Bob Boniface is the chief designer of the Chevy Volt. In this GM video he discusses what the current pre-production state means from a design standpoint and what work is yet left to do. We are treated to some new moving footage of the pre-production vehicle in black.
Boniface explains at this point his team is now looking for fit and finish, gaps and flushness.
He says cars are meant to be seen in motion and this is the first time he can do so with the Volt and thus “its like Christmas morning for me,” he says.
“It looks like a different car to me,” he adds.
He says buying cars is an emotional purchase and that cars are very much a fashion statement.
“We were able to strike a good balance between aerodynamic performance, and those visual cues that excite a buyer,” he says.
He closes by stating the car is “meeting the aerodynamic performance,” that GM had set out for it.
Below the video you can also join in a real time webchat with Bob today at 2PM EDT.
This entry was posted on Tuesday, July 28th, 2009 at 6:03 am and is filed under Design, GM Q and A, Video. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.
+12
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:04 am)“He closes by stating the car is “meeting the aerodynamic performance,” that GM had set out for it.”
Now there is some serious news! My commute is 90% highway and I don’t expect 40 AER at 70 mph, but anything close and this car is a SLAM DUNK! If GM can engineer a Volt to live up the the promises made two years and a bankruptcy ago, then the Volt, the Voltec program, and even ‘N’GM have a fighting chance.
And might I add that this car looks great in black?
NPNS!!!! =D~~~
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:19 am)The Volt will get 40 AER highway.
The Chevy Volt’s Electric Range is 40 Miles in Both Highway and City Driving:
http://gm-volt.com/2009/04/24/the-chevy-volts-electric-range-is-40-miles-in-both-highway-and-city-driving/
+24
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:23 am)from the article,
He says buying cars is an emotional purchase and that cars are very much a fashion statement.
I will be happy to cut down on my support for terrorism.
I will be shocked that I am purchasing a GM car again after 20 years.
I will be sad for parting with $30K – $40K of my hard earned money.
And I will be extremely delighted if it helps keep are soldiers safe.
Yeah, it will be an emotional and very proud moment the day I drive off the lot in my new shiny Volt.
+6
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:27 am)Yes, well said!
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:28 am)It’s a nice looking car… now it’s the count down to production. It does look especially nice in black.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:43 am)My 1974 Chevy Nova was black. I don’t think I will own another black car again.
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:53 am)When they plug in the charging connector in the video, I could see a couple white fuzzy spots in the old charging port area.
Does anyone know if those are charging status indicators or am I imagining something ?
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:08 am)While the car is attractive, I think the more important appearance issue is that it looks “normal”.
For major market acceptance, I think its very important that the Volt NOT have an exotic, “I’m saving the planet” look, but instead is a car that most people could easily accept in their garage or driveway.
The real beauty, of course, is what it DOES, not what it looks like. And that is what people are really going to like about the Volt. I think that, because of its remarkable abilities, the first Volts will be a bit of a sensation wherever they go.
It would be really fun to be one of the first owners.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:15 am)You can bet that if Chevy promises 40 all electric miles they will diliver at least 40. Under virtually any circumstances.
And the hypermilers will do considerably better.
You’ll see.
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:16 am)I love the looks of that car. Particularly the front end. The way the hood is designed is sweet.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:16 am)THe US should design its cash for clunkers to only include the volt like japan did with their C fofC that only includes the prius.
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:24 am)By hypermilers I know you meant a group of people.. but you wont have to use pulse and glide tricks to get good mileage with the Volt, just drive it gently and perhaps even slow down and you will maximize range in both modes.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:26 am)I would include the Ford Fusion.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:27 am)Sweet video. It is so cool to see the actual car driving around now. And it looks awesome in black!
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:31 am)Rashiid, DaveG, I will third those thoughts! I will be visiting my Exxon dealer every 2 to 3 months, for a whopping 5 gallons of gas. I still think the gas tank should be at least 8 gallons for a total range of at least 440 miles, but I can live with the probable 6 gallon tank.
What is up with the Chevy bowtie? Dead as the dodo or simply fading into the grill? And didn’t one of the engineers say at one of the presentations that the plugin had been moved to the front license plate?
Definitely looks great in black, but I question the utility of a black EREV anywhere but up north. But it does look very good…
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:33 am)Yeah , I see those. And they don’t appear on the other side of the car.
My guess: One light indicates “charging” when you first plug in.
The other light indicates “charging complete”.
This would be useful and fun (for me) because I could peek out into my garage and see if the Volt is fully charged up, without having to get in the car and look at a dash light.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:39 am)They should interview you for a Volt ad (seriously). Maybe drop the $ part (though true), but the rest rings true for a lot of people – even outside our “fringe group”.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:41 am)This is just like our “Voltmas Eve”. We should gather to watch the first production model roll off the line and sing Voltmas Carols!
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:49 am)AND it doesn’t look like an Insight/Prius Clone.
Well put, Mikeinatl
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:51 am)I don’t think I do what is commonly called hypermiling but, I do drive for milage. I pay attention all around me to the other cars so I know when I will need to speed up, brake, pass, or turn and try to do these things as smoothly as possible, In addition I drive at as constant a speed as I can while antisipating the start of a hill so I can optomise my down hill speed as much as possible. I hope this type of driving will serve me as well with my Volt as it has with the Buick.
My concern is regeneritive braking, I brake as rarely as possible and expect little advantage from that feature.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:56 am)Yep, that’s the way I drive too.
By “hypermilers” I just mean sensible people that are in tune with the efficiency of their driving.
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:56 am)Tune = We wish you a Merry Christmas
We know we’ll be happy with our new Volt
We know we’ll be happy with our new Volt
We know we’ll be happy with our new Volt
‘Cause we’re driving gas free!
(or)
Bring a shiek to his knees!
(or)
‘Cause we’re saving our trees!
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:01 am)No, not moved to the license plate. It was moved down below the original electric door thingy in front of the driver’s side mirror. It is now a regular circular gas-type door.
This is visible in the video above.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:07 am)As for the Bowtie, I think they probably just don’t have it on this pre-production car yet. Maybe they haven’t decided how big to make it.
You can see a couple of little tabs where it might attach.
Rest assured, it will be there for the production models. Chevy will be proud of this car and want everyone to know it’s a Chevy.
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:09 am)It looks like you have to pull everything out of the trunk if you want to get at the charge cord. From a practical matter, that means that the owner would probably buy an extra cord for their garage. It would make charging up overnight while on a road trip a bit of a nuisance.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:12 am)All my cars are black…so we cancel each other out. (=
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:14 am)Just because GM says it will have a 40 mile range doesn’t make it so. Let’s wait for real world driving.
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:18 am)You certainly can tell Bob was in charge of design after listening to that video…that man is really working hard to ‘talk it up,’ I would be too…he isn’t exactly batting a thousand with this project and the design elements.
In reality there is nothing particularly special about it. It is just a car like any other, in fact it may be less special than anything else in 2011…certainly it will be the plainest car in the $40,000 price range.
…but that isn’t why we are going to buy it, so I digress.
/just built it already
-11
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:34 am)(click to show comment)
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:35 am)So what you are saying is that my prefered smoky burnout launch when the light turns isn’t ideal?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:36 am)From October 2007:
—–
“He (Bob Boniface) says the design goal was to make the car something people wanted to own from both an emotional and visual standpoint, beyond it’s sensibility, and not just be “a science project”. They wanted to steer clear of the “sensible shoes” or “Brussels sprouts” (good for you but you don’t really like them) look of the current hybrid crop”
“He says “the show car was very sporty and personal, and the production car will be very sporty and personal”, and will be a “handsome automobile”. He wouldn’t give too much more detail, because he doesn’t want to ruin the surprise.
In terms of the glass in the roof and doors, he corrected me that it is actually polycarbonate, and admits he is aware of the greenhouse effect of a glass roof requiring more electric draw. They are looking at both ideas of appearance and function and trying to find the balance, but the main goal is customer appeal.
http://gm-volt.com/2007/10/08/gm-volt-exclusive-brand-new-interview-with-bob-boniface-gm-director-of-volt-design-on-the-production-model-volt/
===========================
Mission accomplished?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:38 am)I noticed the lack of emblem’s too.
The “Volt” one is missing above the plug door as well.
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:41 am)I just hope that GM can improve their paint quality… the last 2 GM cars I had…. the paint just does not stand up… unless you go to a metal flake… the basic paint jobs either fades quickly or chips off so easily… Multiple appications of a high end wax does help tho..
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:42 am)I don’t see that as an issue since I’ll install a 220 connector in the garage.
I’ve never seen a ‘public’ charging station, as far as I know there are none in Western Canada!
I think the ‘trunk cord’ will spend a lot of time in the trunk in my world.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:43 am)There’s no reason that the vehicle couldn’t send you a time stamped text message to your cell phone when it’s recharged as recharged as it gets. They could also make it ding like a toaster when its recharged. Just sayin. Maybe for gen III.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:45 am)In reality there is nothing particularly special about it. It is just a car like any other, in fact it may be less special than anything else in 2011…certainly it will be the plainest car in the $40,000 price range.
——————————————————————-
I think that it is the best looking “green” sedan. I know that some people are disappointed that the concept look (sports car) was abandoned. On being “nothing particularly special”…that has good and bad points. It is “good” that it does not look like a “green” car. The “bad” is the preceived sub-par styling for the estimated price. People expect many things for $40+K…but those dollars went into the powertrain. However…the first Prius had the looks of a $15K or less vehicle…IMHO.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:50 am)“My concern is regeneritive braking, I brake as rarely as possible and expect little advantage from that feature.”
Regenerative braking is not 100% effective in recapturing all the lost braking energy, so you want to do as little of that as you can.. even in a Volt.
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:51 am)DING!
I like that!
Maybe you can retrofit one to your bike!
That would be funny!
Jeez, even the cars are texting now…
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:54 am)I DO love a clean black car!
The reason that they look better in the shade is because then it’s harder to see the DUST!
I’ll take the nice cool silver blue, it’s close to the dust colour around here!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:03 am)Absolutely true.
It’s interesting what makes a car ‘feel’ like $40k.
Make the switches good ones and make the doors feel like vault doors.
STEAL the seats from a MB C Class, or BMW M-sport
If there is to be ‘wood trim’ make it REAL wood.
Perceived quality is in the details.
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:04 am)The phrase “buying cars is an emotional purchase and that cars are very much a fashion statement” should be carved in to wooden plaques and placed on every office desk in the GM Design and Marketing Departments.
40 – 50 – or 92 mpg – - If the VOLT doesn’t have the Fit, Finish and Performance of a $50,000 car, I don’t think the “green” aspects will generate enough ‘emotion’ for the average buyer to plunk down $35,000 to $40,000 (and by average, I mean people other than those who read this blog).
Yes, we all agree the VOLT is one of the first steps to energy independance. Beyond this site, who cares about that? GM needs MASSIVE sales figures on the board. They have a lot of government loans to pay back. They need profits.
The engineers need to make the VOLT a “performer that just so happens to run on electricity”. The Marketing guys need to make sure everyone knows it.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:06 am)______________________________________________________
I’m very pleased with the looks of the Volt.
