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GM May Beat Expectations and Exit Bankruptcy by Mid-July, Though Facing Mild Opposition

June 20th, 2009 | Posted in: Financial

When GM entered into bankruptcy protection on June 1st there was uncertainty about how long the process would take. On paper its simple; move all the best performing assets into a new GM in a so-called 363 sale. Bad performing assets would then be gradually liquidated in court. Immediately prior to entering court, the majority of GM’s creditors agreed to swap their outstanding debt for equity stakes in the new company paving the way for a swift process.

The government’s Auto Task Force indicated they believed the process would take from 60 to 90 days.

New reports from persons familiar with the proceedings are suggesting that it could even be quicker than that.

According to the Wall Street Journal executives and advisers are hoping the company can exit court by mid-July, beating initial expectations as so far the court process has been smooth and uneventful.

On Thursday GM will seek access to the $33 billion in government funding it has been offered to launch the new company. Then, the automakers attorneys will return to court on June 30th to ask the judge to approve the final 363 sale. If objections are minimal and the judge can manage them it is possible it will all be over by mid-July.

Although the majority of bondholders have already agreed to the concessions they were offered, a minority are gathering to try and fight the sale in court. This includes a group of 10 state attorney generals, retired UAW workers, and a faction of small bondholders called “Unofficial Committee of Family & Dissident GM Bondholders” who all filed their objections in court on Friday, which was the deadline to do so.

These small groups citing lack of fairness, face an uphill battle and are unlikely to derail the plans for a New GM whose writing it appears is already on the wall.

Source (Wall Street Journal), (Detroit News)

Posted by: Lyle

58 Responses to “GM May Beat Expectations and Exit Bankruptcy by Mid-July, Though Facing Mild Opposition”

-3 Alex S Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:05 am

I think they should stay in bankrupcy a lot more than that cause they certainly need a lot more restructuring.
GM needs to change their cars designers, they need to do pretty cars, not justbig cars. Even Chevy Volt is not good enough, looks like a car that costed 20k, not 40k. Look at tesla, their Model S is 50k and it looks way better than Chevy Volt. They need to shock if they want to start selling again, being average is not gonna be good enough anymore.

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+1 CorvetteGuy Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:06 am

The “lack of fairness” argument doesn’t work in court. I tried that one when my ex-wife took everything but my sense of humor back in ‘82.

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+2 zipdrive Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:06 am

GM will come back big time. The Chevy Volt will be an entire paradigm shift in driving.

Any investor in GM would be wise to hang on. General Motors will dominate the automotive world again soon.

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DonC Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:23 am

Hopefully this is the case but the reality is that even to hit the 60-90 day window (not counting appeals) everything has to go right. To miss the window you just need one thing to go wrong.

#2 CorvetteGuy — Very funny comment. Made me laugh. Good to see your humor remained intact. A few other things doubtlessly came through as well.

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BDP Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:31 am

Just out of curiosity, why is there such optimism about a car company that will be government owned? Name one area of government which has exceeded expectations.

It’s just my opinion, but the struggles for GM will be greater as long as big brother is pulling the strings.

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George Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:43 am

@3 zipdrive

Actually, any investor in GM would be wise to liquidate if they aren’t playing the shorts. The current GM stock will not be carried over to the new company according to the last one I saw. Although I did see one notice somewhere that the current stock holders would get 1% of the new company. Would still make more sense to sell now and buy some of the stock that will be sold by the larger shareholders when the new company makes it’s debut on the stock market.

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+1 BillR Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:45 am

#2 CorvetteGuy,

I heard a DJ on the radio once say “and so-and-so’s profession is listed as a housekeeper. Gee, my ex-wife was a housekeeper: she kept the house, she kept the car, she kept the boat……”

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BillR Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:56 am

#3 zipdrive,

“GM will come back big time. The Chevy Volt will be an entire paradigm shift in driving.”

I agree with your assessment of the Volt.

Whether GM comes back big time will depend upon what cars and trucks they introduce in the next 2 years.

The 2010 Equinox is rated 22/32 with the 2.4L DI engine. This is better than the competition. The new SRX may also be a first class vehicle.

If GM can retrofit the Hybrid Tahoe and similar vehicles with a lighter, more aerodynamic body, a good V6 engine, and upgrade to Li-Ion batteries, they might be able to get 25/25 for 4WD for these large vehicles. That would make the market move, as the best selling vehicles in the past few months are trucks (F-150 and Sierra, I believe).

So if GM can offer world class vehicles with class leading fuel economy, I believe they will be back in the game.

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-1 The Who Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:05 am

New Boss…Same as the old boss !

Won’t get fooled again.

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+1 old man Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:11 am

#5 BDP

There is great optimism for GM because we want the government [us tax payers] to be repaid and for the new GM to again be a profitable company. Paying taxes rather than receiving them.

