BEV rides.
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:45 am)BUT WHY are they not showing the car in the generator mode?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:45 am)Congratulations, Lyle. Now next time I hope they let you drive.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:50 am)The only thing missing from the end of that video was a drag race with the Camaro! That woulda’ been sweeeeeeeet-ah!!!
Attn. Marketing Guys: Put a couple coats of Victory Red over that primer. Get some nice shots for wallpaper downloads ASAP! Thank you.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:51 am)Tag you need to change lol.
Perhaps:
LJGT(Production)VWOTR?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:55 am)Even the center display look good!!! I HATED the display on the early Volts. It looked to me like was just dropped in like something in a trash compartment.
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:57 am)GM seems to be going the extra mile to make the Volt efficient; extensively tested batteries, 100′s of hours of wind tunnel testing, low power draw stereo system, etc.
I think it is possible that GM will use an HCCI engine for the range extender. Not only does this increase gas mileage, it reduces emissions. The Volt is an ideal application for this technology, as the engine only operates at several select speeds and power settings.
It could be that GM doesn’t yet want the public (and competitors) to know that this technology will be introduced on the Volt. GM has had prototypes available for more than a year now. When the engine switches from spark-ignited to HCCI mode, the journalists could detect a change in the engine noise.
“After that, it automatically switched to HCCI mode (as evidenced by the operation mode display) . When that happened, I did notice a slight change in the engine’s timbre, an ever so faint diesel-like clack just after switchover.”
http://alternativefuels.about.com/od/researchdevelopment/a/HCCISaturnAura.htm
The other factor that weighs into this is the recently announced 230 mpg rating. If I look at slide 31 of the Argonne Lab presentation (which I believe was posted by Nasaman), at 40 miles AER, the CS mpg needs to be ~80 mpg. This seems outrageous, so let’s consider that fact that AER may be 50 miles. Even still, this equates to 65 or 70 mpg (extrapolated). So the use of a highly efficient ICE seems to be in line with the data supplied.
As GM states, this is their “moonshot”. So the Volt is their statement to the world that they can innovate and develop the world’s most technically sophisticated vehicle, vastly exceed the efficiency of any other car, and demonstrate a reliable means to ending the transportation industy’s 96% dependence on petroleum.
+8
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:00 am)This “VOLT vs. Prius” comparison of which is the better deal needs to end. The only thing they have in common is they use electricity in one fashion or another.
The comaprison should be “$40K VOLT vs. $40K ________”…!
There are plenty of commuters driving Lexus, M-Benz, and others that would be interested to know about the performance, fit-finish-features of the new VOLT. Get an IVER in the hands of one of them. Let’s hear what they think of the car.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:01 am)Agreed –it reminds me of how I felt when I went to my first Daytona 500 —just plain giddy!
“Frank even said there was a bit of a delay programmed into the instant torque so that the final production cars would be even quicker”.
And I’m still daring to hope the final production cars will modify the control electronics algorithm to also allow “trouncing” on the accelerator to deliver neck-snapping 0-60 times as well as a distinct “passing-gear” effect from say 45-75 mph!
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:20 am)The EREV experience will be no problem.
I drive a Prius and it cycles the engine on and off all the time, most of the time you are totally unaware that the ICE engine has come on at all.
Chelsea Saxton has actually heard the Volt mule in EREV mode from outside of the vehicle as it drove past and she called it “Prius quiet”.
http://evchels.wordpress.com/2009/05/25/poker-faces/
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:23 am)I declare this America’s car. The transition to electrification of transportation just started. Congrats Lyle.
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:29 am)Really? I was under the inpression that the IV units were supposed to be hand-built versions of the actual final production car (not including changes make to correct short-comings, of course). If they don’t test the headlights in the IV stage, then when will they test them? What comes after IV yet before full production?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:34 am)Sigh… Now comes the anti-climatic part where I explain my unfunny joke. My comment above was what a Ricky Bobby family member said to him at the dinner table when he invoked “Baby Jesus” while saying Grace.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:36 am)Nice to see you posting friend. Hope all is well with you!
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:44 am)I am looking for window cranks and don’t see ( 1 minute 28 seconds on video) any so I hope that means power windows
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:45 am)JEC,
Are you trying to take over statik’s place (without the links)? Some of the top management have said that the engineers do not see the charge sustaining mode an issue. Either you can believe them or you can doubt them (personally I believe them), but doubting Lyle smacks of the most terminal of Doubting Thomas’. When Lyle has experienced it, will you doubt his word until you ride in one yourself? The “early statik” doubted that the Volt would ever see the light of day, but he evolved as the facts moved the project along.
Sorry for the rant, but I think it’s warranted.
Be,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
-8
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:46 am)Tag
I am absolutely for getting the Volt our the door .
Your motto LJGTVWOTR is my own.
However, my life is not in marketing, but my close friends who do that keep telling me never to forget to remember the question “Who is your customer?” For the Volt “the customer” is the feds (just as it is for Lockheed) because they have the $billions. IMO none of the other gm vehicles are green enough or visible enough to make a $Billion-level sale to the fed. To me that means that the Volt is intrinsically a niche car, and indeed the most successful niche car in history.
All gm has to do is eventually produce the first 10,000 Volts, and declare the Volt a success (as it shows every sign of being). I’d like to see the wheels on the road, but for gm it is better to proceed at a measured pace, carrot always a little beyond the nose, with a good outcome in the end, whenever that is. The Volt will hold everyone’s attention while it is still “to come”, but after that it is “just another car”, so gm has to take advantage of it now.
Once the Volt is for sale, then it loses the focus, and gm moves on to sell other cars in higher volume. I think that gm has a good plan, just as building the high visibility but low volume Corvette has been a very successful niche car in the past.
/ posted with regards to our late great poster statik (smile)
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:47 am)OK! I’ve seen another video. Is there a possibility to see a pre-production model coming to my town or area anytime soon?
In GM’s hay day, they would have trucks loaded with a new concept vehicle to go from town to town to show the living, breathing people their new idea. This is about like the idea of selling the Volt on e-bay. I guess only GM knows what stupid thing is going to happen next for, the rest of us surley are at lost.
By the way, the Video trip we just took could have gone a little further on that 230MPG trip, couldn’t it?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:51 am)I believe that GM has said that HCCI would be well adapted to Voltec but will not be in the GEN I car.
As for the 230 mpg number, there are a number of different ways to get there. One would be if the Utility Factor was different for the FTP shift schedule. Or the EV range might longer than 40 miles. Very hard to say. But given that the number for the HWFEET schedule, though still in triple digits, is expected to be much lower, it doesn’t seem likely that the mpg in charge sustaining mode will be above 50 mpg.
Too many unknowns with the methodology.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:56 am)Tag,
I have no illusions of being a Statik. I am just saying that until we get someone to provide real feedback on the EREV experience, then we cannot judge the success of the EREV.
It just seems to be a logical conclusion, no links will be provided.
If Lyle gets to experience the EREV, I will definitely be listening. I also, would never make a judgement by a single source, but someone needs to be first, and Lyle would be an excellent choice.
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:08 am)I just took a self-imposed vacation away from GM-Volt posting for a week. I did get on the site each weekday. I did not even try to read all the comments everyone made, but I skimmed through them. Wanted to comment several times, but I had told myself to not comment for a while. I had become just a little over-powered by the site lately and wanted to back off some. Statik leaving gave me pause and made me realize I did not have to be active as much as in the past.
Thanks for your thoughts.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:10 am)Notice how it goes all the way to the side and the side panel finish just under it. Well at the reveal, on the black version we have seen and even on the logo of the site here, you can see the side panel going higher up to the same level of the hood.
My guess it that it is easier from an assembly point of view. Also less fitting involved.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:11 am)Reading that CNN Money article makes me realize how many idiots there are out there that have no clue. Most of the comments were very negative towards the Volt. One guy was commenting about the Volt being a very small Micro-car compared in size to a Smartcar. Another guy says that GM needs to have their cars less expensive than foreign cars because American cars only last 5 years. I could go on and on… I do my best to change peoples attitudes towards American made cars and the Volt in particular but it may be futile. I hope not.
-2
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:22 am)Your conspiracy theory that the Volt is just to get bail out money is sort of ill supported. Everyone knows that Obama is not going to let GM fail. They’ve already erased $100 billion worth of debt or something and if they need more money, they’ll get it whether the Volt is still being worked on, or is in showrooms. Almost every major auto maker is working on bringing at least one electric car to market, even Volvo and Jaguar. I don’t think they are doing it for the bail out money.
I CAN see the Volt playing a vital roll in helping GM meet future CAFE standards. Even if they are hoping there is a serious future in Voltec being iconic, which they obviously do, and profitable, which I think they do, the Volt being an ace in the hole for meeting CAFE standards, is a nice little bonus.
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:28 am)As mentioned, the Tesla S will be a BEV not an EREV. On the downside, it will be powered by something like 8,000 laptop batteries wired together. Not only is this almost impossible to manage, but you’ll need to replace the battery pack every five years or so since this chemistry degrades with time regardless of use. Also on the downside it will probably cost $70K and, like all high end specialty cars, it will cost a bundle to fix (can’t beat a Chevy for repair prices).
The upsides is that it will be faster than the Volt and much roomier. It’s also a more elegant car, at least IMHO, and will have more tech gadgets.
I’m thinking of the Volt as something of a BMW 3 Series and the Tesla S as more a BMW 7 Series but those analogies aren’t really very good.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:28 am)Ha ha, they probably didn’t want to put the Camaro to shame. I can’t wait for youtube searches in 2011.
“Volt vs Camaro”
“Volt vs Prius”
“Volt vs Tesla”
“Volt vs Killacycle”
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:32 am)A fellow employee drove her new car to work yesterday. It is a popular hybrid (hint). Here is our conversation….