I find the looks to be very elegant with subtle yet distinctive styling cues connoting confidence, sport performance, & hi-tech.
Good job Volt Design Team.
I want one!!!
______________________________________________________
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:08 am)Jeff, I agree completely. Those who have seen the Volt in person will attest that it is a beautiful design. Trouble with 2 dimensional pictures is that they are only 2 dimensional – I think most of us will find the Volt to be both unique and striking in appearance, yet certainly mainstream ( but neither bulbous or teardrop in shape like the prissy and the insight ). It will NOT get lost in the clutter, IMHO.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:09 am)It is a ‘fine’ looking entry car, but that is about it. However, we just had a discussion that a ‘green’ car should have its own name/identity and its own easily recognizable look.
Clearly function over form has won here. Lets say this is 2011, how do you make the case that the Volt is any better looking than its own stable mate, the sub 20K Chevy Cruze?
http://www.egmcartech.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/2010_chevrolet_cruze_official_image001.jpg
…if it was unique, you wouldn’t have to. Heck, you even have the sub compact at Chevy looking like this:
http://autonewsamerica.com/media/blogs/auto%20news%20america/2011_chevrolet_spark.jpg
I love what the Volt does, it lets me drive without using gas, and I’ll buy one (if they can get it to me in a timely fashion), but for $40K the car has to look/drive/feel like something as well to make a really big impact.
It is the most cutting edge car/tech GM has put out in a long time (maybe ever), yet it will be the plainest/boringest car on your local Chevy dealers lot in 2011 (had the new Mailibu not been delayed).
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:09 am)When they went to the water based color coat/clear coat process in the late 80s, car paint took a big step back.. but it still is one the most expensive steps in car manufacturing. The problem with clear coats is that it is hard to see how much of it you put down (since its clear), too thin a coat will wear out prematurely and then the color coat will go quickly. They also try to use the minimun amount of paint they can, its very expensive stuff.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:10 am)I think so.
Keeping in mind that 5 door hatchbacks appeal mostly to families.
I have one of those.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:12 am)I can’t argue that one, my ’88 Calais was a nice car, but the paint was not great. (They missed the clearcoat in several places.)
Lots of wax was my solution too.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:12 am)Troll alert ! I’m told the Volt will come in a variety of colors, but the fallback option is a Ford Fusion – not a prissy.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:13 am)I’m happy that Bob’s very happy. Good luck, GM.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:16 am)OK, so we have seen it in black. I don’t want a black car. I am ready to see some more colors. Bring them on GM.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:16 am)I never really noticed in the earlier photos, but is the front bumper REALLY low to the ground? I imagine it’s for aerodynamic reasons, but I hope they’re testing driving it over some good-sized speed bumps and the like.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:24 am)Does yours only have 4 seats?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:25 am)Fringe group? Hey, and I thought we were part of a “cutting edge” group. You learn something new every single day on this site.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:25 am)OK, I prefer the look of the volt over the look of the Cruise.
Which makes sense to me because the Cruise is the latest in the “Cavalier” styling line. Which is expected because that’s it’s target market.
The Volt needs a few ‘high end’ touches and I think it’ll feel the part just fine.
Billet or stainless steel grill?
I’d still like to see LED headlights…
(although I also understand the cost issues)
Subtle top quality chrome/billet accents
I’m thinking BMW/Mercedes understated.
I see no reason why buying a Chevy should mean lame plastic interiors.
The Volt can and should stand tall with anything out there.
I say out German the German’s.
Make it a car people WANT not one they think they ought to buy.
Built like a Mercedes, priced like a Chevy. THAT will sell cars!
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:26 am)The material behind the head light lens appears to be too dark on this black version of the car. you can’t see the features of the nose well as a result. They need some light tones matching the grill around the edges of the headlights or something…otherwise it looks like ‘stealth’ car. maybe it looks different in person…
am i alone? that is headlight area too black. Get a stylist down there and give it more highlights!!!!
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:26 am)Still no video of the car running on generator? or have I missed a video of that?
I really want to hear generator mode and know what the MPG is.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:27 am)Unfortunately, that wouldn’t help too much with today’s sales.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:27 am)OK, GM. You heard it hear. Now listen up. Good job, Corvette Guy.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:29 am)One more thing…
For all of the GM Engineers following this site: Mega-Kudos for your work on the 2010 Camaro! The Fit, Finish and Performance of that car is outstanding. Keep up the great work!
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:29 am)Why not be able to access the status by web or iPhone app like Nissan is proposing. Surely GM can do that.
+7
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:29 am)That would be hypomiling.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:31 am)Oh my god look at how close the front bumper is to the ground…Don’t tell me that will clear the average parking lot or gas station ramp at 15mph w/o bottoming out…
Then again i am used to a pickup…
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:33 am)It is my understanding that “regen” braking will occur when you let up on the accelerator pedal, not just when you step on the brake pedal.
I think Lyle confirmed this some time ago when he did the mule test.
He said something like “it was like one pedal driving” or some such.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:33 am)Those dots are the tabs for the Volt logo on the side of the car. But did you see the “filler” cap in the trunk when he took the charging cable out? What does it serve do you think? And was that “hump” part of the battery pack or did I see that correctly?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:34 am)The Volt moved away from the yuppie/DINK/upwardly mobile (and want to look it) demographic and moved to the quasi-family/divorced parent/functional small sedan business. Sales in year two (after the initial demand is eaten up) will tell us if it was the right move.
The ‘greenies’/environmentally conscious (like myself) are onboard regardless…as long as we feel it is the best technology to suit our mantra at the time of purchase. (I obviously would have preferred something with a little ‘hotness,’ but that isn’t my top priority right now…I just want a EV already)
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:35 am)LOL!
I was wondering what sort of reaction that would get!
Sadly none of my current cars will actually do a smoky burnout…
I’m kinda hoping my 2017 Volt SS will be able to…
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:36 am)I think when you see the car in the flesh you will think it is special.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:38 am)LOL, yep!
But at least our resident troll was somewhat subtle today… a refreshing change!
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:39 am)Yes.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:39 am)I have seen the Camaro on the street, but not very close up. I haven’t gone to a show room to look at one yet because I am waiting for the convertible version to come out. I wonder if it will be a spring 2010 release. Sure would be great if it were. I would get to enjoy it all next spring, summer and fall. Come on, GM. It is a very sharp looking car.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:40 am)Paint has come a long way since then.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:40 am)OT:
Saints and angels, preserve us!! No wood trim, PLEASE!
My GF bought a new Malibu last fall, an LT1. GM coulda scored a LTZ sale instead, except that she (and I) couldn’t stand the look of the wood trim.
… not that I don’t get your point, Rob… they should definitely avoid using cheap materials, regardless of the design theme.
+4
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:40 am)Dave, that’s the EPA highway, which can best be described as a leisurely drive on a country road. Top speeds aren’t anywhere near 70 mph and the top speeds that are in the cycle are quite brief.
It’s hard to say because we really don’t know about the drive train losses or, for that matter, the aero losses, but a guess of a range of 30 miles wouldn’t be a bad one. Could be as low as 25 miles on a nasty windy day.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:42 am)Good to see one of my friends has some sense …
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:42 am)Random shot of backseat of production Volt for fun:
http://www.chevroletvoltage.com/components/com_joomgallery/img_pictures/volt_photo_7/volt_back_seat_20090721_1778049081.jpg
Trunk capacity shot:
http://gm.wieck.com/forms/gm/X11CH_VT043.jpg?download=050093
Any sedans with smaller proportions? I just got my son out of a car seat and carting around a stroller…no chance to be able to accomplish that in the Volt.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:42 am)This is a Prototype Car, they won’t add very expensive plastics like headlight assemblies until the final shapes are set.
Notice the emblem’s are missing too.
All expected at this point.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:44 am)I have wondered a few times since I first saw the production Volt design, if GM looked hard at the Concept Volt and thought it to be “too controversial”. Aerodynamic efficiency was sited as the main culprit in the design change, but I also wonder if making the car less polarizing and more mainstream looking had a hand in this as well? Bear with me a moment.
As a car buff, I was really attracted to the aggressive look of the Concept. I am very accepting of the look of the production Volt, but not as smitten. To me, it’s what the Volt is and represents that is more the key than anything. When my wife looked at the production Volt, she thought that was the nicer car. To her it looked like a regular car, i.e. not controversial, not aggressive per se, not screaming “LOOK AT ME!!!” She, not knowing much of the technology with the car, preferred the production version. Maybe that’s GM pursuit with this car, in that they don’t want to shock and awe with their first mass-market EV. Maybe they want it to be “normal” in every aspect. If you listen to these guys like Farah and Laukner in the interviews, they even say that they want the car to feel as normal as possible.
I’m really fine with the production Volt design. Leave the shock and awe for the Converj. Just build them GM!
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:47 am)Thanks for the Cruze link Statik. In my opinion (which we both know only counts for something to me) that picture of the Cruz shows one very sharp beautiful car. If it really comes to the dealerships looking like that it is going to nearly leap off the lot into people’s driveways. Assuming the regular assumptions we have all voiced before (quality, price and dependability). Just think what a good hybrid system like in the Ford Fusion would do for the Cruz that is already slated to get over 40 MPG. That would be quite a car to have.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:48 am)Reports I’ve read say the convertible is back on track for 2011 now that GM BK is over. I’m seriously considering one of those too.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:48 am)Agreed, Rob/Maharguitar. Most who can afford this car will want more than one cord for sure, if for no other reason than to have a backup in case of “oops, I cut the cord” incidents.
Plus, being that they’ve adopted a standardized connector (SAE J1772), I’m thinking there will be less expensive (think non-GM branded) cords available… at auto parts stores, for example. That should make them cheaper and easy to find. Hopefully they’ll become a ubiquitous commodity before long.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:49 am)I pretty much agree with you on that.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:51 am)Plastic fake wood trim is AWFUL.
The real thing properly finished is a sight to behold, but likely out of budget for this car.
My Jaguar roots are coming through I think.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:54 am)I think it should be limited to GM, Ford and Chrysler vehicles. Period.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:55 am)corvette guy says “40 – 50 – or 92 mpg – - If the VOLT doesn’t have the Fit, Finish and Performance of a $50,000 car, I don’t think the “green” aspects will generate enough ‘emotion’ for the average buyer to plunk down $35,000 to $40,000 (and by average, I mean people other than those who read this blog).”
——————————————————————
I think that GM is thinking along the same lines as you are, but I think that’s wrong. GM has never had a car like this. Yes they had the EV1 but while the product was right the time wasn’t. The Volt is being released at a time when you have a confluence of concern about terrorism, a concern about the environment, and a concern about living ostentatiously. It is going to a huge hit.
With all this the Volt doesn’t have to behave like a $50K car. Given that it’s basically a $25K car with a battery pack It won’t. What it has to be is reliable. If it’s reliable then it will not only sell in decent numbers, it will help GM enormously with its product image. My advice would be if there is a trade-off between reliability and performance, go with reliability.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:55 am)Ok, you got me…I can’t think of any popular 5 door, family sedan hatchbacks on sale now that only have 4 seats. You have me curious, what is it? I don’t think GM sells any.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:56 am)That is real cute, Tag. Somehow I don’t think your future is in writing songs. But a good first try.