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ROBERT M. SPERRY Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:17 am

GM doesn’t want the Volt to look exotic. They want it to look like the car everyone already owns, so that those who are resistant to change will be able to make the change to electric painlessly. After electric cars become accepted, look for the exotic designs.

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NZDavid Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:17 am

Lyle says:
On Thursday GM will seek access to the $33 billion in government funding it has been offered to launch the new company

What happens when the 33 Billion is gone?
Will the Volt be in production by then?
Can I have an Opel Ampera in Black?
Will I give up waiting and buy the iMiEV next year just so I can have something (before Statik)?

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George K Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:29 am

#7 BillR
#2 CorvetteGuy,

You guys are sounding like Rodney Dangerfield…

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/r/rodney_dangerfield.html

=D~~~~

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+1 statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:31 am

I would say they have about the same odds of coming out of bankruptcy in mid-July as they do of having a Volt in showrooms in mid-July.

There are a ton of reasons why it isn’t going to happen…it would have to be aggressive and a ‘flawless victory’ to get it done.

Sidenote: I don’t even think their own internal calendar gets them though this in 6 weeks. A mid-July juggernaut win, would like be perceived as massive bullying by the government, and a PR nightmare in the long run (especially when things likely start to go bad post GSB and they need more cash).

The end result is already determined. Watching this bankruptcy unfold is likely watching a reply of a ballgame that you already know who wins. I don’t see any reason to plough through….everyone is probably better off if they just take a little time and do it right/think it through a little bit and care less about how quick they do it.

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k-dawgski Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:38 am

ROBERT M. SPERRY Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:17 am .GM doesn’t want the Volt to look exotic. They want it to look like the car everyone already owns, so that those who are resistant to change will be able to make the change to electric painlessly. After electric cars become accepted, look for the exotic designs.
—————————–

Have you seen the Converj? Its exotic looking to me.

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statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:38 am

#14 Statik (me):

That should read (in the last paragraph):

“The end result is already determined. Watching this bankruptcy unfold is likely watching a replyy of a ballgame that you already know who wins.”

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k-dawgski Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:42 am

Also, the cars here in Russia are very plain or very exotic. There’s not much in the middle. Its either a rusty box or the latest Mercedes.

to Statik from the last thread: I fly to Moscow on Wednesday. Will be there for 5 days. I’ll look for that place while at Red Sq.

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+1 jbfalaska Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:50 am

Are there are moves afoot again to establish a viable Volt Waiting list? With the tax credit, this is a no brainer buy for me.

CHEVY VOLT: American-made, American FUELED. Please help America get off Middle-East hatred, terrorist funded sources of oil.

Retired US Air Force veteran.

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Thomas Gilling Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:01 am

Agree with Alex S, GM is boring. The Astra car is still boring even though it’s a massive improvement from it’s horrible predecessor. Cadillac is just a through together tin can with a big yank block inside. I sometimes believe that GM hires Ssangyong to do there design’s. Anyway I don’t think Tesla do there own design’s anyway, I think it’s Lotus who do it? Click on my name for link. And as with k-dawgski comment the Converj is supposed to be summat big because it’s going to be EXPENSIVE! Not saying the Volt is as cheap as an old Vauxhall Nova, but it’s cheap considering the saving’s you make on it.

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statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:04 am

#11 ROBERT S PERRY saad:

GM doesn’t want the Volt to look exotic. They want it to look like the car everyone already owns, so that those who are resistant to change will be able to make the change to electric painlessly. After electric cars become accepted, look for the exotic designs.
=========================
That is so not right. That was never a reason why they ‘unbuilt’ excitement from the concept.

The official reason was always the ‘wind tunnel’ with a little side reasoning of it just cost them way to much to do all the other ‘exotic’ things, like the use of fancy GE plastics to ‘reduce the weight,’, the integrated glass shoulderline windows, the ginormous panaramic roof (Lexan GLX resins), the 21″ wheels, etc, etc.

Nobody builts a new car with the intention to look like a homogenized version of what is already out there….unless they plan to sell it as the cheapest car (the Volt is asking for a $20,000 prcie premium). And they certainly didn’t plan on building/showing the ‘hotness’ with no intention of being even remotely true to it….that was a PR fiasco for them.

Now if you can find a quote or hint from GM saying they intentionally redesigned it to be just like “the car everyone already owns” I will graciously retract my statements.

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+1 statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:09 am

#12 NZDavid said:

Lyle says:
On Thursday GM will seek access to the $33 billion in government funding it has been offered to launch the new company

What happens when the 33 Billion is gone?
Will the Volt be in production by then?
Can I have an Opel Ampera in Black?
Will I give up waiting and buy the iMiEV next year just so I can have something (before Statik)?

==========================
What happens when the 33 Billion is gone?
–they ask for more

Will the Volt be in production by then?
–50/50

Can I have an Opel Ampera in Black?
–not before that 33 billion runs out

Will I give up waiting and buy the iMiEV next year just so I can have something (before Statik)?
–if you do that, I will come all the way to New Zealand just to write my name on the side of your car with my keys

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CorvetteGuy Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:41 am

#13 George K

It’s true. I get no respect.