D> Wow, this is yours? Got a new car huh?
Co> Yes.
D> How long have you had it?
Co> My husband and I bought it the last day of the cash for clunkers program.
D> So about a week, nice.
Co> The third dealer we went to had what we wanted.
D> So you traded your old car. What were you driving?
Co> A Jeep.
D> So how is this new one? Pretty peppy?
Co> Well…ah (pause)
D> Kind of like a Civic?
Co> Yes, we were spending so much money on gas, this is better.
____________________________
Thanks for the Iver test ride Lyle. Stay healthy and keep up the good work.
=D~
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:36 am)Amen to that. My old car is history …. needs more repair then it’s worth. So I am in desperate need for a new Car. But trying to hang in there for my VOLT.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:39 am)Yes, until some people have driven it in charge sustaining mode this is an open question. But my guess — based on the fact that Boniface said it was no big deal at the moment and it wasn’t mentioned in the parade of horribles listed in the financial report — is this won’t be a problem. I think they’re tuning not fixing. However, most problems you see are those things you didn’t anticipate. Something else will go wrong no doubt. It’s not the problems you know about that get you it’s the problems you don’t know about.
As for the comparison ride between the Volt and the Mini-E, that would be interesting. Keep in mind that the Mini-E was slapped together with very minimal testing and was not created from the ground up as a BEV. So you have a dicey implementation of the AC Propulsion drive train — AC Propulsion has publicly said don’t blame them for the problems — in a car not designed to be a BEV. Doesn’t seem like a recipe for a great vehicle.
FWIW I don’t think you’ll see much “cycling” between charge depleting mode and charge sustaining mode. Once the car is in charge sustaining mode the battery will be used to assist the genset under heavy loads and that’s about it. GM has been fairly clear on not intending to charge the battery other than minimally in charge sustaining mode for the reason that grid charging is vastly more cost effective.
-7
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:39 am)Lets be honest, this is rich America’s car. At 40K+ only a tiny percentage of Americans can afford this.
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:45 am)I agree, why do they keep hiding this? The generator is the selling point that EVERYONE on this site talks about. No “range anxiety”, right? There is nothing special about electric mode, there are a boatload of electric cars. So why won’t they show anyone the main range extending part of the car at this late date. It’s very disturbing. After everything GM has been through, “take our word for it” just doesn’t cut it anymore. Show us!
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:46 am)Good for Lyle that he got a ride. Next up — he gets to drive an IVER.
What’s most interesting to me is that Frank Weber is moving to what I’d think was the next step in selling the EREV technology — the EV experience. Seems to me that GM has scored with the 230 mpg number. Genius move really. That got everyone’s attention. But to get people other than the nutty fringe excited you need to sell people on the experience. It may be time to move beyond the simple environmental and technological advantages of “no gas” and start moving on to other consumer benefits in order to expand the potential market.
EREV is going to be pricey for quite a while, even as GM moves up the learning curve and down the cost curve. If you can sell the EV experience as a luxury ride than you can sell the vehicles using the technology at luxury or premium prices. So keeping talkin Frank!
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:46 am)Saving the best for last, maybe?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:50 am)Ahhh, i see what you saying now. Looks like they opened up the hood area a bit. The new style seems to work better w/the headlights. I wonder if it helped in water drainage too.
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:50 am)I completely agree. The media, in general, over the years has completely manipulated much of the public. I have a friend that just completed some training as a loan officer at a bank, and basically, that bank feels that toyota and honda vehicles are preferred loans. That means that if the same person came in wanting a toyota or a chevrolet with borderline credit, they will be denied a chevrolet and approved for a toyota. All we can do is work it over one comment at a time.
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:50 am)Need to Vote again
Chevy Volt or two Nissans, which do you prefer?
Just the one Volt for me
Two cars for the price of one? Sign me up!
You’re all crazy. I’ll just take the single LEAF
None of the above
http://green.autoblog.com/2009/08/13/nissan-leaf-vs-chevy-volt-challenge-deluxe-edition/
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:53 am)Sorry Dave K. I accidently gave you a minus. I’ll give you a plus the next time I disagree with you. That may however take a while. Or you could give me a minus and we can call it even.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:53 am)I’m wondering if they will have a face that starts to smile when i’m “hypermiling” and frown when i’m squawking the tires.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:54 am)For one thing, a Tesla “S” will cost around 50-80% more (depending on which projected MSRPs you use).
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:58 am)Yeah Tag, I got a pretty hearty “HAH!” out of it when I saw some official GM video* and one of the GM people said, and I’m paraphrasing here, “as you know, Dr. Dennis and his site are not affiliated with GM.”
I call FOUL on that! Lyle and this site are the best damn thing to happen to GM in many, many years!!!
* = (sorry, I forget where I saw this, I was watching very late at night and shoulda been sleeping instead… maybe it was the 8/11 presentation, I can’t remember).
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:59 am)From the pictures I found on the green.autoblog, I see what looks like a red emergency stop button left of the driver area near the door. Why does this have that button? Is this going to be part of the full production vehicle? Does anyone know? I don’t remember an emergency stop button being part of the specs…. Here is the website, look closely left down of picture near his leg.
http://green.autoblog.com/gallery/quck-ride-in-the-pre-production-chevy-volt/#18
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:02 am)Dang you, er, “Me”!! I have avoided seeing that movie ever since its release… but you’re making me lean towards renting it now. Darned movie reference memes!!
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:06 am)DanK…
It’s okay, I am used to abuse.
The big deal concerning the Volt besides burning very little oil is that the car is peppy. Up to now, have you ever heard “peppy” associated with a hyper efficient car?
FOUR average size people sitting next to a 400 lb battery and the Volt is still “peppy”! Add the lack of strain on the driving components and a quiet ride. Quite a package.
=D~
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:07 am)>> hand-built versions of the actual final production car
Yes, but only to a certain extent. Frank even pointed out during the video that IVers, including the one driven, are not -exactly- the same as the final production Volts.
Secondary things like lighting and (forgive the awkward expression) immaterial materials choices (e.g. paint composition, seating fabrics, head/taillight assemblies, interior plastics), aren’t all that critical and can easily be substituted and tested independently, later on.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:09 am)>> Do you ever sleep Lyle???
I’ve wondered that myself. Let’s hope to heaven he gets a solid 8 before doing brain surgeries!!
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:11 am)I’d say it’s only credit where it’s due, zipdrive!
Would this vehicle even have been greenlighted without the groundswell of grassroots support, for which THIS VERY SITE is responsible?
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:11 am)He did say he stole it right off the line… maybe nobody had set the clock yet.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:13 am)And even that was a Cruze mule, and almost three months ago! It’s no doubt even quieter for the IVers.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:19 am)People have gotten used to so much power in the last 20 years.. I cant imagine worrying about a sub 10 sec 0-60 time in a family car (assuming you are being coy about a Prius).
Can you imagine how she will feel about the gas savings when it gets back up to $4 a gallon?
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:22 am)I guess that it is just human nature for some people to need visibility and attention – just like there is always someone willing to play the role of “class clown”. The role of “cynic” must have looked inviting.
The Volt program was started almost 3 years ago – well before anyone dreamed of the magnitude of this economic collapse.
And I really don’t understand the point of your diatribe. Are you saying that you think GM is insincere ? Since the ultimate motivator of capitalism is money, doesn’t that make most corporations equally so ?
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:24 am)They are a car company… If they’ve learned how to do one thing in the last century, this is probably it….
Just sayin’!
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:24 am)Okay, enough hype. Sell me one, already.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:26 am)Maybe the big secret is that it’s an HCCI engine?
Edit: BillR beat me to this speculation.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:26 am)“What’s most interesting to me is that Frank Weber is moving to what I’d think was the next step in selling the EREV technology — the EV experience.”
They have been doing this for a while, this is what the whole thing about keeping mum on the genset is all about.. to concentrate the minds of the journalists on the BEV experience.. otherwise they would be comparing it to a Malibu or something like that. GM has some pretty smart people working on marketing.
You really thought they had problems integrating a genset to the DC bus?.. probably the simplest task in the whole design.
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:26 am)Ladies and Gentlemen,
With this video of Lyle in a production Volt, I would submit to you that Volt Wheels are now On The Road.
Perhaps we should change the closing statement to:
LJGVITD!
LetsJustGetVoltsIntoTheDealerships!
Way to go Lyle and congrats to GM!
-2
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:32 am)Is it just me or does this car get ugglier every time I see it? What started out as an exciting, cutting edge prototype now looks totally uninspiring and common. Too bad. Such a shame it looks like every other car you wouldn’t want to own. I can’t imagine spending 40k on something so bland. Sure, it’s environmentally friendly…but why can’t it look good too?
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:37 am)Agree on the interior, but very weak on the exterior styling. For a car that is supposed to revolutionize personal vehicular travel, it sure is yawner. Dodge, although lagging GM in schedule, has the circuit, which is a hot looking car in all respects. Too bad GM chose to début their gasoline assisted EV in a boring, ordinary, small family sedan.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:37 am)Very cool car. It’s a shame that the price point will be way beyond what the average American can afford. Most of us are having a hard time making the payments on a $15,000 to $20,000 dollar car, let alone a $40,000 dollar car.
Before posting any videos, I would always recommend using something like SteadyMove that goes into Adobe Premier. Apple’s new iMovie has the same kind of feature built in. There’s no reason to have that camera bouncing all over the place when there is software to fix that.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:39 am)That is a wonderful video. Another milestone has passed.
By the way… I could see Camaros in the video. I went ahead and ordered one in January and picked it up about a month ago. It is truly a great car. I love it. The Volt will be my daily driver and the Camaro will be my weekend car.
Thanks Lyle!!!