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:56 am)Android app… (puts on flame hat…)
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:56 am)Muddy,
Same here on the 220, but I’m fortunate to already have one from a prior need (hottub, now gone). I agree that it’ll be some significant time before we’ll have access to any significant amount of public charging opportunities. Once we have a million or so plugs on the road, “they will come”.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:58 am)True art is never appreciated until the artist dies (lol), but you’re right – it won’t drag me out of retirement.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:59 am)That cord would be hung up in my garage where it would be used. The chance of me ever needing one on the road is next to non-existent. But I do wonder how much an additional cord would cost.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:00 am)Schmeltz; That is how I see it too.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:01 am)Miss Information,
I have to agree with one thing you said. Henry Ford certainly designed the Model T for aerodynamics. He was well ahead of the auto world in that regard. You could just see the old Model T slicing through the wind on the roads at 20 – 25 MPH. Must have been a really heart stopping thing.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:02 am)N.Riley
“Fringe group” and “cutting edge” are not mutually exclusive. I ALMOST said “lunatic fringe”, but showed some small restraint (g).
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:02 am)Agreed on the Fusion.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:02 am)GM – give us a video of someone “squawking” the tires.
Where is the gasoline port?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:05 am)That’s one stream. There are some more, which might be stated as follows:
I will be happy not to make people sick with my emissions
I will be happy to have a lower carbon footprint
I will be happy to have a car that has such cool tech that it makes my neighbor, who owns the ever so expensive to buy and maintain BMW 7 Series, with the interface which is so complicated he can’t figure out how to turn on the radio, jealous
The Volt capitalizes on a number of disparate emotional threads. In an advertising spot you have to pick one, but GM has a number of different ways it can go.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:07 am)My hot tub is still plugged in happily, but a new plug is just a couple hours work away.
I’ll wait until the Volt is here so I can set the connector in the right spot.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:12 am)I don’t think you are looking at production lights on the car. It seems that was mentioned before. But I agree about lights being a very important aspect of the frontal view. They really need to be very sharp looking plus provide excellent lighting.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:14 am)The family only has 4 seats! (guess we crossed wires there, sorry!)
And one of those seats is away at university 8 months of the year. With his own car.
A Volt will be perfect for us.
It will replace a 2002 Subaru Impreza.
(Will sadly miss the AWD though.)
I can count on one hand the number of times we have squashed 5 people into the Subaru.
4 seats are fine with me for the primary commuter/daily driver.
If I need to take more than 4 bums I have my old Malibu and my Land Rover (seats 7).
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:15 am)Just think of your wife, if you have one, pulling up to a parking lot concrete stop and taking out the ground effect plastic. Probably won’t cost you over $500 – $750 to get it replaced. If GM is doing this to get air into the car, which seems the only reasonable explanation, they need to reconsider opening up the grille more and getting rid of the “low hanging fruit” on the front. IMO.
Edited: Went back and looked at the video again. The front air damn, if that is what it is, looks to be only about 3 inches above the pavement. The first speed bump will take that thing out or badly scrape it up. I know parking lot concrete stops will. I see too many people pulling up all the way until their wheels touch those stops. That will be the end of the plastic hangy down thingy. Maybe the wife or you son or daughter will stop and put what’s left in the trunk for you. Reckon?
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:18 am)I’ll put in with you there. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:22 am)Gas filler right rear quarter.
A little tire chirp is good fun!
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:22 am)The gasoline port is on the right rear fender. I wish it was on the driver’s side. I always hate walking around to put gas in that side. I always have to think “OK, which vehicle am I in and on which side is the gasoline filler port”. Why can’t the auto industry come to a common decision about which side to put it?
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:22 am)statik says “t is the most cutting edge car/tech GM has put out in a long time (maybe ever), yet it will be the plainest/boringest car on your local Chevy dealers lot in 2011 (had the new Mailibu not been delayed).”
———————————————————-
Very hard to argue with this. However, it may be a good thing. Without getting too deeply into it, this whole “super tech/plain package” is right on point for a new and expanding consumer desires — to be an insider. You see it on a lot of luxury products where they put a very subtle detail on the product that lets those “who know luxury” understand what “those who don’t” wouldn’t.
Having the Volt be a Chevy only makes the who superiority thing work even better, especially now when conspicuous consumption is out and inconspicuous consumption is in.
As you also point out, what you don’t want is something that even an insider would find hard to spot. For example, GM needs to avoid a situation like Lyle being disappointed that people don’t understand he’s driving an electric Mini. Why pay a bundle a month if no one will notice? (This sentiment has been mentioned by other Mini-E drivers). The separate look eliminates this problem.
-2
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:23 am)I’ve had daily driver Camaros, Corvettes and now a Solstice. You get used to not dragging the front end, you just need to be careful and not drive like a woman.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:24 am)“Built like a Mercedes, priced like a Chevy. THAT will sell cars!”
———————————————————————————————
It sure would, and it would drive them bankrupt again. It’s really easy to say “Just make it as refined as a Mercedes and go like a Ferrari, then sell it like a Hyundai and you will have huge sales!” Doing it is another story. Refinement, content and performance cost money and it’s difficult to get around that. The best way to get your Mercedes at Chevy prices is just compare you new Chevy to an old Mercedes. A 2010 fully loaded Malibu, blows away a 1990 Mercedes.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:27 am)You get kudos and grins for that! Great work. I especially like the combination of the sheik and the tree thinges.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:29 am)Good thought that. Not saying lunatic fringe. Some of us “might” resemble that. Or is that “resent”?
+5
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:31 am)I agree. The 4 seat thing is not an issue for us.
I like the looks. It really reminds me of our old Impala. I could do without the chrome side accents, but that’s why they make striping tape, so no problem.
After 14 years with the Impala (probably 16 or 17 by the time we actually get our hands on a Volt, LOL), I doubt if we will be getting another black car either. It does look great when clean, but it sure doesn’t look that way for long.
I’m a buyer boys. Just get ‘er done before it’s too late.
I also have to agree that the Cruze and the Spark look very promising. Maybe the game isn’t over quite yet (he said optimistically). Once again, get ‘er done before it’s too late.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:33 am)The paint on our Impala is 14 years old, and it still looks pretty good.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:33 am)I like the idea of reliability also. After all we all want a car that will be still providing a great ride and 40 MPC after the 10years/150,000 miles. Having it still look good would be an added bonus.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:34 am)Rob/Neil, you guys are the “answer twins” today… LOL!!!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:35 am)You got me wondering about that so I went back and watched the video again as well.
It looks a lot like the plastic ‘spoiler’ under the nose of my Malibu.
More curved though.
That thing is tough. it has had several ‘meetings’ with concrete parking stops and suffered only superficial scratches.
If it’s a similar material then I’m not too worried.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:36 am)The front of our 95 Impala SS is that low. We are on our second air dam/spoiler, but they are sort of a consumable item and pretty chaep to buy and install. Not a big deal in our experience.
It drags the spoiler and the tips of the exhaust pipes every time you go out of a driveway which is the least bit steep, but it has cost us about $200 in maintenance over 14+ years. No big deal.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:36 am)I like the right side because it matches my other cars!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:39 am)I can see my Volt having a facebook page and it updates it’s status: “My owner took me to work today, I had to wait 8 hours in the parking lot, man it was hot today.”
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:41 am)In the foot, my foot. We have been trying for a head shot. Thankfully we have missed and only shot ourselves in other areas not completely life threatening. I don’t understand some of our policies. I guess it depends on which lobby group you expect to get donations from. (And to hell with the American public.)
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:43 am)Well, with that let’s hope appreciating your “art” is a long, long time away.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:45 am)You are absolutely right.
However aiming for the dirt pretty much guarantee’s you miss the stars.
What I’m saying is bring up the standard.
I’m not asking for gold plated window switches, I’m asking them to build a car the OWNER can be proud of.
“Hey Rob NICE CAR! Yep and it’s ‘green’ too!”
At the price we expect to see I don’t think most people would have any issue with a little bit more to have it ‘nicer’.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:47 am)I always look for the little arrow on the gas gauge when i rent cars.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:49 am)Work is painfully slow this month…
So I have WAY too much time on my hands!
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:50 am)(Away in a Manger?)
Ahhhway in old Hamtrack, cobwebs everywhere,
They’re building our Volts there. It’s no longer bare!
Our fringe group all love it, we’re saying our prayers,
That Gm can do it, avoiding all snares.
The engineer”s toiling bears fruit on the road
and we’ll all be cheering our e-lec-tric mode!
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:50 am)The Volt looks really sharp in the hatchback view you provided, Statik. In the back seat shot, I thought GM missed a chance to add some storage in front of the cup holders in the hump. Looks like there could be some room available there. Thanks for the pics.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:54 am)There is a lot to be said for what you are thinking. Probably played a larger role than we previously thought. Someone at GM probably thought they might get some bad PR for bringing out another “sporty” car during these trying times for the company and the public.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:57 am)DUST?! Now I had the distinct notion that it would be mud that you would have to mask, MuddyRoverRob.
I recall a certain Land Rover who’s very appearance was brilliantly camouflaged by the very, most abundant mud that we encountered on an expedition in Africa. From a distance you could barely make it out at 30 yards. In fact I lost it, temporarily, whilst going away for a little, ah, reconnoitering.
LOL!——–Higgins & The Lads
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:06 am)The one thing I noticed was the front air dam or chin spoiler on the front end is far too close to the road or low. The first speed bump would mess that up.
I recognize this issue because my sons 1988 and 1991 MR2 have this problem especially when the front struts start to wear just a little the car will bounce slightly on the speed bumps or dips/pot holes in the road. Most MR2′s have a damaged front air dam.
If you watch the video you will see a lot of bouncing not sure if its the camera or the car or both?
-10
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:17 am)(click to show comment)
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:18 am)I think I saw it that way two years ago, but I can’t remember now
I would like to see Boniface and the Volt design team get their completed Volt from the IVER’s of a couple different colors with all the final trim including covers for the lights painted spoilers etc. for design evaluation purposes!
I hope this doesn’t sound like a snarky comment, well maybe only a little, but for those that can’t see the difference between the production Volt and the Prius, I’d suggest you stay away from decisions that involve aesthetic choices and maybe let the significant other take over that role.
If someone can’t pass the math classes a career in physics probly’ won’t be a good choice.
If metaphor, allegory and high concept are lost every time in a good ole’ belly laugh then a literary career is out.
If every question results in a knock down drag out fight a diplomatic career is a bad move.
And if someone can’t see the differences here; designing beyond the limits of your own property boundaries might feel good, but it’s not likely to gain any influence or win any friends.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:19 am)Truer than you know N.Riley. May we all live long enough to see the “ubiquitous Volt” (Ver. IIXC).
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:20 am)LOL!
My Discovery is actually quite shamefully Muddy AND Dusty!
Silver/grey base with flat black hood (Bonnet) off road bumper and expedition roof rack and a mild 2″ lift.
Hard to tell with all the muck on it though!
I use it sparingly where it makes sense to.
Next week it will pull our camping trailer for our vacation.
(Might even wash it for the occasion, my wife would like that…)
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:20 am)Me too! I want to see some cool metallic blues….