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GM Volt Fan Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:50 am

If YOU ran the “New GM” …. how would you structure the brands and the individual models?

http://www.motortrend.com/features/consumer/112_0906_the_new_gm_future_plans/index.html

Hmmm …. Good article by Motor Trend. Every good auto magazine ought to do stories like this and give GM managers a little feedback. After all, us taxpayers NEED GM to succeed so they can pay us back and maybe even get a good return on our investment.

From the ones I’ve seen pictures of and read about, my favorite GM vehicles are of course, the Volt … then the Corvette, Traverse, LaCrosse, Equinox, and the Acadia. I hope the upcoming Z28 looks as good as the Ford Mustang when it comes out. Ford did a good job with the latest Mustang.

I would LOVE to see Cadillac have a huge turnaround and start being very serious competitors to BMW, Mercedes and Lexus. I think Cadillac needs to leave the vertically stacked headlight design to the SUVs and trucks. That’s fine for those kinds of vehicles. Cadillac needs to make their cars look more like er …. BMWs, Mercedes, and Lexus. Let’s face it, those cars look pretty good.

I’m sure the powertrains of Cadillacs are very competitive vs. those guys. They just need to optimize the exterior designs. Cadillac needs to be one of the FIRST dealerships that people with plenty of money go to when they are looking for a new performance/luxury vehicle. Make BMW, Mercedes, and Lexus the “secondary choices” for a change. If more Cadillac vehicles could get a bunch of excellent reviews from the automotive press it would probably raise the prestige of GM in general. Not everyone can afford a Cadillac, but it’s nice to know that the same car company that makes the highly regarded Cadillac also makes the GM car you CAN afford.

Out of all the segments that GM needs to focus on the most, I think it is the midsize sedan segment, the compact segment, the hybrid/ER-EV segment and the small SUV/crossover segment. Those are the “bread and butter” segments they’ve got to do well in. Focus a LOT on the Malibu, the Cruze, the Volt, Equinox, Acadia. GM needs to make sure they always have great cars vs. the Accord/Camry, the Civic/Corolla, the RAV4/CRX, the Prius, etc.

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CDAVIS Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:58 am

______________________________________________________
Subaru EV Surprise!

“…The automotive world held it’s breath as Mitsubishi announced the production schedule for the i-MiEV. Would they be the first major automaker to bring an EV to market and sell to the general public? Close, but not quite. And close doesn’t get you a world’s first. Of all companies, Subaru unexpectedly jumped on the opportunity and now claims the title of the first major automaker to make an EV for sale to the public…available in Japan by August…”

Source:
http://www.allcarselectric.com/blog/1021631_review-2009-subaru-stella-plug-in-ev-worlds-first-production-ev-for-sale-by-major-automaker
_____________________________________________________

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NZDavid Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:04 pm

Statik says : Will I give up waiting and buy the iMiEV next year just so I can have something (before Statik)?
–if you do that, I will come all the way to New Zealand just to write my name on the side of your car with my keys

And to think, I was going to let you drive it!

Do you seriously think its 50/50 they will burn 33 Billion by November next year?

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CDAVIS Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:19 pm

______________________________________________________
Lyle’s Article:
“…On Thursday GM will seek access to the $33 billion in government funding it has been offered to launch the new company…”

—–
Anyone here venture to guess how long it will take for GM to burn through the $33B and put its hand out for more taxpayer $Billions?

My Guess: 9 months after existing bankruptcy, Obama will again replace some top execs and give GM another $50B. A few days before the additional money request, GM will announce that the Volt is a couple of months ahead of schedule and priced ~$34K after tax incentive but at very limited production volume (basically fleet trials).
______________________________________________________

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DonC Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:35 pm

#23 GM Volt Fan – Very interesting article, particularly for me because I didn’t understand all the platforms. Not so hot news about the Converj. I think Motor Trend is right — they need to get that guy off the respirator. If nothing else they could break even and it would be a heck of a halo car, especially for younger and upscale buyers.

#26 CDAVIS – My guess: the pot of money is fixed. Take it now. Take it later. It isn’t going to increase.