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:39 am)I disagree about HCCI being ideally suited for EREV. The efficiency is great but cost and weight are not. Atkinson cycle makes a lot more sense to me for the near term. I wish they would give a little more detail here.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:40 am)I think that would have to be incorporated into the traction motor.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:42 am)Even once the battery is “depleted” and the range extender turns on, you’ll still have 35% battery SOC left, so there is still plenty of juice to give you some peppy acceleration.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:45 am)Yeah, to Frank Weber if you read this, thanks for your cavalier hijacking of the IV from PPO. I loved it!
“Step on it, Frank!”
“I am, I just have to make sure I don’t leave any dead bodies behind”
Classic.
Lyle, you got shotgun? You’re the luckiest man alive, ha ha.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:53 am)Are we debating this one again. Once a month for a year and a half and from now on until cars are in showrooms…..yawn.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:56 am)I know several people who have said. Forget it I don’t like your loan terms I’m paying cash.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:02 pm)its only on the prototypes and mules.. a safety disconnect in case something overheats or catches fire.
-5
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:06 pm)Look I was never a “nay sayer” but the only reason GM did this was to try and catch up with companies who are leading the way. Like Toyota with the prius. If they would have gotten their heads of out of thier “money pockets” the Amarican Auto makers would not be palying catch up!!! What amazes me is they are still lagging…
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:09 pm)I think GM is hoping all of their competitors are of the same opinion that you seem to be. Why would GM uncover their ace till it was time to rake in the winning hand. An electric generator is no big deal But controlling the power it produces and timing the start and stopping of said power quietly and smoothly is. We will see it when it is as close to perfect as GM can make it.
I think GM has built enough gas engines and generators [before they were called altenators] to be able to master any problems that come up.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:12 pm)Fab video,,NOW I’m starting to really get excited by this.Can’t wait to not hear one on the road. If only they had dressed it up in the original skin….
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:13 pm)I think the matte-colored Frankenstein look of IVERs don’t do it justice.
Although I was excited by the first glimpse of the show car, when I look at them side by side now I much prefer production Volt.
I’ll take mine in silver or black.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:14 pm)Even if the car is everything they say it will be the price won’t be. I can’t believe everyone is so quick to forget about the $40,000 or above price tag.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:16 pm)Brian, your being short sighted. LazP is saying that in 20 years from now, when all new cars are electric, historian will look back at the watershed moment that started it all and they will see the Volt. Just like now when we look back at Henry Ford and think assembly line.
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:17 pm)Its nice it is a game changer plus they solved the range anxiety issue. If you think about it that’s why they equip a sailboat with a small motor. One thing with the low clearance on the front air dam when GM compared that to the Corvette and standards one has to remember the Volt does not have a Corvette suspension system. Nobody want to run up over a curb when parking towards the curb. I looked at my friends BMW and even the 5 series has ample room to clear a 4″ curb.
Overall there is a lot of positive things about the car.
I read where the volt only hasa 300 miles max distance although I wonder if it was through shrinking the gas tank to keep the MPG average above triple digits?? a larger aftermarket tank would be nice.
I will be curious over time about the bearings for the electric motors and how long they will last especially on bumpy dusty gravel roads. My 1984 skylark bearings only lasted 120,000 average so after 225,000 on my Alero I proactively replaced them.
+7
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:19 pm)People who think there will be a problem selling Volts at the rumored price don’t know the demographics of the country they live in. There will be people next summer and fall looking at Acura TLs, Nissan Maximas and 370Zs, BMW 1 and 3 series, Infinity G37s and Audi A4s that will see that the Volt has a $7500 tax credit saves a $1000 a year in gas and still has cutting edge tech found no where else.
Some will realize not getting the Volt and choosing their favored entry level luxury car means leaving $12,500 on the table if you keep it for five years and $17,500 if you keep it for ten years. Saving $17,500 on your near 40 thousand dollar purchase is a big deal, even for someone who can pay cash!!!!
That’s a lot to lose sleep over at night. Cutting edge tech and a pile $17,500 high sitting on the dining room table, or a European or Asian Luxury nameplate in the driveway.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:22 pm)Of course GM knew they were in trouble three years ago. The “economic collapse” just sped it up. And yes, there was federal money on the table for retooling loans at the time that GM debuted the Volt prototype.
These aren’t new relevations. Instead of insulting people about things you haven’t researched, why don’t you to a quick search or two to educate yourself?
Here is pretty much the first link I hit in google. It is a blurb from “Bailout Watch 1: Energy Bill Earmarked $25b for Big 2.8 “Re-Tooling” at TTABC in Dec 2007:
“It must be said that $25b is a lot of billions– especially when its your tax dollars on the line. That’s doubly true given that the money was earmarked for companies retrofitting factories built before 1987. That means virtually all of the cash would go to The Big 2.8, as the transplants (Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, Nissan, Mercedes, BMW, etc.) built the lion’s share of their domestic production facilities after that date. A federal bailout by any other name would still smell so rancid. ”
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/holy-energy-bill-earmarked-25b-for-re-tooling/
-5
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:24 pm)According to some analyst from Financial Times, the Volt may well bomb GM for good. I agree. If competitors like the Chinese BYD and Nissan bring cars 40% cheaper than the Volt, GM may be in a bad shape rather quickly with the Volt.
If it turns out that the Nissan Leaf costs under $20K and people end up installing special charges to allow people to recharge in 30 minutes the Leaf may become viable (think about it, major employers could just install special recharging stations to give incentives for people driving electric) then the Volt may not sell many units.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:24 pm)“The big deal concerning the Volt besides burning very little oil is that the car is peppy. Up to now, have you ever heard “peppy” associated with a hyper efficient car?”
_____________________
Only the car that inspired Bob Lutz to say, If some little start-up in California can build an electric car why can’t GM. (I’m guessing there were just a few cusses removed from the version released to the public)
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:32 pm)I think they want to focus on the EV experience. This way is simply calling attention to the transition to the generator though.
Just my own rambling but maybe they should have had folks see some heavily sound insulated version of ICE start-up in the very beginning and then let that fade from memory and tell everyone from now on they are focusing on the EV experience and not engines, which have been refined over the last hundred years and clearly are not problem with GM using a 1.4 liter four that is sold globally.
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:34 pm)Maybe you would save more gas by reversing their roles, depends on your driving patterns though
-5
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:35 pm)Regarding, “And I really don’t understand the point of your diatribe. Are you saying that you think GM is insincere ? Since the ultimate motivator of capitalism is money, doesn’t that make most corporations equally so ?”
Most, but GM has been pretending extra hard, haven’t they? And this site becomes quite the tool if true.
GM’s PR for the Volt was of a widely available and affordable car to help the environment and get 78% us virtually off gas.
I think a lot of people here actually believe that. In case it wasn’t obviously false, the pink-tied-creator himself has pretty much shot all that down over the past few interviews.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with reminding people as to what GM’s ultimate motivation is and what they most likely consider the real success factor here: PR and Federal Dollars.
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:37 pm)I’m not knocking your assesment, but I think historians will see Tesla as the real watershed moment. The first true publically available EV. Then it will probably look to the first mass produced, widely available EV, which we don’t know who will get that. (Leaf maybe?) The Volt is a self described stopgap car (still with an ICE) so I don’t see it being very historic with everything is headed to full BEVs in the future.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:38 pm)Before alternators they were called generators, at least I think that’s what my Dad told me
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:41 pm)If you want looks, you have to buy a Tesla or Fisker.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:47 pm)Funny I see assembly line and I think Ransom Olds. You never know who history will declare to be the winner. No more Oldsmobile so, say this to the coming generations and people might say, what’s up with that crazy old guy. Unless we have always on ubiquitous computing and a wiki of Ransom Olds pops up on their shirtsleeves!!!
Tomorrow will arrive when we fall asleep tonight… NPNS
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:53 pm)While I agree $40K for the initial offering under a Chevy badge is probably a mistake, I don’t think you can go that far. GM will rise or fall on its other offerings and on how quickly it can integrate it’s hybrid tech into other models.
The proper response to the Leaf is not the Volt but an all-electric based on the their experiences with the new batteries. Personally, a battery version of their skateboard concept would be cool if it gave them enough range.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:54 pm)Different markets for different needs. The cars are each very unique and BYD will be highly modified (much more expensive) if it ever reaches mass sales, and more so if it reaches the US and has to comply with FMVSS and CARB standards.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:58 pm)I would love to. Just as soon as it appears in the GM ordering system. That is, of course, if you are not going to attempt the “eBay Motors” way of buying a VOLT. (gag!!)
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (12:59 pm)Bravo! Here here! (cue very loud applause)
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:08 pm)Koz, you are right.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:09 pm)when is comming for road test in canada??? (montreal)
-7
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:09 pm)It has become the ugly red headed step child…and for 35-40K I wont buy an ugly car. Somehow Gm got people to buy the a$$tek though…
I will never buy another GM car (so far only one non GM car in my family and it was 66 mustang). GM closed my grandfathers dealership…95 years in business selling cadillacs taken away from us…But we got a check for $22K to compensate us… Gm said we could keep buick and GMC but we had to take any car they deemed we needed, we had to build a new facility … FU@# GM FU@# the Volt…GM should never have been bailed out…If you guys are seeing how GM is screwing over the local dealers who have been with GM from the get go thourgh the good and bad times, youd possibly have a different view of things…
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:17 pm)OK I’ll go back and watch the movie again.
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:30 pm)______________________________________________________
…that was classic.
Give Frank +1
______________________________________________________
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:33 pm)Again, you are speaking as if the VOLT will be the ONLY e-vehicle that GM ever makes. Not so. This is just their first ‘proof-of-concept’ with Voltec. Once the VOLT hits the showrooms, the lesser-expensive EREV Cruze or other small chassis version will be close behind.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:40 pm)Of course GM built the Volt concept car to attract attention and positive publicity – that’s just smart business, especially if you can use it to generate profitable revenue. Who are you, anyway – Karl Marx ? How’s things over in Utopia ? Your argument smacks of the old “vaporware” crap – that there really is no car here … check out the man behind the curtain. I might as well admit it, I believe we landed on the moon, too.