Like a sky blue – looks clean most of the time.
That was always my problem with black. They look great for about the first 15 minutes after you clean them. Then they get that coat of dust, and it drove me crazy. Not that I need much help in that department…..
Looking forward to hear what Mr. Boniface has to say!!
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:21 am)What timeframe are you talking about…
I have not seen that issue since the 80′s. Recently I have owned a 1997 Malibu and 2003 Venture, neither of which I ever waxed (other than carwash “wax”).
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:24 am)Gonna disagree with you on the doors. I don’t want my vehicle doors to feel like massive barn doors or weigh as much as them. I want my vehicle doors light, like the rest of the vehicle, for optimal performance. Please note that light is not the same as cheap or weak. Haven’t we learned anything from modern racing?
Cue Colin Chapman.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:26 am)I believe they stated that they have not fitted head light covers to the IVER’s at all yet.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:32 am)I agree with your wife. I wouldn’t want to drive a car that screams “look at me” either. I would buy it anyway, but I prefer the production version.
I do think the concept version looked great, but it’s not me. But I’m sure GM will produce the converj for those who a) care about looks, and b)are willing to spend extra to get it.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:37 am)Colin Chapman was a BRILLIANT racing car designer.
Maybe the best ever.
I actually have gone as far as a dealer visit and order form on a Caterham 7. (The modern ‘child’ of the Lotus 7.) I then came to my senses on how much money it was…
His road cars however had and I’m trying to be VERY tactful because I respect his legacy, spotty quality. A seven has no doors, so that wasn’t an issue there.
People need to feel SAFE in their car or it won’t BE their car.
The doors need to feel solid. That does not mean heavy, but they must close with authority and NOT rattle.
(Sadly very FEW Lotus’ ever felt like that.)
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:38 am)That is a beautiful car! I love it! Terrific job.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:40 am)Yeah that can be an issue if you have to drive more than one car. I always wondered why the industry couldn’t solve that, but there is a stress free way to know which side of the pump to pull up to at a glance. Look at the little pump symbol by the gas level indicator. The side of the symbol that has the hose is where your cars filler cap is located.
Edit: some cars have an arrow pointing to the filler side.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:40 am)Tag, old buddy:
Have you gone off your meds again???
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:41 am)In other news, GM cancelled their sponsorship of the Buick opening. Personally, I think it’s a good move on Lutz’s part–they have better ways to use their marketing dollars.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090728/ap_on_bi_ge/us_gm_buick_open_4
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:42 am)Amen.
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:43 am)THANK GOODNESS!
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:46 am)Spare me the polycarbonate. There HAS to be a way to opt out of that.
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:47 am)I’m just curious, why are you here then?
If you have a specific issue PLEASE share it.
Otherwise you are just an under bridge dweller.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:50 am)I get by with a two seater Chrysler Crossfire for my daily driving, and would have been happy if GM made an E-REV Solstice.
Maybe for the second E-REV purchase!!
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:53 am)If we go by published data for the Tesla Roadster, they have a graph with wh/mile vs speed, essentially battery drainage per mile traveled, graphed against hwy speed.
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/
We know the Volts has a usable capacity of 8kwh, so to get a range of 40 miles it must use no more than 200wh/mile, this is around 47mph for a Tesla, and we could assume a bit faster for a Volt since it does not use sport tires (large and sticky) like the Tesla. I believe the EPA Hwy cycle has an average speed of 48 MPH.
Note in the graph that the power requirements of the tire drag are pretty constant no matter how fast you go (it is determined by the tires and the weight of the car, not by speed), for the Tesla it is around 50wh/mile.. since the Volt uses narrower tires maybe we can assume the Volts will consume 25wh/mile to overcome tire drag, half of what a Tesla requires.
So from the graph we can guess at power requirements and range at different speeds for the Volt.
55mph= 200wh/mile = 40 miles
60mph= 225wh/mile = 35.5 miles
65mph= 250wh/mile = 32 miles
70mph= 275wh/mile = 29 miles
75mph= 300wh/mile = 26.7 miles
So about 30 miles range at an average speed of 65mph.
This assumes the Volts is as aerodynamic as a Tesla Roadster.
Another neat thing in one of the graphs, Power vs Speed.. we can see that a 100mph the Tesla needs exactly 50kw of electricity.. by coincidence the Volts genset outputs 50kw also and it can drive the Volt at 100mph on the hwy (original design spec).
We could also work out hwy gas comsuption from this graph, but I dont know much about genset efficiency. We also see that a small 10kw genset could power the Tesla up to 50mph, if it was a serial electric.
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:55 am)That charger port plug looks expensive. I hope they have it set up so that when you lock the car it locks the plug in the port. I can see that being a problem when charging it in certain areas!
-1
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:56 am)I hate to say it but he is right. It looks like a 94 Dodge Stratus. I think he is saying the design is the specific issue.
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:58 am)The side plastic trim at the bottom of the rocker panels is not in yet. I think the car looks better without it, although there is something that looks like a structural rod or plumbing tube that is visible below the drivers side.
Jul 28th, 2009 (11:59 am)That’s an interesting bit!
Thanks Herm!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:00 pm)I completely agree with you. I would limit it further to cars those manufacturers build in North America, and require a certain amount of North American content. Spending our money to stimulate the Japanse/South Korean economy is not my idea of a good use of US taxdollars. Unfortunately, you really can’t do that, which is why I would skip the idea altogether.
Oh, and speaking of shooting ourselves in the foot/head/whatever, did you hear about the new cafe exemption for “small volume manufacturers?” Now Daimler and BMW (and Suzuki/Mitsubishi) can make all the gas guzzlers they want. And they don’t even have to pay fines for the privilege!
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124873997073285323.html#articleTabs%3Darticle
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:03 pm)Right. It’s true that they’ve tested by EPA and other standards, like US06 mentioned in the 40/40 link, but it sounded like Mr. Zeilinski wasn’t allowed to expunge much at all. Some ranges are within a mile of each other, okay, but which ones? I am just skeptical that the range is 40 miles at 70 mph and 41 at 30 mph.
I suspect, as I’m sure we all do, that the real ranges for 30-55-70 mph will be something like 45-40-38 miles. Come production ads, if we don’t have more concrete data by then, I’ll be worried if we still haven’t heard a number higher than 40 for highway mileage, because in that realm they _can_ legitimately push the EPA numbers, and the AER at 55 mph surely can’t be the same when going 70.
If they’d release some numbers running more accessories like the AC, I might feel more comfortable. I was just happy to hear so plainly that the aeros are working as intended.
NPNS!! =D~~~
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:04 pm)I think most people are with you on this one LauraM.
+3
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:05 pm)Exactly. We here at this site are the enthusiast crowd. But the thing I struggle to grasp is how many people outside of our little group would actually give an EREV a look and willingly write a check out for one of these, no matter how it looked? What is the TRUE interest in the exterior world outside the walls of this site? Maybe if we are honest about it, the truth may be a bit disappointing. I can’t help but wonder if Bob Lutz was right when he said that the bulk of customers for this technology reside on the coasts. Mainstream America may prove not to be an easy sell for anything electric. Many here tout the virtues of hybrids like the Prius, (myself included), but in reality they hold a very small portion of the overall market. Almost everyone has heard of a Prius, but that certainly doesn’t mean everyone is buying one. Pick-ups are still king in the sales category.
I really think GM had a difficult decision to make with developing this car. How do you develop a car with a revolutionary drivetrain, that will be universally accepted and recognized, yet not be polarizing, boring, or ugly, and will all the while meet or exceed efficiency targets, and not be too expensive? Talk about a balancing act! In the end, they made a choice to lean towards a mainstream design for the Volt. Looking at the big picture, I don’t know if I would have done it differently either.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:05 pm)…it sounds like Corvette Guy needs a new Corvette.
(=
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:06 pm)They are 2 completely different vehicles. Aerodynamics, weight and drag are completely different. Also the Tesla graph will be in ideal conditions with no A/C or heating. I would love to see the volt meeting those numbers but I’m not holding my breath until somebody has some real world driving with a production vehicle.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:07 pm)I’ve heard that this arrow indicates to which side the filler location is, although it does not on my 2003 GMC Sierra nor my wifes 2003 Elantra. Go figure.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:10 pm)It is, first quarter of 2011.
Sidenote: It actually looks really nice as a convertible, I seen one kicking around the south end of Oshawa 3-4 weeks ago, albeit with hideous two tone paint….but it was a ‘onsie,’ what can you expect, lol.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:16 pm)That is a really good thread from Tesla’s site that we’ve referenced numerous times. Note they give the operating parameters as single person load, no heat, no A/C, no headlights. Hopefully GM has squeezed out some other efficiency gains beside the tires. It will be cool to see these graphs for the Volt.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:20 pm)“They are 2 completely different vehicles. Aerodynamics, weight and drag are completely different.”
I attempt to compensate for the differences in my estimate.
“Also the Tesla graph will be in ideal conditions with no A/C or heating.”
from the link provided:
“The simplest experiment to consider, and one that gives great insight into the whole vehicle performance, is how efficiency and range vary as a function of driving speed. This is assuming that speed is held constant (i.e. cruise control) at each point. For any test or model run, there are many inputs that need to be specifically stated to make the results meaningful. So here are some of the critical inputs that we have assumed:
• Single driver ~180lbs
• Soft top or Hard top on vehicle (with windows up)
• No air conditioning usage
• No heat usage
• No headlights or cabin air blower (large 12V loads)
• Tires inflated to recommended efficiency setting 30/40 front/rear psi”
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:20 pm)Sadly you are likely right about that.
The Volt needs to be a big number car post Gen1, so it needs to be very nice but inoffensive and affordable. Not an easy task.
I still think that GM could make a huge impact (both for oil use and their CAFE numbers) by making 2 mode the standard driveline on all light duty trucks. I don’t know if there is a heavy duty version or not but it would be good there too.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:22 pm)“Nurse, a round of meds for the “house”….
There, that’s better. Thanks, Jim
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:28 pm)Reminds me of the old bar toast: “May your wife be as dirty as your truck!”
Apologies to all…..
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:29 pm)Jim my friend, you ‘get by’ in style!
My neighbor has a convertable crossfire, it’s a really nice car.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:33 pm)garage kept?
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:34 pm)I try to keep my foot off the brake as well. In fact, in the past I’ve been able to put 100,000 miles on a car before it’s needed a brake job. (Wish I could show the same restraint on the accelerator…).
The fact that regenerative braking has losses is actually a note of hope for getting a good AER on the highway. On the highway we will be trading regen losses for wind losses, and maybe it’ll come out a wash, which would be great.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:39 pm)Patent that Idea
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:45 pm)I thought there was Dual mode Regenerative Braking? City/low speed was more aggressive with the feel of brakes being applied and Highway mode allowing the car to coast alot further with very little Regenerative Braking? I’m pretty sure thats how it will work because you don’t want to lift the throttle on an interstate and the car slows down quickly.
When this was brought up earlier I immediately thought I would almost never use the more aggressive Regen brake setting given I’m one of those drivers who lifts off the throttle early and does alot of coasting when approaching lights, etc. And before I take any crap from Lead Foot Drivers on this web site, I do look in my rear view mirror and make sure I’m not holding any of you up…
I thought Lyle said it was a selector switch on the dash or in the controls so you as a driver get to choose….?