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kent beuchert Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:40 pm

If GM or the Feds think that investors will forget what happened to the old GM shareholders and bondholders perhaps by giving the company a new name, they are in for a big surprise. What they’ve done is nothing more than what they could have done years ago except for the power the UAW had to block any plant closures, etc. unless all the workers were paid off to retire (and then draw fiull
health coverage paid by GM. GM’s exec had about as much power as the janitors who emptied the wastebaskets at night. The fallacious logic in the optimistic claims, is that paring off the currently
low selling models will “solve” something. What they are doing is simply taking advantage of chance, you might say. It’s similar to a gambler who simultaneously is playing 8 hands and is then allowed to fold 4 hands without penalty and play the other four. So he takes the four good hands, proclaiming that “My losing days are over. Just look at these hands.” His problems are over. But only until the next deal, or, in GM’s case, the next redesign. In other words, GM is simply taking advantage of the chance occurance that
four of their brands aren’t doing horrible business at the moment.
And also their temporary ability to shut down these brands because they are bankrupt. That disappears when they emerge from bankruptcy and does any access to capital in the bond market.
GM is resting a lot of its claims to be “reborn” upon the advent of the Volt. But the two BYD versions are already not only being debugged on the streets of China, but ready to massacre the Volt in the marketplace. The Volt is simply not even remotely close to being cost competitive with the BYD offerings, both of which have much cheaper batteries and a 50% greater electric driving range. The F3DM retails at around $21K and has a drivetrain identical to the more upscale F6DM. Debug the F3 and you’ve also debugged the F6. They will have almost two year’s of consumer testing of their
powertrain before the Volt even shows up. And they are reportedly producing the cars in numbers such that one month’s output equals the entire Volt output for the first 18 months. I simply see no possibility that the Volt will be able to compete. The numbers say that the car will simply not be competitive. This should show everyone that with 100 times more engineers than we have, the silly fallacy that we can “out-tech” the Chinese is a really bad joke. Obama and his illusory “hightech” future moslty seems to involve changing the oil in windmills and washing the solar mirrors in the solar thermal plants. And currently the Chinese are replicating the AP1000 nuclear reactor design with almost 100% Chinese sourced parts and bringing those plants in on time at a rate of one every two months(!), for less than $2 billion , producing power at less than 1.75 cents per kilowathour, while the California dimwits are cheering about their new solar plants that can produce unreliable and uncontrollable power at between 20 and 30 cents per kWhr. They might last 20 years, while the Chinese nuclear plants will be around three times that long. What a brainless country we live in. The EPA, after two years, still can’t figure out how to rate the Volt’s mileage numbers, and no one seems to have the ability to do a simple cost analysis of power technologies. Important decisions are being made strictly on a political basis, and in about 5 minutes, by people not capable of understanding much of anything, not even the “Austrian” language.

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statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:48 pm

#24 CDavis said:

Subaru EV Surprise!

“…The automotive world held it’s breath as Mitsubishi announced the production schedule for the i-MiEV. Would they be the first major automaker to bring an EV to market and sell to the general public? Close, but not quite. And close doesn’t get you a world’s first. Of all companies, Subaru unexpectedly jumped on the opportunity and now claims the title of the first major automaker to make an EV for sale to the public…available in Japan by August…”

Source:
http://www.allcarselectric.com/blog/1021631_review-2009-subaru-stella-plug-in-ev-worlds-first-production-ev-for-sale-by-major-automaker
======================

Clearly this is some fancy stunt work…the total run is limited 170. I’d say thats not really production at all. They are dumping the testers on the public and then calling it ‘produiton’ …all semantics.

Mitsu has over 700 i-MiEv out in test fleets…doing it the right way, and not worrying about stuff like this. (which is probably the right way to do it) If they really wanted to, they could just sell a couple dozen of them to the public and claim ‘production first’ too I suppose.

I don’t know how they discount Tesla either…I guess they don’t count Tesla as a ‘major’ automaker, but the fact they (Tesla) have almost 4 times as many EVs already on the road as Subaru will ever produce of the Stella is telling. Tesla certainly could claim to be a ‘major’ automaker for EVs at this point, and probably for the near future. Althoug…even they are ‘producing’ a EV…but it is a stretch to claim ‘production to the public’ (hand built, 600ish units over 2 years @110K a pop is not exactly the truest depiction of reality)

This was clearly just some kind of weird PR stunt by Subaru, and I say it wasn’t a particularly good one. Should have a big *asterisk, and I think history (or people now) will not remember this Subaru as any kind of ‘pioneer,’ or being first.

I’m pretty sure when it is all said and done it is going to be remembered like this:

Tesla is going to get the credit for leading the wave, and for making ‘available’ an electric vehicles to anyone with enough cash.

Mitsu is going to get credit for being the first production/mass-produced, unique EV, available to the public.

GM will get credit for being the first domestic automaker to mass produce a EV, and for being the first to offer mass production vehicle for the public in the North American auto market.

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jeffhre Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:58 pm

#19 Thomas Gilling

… Anyway I don’t think Tesla do there own design’s anyway, I think it’s Lotus who do it? Click on my name for link. And as with k-dawgski comment the Converj is supposed to be summat big because it’s going to be EXPENSIVE! Not saying the Volt is as cheap as an old Vauxhall Nova, but it’s cheap considering the saving’s you make on it.
________________________
The chief designer of the Tesla Roadster was Barney hat of Lotus along with Tesla and Lotus employees, before Tesla had a complete staff.