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:42 pm)I think it is good to take a break sometimes, and re-charge the batteries, (no pun intended). Glad to hear you are doing ok as well. Sometimes it easy to get hyper-involved when you are passionate about something, but if you don’t step away or tone down the involvement it can cause un-due stress. I wonder about Statik from time to time and just wonder if he got burned out here. Then I wonder about Lyle too for these same reasons.
Lyle, if you’re reading this, it’s ok to take a breather every now and then, and Statik, if you’re reading this, it’s ok to “un-retire” if you ever feel you want to. Just throwing that out there.
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:44 pm)BFD. Sometimes you have to walk before you run. How about pointing out some successful auto companies that DON’T behave this way ? Ben and Jerry’s ? I just hate seeing grown adults whine all the time.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:52 pm)Great! Now bring a dozen to Charlotte Motor Speedway for a (Safe) demonstration race! “A win on Sunday is a sale on Monday!”
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (1:56 pm)What if it is a $40K and below price tag?
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:00 pm)I believe Statik is OK. I see where he does some blogging on other sites. Not like he did here. Same for me. I have commented on some other sites, but only a little. As far as Lyle is concerned, I can’t speak for him, but although he is busy with GM-VOLT it is a different kind of pressure. He steps away a lot, I am sure, by doing his doctoring while attending GM and other auto companies’ events. But, if it does get to be just too much for Lyle, he should just step back for a while like I did. I do not plan on continuing at my previous level of comments. It is just not that important to me anymore. Maybe I have become too involved. I commented a lot in the past, but my comments never approached the thought provoking comments of Statik and a number of others I have grown to respect. You notice I am “speaking” in general without discussing Volt topics. I may continue reading and watching the comments of others for a while longer with only a few comments here and there. I am well although I do have small problem that may require light surgery later this year. Thanks for asking.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:02 pm)I’d prefer a Volt Finder app for my iPhone. Have it pop pins in google map of all the ones for sale at dealerships close to me.
-17
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:09 pm)(click to show comment)
-24
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:15 pm)(click to show comment)
-11
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:20 pm)(click to show comment)
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:22 pm)Don’t forget that the Nissan LEAF will be on the road BEFORE the Volt and it will get 367 MPG using Volt Math.
+6
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:24 pm)Roger,
Step away from the Ram….we know what gets you excited.
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:30 pm)And that might matter if it had a range extender…Maybe a Honda generator will fit in that fifth seat.
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:32 pm)mmmmm Fisker.
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:37 pm)Consider this: If the windows were manually-crank, on ANY $30k+ vehicle, how well do you think it’d sell?
It’d be marketplace suicide-by-poor-design.
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:40 pm)Removed. (I hit the wrong reply button! sorry)
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:42 pm)Fascinating idea. I wonder what Tagamet will say about this — didn’t he come up with “LJGTVWOTR” in the first place? Whatcha think Tag?
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:56 pm)RB,
Sorry for the tempest in a teacup this started. As I’ve stated many times it’s nice to live in my world. It’s OK for people to work hard and make money. The Govt doesn’t need to bail anyone out. and the Volt arrives on Independence Day 2010 – less than a year from now. AND we’ll be pleasantly shocked at the things that GM has under-promised and over delivered.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:58 pm)If it help for water drainage, it can also help air flow…
-2
Aug 14th, 2009 (2:59 pm)Absolutely Not True. Deactivation on 4 cyclinders is highly efficient and trouble free. Keep your rubbish off this site please.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:01 pm)JEC
In shrinkery when we look at someone we say “look to the history” and you’ll have some idea of what to expect. The history on this site is that it provides info, as it’s available with a pro-Volt spin. I expect that to continue. To date, I have never felt mislead by this site. Some of the posters, maybe, but not by the site itself. I expect that that will continue.
Don’t you?
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
-18
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:03 pm)(click to show comment)
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:03 pm)kdawg,
I heard that they have the driver’s seat wired to “discourage” inappropriate driving (g).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:06 pm)Mike-O,
FOUL and Phaff! Not affiliated my arse! (lol).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
-16
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:07 pm)(click to show comment)
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:09 pm)Thanks Lyle for the HD video. It looks and sounds great on the full screen! Way to go GM. Go VOLT.
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:20 pm)I didn’t bother reading through the comments yet to see if anyone has already answered this one, but anyone know if those are the production tail lights? I thought the Volt was going to have those LED ring / bar looking taillights ?
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:29 pm)RB,
Maybe they’re building it for YOU.
I am pretty sure they’re building it for me. I haven’t been in a GM showroom for like 20 years. I would definitely go for this car, and almost certainly buy this car.
Sadly, my car (and other product) choices typically do not sell well to the general public, but very often the early adoption technology lives on in future generations of products that cost much less and are popular.
(Like, I have an Apple Lisa, for example, which is maybe not a bad analogy for the Volt. The Mac version of the Volt will probably be very popular.
Besides, back before January of 2007, I don’t think GM was actually planning to go bankrupt. I’m not sure they could have planned such a clever bankruptcy plan and yet not have come up with a clever plan that would have kept them OUT of bankruptcy in the first place!
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:30 pm)Guido says “I guess that it is just human nature for some people to need visibility and attention – just like there is always someone willing to play the role of “class clown”. The role of “cynic” must have looked inviting.”
————————————————-
If you would rather that I stop posting, then I will.
It seems to me logical and not at all cynical for gm to think about how product plans can and will affect government support. Certainly I would do the same were I in the same position as gm. One does have to wonder about why gm is putting such a tremendous amount of time and effort into what is going to be, from all indications, a low volume vehicle.
At the least how things look from a government viewpoint is a perspective to be considered. As for my posting it, more than one perspective can appear on gm-volt, and when that is the case it makes reading the posts more interesting.
As I said in the first line, if you would rather I stop posting, then I will. I’m not joking.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:33 pm)So… which neighbor are you going to ask for a ride?
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:34 pm)but it would fit on a small trailer
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:34 pm)I would love to have one, just like all the other people who post on this site.
As I live in a state where availability is going to be low to non-existent (NC), I am not thinking that is going to happen for the Volt. I am sure I will enjoy seeing my congressman driving his (smile). But perhaps it will possible for me to have some subsequent generation or off-shoot of Voltec into another gm vehicle.
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:36 pm)It looks as if the lights in the IVER are not the production head lights or tail lights.
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:38 pm)Hey Rick, you might want to turn your sarcasm detector on. Nobody believes that the Volt will beat a Camaro or Tesla. I think you’re taking everyone on this site a little too seriously.
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:38 pm)I vote Laguna Seca!
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:42 pm)omnimoeish said “Your conspiracy theory that the Volt is just to get bail out money is sort of ill supported.”
———————————————————–
It is not “my conspiracy theory” but the viewpoint put forward in some opinion columns in the WSJ. As you no doubt know, the WSJ has not been supportive of the Volt project. (I like the idea of the Volt because I see it as technically innovative and thus exciting.) The WSJ columnists ask, quite logically, why a corporation in financial distress has been putting large sums of money into a vehicle that has poor prospects (because of its high price and low projected volume) of giving a good return. I think that is a good question.
However, it is not my intention to disrupt you or the gm-volt site — I am a supporter of the Volt, not an opponent. Accordingly, as I said to guido, I will just stop posting and let everyone go on in peace, and with my best wishes.
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:45 pm)It brought attention on the wrong thing because we are not normal
but most of the resulting articles came out pretty good with no malibu comparisons.
+4
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:49 pm)Does the leaf have any better chance of being under $20k than the volt does? (Even if they leave out the batteries from the initial cost, they still have to be paid for somehow… even if later).
But it will certainly be interesting to see what the price points of electric vehicles are. Subaru and Mitsubishi have quoted around the mid $40k’s for their cars in Japan…
Sadly, I just don’t see a <$20k electric (highway) car anytime soon…
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:52 pm)If so, that makes the reason why they didn’t drive the IVERs in generator mode even more of a mystery.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (3:54 pm)Ah, but it’s just the first generation.. Many years from now when electric cars are putting out >2000ft-lb of torque and >600hp for cheap, you will be thanking us old early adopter balloons. Or bassoons or something. Eh, I don’t know, I’m old.
I will also point out that the first gas cars were even slower than that! (But it was ok, because if you went too fast you risked running over a dinosaur or something)
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:03 pm)The Volt is on the road! That’s the car in the video.
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:06 pm)“The minimum you could use is 6….”
_________________
Better call up Honda and let them know.
http://www.dancewithshadows.com/motor/2010-honda-vfr-1200-v4-photos-revealed/
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:07 pm)Besides, driving around in a 5 Series or comparable luxury car is so passe in many affluent communities that most people yawn when they see one pass them by. Why try to keep up with the Joneses when you can use the Volt to leapfrog right over them ?
Anyone remember when Hollywood icons grabbed up the first Gen 2 Priuses that came out a few years ago? Well, if GM does things right, the Volt will become the new darling of the rich and famous.
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:13 pm)Looks so much better without that nasty mac-white center console. Amazing what a little paint can do.
Thanks Frank for stealing the Volt and not leaving a trail of dead bodies from them speed demon bloggers egging you on
. And thanks Lyle for giving us a shotgun view of the Volt.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:22 pm)Even if the Leaf is around $20k (not including the battery lease), a 100 mile range is not enough to make it the primary car in any family… whereas anyone with money could make the Volt their daily driver. Even Elon Musk doesn’t drive the Tesla roadster around on a daily basis; he prefers his Porsche 911.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:25 pm)Who cares if the Volt’s 0-60 time is “only” 8 seconds? Once the batteries in your BEV are depleted, your 0-60 time will depend on the speed of the truck that’s towing you.