Todd
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:47 pm)Congrats to all that are involved on the Volt project. It’s a great day for GM!
Thanks Lyle for always working so hard on this site. Great Job friend.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:47 pm)LOL!!!
Errr, no comment…
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:49 pm)Volt in motion really conveys it’s image nicely.
Golden Pewter Metallic (a silvery-light-green-metallic) is what I want. Are current Malibu colors going to carry forward to Volt, or will Volt have its own color groups?
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:52 pm)The comment about a car being an emotional purchase is basically correct; however, I’ve felt for decades that GM’s emphasis on this has been to the detriment of other factors.
Yes, avoid the turn-offs. Under promise and over deliver.
It sounds like you’ve gotten the engineering right (knock on simulated wood-grain).
But you’d better have more ‘under the hood’ of your ad campaign than the same old glossy brochures and mood-inspiring commercials. Volt (and hopefully, the new GM) is a whole new beginning, and will require some actual education and attention to the more analytical side of car purchasing.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:53 pm)Lyle already has permission from his workplace to plug in his Mini. I suspect that finding a place to plug in while on the road won’t be all that hard. Most drivers won’t ask for permission to plug in if there is a socket right next to the parking lot at a motel. Stopping off at your cousins while on the road is a pretty common thing too. I suspect that owners will be getting out the charge cord more often then they think they will. Most likely, they’ll just leave is out while traveling.
I agree that most owners will get an extra cord to keep in their garage or even permanently connected to their 220v box.
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:55 pm)(to “away in a manger”
Away in foriegn lands
our soldiers may die
While families and children
are left here to cry
reducing dependance
on foreign source oil
Bring back all our heroes
to American soil
Electrification of autos is great
for 2010 I can hardly wait.
Going to GM to buy me a volt
Giving the oil sheiks a tremendous jolt
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:57 pm)Nice job, Mitch. A bit gloomy, but uncontested.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (12:58 pm)My cars are all silver or white. I like silver the best but it tends to fade weirdly in the sun and (plastic fades at a different rate than the metal paint) while the white cars are cooler and because they’re so much brighter your eyes are blinded and can’t see the dirt on them.
However, I note with some dismay that there are now so many traffic cops using LIDAR that I might have to get a black car and then black out all the chrome bits. That does seem to buy you a couple more seconds before they can get a lock on.
Still, I really don’t want a black car.
I wonder what colors they really were envisioning as the “primary” design colors? I always suspected it was silver. Somebody should ask at the webconference, today.
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:00 pm)Sadly, no, because it will be AWD by then.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:03 pm)One not-so-subtle indicator of quality is … quiet.
Ask a Buick salesman.
It’s hard to imagine a potentially quieter car than one with an electric motor. As a fan of classical music, I look forward to the day that I can actually hear soft passages while driving …
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:04 pm)When looking at the wh/mile chart published by Tesla, you have to assume that the Volt will probably have a lower Cd, say .25 versus .35, and have lower RR tires. The Roadster, however, looks to have a smaller cross section and will weigh 700-800 pounds less.
To some extent these things cancel out, though perhaps not fully, leaving drive train losses as the big unknown. Those are quite significant for the Tesla. We’ll see if the “transmission no one has ever thought of before” helps here. You’d have to guess that GM will do better than Tesla — this is one area the Tesla engineers struggled in — but whether this is true is something we’ll just have to wait and see on.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:07 pm)A co-worker really wanted an Equinox to replace her old minivan; but when push came to shove, it wouldn’t be enough of a mileage improvement to qualify for the Cash for Clunkers bill. She drove out with a newly redesigned 4 cylinder Highlander.
Cash for Clunkers was the only way she was getting a replacement for the 10+ year old van.
Yes, there was an emotional appeal to buying American (especially given current realities). But when a company can’t seem to find an in-town mpg number higher than 24, practicality has to rule.
This is an example of what I mean about excess attention to the car as an emotional purchase to the detriment of other factors. There has to be a concession to reality on every side. I think the Volt has that, in spades; but there needs to more than “emotional purchase” thinking, or it could fail.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:08 pm)***Threadjack***
Sorry to interrupt today’s topic, but this seems like it will be a big deal for GM or I am I reading too much into it?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124874527824585671.html#mod=djemalertNEWS
“Delphi’s lenders prevailed in a bankruptcy auction and are poised to take control of the bankrupt auto-parts supplier, beating back a government-orchestrated deal to sell the company to General Motors and a California-based private-equity firm.”
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:09 pm)You may be in for some disappointment. While they’ve done their best to hide it with bits of trim and odd window lines, it’s more or less a Prius clone in shape, with slightly worse aerodynamics. Not that there’s anything wrong with this– I’d rather see good engineering win over style, and there’s just not that many ways to get a small car to have a large interior *and* be slippery. Tall, fat “Kammback” hatchbacks like the Prius, Volt, and Insight are about as practical as it gets.
http://image.motortrend.com/f/17960367+w750/112_0905_02z+volt_insight_prius+drag_comparison.jpg
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:16 pm)I heard about the Volt before I saw the show car version. I was hooked by “40 miles all electric,” and the rest was only investigating whether or not they were kidding.
You enthusiasts would have had a time rolling down those crooked windows …
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:25 pm)lol….
Getting errors on the Voltage site…
Database Error: Unable to connect to the database:Could not connect to MySQL
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:39 pm)At this point, I’d go for domestic production over fuel economy. But I find it hard to believe she couldn’t find a domestic option. What abotu the Ford Escape hybrid?
Environmentally speaking–we’d be better off if she’d kept driving her old minivan. The emissions involved in creating the car more than offset the fuel efficiency advantages. WHich is why I think the whole bill is a really bad idea.
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:43 pm)Yeah. Early on there were problems viewing videos as well. The site does seem as if it were a little “rushed to market.” Let’s hope the Volt doesn’t seem the same way!!
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:49 pm)jdsv says: “I suspect, as I’m sure we all do, that the real ranges for 30-55-70 mph will be something like 45-40-38 miles.”
——————————–
Sounds about right, except that its rare to drive 30 mph for very long without turning, braking, stopping, etc, so that’s why city AER is 40.
As for the air conditioner, it shouldn’t be too hard to calculate. We did this a while ago using a room air conditioner, and IIRC it was about 15% less.
Jul 28th, 2009 (1:55 pm)Have been busy writing today but I looked into the looking glass and saw the troll, and well, other remarks about the Volt in kind of the same venue. I think there is a well seated hidden background angst about the design as it stands now, post prototype. Even Lyle has offered a glimmer of thought on the posting of whether electrics should have a distinct shape or not.
Such as it is, we have what we have. The nose, egad man but the 19th century steam train cattle/buffalo catcher is surely going to catch all sorts of other things.
The Lads are smart enough to avoid being snagged. Aren’t you boys? Well, Zeus is at least.
Regards!——-Higgins & Co.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:02 pm)The Bob Boniface Q&A session has just concluded. GREAT QUESTIONS Statik, Tagamet, and others!! Too bad he didn’t give more definitive answers to a lot of the questions
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:05 pm)For example, this 10,000 BTU room air conditioner:
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7661595&type=product&id=1134701146824
draws 8-8.9 amps at 115 volts, which is right around 1kW.
If you drive 70 mph, it would take you about 34 minutes to use up your 40 miles, which corresponds to around 0.5kWh for the air conditioner, leaving 7.5kWh for driving, which should get you around 37.5 miles AER.
If you drive more slowly on side streets, it may take you an hour to travel your 40 miles AER, so that would be around 1kWh for the air conditioner, leaving 7kWh for driving, which should get you around 35 miles AER.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:05 pm)The chat is over.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:07 pm)It is not clear that coasting to a stop when you have regenerative breaking is the most energy efficient thing to do. All of the do’s and don’ts of efficient driving will have to be rethought. Many things will stay the same but some will probably be different.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:12 pm)There are “mountains still to climb” in the science of car painting. How about dark colors which reflect light in the infra-red (to reduce cooling load)? How about an exterior coating system which acts like a photovoltaic cell (generating electricity from sunlight) even as it protects the car? How about photochromic paint that changes color? These last two stretch the definition of paint.
Neither here nor there for this thread, perhaps; except to note that there is much more to the future of auto paint than matching some lost ideal for quality, or the lowering of costs for the manufacturer.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:17 pm)We agree, then, that high quality and heavy are not synonymous, indeed can even be opposites. Yay! There is hope for efficient AND high performance vehicles on the planet yet.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:17 pm)I agree that some of the questions were sort of glazed over. There were quite a few deferred “stay tuned” kind of responses too. To Bob’s defense though, it’s tough to give depth to answers when you’re given such a finite window of time for a webchat.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:20 pm)Anything to do with Delphi is a big deal for GM. But I don’t know the implications of this particular deal.
It is good for future firms that want to go through bankrupty though. And, that’s just as important if not more so than than the immediate implications for GM.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:20 pm)I felt like I struck a nerve with “When will someone outside GM get to experience charge sustaining mode” (g). Answer: What’s all the fuss? I drove it and it’s fine.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:20 pm)Lyle,
You have done it once more. Great chat session with Bob. I saw some great questions and Bob did some fancy foot work. Some he just wasn’t allowed to answer yet. Don’t you know he goes home and gets in the bathroom all by himself and talks about all the things he can’t tell anyone. Must be hard to keep from blabbing it all out.
Anyway. Great job, Lyle. I put in a good word for you to get one of the test vehicles for a few months. Of course, I added myself to the request and told Bob to not include Statik. I sure wish he could have answered more questions. How many questions were asked and how many did he answer?
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:23 pm)ok..how bout more up beat “jingle bells”
reduce our oil
from foriegn soil
go and buy a volt
hear the sheik
give a shreik
we’ll give em quite a jolt
‘lectric drive
aint no jive
glory say amen
I cant wait
until that date
november twenty ten
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:24 pm)You know like this full size SUV like seat:
http://www.vrrentals.com/images/2006_big_chair.jpg
or even
http://www.rusticwoodland.com/contents/media/t_rustic%20standard%20chair.jpg
versus this
http://www.dexigner.com/design_news/5042.html
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:25 pm)Tag, that sounds like a errogant bastards response.
“Answer: What’s all the fuss?”
What a jerk. It’s almost enough to assume that the experience is of one “Only a mother can love”.
That’s JMHO
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:26 pm)Bob did a really great job given that his department is specialized in the style and aerodynamics/physics stuff.
Anything we can learn from anyone at GM is a real help for us to understand the extremely high quality vehicle GM is working so hard to make for us.
Thank You Bob!!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:27 pm)Edit: that answer is paraphrased. It was closer to “I can’t understand all the fuss is about… I drove it and its fine. If anyone has the direct quote, please post it.
got it
[Comment From Tagamet ]
When will someone outside of GM experience charge sustaining mode?