The chief designer for the Tesla Model S is Franz von Holzhausen, who was hired by Tesla from Mazda, after both Tesla CEO Elon Musk and Henrik Fisker of Fisker Motors and former designer for BMW and Aston Martin each took their turn at designing earlier versions of the sedan.

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Dan Petit Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 1:32 pm

It really seems to me that anyone not wanting to trade-over their old GM interests into the New GM are very very very terribly uninformed.

Voltec will have New GM rocketing right on up into high profitability.

While there are always some who are initially unable to intellectually convert over with any imposed need to “change”, a thoroughly-understood need for “change” can also mean “profitability”,

There is the simple Chinese proverb:
“There is profitability in change”.

Another one I like a lot describes the contrast between those who recognize that “change is the only constant in the universe”, and, those who sadly happen to become gradually more unorganized (to trends) as a result of that fact, and it goes like this:

“When there is “order” under the heavens,
Large problems are handled and small problems take care of themselves.
“When there is “disorder” under the heavens,
Small problems are treated as if they are large problems, and,
Large problems are not handled at all.”

Constant adjustments to your many types of plans in synchronization to each other causes your “orderliness” to be maintained so as to be able to handle the large challenge of working hard enough and efficiently enough to get your Volt.

(And, to make back money in the New GM).

Dan.

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k-dawgski Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 1:34 pm

@ Subaru first
that’s like the posters here who type “first”. Does anyone really care? Dont get me wrong. I’m glad Subaru has joined the EV fight. I just dont care who’s first when we are talking about 6 months/year. If they had done this back in the 90’s when GM had its EV1, that would be more impressive. “First” isnt nearly as important to me as”best” is. Do it right, first.

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+1 Guy Incognito Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 2:03 pm

Once they sell of the final pieces of GM to the various repressive regimes with slave labor rates such as Brazil, Communist China, and Mexico it will be smooth sailing all the way.
Hey, maybe with any luck we’ll be in a full-fledged shooting war by November, and this war will provide the economic turn around that GM needs so badly

On a lighter note:
Still not seeing any ads for the Volt, but I am seeing ads for the Camaro everywhere.
GO CAMARO!!!

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GXT Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 2:08 pm

32. Dan Petit wrote:
“Voltec will have New GM rocketing right on up into high profitability.”
————————————————————————————–

Not a chance. Never. Not even in the shangri-la that is this board!

To do what you claim GM would need to sell Voltec cars mass-market and for huge SUV-like profits.

GM is going to sell a small number of Voltec cars through 2012, and certainly at a loss. No “rocketing high profitability” there.

Let’s assume the Volt currently costs GM $45-50K to make. Let’s say they shave $10-15K off the cost by 2013 (unlikely). To make “rocketing high profitability” on a car that costs ~$35K they would have to them at perhaps $40-$45K… which is the same price that is TOO HIGH right now. So even by perhaps 2015 there really isn’t much money in Voltec.

But from Lutz’s interviews it was never really meant to make money, was it?

By 2015 GM and Voltec are going to be very small players in a very crowded field. Voltec will be the Aveo of electric cars outgunned by any number of excellent competitors.

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ThombDbhomb Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 2:14 pm

#5 BDP

While there may be things to complain about, the US government has provided us a pretty good standard of living. Being able to complain (free speech) is one area that works well.

Name one area of government which has exceeded expectations? …Keeping us off the metric system.

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Shawn Marshall Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 3:46 pm

Kent # 28
Who on the US ever heard of an AP1000? I’m afraid you are too much aware of what’s about to happen; we have met the enemy and he is us.

GM won’t get any more bone-us bucks – the political costs are way too high – this first bonanza isn’t going well at all with the public.

What do people think is going to make GM competitive going forward?? Aren’t they going to lose money starting day one as the new GM? Is something going to fix the Volt pricing problem? Forget BYD for a minute, do we think Toyodor is gonna let Volt eat its lunch?

I’m afraid the gig is up – the government/proletariat combine can not compete in a free market. Isn’t it odd how only our foreign competitors are free to compete freely here on our free soil while domestic producers are shackled about the ankles with UAW thanks to Uncle Sam.

(X)EVs + Nukes = the dawn of a new age in US, if only we would go there

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Dan Petit Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 3:57 pm

While GM at minimum sales would be at “break even” at 10 million units after reorganization adjustments (as I believe was previously posted here), as the entire market resumes to buy more vehicles out of sheer need, GM stock will indeed rise.

While the Volt production numbers at first will not make a large contribution to bottom line at first, the “rocket on up” is to be taken in terms of normally-expected Corporate growth time frames of steady quick growth over 3 to five years, and not in as much toward a context as might be the expectations of day-trader time frames.

Dan.

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Bob Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 3:59 pm

The sooner they are out of bankruptcy the better. Time for the volt!