+3
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:38 pm)Although I’m from near your dealership (I think), I can’t buy one yet from you (it will be gen II or so before I fork out that amount of cash). However, I will try to get as many older people that I know as I can to buy a Volt when they are available. Your contributions to this site from the perspective of a dealer have been very valuable and every gm-volt.com-er who lives near you should get their Volt from your dealership if they can! Advertise your dealership on this site in the weeks before the Volt comes out and I bet you’ll find some customers.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:46 pm)That really sucks. Unfortunately, if GM weren’t cutting dealers their wouldn’t be a GM to sell vehicles from in a few years. I really hope they consider re-establishing relationships with people like your grandfather in the future. I would probably hate GM too if I were in your position, but they had to cut costs somehow. I doubt they did this out of spite, they were in an impossible position. In any event, don’t knock the Volt- it is only innovations like that car that will save the company and allow them to give dealers great cars once again.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:49 pm)I understand your anger and expect I would feel the same if I were in your shoes.
They closed the Buick dealership in NC where I have purchased my last 4 cars. I don’t know how long they were in business but I would guess nearly that long. They were great people to do business with and I will miss them.
The dealership is still in business and is trying to make it in the used car business. I doubt they will be successful but I hope so.
Aug 14th, 2009 (4:55 pm)Even tho I am not a fan of BEV autos at this time I do expect they will in time be a [if not the] major player.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:02 pm)Wow it’s almost a waste of time to respond to this….
Eliezer google “extended range electric vehicle”
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:06 pm)Roger ramjet
In a very short race the BEV’s would win the race. How about we race the Volt against the Tesla on a 500 mile back roads, small town, with no rapid charging stations. [ you know, a place like most of the country] You could say that would not be fair as the Volt could get gas as needed but the Tesla could not get the needed quick charge to win. [my point exactly] The Tesla could still win IF THE TOW TRUCK IS FAST ENOUGH.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:07 pm)Arkansas Volt,
I really agree with you. If I am able to get a/my Volt a few months ahead of time (in time for the Renewable Energy Roundup in Fredericksburg, TX in Sept, 2010), I would also first make the rounds to the various financial institutions to explain why the Volt ought to be considered in the same quality category as those with the best vehicle value retention and low maintenance in conjunction with the 100k “Bumper to Bumper Extended Warranty”.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:07 pm)Well done, Lyle, well done. It’s wonderful how sincere and inviting Mr. Weber is.
And this car…. I think I’m in love.
NPNS!!! =D~~~~~~(L)~~~~~~~~~
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:09 pm)you call the volt costly yet you think saving money to a car that is going to be well more expensive, and even if it were cheaper, I could get a cheap electric kit car. The thing is Tesla has a cool electric car but I could never afford it and neither can the majority of consumers. I will say I can not afford the volt right now but in a few years after release when the technology is cheaper to build the price will go down. Its a Chevy a name that has been around for a century or so. I would go with the Chevy over Tesla. But I do like the Tesla just not as much as the Volt
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:12 pm)Ummm… isn’t that a Motor Bike which uses differently designed engines.
I agree with Dan Petit here. Cylinder deactivation on the current crop of I4 Automobile engines would be…. inadvisable. Doesn’t mean GM couldn’t have built an I4 which could cylinder deactivate, but since the Volt’s engine is just a “small” modification of the I4 engine that won’t have cylinder deactivation (As far as I have heard), I don’t think its likely for the Volt.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:41 pm)So long as they’re only trying to sell a “niche” quantity of Volts (What, under 40 – 50,000?), and the Volt still has both novelty value and a growing reputation as a superior vehicle (no PR-wise disastrous problems), I don’t think that the $40,000 price tag represents a problem.
I think that the trick will be for GM to be able to lower the price significantly about the time they’re ready to sell them in larger quantities, say, 3 or 4 iterations out. Or something. I imagine a lot of somewhat unpredictable changes will have occurred by then.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:43 pm)Except for that one guy who thinks we are all “shady”… Heh heh…
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:46 pm)“Not only is this almost impossible to manage, but you’ll need to replace the battery pack every five years or so since this chemistry degrades with time regardless of use.”
Maybe a little more clear (although less simple) is…
Laptop batteries in the Telsa Model S use a Chemistry Called Lithium Cobalt which has very poor shelf-life. Range will decrease by 70% over 5 years, regardless of how its driven, and potentially more in different situations. Volt’s Lithium batteries use a relative new chemistry called Lithium Manganese Spirel, which promises much better shelf-life, though actual real-life testing has not been complete for the 10 year time frame. GM has taken extra care to ensure the same Electric Range for 10 years and backed this up with a 10 year /150,000 mile warranty of the battery. Telsa’s battery warranty covered 3 years/36,000 miles and only if your Battery capacity falls below some percentage.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:49 pm)I’m still hearing DJ’s and filler-talkers on the radio mention the 230 MPG meme-thing about 3 times a day. I think it’s the best PR yet for the Volt.
Aug 14th, 2009 (5:57 pm)Wouldn’t the hurt MPG somewhat?
Would be interesting to see Volt versus Leaf + Trailer Extender
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:00 pm)“Don’t forget that the Nissan LEAF will be on the road BEFORE the Volt and it will get 367 MPG using Volt Math….”
…(You left out) and be dead on the side of the road before you get from San Francisco to Santa Rosa, while the Volt will take you all the way from San Francisco to Washington and the Canadian border, stopping only for gas.
Who the bloody heck cares if the Leaf will be out a few months earlier or not? The Volt is a much more ambitious vehicle.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:04 pm)Ummm…. wow, how astute. It IS a motor bike.
I was refuting Dan’s blanket statement that you can’t use cylinder deactivation on a 4 cylinder engine.
It is possible to successfully engineer cylinder deactivation on 4 cylinder engines.
Honda looks like they’re getting ready to go into production with a V4, Mitsubishi’s used it before on I4′s.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:09 pm)A good side not is that in Japan, there is a -massive- government incentive for Battery Cars. I think it works out to 15,000+.
Japan has next to no domestic supplies of Oil and a robust Nuclear Industry.
However, its unclear if the BEVs really are mid 40ks or without the incentive they would be mid 30ks.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:14 pm)I still prefer the Tesla over the Volt. Tesla is a pure electric car where the volt still has a gasoline engine. Still a slave to oil companies.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:18 pm)|OO|
l l
~LL~
~ ~
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:25 pm)There are various measurements of “quick” in the Auto world
0-60, Quartermile, 0-45, 50-70 etc
With no shifting, hiccups, hesitations, or load noises etc this Volt will get from 0-60 in the same time as someone really “pushing” cars in its class. I think its similar to someone getting into a Tesla Roadster and going -wow- 0-60 in 4s this fast and easy!
IE, the Volt is going to seem more practically quick since people aren’t going to have to “abuse it” to experience the full accleration. And since the electric motor is efficient over a very wide range, “full accleration” in the electric mode shouldn’t waste nearly as much energy when in a gas car.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:32 pm)got to love this:
66 mustang was a GM car?????… and you are saying you had a GM dealership???????
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:46 pm)One guy? Try all of America.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:49 pm)I generally prefer cars that cost twice as much too….as long as they get me there.
Will be interested to see the Model S when it arrives.
Aug 14th, 2009 (6:56 pm)marc said “only one non GM car in my family and it was 66 mustang”
You missed the word “non”
+2
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:03 pm)OK, OK, I’m gonna “come outta the closet”, Jack Hole……
I ride a Yamaha R6 (FL license plate ‘NASA GUY’) that’ll blow the doors off almost anything with 4 wheels w/ its 0-60 time of 3.6 sec. & its top end of >145mph. (BTW, it also gets ~50mpg!)
So Mr. Hole, why not just go shove your head up your own hole?
/BTW, if you want to compare vehicles for acceleration or top speed, I’ll gladly enter any manned rocket I’ve ever worked on and leave you in a “BLACK HOLE”, my friend!
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:07 pm)I had to read it twice but what he said was it was the ONLY NON-GM car in the family.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:13 pm)Nice! I still don’t like the center console though, but that’s something pretty minor. Maybe it’s better in person.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:14 pm)Tag, I believe what you saw around the tail lights was notations from the line test folks of the gaps between the bodywork and the light housing. One of the very big concerns in build quality is maintaining tight gaps in the bodywork.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:20 pm)Cab Driver,
Thanks, that makes perfect sense about the tail light arrows (and they need to get that RIGHT).
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS!
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:24 pm)Shock, I think you misunderstood me. I was disputing Roger’s claim that pure EVs are bettter than the Volt because of better acceleration. With the Volt, there is no range anxiety, whereas if you have a BEV like the Leaf, you’re screwed once the batteries reach 0.
I understand the benefits of an E-REV… I don’t think Roger does.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:25 pm)Omni,
The Volt would have a tough time against killacycle! That puppy would stand a good chance against Nasaman.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:30 pm)They would sell at least 1. CJS model.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:31 pm)NZDavid,
Along those lines I was wondering what will happen with this site once the actual production Volts DO hit the streets. It’d continue to be a great place to chat about Gen II, III, IV etc or other Voltec vehicles, but I don’t know how Lyle feels about “going on” once it’s “Mission Accomplished Day”.