2:57
Bob Boniface: I have driven the mule in charge sustaining mode and, frankly, I don’t know what all the fuss is about. It was remarkably smooth and quiet with a nearly seamless transition. I think the team wants it to be perfect before letting others drive it. So, as far as outsiders driving it is concerned – stay tuned.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:29 pm)I didn’t bother trying to join the webcast. I think it sucks that they have to pick and choose the Q’s they want to answer. They do that on their Voltage site. Pisses me off…..
Yeah, I’m a selfish jerk.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:29 pm)I have never noticed that. I will take a look at my 3 vehicles and see what they say. My two Honda vehicles (Odyessey & Accord) are on the driver side while the Nissan Frontier Crew-cab is on the passenger side. I do wish they were all on the same side. Would not really matter to me which side. Just chose one and go with it. I can remember when most of the GM cars had the gas filler under the rear license plate. Wasn’t a bad location except in a rear end collision.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:31 pm)2:03 [Comment From David]—Not me, by the way.
Hi Bob, Can you give us an approximate number of how many mpg the volt will achieve after the battery runs out?
2:04 Bob Boniface: When battery is depleted you should expect several hundred more miles running on engine generator.
———————————–
“several hundred more miles”
WOW!!! Several to most people more than three and close to 7, but I guess the strict definition is more than two.
But what if the tank is 8 gallon capacity and we get an additional 500 miles…62.5 mpg!!! Too optimistic? Ya, I know.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:32 pm)I asked Bob that question about the front air dam being too low. He said it is the same height as the Corvette and should pose no problem if hit. Well, somehow that doesn’t really make me feel better.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:32 pm)Right on, Muddy!
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:34 pm)I suspect the front grille is going to be a “sticking point” for bugs. If you know what I mean. Going to be like a mobile bug zapper. They just won’t fall off onto the road surface. They will stick there until you high pressure wash them off.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:40 pm)Bruce,
With the Volt, the design is just a part of the main issue. Sure it would be great if GM had designed the Volt to look like a Fisker Karma, but they did not. Design in this case is somewhat secondary to the primary purpose of the Volt. You will be able to drive 40 miles before having to use any gasoline. If your commute is less than 40 miles round trip and you re-charge each night, you may use very little gasoline during most of the year. So, driving as many miles electrically is the primary purpose of the Volt. If it looks like a 94 Dodge Stratus and does 40 MPC, great.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:42 pm)Maybe Tiger Woods and others will find some work some other place. GM can save a lot of money by staying away from high paid spokespersons. Just get some “everyday” people to do spots. They would probably be more believable. And save a ton of money.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:44 pm)Statik, once again, goes under the bus (g). I probably joined him with that last question, but to give BB credit, he DID choose to answer it.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:45 pm)I hope they have a real “fire engine” red. Most of GM’s red colors look to blah. Ford and Chrysler have some good colors. Surely GM can do as good.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:48 pm)Probably for the best, don’t you think. One less company the government will totally control. Might get some better management in the bargain. Let’s hope so.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:48 pm)I think he can understand what the fuss is.
IMO, most of the people who post their opinions here seem to be pretty knowledgeable and the transition from Battery to ICE seems to be an (the most!) important aspect of this Voltec platform.
I’m not really a conspiracy theorist, so I think that they do have some issues to work through, but I believe that they will make it nearly perfect.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:49 pm)I can never remember which sides my gas fillers are on and only one car has “Fuel door (arrow)” printed clearly on the dash. However, I found I can easily remember what the back end of my cars look like and the filler is always on the opposite side from the exhaust. For my one car with twin exhausts, the center pipe underneath the car is offset to one side and sure enough the filler is on the opposite side of that.
What might be kind of scary is that I can remember what the underside of my car looks like better than I can remember which side the gas filler is on. I try not to dwell on that.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:51 pm)AWD is good!
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:51 pm)We all knew he could not answer some questions that GM doesn’t want out just yet. But that should not keep us from trying and we did try, I am sure. I know I asked a couple I felt sure he could not answer without breaking confidences. But all in all, it was a good chat session. Looking forward to the next one.
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:54 pm)Funny! When I rode motorcycles there was some comment made about bugs and my teeth. Yes the Volt will have an interesting, ah, look, once encountering massive numbers of bugs not to mention cows. Oops, I mentioned cows. Well anything that encounters a cow mass is going to look, “different” as in destroyed.
Cheers!—-Higgins
Jul 28th, 2009 (2:55 pm)That IS interesting. Don’t know what it means, either, though.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:01 pm)I agree. I have no problem with questions going unanswered. Besides, we wouldn’t want to have the Honeymoon night before the wedding! (ok, ok, some would, but I’ll keep looking forward to some surprises).
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+14
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:02 pm)I haven’t posted here before but felt a need to clarify one of my comments from the chat. When I said that I did not understand what all the fuss was about, I was referring to the internal fuss. Of course I understand that this is a crirical part of the EREV experience and people are eager to understand this part of the puzzle. The point was that the transition is so good that I do not know why we do not allow people to experience it. Apologies for the confusion.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:02 pm)He seems to be referring to the GM team’s fussing about not letting people drive in charge sustaining mode, not why outside people are wondering about it. Remember, his world is surrounded by GM folks and our world is surrounded by eager potential consumers.
The more I read it the more I’m pretty sure he was referring to wondering why the GM folks fussing about not letting people drive it.
So, I think the closest translation would be “Seems fine to me, I’d just let people drive it with the engine on. But the decision is not up to me so you will just have to wait until somebody says it’s OK”
But that’s just my interpretation, of course.
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:03 pm)Bob, Thanks for the clarification.
Much appreciated.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:04 pm)Capt Jack,
Sorry if you don’t like the format. But if you have any questions you would like answered just ask them here on this site. I am sure someone will give you an answer. Might not be a good one or one you could “take to the bank”, but it would be an answer. I’m just kidding. I know how you feel.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:05 pm)I asked a similar question, which didn’t get posted.
Overall considering he’s the big cheese I guess his answers were OK, overly politically correct, but ok.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:06 pm)Bob did as good a job as he was allowed to do. Answering some of questions would get him in hot water with the boss.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:07 pm)I think of you as a straight shooter my friend!
No BS… you say it the way you see it!
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:07 pm)That’s certainly a plausible interpretation. Although I felt a bit smacked down, he may well have been referring to their team, as opposed to our team.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:10 pm)Uncontested.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:10 pm)Actually it is quite clear. Most batteries only capture about 70% of the energy that is sent their way, and the remaining 30% turns in to heat. Special batteries may be better, but there’s no way (thermodynamically speaking) that they can be 100%.
I also drive like Old Man. Think ahead, drive gently, don’t get race to stoplights. It’s also great for avoiding accidents, especially the thinking ahead parts. It’s also a great way to keep passengers from loosing their lunch. I don’t get as much of an advantage out of the Prius’s drivetrain as someone who drives more aggressively, but my overall energy usage is lower. If you reduce the need for the HSD’s hybrid features in the first place, you win, even if you have it on-board.
Even though I was once 18, I am a little confused by people who want to race to a stoplight only to slam on the breaks and sit still as I glide through just when the light turns green. Being able to time a traffic light is both more efficient AND faster — the only downside is that it requires practice and knowing the peculiarities of your town.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:10 pm)Wouldn’t it be great if GM could post all the questions on the Volt-age site and answer them all as best as they can within what GM would allow? Doesn’t seem like too big of a job, but who at GM would have the time to go through all of the questions and formulate a “GM allowed” answer?
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:11 pm)Thank you.
Can you clarify one more…the mpg in Charge Sustaining Mode?
Just kidding!
I completely understand why that information can’t be divulged at this time.
Thank You (and GM) for your time.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:11 pm)Muddy,
Your have CJS pegged pretty good.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:12 pm)What is the MPG in generator mode?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:14 pm)He did answer my question about the colors and design but he didn’t answer my question if there is going to be a Transformer’s edition (eh, I had to ask…
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:15 pm)What do you want it to be? Not trying to be funny. If you ask that question you should have an acceptable number in mind. As to what number I would accept, anything over 30 would be acceptable because I don’t plan on using much fuel. Any MPG over 40 or 50 would be icing on the cake.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:16 pm)Absolutely.
I was on a team that built a Burt Rutan Long EZ aircraft.
It was VERY light and very strong it was well designed and our team (class actually) did a darn good job building it.
so yes I know from experience that light, strong and quality are not exclusive.
————————————————————-
MY SUV is a Land Rover Discovery, does that count as a large SUV?
I think of it as more midsize. The seats are excellent!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:17 pm)I want it to be 83.3 mpg.
Too greedy?
What about you?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:17 pm)I agree! Those are all things that I value.
However, I think that Bob Boniface could be missing something. A lot of the people who aren’t looking to make an emotional purchase are the people who buy Japanese Transportation Appliances and keep them for decades. (Not all Japanese cars are Transportation Appliances, but a lot of popular ones are.) Any car that I buy must be win on a buy-the-numbers comparison with the transportation appliance that we currently own, in order to justify the purchase to both the wife and also the financial planner.
I think Bob Boniface is absolutely right about the cars that GM sells, but it’s possible that by focusing on the emotional aspects, they might be missing a significant part of the market — and the same part of the market that they lost in the late 1980s and early 1990s. Or maybe his job is to focus on the emotional aspects, and other parts of the team are focusing on the numbers.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:19 pm)And apologies from the Questioner for misunderstanding the reply.
Many thanks for all you do toward getting the Volt’s wheels on the road!!
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:24 pm)David,
I don’t think any MPG would be “too greedy”. The more the better in my thinking. I would like to beat the Prius, the Insight and any other vehicle on the planet in MPG in generator mode. If that answers your question. And it was a good, valid question. Thanks.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:26 pm)Capt Jack,
Bet you didn’t expect an answer from BB, did you? Hey, I thought he had to head out to another meeting! But he took time to give you a shout out. Mighty good of him. He knows we got to keep our Captain happy. OK?
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:31 pm)Make my day! and let me feel it and drive it. It would probably be like Christmas to me also. It is good that GM is on track however, they need to shoot directly at the target and keep on track. The Volt team has been sounding a little flaky at times.
We need to see something on the road!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:31 pm)lol….
The squeaky wheel gets the grease I guess….
Hey Bob, if you’re ever in Northern CA, you & me, Lunch @ H( . y . )TERS, I buy!!
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:35 pm)Bob Boniface’s Volt is going to be black, how can the lead designer be wrong? lol
“Bob Boniface: We will have a full range of colors but you can be certain that the original concept Volt green will be available. I will order mine in black… “
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:35 pm)Heh, that sounds about right!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:37 pm)Yep, just have to keep him stocked with Kaluha and hooters wings and he’s right as rain!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:38 pm)I want a button thats labled “BatOuttaHell”. That’s how my wife drives. It should get say 20AER….lol
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:38 pm)Thanks Bob!
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:41 pm)He definitely issued you the ‘pimp hand,’ heeh. He is a lot more polished Jon Lauckner with the delivery…skipping over the parts he doesn’t want to answer.
Probably good for him…not so much for us on the outside.
I give Lauckner a ‘A’ for his webchat, maybe a C- for Bob.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:41 pm)Guess you win THAT particular argument statik!
(I’m still getting the blue silver for my prairie dust.)
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:42 pm)I quite like the looks of the Prius. And the more I drive it, the more the shape means “efficient, reliable, and useful” to me.