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zipdrive Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 4:27 pm

Dan Petit @ 32 says:

It really seems to me that anyone not wanting to trade-over their old GM interests into the New GM are very very very terribly uninformed.

Voltec will have New GM rocketing right on up into high profitability.

While there are always some who are initially unable to intellectually convert over with any imposed need to “change”, a thoroughly-understood need for “change” can also mean “profitability”,

There is the simple Chinese proverb:
“There is profitability in change”.

Another one I like a lot describes the contrast between those who recognize that “change is the only constant in the universe”, and, those who sadly happen to become gradually more unorganized (to trends) as a result of that fact, and it goes like this:

“When there is “order” under the heavens,
Large problems are handled and small problems take care of themselves.
“When there is “disorder” under the heavens,
Small problems are treated as if they are large problems, and,
Large problems are not handled at all.”

Constant adjustments to your many types of plans in synchronization to each other causes your “orderliness” to be maintained so as to be able to handle the large challenge of working hard enough and efficiently enough to get your Volt.

(And, to make back money in the New GM).
————————————————————————

I totally agree Dan. I think most people who have sort of written GM off are not keeping current with what is really going on. GM has had an epiphany. It is not evident to most people because there is nothing to show for it yet, or they just don’t understand the implications of the Volt’s technology.

But just wait.

I predict that when the Volt comes out, it will be hailed by the press. It will be Motor Trend’s Car of the Year, etc. and Hollywood types will want to be seen in one. It will cause a stir like no other vehicle in history since the Model T.

Then GM will ramp up production and spin the technology off to other cars and divisions. The price will drop so everyone can afford one, and millions will be sold, and GM will never look back or have to apologize again.

GM has been punished and shamed enough for its mistakes. It has learned many important lessons and is now ready to assume its role once again as leader in the world of motoring.

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statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 5:20 pm

#26 CDavis said:

Anyone here venture to guess how long it will take for GM to burn through the $33B and put its hand out for more taxpayer $Billions?

My Guess: 9 months after existing bankruptcy, Obama will again replace some top execs and give GM another $50B. A few days before the additional money request, GM will announce that the Volt is a couple of months ahead of schedule and priced ~$34K after tax incentive but at very limited production volume (basically fleet trials).
——————–
#27 DonC said:

My guess: the pot of money is fixed. Take it now. Take it later. It isn’t going to increase.
===========================

Time to burn through 33 billion? 20 months…but the government has lots of ‘other’ ways to siphon cash off to them and still pretend they have only given out 33 billion. (Like the 10.1 billion in loans I’m sure GM is going to get about 10 minutes after they exit the GSB)

…and in my opinion they may ’say’ it is fixed at 33 billion, but they have put ‘lines in the sand’ so many times during this process, just to brush them over and redraw it, and/or rationalize it away directly or indirectly with subsidies that I think their words are worthless at this point.

Like them paying out the VEBA for 10 billion (+2.5 later) after initailly telling them to eat it and take stock, or the supplier bailout, or the ‘buying out’ of Delphi and incorporating that back into GM, or the phony demands for GMAC to exchange debt/get to 30 billion in cap to get bank status, just to give them 5 billion to fake it, or the billion they gave to GM to give to GMAC, or the 10 billion in ‘loans’ they are going to give them once they get out of the GSB under the restructuring flag, or the THREE ‘extra’ funding troughs after the intial bailout in december, or the way they changed the bondholder payouts three times after they said they wouldn’t, or moving the ‘deadline’ twice, or the…

I think they are serious with Chrysler’s ‘no more money for you’ mantra, because I don’t think they thought Chrysler were actually going to be able to hit the benchmarks they set to allow them to get into the GSB. Chrysler got it done (bondholder capitulation, merger with Fiat, UAW capitulation, etc), and cornered the gov’t into have to do it for them…or not do it for both of them (GM). I think they would be all to happy to fold Chrysler up…and by early next year. Nobody needs Chrysler, and they are just sucking up market share.

If GM is in trouble at any time in the next 3-4 years, while the government are still projecting huge budget deficits as part of their ‘keep throwing money at our problems’ plan, I don’t see them letting them fold by any stretch of the imagination. They are in a situation now where they are in waaaaay to deep to let GM fail in the short term…and at least not until we go through another election.

…besides, they still have to do this whole ‘GSB’ thing with Ford soon…they can’t have Chrysler failed, and GM on the ropes, heading off the end of a cliff, burning through piles of cash after them both being in the GSB process

/guilty until proven innocent at this point I think

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CS Guy Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 6:39 pm

While I applaud as each company throws its hat into the EV ring I have to agree with previous posters that 170 vehicles is not a production run. That is not even a good test fleet. I’ll take that “record” with a grain of salt. It seems even more like the greenwashing I accused GM of planning with the Volt (in a post a few days ago).

http://gm-volt.com/2009/06/09/lutz-denies-ambivalence-about-the-volt-andintroducing-the-worlds-first-images-of-the-volt-in-black/
(post # 49)

It seems like Subaru and GM are looking for their “mass produced” electric vehicles to give a green washed halo effect to their entire vehicle line. Without actually doing anything to make the other cars/trucks a true part of the solution to getting us off foreign oil, that is.