Re the anagram, I think I’ll hold it as is until the preproduction Volts get into civilian testing hands (if they go that route).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:38 pm)I don’t think it’s any mystery why we haven’t been shown Charge Sustaining mode yet. With 15 months to go before product launch GM wants to dribble out info and experiences very slowly to keep us fish on the hook.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:39 pm)JEC: With respect to your fret about off the line performance in CS versus CD mode; Frank Weber has stated very clearly that all performance in CS versus CD mode is to be indistinguishable (at least until you’ve exceeded 53 kW for so long that it needs to limit instantaneous power to 53 kW to not drop the pack SOC below a danger level.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:41 pm)Now you are talking!, Yup I want to see it on the cover of Automobile, Car & Driver, Motortrend, Newsweek, Time, and the WSJ! Then I want to see Lyle there too! Sure I will buy a couple of copies. Then they will sell every Volt they make on Ebay. The time is not quite right yet for the unveiling of the Victory Red Volt…
I expect the gen-set start-up for the press will happen when the weather gets colder, hope Lyle is there to witness it. With the summer time media blitz coming next year we will see the Victory Red Volt in the spring. Or so I predict…
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:43 pm)Tag,
Are you putting me on your coach? ( I do prefer Corinthian leather, like the Volare, if you have it)
But, this site is used as a voice for many people. I would expect the site to have plenty of pro-Volt voices, but there will be other voices, right or wrong.
Is this not what makes this site worthwhile? If we all said “GM, your the greatest. You deliver on every promise and provide the highest quality car at the lowest possible price”, then, would this site be worthy of visiting?
BTW: I thought you were retired? Don’t expect much in the form of payment. Maybe I can wire up the electrical outlet in your garage for you.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:47 pm)With all the money I save on the Camaro over the Volt, I could buy a whole lot of Al Gore’s carbon credits. Then I would be “Greener” but then who would know?
Silly thought I know, just had to say it.
Aug 14th, 2009 (7:54 pm)I’m plumb out of coaches, but I have a really nice leather couch warmed up for you (g). I was referring to Lyle’s behavior historically as honest and genuine. That many voices are heard here is uncontested, including yours AND mine. I saw you questioning our host, which in my opinion is more than a hair over the line. I guess it’s hard to appreciate your view waaaaay over there, from mine here with my “rainbows and Lollipops. NOTE I did NOT say koolaide. That would be an insult.
As always,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:05 pm)Speaking of the wheels; WHY DO I SEE LUGNUTS! What happened to hubcaps!!!
Lugnuts are a pain in the %#&* to clean. I want a hubcap app!
Thanks
/nobody listening
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:07 pm)Shock Me
I LOVE that skateboard concept, and it’d really save a ton of resources if a person just wanted to purchase multiple “shells” instead of the 3rd car that some families get their teens.
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:14 pm)“I don’t think there is anything wrong with reminding people as to what GM’s ultimate motivation is and what they most likely consider the real success factor here: PR and Federal Dollars.”
You say this like it’s a bad thing! lol. I don’t know if you know this but PR is a very valuable thing. It can make or break you. You think they give huge salaries to marketing executives for show?
Also, the point for federal dollars is to put a carrot out there for companies to follow. Kind of like motivation to go in a path that our nation needs to follow. Instead of say driving more and bigger Hummers to driving with less fossil fuel and being more sustainable.
I think most people understand GM’s situation. They were in the crapper. Are you happy with that? Sometimes when you are in that situation you have to swing for the fences. Get a bit crazy or suffer a slow death. I like to think the Volt is that swing. Maybe it started off as a just a PR stunt but has evolved. As the true potential of transportation electrification was realized and the discovery that the E-REV concept can start that transition without any infrastructure, well, things have just snowballed from there.
You might dismiss the Volt as but another shady project that takes your tax dollars away but I feel it’s going to go down in history as a true innovation and valiant attempt to hit a home run. Go Volt team!
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:16 pm)Lugnuts? Some time ago there was a picture of a Volt wheel in a studio with a hub cap I liked that one better.
I do not like dirty naked exposed lug nuts…
Do appreciate the chrome though.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:20 pm)Tag,
Ok, I think I now understand what your saying. Sorry, I just missed the point about insulting Lyle. It really was not an insult, but more of a poke to Lyle, that he needs to be sure he keeps himself removed from all the hype. Lyle is immersed in the Volt, and sometimes, when your involved so closely, you can lose your objectivity. This is just human nature (this is your area of expertise, so I will stop with that)
I truly was not attempting to demean or put Lyle down, but more just a request that he keep his balance.
If you pulled up my past history, you would find that I have often given Lyle much praise and kudos for all his effort.
And again, maybe your able to see deeper into my posts then myself, but if you think I was aiming the comment regarding people who make only positive GM comments, at you, I was not. I was attempting to simply convey that idea that this site is based upon controversy.
BTW: I did mean couch, but if the coach is of female persuasion and exhibits traits similiar to Megan Fox, than I will take her instead.
Take care.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:30 pm)Wrong, wrong, wrong. The Chevy Volt is a watershed car in the history of transportation. Completely apart from getting an EPA of 230 MPG, this car will HANDLE, and ACCELERATE like no other typical four door car ever.
It will be a WHOLE NEW WORLD of motoring for America and the rest of the planet.
Get over it naysayers – you have been wrong from the beginning about the Chevy Volt and the motivations of GM.
Get over your jealousy and your obsession with Toyotas and Hondas and the technology of the last millennium.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:32 pm)Then I guess you’re not my kind of girl.
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:39 pm)The Meagn Fox virgin of my couches is VERY popular. It sure makes an hour of “therapy” fly by (wink).
Be well,
Tagamet
Let’s Just Get The Volts’ Wheels On The Road!!**********NPNS
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:42 pm)That’s a good video Lyle. Thanks. The more videos of the Volt the better. I’m looking forward to seeing the Volt at dealerships next year so I can test drive one. I hope to see one at an auto show in the next 6 months or so if GM has them ready.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (8:55 pm)GM has been planning the Volt for a long time. Long before auto bailouts etc. etc.
The Volt V1.0 is and has always been a green halo car. They will not make money on it and will not sell them in significant numbers. 10,000 the first year is a very small run for a company like GM.
The benefit is that they can have a 45 foot inflateable Gorilla outside of the dealership holding a sign that says 230 mpg. This brings in the people who see the loaded showroom car at $49,750 and then decide that maybe the $17,000 cruze at 40mpg is worth a look or the $21,000 Mailibu at 33 mpg (I personally like the 32mpg Equinox).
If more people see what GM has in the showrooms, they will sell more cars. The Volt will help bring more people to GM and will give GM some green cred.
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:11 pm)I wonder if they had a chance to crank up the ICE for the test drive? It would be nice to know what effect that would have on the noises level.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (9:34 pm)Gotta love TV press coverage and articles like this one about the Volt “driving experience”.
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5235222n
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/08/14/tech/cnettechnews/main5242252.shtml
“What surprised me though was the handling. As Weber dipped around the couple turns we took, the car seemed to really stick to the road, and I didn’t slide off my seat at all.”
It sounds like the suspension and handling is going to be really good. GM did a great job on the suspension for the Cadillac CTS according to the auto magazines. They say the CTS’s (especially the CTS-V) suspension is one of the best in the world. As good or better than any BMW or Benz. Hopefully, GM will make the Volt’s suspension as good as possible without it costing too much.
I feel like I’m 16 again. I just want to get my hands on a Volt and take it out for a spin for an hour or two. I think by November 2010, people will probably be standing in lines at dealerships wanting to test drive a Volt. It’ll be like when Apple released the first iPhones. I have a feeling that the Volt design team is going to “deliver the goods” bigtime with the Volt. People will love their Volts like they do their iPhones maybe. Who knows?
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:01 pm)Quoting Jack Hole:
>> “I get there in about 3 seconds DAILY on my motorcycle.”
Oh, so you’re that jackass.
Another mystery solved.
+1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:03 pm)RB,
IMHO, you will get that opportunity to purchase one of the Voltec cars far sooner than you thought. GM has already shown that they intend to use the Voltec technology in other models. The Volt will not be a low production car for long.
As far as the so called bailout to GM, you obviously aren’t a GM worker who has been called back from layoff. The number of people who work in or provide supportive business to the auto industry is what has driven this nation to its stature in the World. Its great news to see them produce such forward looking products. The time for the electric car has arrived; the need for non-fossil driven transportation because of declining petroleum production, expanding world economy in third world countries, and global warming to mention a few. GM conceived the Volt before the recession hit us. IMHO, you all will find in the future that GM was far ahead of their competitors, and did a superb job from conception, throughout all phases of planning, development, testing, and all the necessary changes in the companies structure. You and the your government will recoup every last dollar we provided to save the company, its industrial base here in the United States of America, and all of jobs and businesses dependent upon them. Had our government not helped them through those trying times, America as it once was, would not be anymore and you would have a really good reason to cry the blues.
To all those who were so skeptical of GM and the whole Voltec program, all we need do now is look at the coming full production of the Volt, one beautiful vehicle!. Go Volt!
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:06 pm)You know it. PS. I did not know you were a cat; it’s interesting to learn that.
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:09 pm)>> “I am, I just have to make sure I don’t leave any dead bodies behind”
He even sounded a little like Ahhhnold when he said it. First class!!
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:15 pm)I agree. Why not build the suspense?
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:24 pm)Mike-O
The cat is one of those metaphor thingies. Agile, mobile, OBVIOUSLY happy, and all that…
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!*********NPNS!
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:28 pm)Haha! I guess you’re right!
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:36 pm)LOL! @ JonboinAR.
Golly, Red HHR, that’s really got your topknot in a tizzy, doesn’t it? Maybe you can get some clear covers for yours.
-1
Aug 14th, 2009 (10:47 pm)Chill Jack! Chill!
+5
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:00 pm)I have a Prius, and a few years ago drove cross country.
Going up the Rocky Mountains was a real pain – the battery drained, and the 76 hp gas engine had to strain to just keep the car going up, up, up at about 40 to 45 mph in the right hand lane (well, the car was packed, pretty heavy).
The Prius battery is only 1.3 kWh, and they keep the state of charge between 80% and 40%. If the battery is charged, the 67 hp electric motor is able to help the 76 hp gasoline engine. Since my battery was depleted, and the gas engine could not charge it at all since it was struggling to keep the car moving, going up the Rockies with a 76 hp engine was the worst part of my cross country trip.