When I first started driving the Prius, the shape meant “my other car is an Star Trek Shuttlecraft”. That really works for me, though, since I’m a geek to me core.
I have keep correcting you “prissy” people. You’re missing the point about the Prius and, until you figure it out, you won’t be able to best the Prius — or even understand what you’re seeing on the road. There are currently 4 Prii in my extended family, and they’re all owned by practical people who value both efficiency and utility — the hard-core environmentalists ride bicycles.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:43 pm)Actually thinking about it, an AWD Volt could be pure rear drive at the flip of a switch (ok, beep on the touchpad)
A Volt drift car…. ooooo
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:47 pm)EDIT: moved
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:48 pm)bob_boniface said:
“…of course I understand that this is a crirical part of the EREV experience and people are eager to understand this part of the puzzle. The point was that the transition is so good that I do not know why we do not allow people to experience it. Apologies for the confusion.”
————
Glad someone else doesn’t use spellchecker.
/real man
…and a real man’s choice on color too…black
+1
(Grats on one of the slipperiest interviews yet @ Fastlane…I could use you at my business, subterfuge is always handy, hehe)
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:53 pm)It’s an extension cord.
The price will drop quickly as more electrics hit the streets.
NAPA and the like will stock them.
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:57 pm)I thought that was the most obviously evaded question too.
It would have been better if he simply said “I’m not at liberty to share that information at this time.”
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (3:58 pm)Don’t forget the rum, one can’t be a proper sea cap’n without the rum…
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:01 pm)Why are we asking the outside GM drive in extended range mode’ anyway? He is the lead designer. Even if he knew/knows…it isn’t going to be his question to answer.
BTW Bob, if your still out there, how many titles have you had since the Volt program started, I remember you as:
Director of Advanced Design when ithe Volt came out in early 2007.
Director of E-Flex/Volt Studio later in the year.
Now, Director of Design
Have I missed any? And do you just get new name placks for your desk and door…or do you get a raise too with each new title?
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:02 pm)lol….
I’m an easy going guy. Jus put her:
http://www.101thefox.net/Portals/1/Brody/Danica%20Patrick%20-%20SI%202009.jpg
in front of me and i’m a “SUBMIT”, “CONFORM” and “OBEY” kind of guy.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:07 pm)True, but some old cars are an environmental disaster. I once drove a car that burned a lot of oil, and it seemed like replacing it (or funding an engine rebuild that I couldn’t afford) would be a win for everyone. I would love to do a real scientific calculation to find out where that borderline is.
Every time I follow someone who has a malfunctioning (or nonexistent) catalytic converter, my inner Libertarian hangs his little head and thanks the EPA for cleaning up car exhausts around the time I was born.. If you asked me when I’m following such a vehicle, I’d probably put $50 toward having the owner install/fix the catalytic converter on that vehicle.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:08 pm)MissusSparrow is giving the indy a go… on the way to work!
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:09 pm)Fascinating topic, Lyle! I admired your attempt to get Boniface to reveal the Volt’s CD (and chuckled at his clever sidestepping of the question). But what interested me more was his comment, “We designed the Opel Ampera in my studio as well and it looks great in white.”
Others here may recall that I don’t like the “fake-looking” traditional Chevy double-grill design of the Volt by contrast with the bold, creative, distinctive “double boomerang design” Boniface used for the Opel Ampera (see this photo: http://www.netcarshow.com/opel/2012-ampera/1024×768/wallpaper_02.htm) The beauty of the Opel front end is that the sculpted headlight/running-light/turning-signal/fog-light housings are highly functional yet aerodynamic and extremely distinctive!
Bravo, Bob, for the gorgeous Ampera styling! I’ll be taking delivery of mine in Europe.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:09 pm)Expected ICE-mode mileage, eh? Well, let’s see. If I got…
<40MPG @ <45MPH? I’d be pretty disappointed.
~45 MPG in mixed city/highway driving? I could enjoy and respect that.
~50 MPG in mixed city/highway driving? I would think that was very good.
~55 MPG @ I-don’t-care-what speed, and you can color me impressed!
60+ MPG @ 65MPH+? Dang, I’ll slap my own granny in the face, just sell me one ASAP!
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:10 pm)Busy day at work for me, I missed the chat. Did anyone ask about the different trim levels?
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:10 pm)I remember when the great Jim Healy used to do his sports show in LA. When he reported the golf and tennis results, he had a snoring track running in the background, LOL.
Although I have to admit that the recent tournament in Scotland, or wherever it was, got a bit interesting. Even to the likes of me, who has never hit a golf ball in his life.
-1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:13 pm)The Fusion is a sedan. I’ll keep the higher-mileage Prius with usefully shaped cargo area that’s already paid-off and sitting in my driveway, thank-you. The Fusion looks great if you want a bigger sedan, but it looks like a slightly less versatile car (I’d be all over a station wagon version).
BTW, calling it a “prissy” misses the point.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:14 pm)Yup, she’s “Pre-MenOnPausal”….
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:15 pm)Yeah, there not Megan Fox Trim Level.
P
Bummer.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:15 pm)Well Dave, given that there was about a whole seven* seconds of on-screen time for “Jolt” (the in-movie name for the Volt-based Autobot)… and it was VERY easy to miss altogether, unless you were watching for it…
… then I would have to guess “no.”
* = this is a total guess, but it was very, very brief.
-1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:18 pm)Do you all think that it was the real Bob? Sorry to be so cynical.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:20 pm)I’ll put in with you there too.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:21 pm)In Manitoba everybody has these huge mesh screens tied to the front of their cars. The bug splat there are something beyond overwhelming!
The screens are necessary otherwise the radiators full with bug guts and they no longer cool properly
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:23 pm)Ya know, NM, I preferred the Ampera’s front-end look at first too, but now that I’ve seen the Volt in black, and in motion, it’s really growing on me quite a bit.
Interesting that both designs came from Bob’s team though. I guess the contemporary design language at Chevy is painted on with a pretty broad brush, all across the product line.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:25 pm)SOMETIMES the Captain just has to take direction…
See, he’s humble too!
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:27 pm)FWIW I interpreted it exactly like DaveP did. I never caught so much of a breath of a “pimp hand”. Basically what he said was that he had driven it and he had no idea what the engineers were fussing about — seemed seamless to him but hey, the engineers are just being engineers.
This was BTW both an interesting Q and an interesting A. In so many words he answered your question. He could not of course answer your Q directly about a date because he doesn’t really call the shots on when someone can experience charge sustaining mode.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:28 pm)Edit: My first paragraph got chopped up during ‘cut and paste’, it should have read:
“Why are we asking what the MPG is in charge sustaining mode and why hasn’t anyone outside GM driven in extended range mode’ anyway? He is the lead designer. Even if he knew/knows…it isn’t going to be his question to answer.”
/sigh
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:31 pm)She was fretting all week that something on the van was going to break before she could pick up her new car (it had been a regular occurrence).
Compare the cost of the Ford Escape (taking Cash-For-Clunkers into account) to a modestly equipped Highlander (also, she has a fairly large family), and you might get an inkling of why she chose as she did. Remember, she wasn’t going to be able to get the Equinox or the Highlander without that check.
Again, when push comes to shove, you do what you have to do for yourself.
To put it another way, the less you have, the more likely it is that practicality will outweigh emotionalism. (Of course, there are those who are both practical and well-off; this is laudable but not as common).
At initial prices, there are droves of people who cannot consider a Volt, whatever their feelings.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:34 pm)I always think the same thing too, but I never say it because I figure I would get uber-flamed for being to cynical…glad you mentioned it.
And then I figure they get the benefit of the doubt if they don’t use any ‘d00d’ speak and/or profanities…and at the end of the comment they really haven’t said anything that is unexpected, so even if they are ‘not legitimate,’ they really haven’t said anything the ‘original’ wouldn’t have.
Few people impersonate post just to be that ‘uneventful’
+2
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:36 pm)I’ll keep my ’79 until Chevy comes out with the next Stingray!
Hopefully it will be electric!
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:37 pm)All kinds of interesting Qs. I have to say I couldn’t figure out where statik’s Q came from? GE? But it was an interesting Q, as was the “amusing” part of the answer.
I thought the A to Lyle’s Q was the most interesting. We also now know that we can’t ask about the Cd but after this week we can ask how the Volt’s Cd compares to the new Toyota’s!
Those still fussing about charge sustaining mode should have been reassured by the A to Tag’s Q. Seems like this issue boils down to anal retentive engineers (but that’s a good thing).
Overall a very good session.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:40 pm)Thanks for taking the time to clarify. Very thoughtful.
Please never do this for statik! (All we wants is a tie anyway).
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:41 pm)Jackson: “Volt (and hopefully, the new GM) is a whole new beginning”…
Yes. We all are hoping and praying that is the case. If the quality of fit and finish and performance of the New Camaro is an indicator of things to come, then the good ol’ boys at GM are finally getting it.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:41 pm)Yes, he said there would be some (seriously I’m not being funny – “We will also have more than one trim level”).
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:43 pm)As Mike says, after “Jolt’s” limited on-air time in Transformers, I would have answer your question of “…is there going to be a Transformer’s edition” Volt, like this:
“Yes, we will build blue Volts, but we couldn’t tell if it had any special badging in the film, so that is up to you to throw stickers on it. As a added bonus, our blue Volts will go farther than 10 feet.”
Sidenote: Bob has to be pretty pissed about the whole ‘Transformers/Volt’ thing. They do all the work up to make it, and not only is it hardly used in the film, but it started the hellstorm of bad PR on the production design, while stealing GM’s thunder on doing their own Volt reveal, when it got leaked.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:48 pm)I don’t care. As long as there’s a chance he “Maybe” reading this I’m good.
Jul 28th, 2009 (4:56 pm)Just for fun, this is the Transformer’s original thread I was refering to that surely drove Bob insane:
http://gm-volt.com/2008/08/28/breaking-production-volt-spied-the-real-deal/
(I took a world of heat on that one…good times, lol)
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:14 pm)That’s only because Jon told you he was still working on getting Bob’s pink tie for you
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:33 pm)I agree with you on his answer to the Cd question, which is why I posted it on our Facebook page and also tweeted it out with a link to the chat. People also need to understand Bob is a designer and that’s what he really tried to focus on – questions related to the design of the car. Also, he obviously can’t comment on the mpg in charge sustaining mode yet because we haven’t even announced it. We’re still working with the EPA to figure it out.
Feel free to chat me up on Twitter anytime.
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:43 pm)As per Lyle’s question on the cd:
“…and are you able to tell us the actual CD at this point in time? Tesla mentioned its yet to be built mode S has a CD of 0.27 ”
Bob Boniface responded: Hi Lyle. People may think we are skirting the aero issue by not quoting our tunnel figures. We are not. The fact of the matter is that many of our competition quote grossly exaggerated aero figures that are not repeatable when we test their vehicles in our tunnel. If I quote an actual GM derived tunnel figure, it may not look impressive to you when, in fact, it is superior to most if not all of our competition. It is very much like the horsepower race back in the 60s. The Volt aero performance is second only to the EV1 in GM history.