We Americans are fed up with car companies trying to lie to us and shove crap we don’t want down our throats. The American car buying public wants electric cars. That is the consensus of most polls on the web (except those from or paid for by oil companies) – most people would buy an electric car if the car makers had one to sell. Ignore this market at your peril, GM and Subaru.

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Dave G Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 7:45 pm

#3 zipdrive Says: The Chevy Volt will be an entire paradigm shift in driving.
————————————————————————————–
Yes, well said. Hopefully, other car manufacturers will follow the EREV-40 recipe as well. Mass adoption of this type of vehicle would replace the vast majority of our gasoline consumption. The remainder could be replaced by cellulosic ethanol.

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jeffhre Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 7:59 pm

# CS Guy 41.
“It seems like Subaru and GM are looking for their “mass produced” electric vehicles to give a green washed halo effect to their entire vehicle line. Without actually doing anything to make the other cars/trucks a true part of the solution to getting us off foreign oil, that is.

We Americans are fed up with car companies trying to lie to us and shove crap we don’t want down our throats. The American car buying public wants electric cars. That is the consensus of most polls on the web (except those from or paid for by oil companies) – most people would buy an electric car if the car makers had one to sell. Ignore this market at your peril, GM and Subaru.”
________________
Wow, this from folks that want electric cars to proliferate. With GM and Subaru two of the first out the gate with planned electrics, I’d be afraid to see the scathing comments from the electric car haters, if this is the criticism from GM-Volt’s own community of enthusiasts!

(Quote)
Edwin Mang Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:01 pm

And We all thank God for Hope , God’s word .

God Bless

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CDAVIS Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:27 pm

_____________________________________________________

#40 Statik Said:
“…I don’t see them [Obama Administration] letting them [GM] fold by any stretch of the imagination. They are in a situation now where they are in waaaaay to deep to let GM fail in the short term…and at least not until we go through another election…”
——

If GM Sinks, Obama Sinks…

I agree w/ Statik that Obama allowing him self to get into a business proposition where failure (cut bait) is not an option (as Obama has gotten him self into with GM) will result in Obama doing whatever is required to keep GM afloat in name.

As Statik points out, there are all sorts of slight-of-hand ways to keep GM’s deficits funded w/ taxpayer dollars but I believe many of those techniques will become more visible and scrutinized by the public as time goes by; GM’s non-nationalized car making competitors will see to that.

Obama will be forced to decide to either keep feeding the GM beast with additional taxpayer $Billions or continue cutting away (sell off) parts of the GM beast. If Obama finds himself in a situation that the American Taxpayers is at their limit with regards to GM bailouts, GM will be directed by Obama to shut down or sell off additional units of operations to the point where the cash burn goes away.

GM may end up with very little actual factory production three years from now. GM may end up being a holding company licensing intellectual property to other (mostly Asian) car makers.

Then again, perhaps a miracle may happen and the GM corporate culture will somehow be transformed into a lean mean profit making machine…no such evidence to date.
______________________________________________________

(Quote)
jbfalaska Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:32 pm

Ready to take my Volt off the assembly line. Prouder American the day I can own such a car, not only made here in America, more importantly, FUELED here in America.

Dear Saudi friends – KEEP YOUR TERRORIST FUNDING OIL! With the Texas oilman no longer helping keep the stranglehold of foreign addiction on our nation, I hope we can soon prosper again. To do so, we need electrification of the automobile industry. God may it come to us soon.

Proud Military Retired Air Force Veteran.

(Quote)
Steve Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:38 pm

Somebody fail, all ths balilout is making me ill. Fake bankrutpcies, lobbiest/bribbery, Any how, seems GM is requestion the rest of the added 33 billion. Where is this going? Seems like not gonna have any money to run the wothless car company next year, either. We sre gonna loose 100,s of billions and not even build a car. Pitiful comes to mind
. ((((((((((((((((((())))))))))))))))))))))
They don’t want t be called back, they are getting paid all summer to not build cars. Glad the UAW did away with some vacation time, casue having 3 months off with most pay sounds good to me. When is this madness gonna stop. We are so gonning to loose and loose again. Fold this POS and let it grow back normally. Where have all the billions gone while factories are idle?

(Quote)
GeorgeB Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:59 pm

Question for anyone….who of the stakeholders in the New GM will have any money? The bondholders? Not aymore! The UAW? They’ll be lucky to keep VEBA afloat! The only way I see GM surviving is an endless dole out from the taxpayers…… I just don’t get it……

(Quote)
john1701a Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:04 pm

The Chevy Volt will be an entire paradigm shift in driving.
____________________________________

For a shift on that magnitude, serious production volume must occur.