Is there any way to FORCE the Volt to charge up completely (or 80%, whatever their top State of Charge is) in anticipation of a mountain/hill ? Like an emergency button, or choice on the screen ?
It seems their onboard generator is only 53 kW, and their electric motor is 111 kW (150 hp). That means once the battery is depleted, the generator would struggle to keep the car moving uphill with about 72 hp of power, just about the situation the Prius had.
It would be *great* if in those rare situations, you could pull into a rest area, run the generator and charge up the battery, then get out on the highway with a full battery and a full 150 hp electric motor (using the battery plus generator as you go). Maybe the Volt could detect sustained incline angles ? Or in a later version, have GPS maps with altitudes included, so it would know about hills coming up ?
Can you force it to charge to the max ? And how long would this take ? (a 53 kW generator charging 8 kWh of battery – but you couldn’t force it all in in 9 minutes, could you ? too much current ….)
Also, going DOWNHILL was frustrating in a Prius, since all that free energy would quickly fill the tiny battery, and after that, it was wasted. In the Volt, I HOPE they will allow coasting down a hill to fill up your battery, and not force it to some 30% state of charge because you are in “generator mode”. Free energy is free energy. And it will save brake wear.
These are just minor software tweaks, but will make a BIG difference on the road.
Just some friendly advice for the test-drivers
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:13 pm)The ICE will be seamless! Believe it.
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:16 pm)Not as nice as the Volt maybe, but we WILL be driving electrics of some kind by 2011 if we want to. Believe it!
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:36 pm)i see this car cannot hold four people based on the video. the two guys in the back had their legs stuffed up against the back seat. Are there any hybrid cars that can actually hold four people and transport them from A to B on a ride that may last an hour?
This would be a great system in a truck linke the Tundra crew cab. But this Volt looks pretty small and cramped from the video.
Comfort is going to be a big problem here.
I have a family and need something that will fit us without being 1/2 inch from each other and with legs cramped up into our seats from behind.
What is the Volts target audience? i would NOT buy it for my family based on this video.
It would be a very expensive car for just one or two people to commute to work?
It looks like the same if you tried to put 4 people in a Prius. ha ha!
Aug 14th, 2009 (11:50 pm)It doesn’t have to be. There are plenty of folks out there who will convert your ICE machine to a BEV. Or you can do it yourself if you really want. Just a thought.
+1
Aug 15th, 2009 (12:06 am)Great job Lyle! Keep the video coming. I saw your upload on youtube last night. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZDOdvl5DSk
Notice: 4 (not small) guys in the car with their gear and the a/c was on! And it still has good acceleration. Impressive.
All this talk about a gas engine running quietly is giving me a headache. I think GM knows how to make a gas engine run quietly. Without direct coupling to the drive train it should be very isolated. Rev that puppy up to 8000 r’s. It’ll still be smooth as glass.
My ’72 Eldo with 500cid V-8 (that’s 8.6 liters for you metric guys) was pretty quiet. The ’70 LS5 ‘Vette was kind of loud though
The ’91 Lumina Euro was throaty, fast, and cornered like a puma.
I don’t care what anyone says about Vegas and and other ancient history. (Yes, I had a Vega and a Chevette and some Fords, Dodges, AMCs, Datsuns, Mitsus and Hondas.)
GM makes great, exciting cars! This looks like the greatest yet!
Aug 15th, 2009 (12:33 am)I’m concerned over the CNBC report last Monday that implies the public should question the so-called 300-mile range. Reports like that especially imply the Volt has to be re-charged at that point. However, that makes no sense and defies the logic of a generator engine.
The generator engine should keep the vehicle at 30% SOC for multiples of gas tank fills; and that should mean multiples of 300 mile trips without a plug-in charge.
Please correct me if my perception is wrong, as I want to fry reporters like that Mellissa Francis of CNBC in one of my upcoming articles. I need a clear answer.
By the way, I wrote about the generator engine could be HCCI a few months back, but Atkinson cycle would do as well.
Aug 15th, 2009 (12:49 am)If I could make my 20 gallons a year E 85 at least I could avoid that part. I apologize in advance for the potential of making the 4th of July corn cobs more expensive with my expected 20 gallons a year of liquid fuel use.
Aug 15th, 2009 (4:20 am)if the $40,000 price tag is true, what good, honestly, what good is that ? The car sounds,looks great, but,We need a roof over our heads for that price–
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:09 am)Frank,
The 300 miles is the gasoline range, likely for 6 of the 8 gallons in the gas tank. The lowest 2 gallons are to keep the in-tank electric fuel pump cooled, which is an ICE industry standard.
Alas, as more reporters become more educated to at least a minimum, more of the public will want only VOLTec vehicles, making their availability become less so.
Somehow there ought to be brought about a set of situations where production could be accelerated and multiplied toward exponential numbers while maintaining the GM quality.
Managerial span of control for maintaining quality would generally be at least one restricting factor.
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:19 am)And thus a mini-van is born.
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:27 am)Jeffhre
“People who think there will be a problem selling Volts at the rumored price…”
Seems a bit early, but at some point, the deal making will start on the Volt. What are the benefits of full cash offers (5 year bumper to bumper coverage?). Length and terms of monthly payment plans? Will GMAC accept the tax credit as a down or as part of a down?
We are witnessing a car company press hard on the inside of the proverbial “box”. And It’s a lot of fun for potential buyers as well as for showroom shoppers and electric dreamers.
http://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play?p=electric+drag+race&n=21&ei=utf-8&js=1&fr=yfp-t-501&fr2=tab-img&tnr=20&vid=0001536736623
=D~
+1
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:43 am)The bar for EPA mileage has been placed high with Volt.
Other OEM’s, while not able to go E-REV, may likely have to do desperate things to get their fleet averages higher.
Long term increased wear on rod bearings and piston wrist pins (increasing the likelihood of piston slap) are several issues (in addition to many others) that those OEM’s face.
But GM is VOLTec. The other OEM’s have to do what they have to do to increase fleet MPG. From the Volt buyers perspective, discussion of what the other OEM’s are doing is worthless and entirely unrelated here. So, I just still remain entirely unimpressed with what other OEM’s are doing. What they are doing is not even worth bringing up to compare with 8 or so gallons per month for 78% of Voltec consumer gasoline usage in CO2 prevention.
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:44 am)The real shame is that the only $40K houses built to today also come on wheels.
Aug 15th, 2009 (6:57 am)Thanks for the answer. I understand what you are saying and it makes sense for a typical I4 automotive app. I guess the question is then:
Can the Volts I4, which was originally developed for conventional automotive use, be adapted for cylinder deactivation considering there is no direction to the motive load and timing is purely up to the engine designer’s discretion?
I could see this might not be possible with the I4 being used or with any I4. Perhaps they could use a different piston layout for gen 2 to achieve this.
Aug 15th, 2009 (7:03 am)Well 4th of July sweet corn isn’t really used for that, but yeah most corn ends up as sweetener and cattle feed anyway. I wonder how many tortillas you can make with 20 gallons of E85?
+2
Aug 15th, 2009 (7:15 am)Of course while it is possible, in VOLTec it is a situation where you want a high proportion of the horsepower the engine can make, not just a very minor amount of power that the engine can make.
In ICE, getting up to speed on the highway takes all cylinders.
Once at steady speed, you may not need all cylinders firing.
(To distribute heat evenly, they may rotate around the deactivations.) But in VOLTec, you either want a large proportion (greater than 25%) of the power to most of it, or, you want the ICE off. 85% of the gasoline energy is wasted out as exhaust heat and cooling system heat removed. The lower the demand from the ICE, the far more CO2-inefficient it is for the kilowatts you are driving the generator. Cylinder deactivation, then, just does not make efficient sense for VOLTec proportionally in terms of ICE inefficiency. (Minimizing ICE run times).
In addition to that, the ICE (if not HCCI), must run long enough and hot enough and fast enough to light up the catalytic converter to purge built up trace solid hydrocarbons, in addition to run the exhaust system hot enough to purge condensed water in cool weather.
(Got to go teach a seminar). Have a great day everyone.
Aug 15th, 2009 (7:24 am)Yeah I figured that out after reading one of your earlier posts more closely. My apologies.
Aug 15th, 2009 (7:26 am)that’s very true ! but, will the Volt come with a kitchen?
Aug 15th, 2009 (8:03 am)Volt not going to save GM. Dreaming
Aug 15th, 2009 (8:31 am)Well…city and congested commutes will have average power needs of @8KW, although I don’t think charge sustaining city driving is that important. Commuting loads and open highways loads are where most of the charge depleted miles will be driven. Whatever optimizes (>35% thermal efficiency ICE) the ICE for the 20-30KW power band is most important IMO. This is what will make the Volt’s charge sustaining highway mpg pop.
-2
Aug 15th, 2009 (9:09 am)The Volt is nice, but not anything like the prototype. The prototype was beautiful I would pay 40,000 for the prototype version, but not this current version. I think GM shot theirself in the foot by changing the design.
Aug 15th, 2009 (9:21 am)I disagree, again.
There may be a lot of situations where the ICE needs to stay on at a low power setting. This will largely depend on how GM chooses to manage the “buffer zone” of the battery after customer depletion.
Another issue may be emissions and continual start/stopping of the ICE.
I’m not suggesting that GM will put cylinder deactivation in the volt, or even that the 1.4l could handle it (probably not, without a major redesign) but in theory it could be useful in the volt setup, IF the volt were used a lot in RE mode. But GM seems to emphasize only the EV part.
/not that it’s directly related, but interesting to note: Honda uses cylinder deactivation with the hybrid insight’s 4 cyl engine.