==================
I don’t think anyone is buying that answer as being a straight shot. We aren’t telling you strictly because other people exaggerate? What is that?
If he really wanted to thrown down and give you a answer, but not give you the ‘hard number’ he feels is legitimate, he could have said, “a lot of people exaggerate, so I don’t want to tell you our internal numbers…but we are lower than the 2009 Prius in a head-to-head in our tunnel, or close to it”….because he sure as heck knows how those two compare.
…but he didn’t do that, and that is really what we want to know. How does it stack up against the ‘big boys,’ in the ‘hybrid/EV’ segment. ie) Prius, Insight, Tesla
He did mention later about getting a 2010 in the wind tunnel this week…I would love to hear what GM finds the differential to be between the two (if they still don’t want to give the Cd)… more important to me would be the CdA (but I digress)
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:44 pm)I will guarantee it’s the real Bob Boniface – he reads this site quite a bit like many of us who work on the Volt program, which is why he answered Lyle’s, statik’s and Tagamet’s questions. We can’t always answer everything or comment on every story here, but we do our best to get as many questions answered as possible, and we do pay attention.
Not sure how familiar you guys are with Dave Darovitz over at Chevy, but he’s also a good link to the inside at http://twitter.com/ddarovitz and as always, you can reach me at http://twitter.com/philcolley
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:45 pm)You’re a funny guy!!!
You probably think the guys whose role it is to announce recent deaths, execute home foreclosures and explain tax mistake realities for families facing hard times are not only hilarious but a great deal flaky too.
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:51 pm)But you said “STEAL the seats from a MB C Class, or BMW M-sport.” Now you want your Rover seats in the Volt? Make up your mind.
Poor vehicle makers trying to figure out actual consumer demand. You’ll get what they give you and you’ll be happy (for gen I).
I think the seats in a current Jetta TDI feel great and I can’t stand the 2000 Subaru Outback seats for more than 20 minutes (don’t know why, they look fine, but hurt my back) , but what do I know from seats? I’m big and tall.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:53 pm)Hi Dave.
I work HVAC and that is probably old technology.
Variable frequecy DC dribes can reduce power draw and be based on demand vs straight output.
our top line unit uses 20% of the power of the base model not counting load modulation.
Load modulation allows lower compression rations making to co efficient of power lower saving energy. if it is hot it runs full out, and as it approaches target temp it actually reduces the capacity for smoother more comfortable cooling.
I woudl bet a much lower energy penalty on the volt or cooling
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:55 pm)besides…black cars look better in the shade….(name that artist..)
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:57 pm)“the fast and the furios 6- electric boogaloo”?
Jul 28th, 2009 (5:59 pm)Do you mean commentary about the car running on generator. Because the video will look just like the one above!
Couldn’t resist
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:03 pm)LOL!!!!
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:05 pm)We could sure use more rain, keeps ‘em under the bridges
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:36 pm)Well it’s very encouraging, if true. It’s kind of hard to argue with Mr. Colley’s comment below.
If GM folks are actually following this blog, i hope that you know that I am a pretty loyal customer. It’s just that the future looks so uncertain and scary sometimes that it is hard to keep from coming off as angry and cynical. In fact, I devoutly hope that you can turn it around. Show me a Volt, and I’m there to buy it, as I’ve said about 1000 times.
We are taking our 1917 Chevrolet speedster to the Monterey Historic Automobile Races next month to try to put up a challenge to the ubiquitous Model T based race cars. That’s about as Chevy diehard as you can get, IMHO. You can check out the entry list at montereyhistoricautomobileraces.com, Group 1A. If we can keep the old 4 cyl, babbitt bearing, engine together all weekend, maybe we can send you a photo of the car in action.
Best regards.
Jul 28th, 2009 (6:57 pm)Hey, We’ll be in Monterey this weekend. Gonna hit up the big Aquarium and beaches and Canery Row. The Pier too for some good ol Shrimp in a cup.
+1
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:18 pm)I’ll go with Gino Vanelli for $800 Alex.
(how sad is that?)
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:26 pm)I am not above bribes, I freely admit that. I’ll say nice things about you too if you have something to offer heeh.
…your in PR, you know what I’m talking about. (=
(Lyle has some wicked viral marketing action here doesn’t he?)
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:27 pm)Well, I’m fascinated by the Cd and the CdA as well, but it all just leads to the true bottom line, the AER and the gas mileage on the “range extender”, actually.
Even though I don’t agree with N Riley all the time, I have to totally agree that the gas mileage bragging rights are going to be a critically important marketing issue. It really will be kind of like the old “horsepower wars”, as somebody, correctly IMHO, pointed out yesterday or today.
i am also waiting impatiently to find out the weight. I continue to refuse to believe that weight becomes irrelevant because of regenerative braking. Somebody, also correctly IMHO, pointed out that the best results still come from miminizing braking, regen or no regen. You still have to accelerate the weight, and it takes energy/fuel to do it. The laws of physics have not been repealed.
So, if they want to keep all of this stuff close to the vest, well and good. I’m just saying thay they have to beat the Prius on gas mileage, or pay some sort of a substantial marketing price.
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:30 pm)Hey Mitch,
Does it do that with a PWM bleed from high side to low side?
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:37 pm)We appreciate any of you guys sticking your toes in the water over here (or on online chats)…don’t let our cold, seemingly callous shells and calculated questions throw/scare you off. Hey, Rob Peterson called me a villain…I didn’t shy away, heeh. (=
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:39 pm)Sidenote to you mentioning the pink tie earlier:
Clearly I need to step up my effort to get that tie off him. I’m thinking about organizing some kind of grassroots email campaign to Bob from all the members of the Volt team to make that happen. Or maybe something more ‘low tech’ to catch Bob’s eye….like a flyer blitz inside the Renaissance Center to put the pressure on him. Your in marketing, maybe you could give me the inside track, lol. I hear work stoppage usually work in busting down barriers at GM.
How do you guys not smirk whenever he is talking to you and sporting that bad boy? (….that is if you ever get a chance these days to see him in the flesh that is)
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:49 pm)DonC, re: my question.
I was trying to be specific to his job, something that he knows/could answer that we really didn’t have a good answer for, and not the usual fair…tricky though.
I/we didn’t really get a answer either, he kinda dodged it. GE plastics got sold out to SABIC in 2007…but what does that have to do with the price of soup? They didn’t stop doing what they do, or severe relationships because of having a new boss.
At no point along the way did we ever hear the Volt was not going to have all the fancy GE stuff because it got sold in May 2007, this is the first I’ve heard about it, we believed we were going to have things like the roof/door sills right up until the ‘accidental’ reveal…and Bob still didn’t actually say, “well GE Plastics sold to SABIC, and thats why it didn’t happen”…I suspect cost/bad follow through on the concept was at play here again. (just my opinion though)
Jul 28th, 2009 (7:51 pm)Actually, there is a company in England making light-weight wheel motors:
http://www.hipadrive.com/phev.html
When you add up the weight for wheels, CV-joints, axels & such, their in-wheel motor is about the same weight.
However, AWD with in-wheel motors would probably have fairly weak motors in each wheel. All 4 wheel motors would be needed to produce maximum power.
So if you switch to RWD only, you would lose 1/2 of your max power.
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:06 pm)I believe the regen mode is on the shifter, where the low-gear positions would be on a normal transmission, like this:
P = Park
R = Reverse
N = Neutral
D = Drive (normal with coast)
M = Regenerative braking when you let up on the accelerator
Here’s a picture of the shifter markings on the LCD:
http://www.autoblog.com/gallery/production-chevy-volt-interior/low/#9
Jul 28th, 2009 (8:46 pm)Lyle should be really proud that some of the GM folks visit the site from time to time – and even “recognize” some of us by name. It might have gone better for us if they hadn’t complemented statik quite so much, but hey, it’s not all rainbows and lollipops (g). I’m still working on generating a scab for the wound related to the “new” site, but I imagine I’ll heal before Independence Day.
Thanks again to the GM folks.
Be well,
Tagamet
PS unrelated question – what did they settle on as the volume of the fuel tank?
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:06 pm)“Some” would say *cough*statik*cough that competitors would then use the site to glean even more info. That WOULD be “my kinda world” though.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (9:16 pm)I asked about special accessory packs but didn’t get a direct reply to that. I was wondering about NOVEL accessories that might be value-added features. I guess we’ll have to settle for dual, high def, configurable, finger-or-glove sensitive, touch screens (lol).
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:17 pm)PS, still haven’t announced it yet
But you guys will certainly be some of the first to know when we do. And you’re probably right, maybe if we gave statik a little more flack sometimes, he wouldn’t send us novels for questions during the webchats 
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:25 pm)I bet they will have a good red. Check the first pictures of the Cruze that were released, and today’s post on the Viva (same red). That red is HAWT.
FWIW, the pics I’m referring to (Cruze in red) are shown in this thread:
http://gm-volt.com/2008/08/21/gm-releases-pictures-of-the-chevy-cruze/
EDIT: DANG! Clicked -1, meant to click +1. Everybody add 2 to N.Riley’s post vote-count to compensate, please.
Jul 28th, 2009 (10:25 pm)Still some surprises left then. Lots of chatter about that MPG #, and thought I might get at it vama marga (left-handed). Worth a shot.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!**********NPNS
Jul 29th, 2009 (7:37 am)Phil Colley with GM said:
“PS, still haven’t announced it yet But you guys will certainly be some of the first to know when we do. And you’re probably right, maybe if we gave statik a little more flack sometimes, he wouldn’t send us novels for questions during the webchats”
—-
…next time, it takes you the whole hour just to read it
(=
Jul 29th, 2009 (8:31 am)I believe in options!
I have spent a good 100000km in the Discovery and can say with authority that they are excellent 8 hour or better seats.
But in any case good seats DO make a difference in the perception of a cars value.
Jul 29th, 2009 (9:15 am)Dan.
we are using a variable frequency DC drive to modulate tot motor speed and variable orifice bypass. Indoor / outdoor sensors and a computer algorithm to control both..It is not available on the general market, but on average in the lab vs a comparable 14 SEER standard central air, it maintains temperatures more precisely and uses about 25% of the power consummed,
Mind you this is tied to a variable speed blower in the furnace and there is communication between the units.
With the Volt i would anticipate no difficulties in crreating a similarly structured heating and cooling system as the car is DC powered anyway
Jul 29th, 2009 (10:02 am)Gotta have my rims, as Chris Rock might say. I saw a black Smart yesterday with what I swear must have been at least 18″ wheels, also black. Looked pretty sharp, I’m forced to admit.
Jul 29th, 2009 (10:06 am)Wouldn’t that effect the AER to put larger wheels on the Volt?
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!***************NPNS!
Jul 29th, 2009 (12:37 pm)Yes, it should officially be called the “Production Volt Leak Commemorative Transformers Edition”
You guys are right. ALL Volts are going to look like Transformers editions… as far as anyone will be able to tell.
Jul 31st, 2009 (12:47 pm)People believe because I have a smart car i am saving.. so putting bigger wheels while shaving down the mileage. they are still saving.. so fashion mixes with times..
Jul 31st, 2009 (3:26 pm)A nice compromise.
Be well,
Tagamet
LJGTVWOTR!!