P.S. How’s your Honda running Dan? Does it require a lot of maintenance?
Aug 15th, 2009 (11:43 am)[...] over the past couple of years. Here’s to the future, and, the success of the Chevy Volt. [GM-Volt] [Images via GM-Volt on [...]
Aug 15th, 2009 (12:42 pm)Although I am still unhappy about the current model vs. the prototype (the latter being much better looking)… I will hold off on judgment until we can actually drive a Volt. I sincerely hope the care is the hit is hyped to be… for GM’s sake and the American economy
-1
Aug 15th, 2009 (1:06 pm)I never expected them to look like the original concept – but they are so plain and so far off the concept that I’ll never buy one so long as they remain looking so… so…, uninspiring. Oh sure, the tech is great and exactly what I’d hoped for – but it’s so manila now. Truly sad.
Aug 15th, 2009 (1:07 pm)Let’s give GM a break here . . . they have been AMAZINGLY OPEN with their development of the VOLT – at the risk of showing their hand to every competitor out there. To their credit, they have maintained focus on this product through the most difficult business cycle ever in the American Auto Industry and perhaps in our US economy. They have met each goal and deadline and in many cases exceeded them. Along the way, GM has come out with several critically aclaimed models – like the Malibu, CTS, Camaro and Equinox – and have many more coming – like the Cruze and VOLT. Not one of these models is for EVERYONE, but collectively they tell the story of a very capable, forward thinking company. The engineers at GM have clearly been working hard on the VOLT and there is ABSOLUTLY NO REASON TO DOUBT that they will come up with a seemless integration between all-electric and EREV mode.
Thanks Lyle.
Thanks GM.
Go VOLT!
Aug 15th, 2009 (1:09 pm)Terry … keep dreaming – at least long enough for the rest of us to take delivery of our new VOLTs!
Aug 15th, 2009 (1:18 pm)I drove past three houses today that are for sale in a nice neighborhood of the suburb of a city that was never effected by the down-turn in the economy (barring investments made outside the city by those in [401(k), etc.]). Sure, they are on the small side – good starter homes for new families. Asking price: $60 to $75k range.
The point – not everyone lives in California or New York. I sold off a house on the failing coast for the mid $200k and picked up a NEW one here for $125k, and it’s nicer. In addition, I picked up an 8% raise in pay. Hmm, and the crime rate is 73% lower!
BTW – now I could pay cash for a couple Volts when they come out, just on the reduced cost of living. But I won’t because they are so bland looking.
Wake up Government Motors! But I digress – at least 51% of America slumbers with you.
Aug 15th, 2009 (5:37 pm)I like the original better (inlaid hood) – this new hood reminds me of the old Equinox style vs the new Equinox style. Even the new Malibu has the hood higher like the first Volt prototype – it makes the cars with the hood inlaid look like they have cleaner lines – especially from the sides
I would like to know the reasoning for changing this
Aug 16th, 2009 (11:26 am)I always return to the original concept design myself. Beautiful as it was to me, the younger Gen-Y crowd likes this new, more compact, far more aerodynamic look which Prius and Hondas took to the streets. This is likely the future anyway with CAFE at 34, the muscle bound appearances position less well than the bullet shapes.
Aug 16th, 2009 (1:28 pm)It’s called “aerodynamics” – does “coefficient of drag” ring any bells ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_drag_coefficient
The prototype shape:
http://www.dancewithshadows.com/blog/uploaded_images/chevrolet-volt-picture-717300.jpg
http://www.dancewithshadows.com/blog/uploaded_images/chevrolet-volt-picture-3-705379.jpg
was rejected because to achieve the desired 40 mile All Electric Range, they would need a bigger battery (more power needed to push the less aerodynamic shape through air).
That ‘cool looking’ prototype had a drag coefficient (Cd) of 0.43, about the same as a Chevy Silverado pickup truck. After much tweaking in the wind tunnels, the production Chevy Volt has a Cd less than the Prius (0.25).
http://www.wired.com/cars/coolwheels/news/2008/09/volt_revealed/
I guess after the Volt is established, they could change the sheet metal shape around the core of the car, so people that liked the ‘prototype’ look can have that, and maybe 32 miles range, instead of 40. Hey, give the customer what they want.
I hear the Aptera ‘rolling airplane’ car doesn’t even use side mirrors, to reduce drag: they use cameras instead, and let you look at a screen on the dash for side views.
+1
Aug 16th, 2009 (1:50 pm)Hey, I just found that GM had a sedan design with a Cd of 0.163 back in 2000 !
http://www.electrifyingtimes.com/gmprecept.html
This ‘Precept’ car had an even lower Cd than the EV1, which was 0.19.
(And Ford had a similar concept car, Prodigy, that used cameras instead of side view mirrors: back in 2000.)
So I guess hitting 0.24 for the Volt is doable (lower than the 2010 Prius, at 0.25). I haven’t heard an official announcement yet, but I heard that they beat the Prius Cd.
At highway speeds, this really helps conserve power.
-1
Aug 17th, 2009 (12:06 am)Why is GM so excited about the Volt, they crushed the EV1.
Aug 17th, 2009 (9:20 am)I am very impressed with the Volt but there is one major problem with this car. Even with a $7,500 tax credit (remember that is tax payer’s money – a form of corporate welfare) the car is more expensive than most people can afford. GM needs to sell millions of cars, not thousands. In an attempt to shoot for the stars do they have a solution too expensive to help them out of their financial state?
+1
Aug 17th, 2009 (10:24 am)Two of my favorite parts:
“The air conditioning works. That’s good.”
I was hoping that the Volt would have a little drag race with the Camaro.
+2
Aug 17th, 2009 (11:42 am)Reading thru the posts today, many are old, tired subjects already covered to death:
1) “Why doesn’t it look like the concept car?” Duuhhhh. Your posting priviledges will soon be revoked.
2) “Ain’t gonna sell at $40k.” I agree–probably will sell at a premium to that, with such a limited supply. Then the battery price comes down, bringing the MSRP with it. That’s the plan/hope, anyway, and it seems very reasonable.
3) “The EV-1 is relevant. Somehow. Someway. Well, ok, not really. I just CAN’T get over my anger from years ago.” Probably written by the guys with Japanese and German metal. Can you say ‘inconsistent’?!
4) “The Volt needs to hold 5 6’6″ adults and their luggage for a week-long 3k mile vacation.” Uh, no it doesn’t. Lots ‘o successful cars are really only 2 seaters–have you sat in the back of a Mini or 3-Series or A-4 or Honda Accord Coupe or… Wait for the Voltec SUV or full-size sedan.
5) “That dash sucks–it doesn’t look at all like my ’57 Chevy’s”. Thank God. This is GM’s ‘vision of the future’ car. Gotta have something that LOOKS futuristic, to match the futuristic drivetrain.
And there are more. Perhaps we should start labeling the worn-out posts, like, “#4″, or “I gotta take a #2″, to save the rest of us.
+1
Aug 17th, 2009 (12:35 pm)Oh, and:
6) “The type of ICE is critical.” Ummm, no it’s not. The vast majority of prospective customers won’t care less–it’s gonna be way down their priority list. It’s about the forward-looking items, the “look Ma, I’m driving with no gas” bragging rights and coolness and patriotism, etc. NOT the backward-looking items, like the ICE and the ABS and the rust-proofing. In fact, I say cut corners on the ICE to save $ and time–for a lot of people, it probably won’t even run very often. Maybe the Korean sub can supply them.
+1
Aug 17th, 2009 (3:28 pm)Well said Timaaayyy. I can only agree on all counts.
Now, for about the 10,000th time, how in the !@#$ do we get one?
+1
Aug 17th, 2009 (4:24 pm)Thanks, NP. Fun for my ego to be a cop every now and then.
As far as getting a Volt, great question–the silence from the board suggests that GM hasn’t revealed their detailed distribution plans yet, such as advance orders. Lots ‘o fun stuff GM could do here–this site’s Want List, ebay, contests, centers of influence people, viral, and on and on. If I were a GM marketer, I’d be fighting and scratching my way on to the Volt Team.
Aug 17th, 2009 (4:40 pm)Oh oh, and:
7) “I want my Volt to have [insert naive/impracticle/impossible dream item here]” Yes, I think it would be cool to have that, but ain’t gonna happen for v1.0 from a company with pencil-thin resources. Probably not even for any version. Every item has to have a reasonable case for inclusion–even the whole Volt program, which of course does not make biz sense as v1.0 only–had to be other reasons for its existence.
Aug 18th, 2009 (10:16 am)Keep It Simple Stupid.
Simplicate And Add Lightness
What Ain’t There Don’t Give You No Trouble
Aug 18th, 2009 (3:25 pm)You gigged the volt for being 40k. How much is the Tesla, with it’s range anxiety?
Aug 19th, 2009 (8:42 pm)GM still too top heavy and it’s rudder way is too small…it cant take the turn even if it has tax payer money. Those at the helm failed and the best thing that can happen is to let it sink to the bottom and make room for innovation. Sincerely looking forward to a world without corperations as large and wasteful as GM…hey how fitting is that GM = Government Money, Greedy Management…you do the math
Aug 19th, 2009 (8:47 pm)“…and it’s rudder way is too small…it cant”
http://garfwod.250free.com/canttruth.wav
=D~
Aug 21st, 2009 (3:31 pm)I am very impressed by the way the Volt looks both interior and exterior, very sleek and modern. I can not wait to drive one!
The volt is going to be one of the most advanced vehicles on the road, truly ushering in the age of EV’s and removing the age of the Hybrid. If any one thought hybrids were the future you were way off, they were simply a stepping stone.
As far as price range we still don’t know where it will come in at, every one keeps assuming it’s going to be $40k and I highly doubt that. My guess some where between 30-35k plus $7500 tax credit. Plus the more sold the lower the price will be in the future.