The potential is there. But an effort to deliver on that magnitude is missing.

Are you aware of the quantity required? If so, explain how that many sales will be achieved? Waiting for price to drop pretty much negates the shift. Other technologies will fill in the gap while we wait.

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Mr. X Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:36 pm

“Name one area of government which has exceeded expectations.”

Running up dept?

(Quote)
George K Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:27 pm

# 40 statik
“…and in my opinion they may ’say’ it is fixed at 33 billion, but they have put ‘lines in the sand’ so many times during this process, just to brush them over and redraw it, and/or rationalize it away directly or indirectly with subsidies that I think their words are worthless at this point.

Like them paying out the VEBA for 10 billion (+2.5 later) after initailly telling them to eat it and take stock, or the supplier bailout, or the ‘buying out’ of Delphi and incorporating that back into GM, or the phony demands for GMAC to exchange debt/get to 30 billion in cap to get bank status, just to give them 5 billion to fake it, or the billion they gave to GM to give to GMAC, or the 10 billion in ‘loans’ they are going to give them once they get out of the GSB under the restructuring flag, or the THREE ‘extra’ funding troughs after the intial bailout in december, or the way they changed the bondholder payouts three times after they said they wouldn’t, or moving the ‘deadline’ twice, or the…

I think they are serious with Chrysler’s ‘no more money for you’ mantra, because I don’t think they thought Chrysler were actually going to be able to hit the benchmarks they set to allow them to get into the GSB. Chrysler got it done (bondholder capitulation, merger with Fiat, UAW capitulation, etc), and cornered the gov’t into have to do it for them…or not do it for both of them (GM). I think they would be all to happy to fold Chrysler up…and by early next year. Nobody needs Chrysler, and they are just sucking up market share.”
- – - – - – - -

Walter Cronkite couldn’t have summarized it better.

=D~~~~

(Quote)
statik Says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:09 pm

#45 CDAVIS said:

#40 Statik Said:
“…I don’t see them [Obama Administration] letting them [GM] fold by any stretch of the imagination. They are in a situation now where they are in waaaaay to deep to let GM fail in the short term…and at least not until we go through another election…”
===========================

Hey, don’t you be adding [Obama Administration] into my quotes, lol.

I try very hard to make my posts ‘non-specific’ lol. Some actions take by the gov’t (like this one), I find whoever is in office to be irrelevent. This one is Republican started and Democrat finished…there was no candidate for either party that wasn’t going to go down this road.

As for them being more scrutinized as they send more money…I don’t know. Almost no one is calling them on the carpet at all for it now. People are still letting them get away with pegging the auto bailout at like 19.4 billion for GM and Chrysler at 14 billion (7 billion pre…7 billion post)….when the actual total is well in excess of 100 billion spent or committed DIRECTLY thus far.

Right now it is ‘don’t ask, don’t tell,’ or rather, ‘we didn’t ask, so please don’t tell us’…and the only way the ‘American’ people reach their limits of the bailout for GM and the ‘throwing money at problems policies’ is if the economy levels out and the desperation is taken away.

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Larry McFall Says:
June 21st, 2009 at 7:24 am

Of course the group that has filed their objection to getting out of bankruptcy doesn’t want this. The people have not gained a whole lot of confidence in GM that the executives can make sound decisions. As long as GM is in bankruptcy, the government (i.e., idealy the tax payers) have some control.

The Volt is a good start to show new strategy toward the running the auto business but, the Volt is not on the street or, even at the showrooms. Otherwise, we are not seeing or able to touch or get a good feel of the products that we HEAR so much about. Even this forum can be slanted to sound good.

We want to see the products. We all know that it takes time however, GM executives and the labor union got this industry in this mess and the people are in NO hurry to give the farm back for some additional abuse. I am sure GM still has some leeches waiting in the wings for their opportunity to dive into the gravy bowl and stick as much money/stock in their little hiding places.

GM is already leaking out that the Volt is going to be priced out of the range of most GM employees. $40,000 + is a pretty good indication that they don’t want to sell many.

(Quote)
statik Says:
June 21st, 2009 at 7:49 am

#51 George K:

/mumbles, “and thats the way it is
(couldn’t resist)

Walter was the man though…one of the few guys/reporters that could actually influence the news if he wanted to (don’t know if that is good or bad)

(Quote)
CDAVIS Says:
June 21st, 2009 at 8:28 am

______________________________________________________

#52 statik Said:
“Hey, don’t you be adding [Obama Administration] into my quotes, lol.

I try very hard to make my posts ‘non-specific’ lol. Some actions take by the gov’t (like this one), I find whoever is in office to be irrelevent. This one is Republican started and Democrat finished…there was no candidate for either party that wasn’t going to go down this road.”

—————–
Statik,
Inserting in-text [brackets] is a common editorial method of making context reference of a quoted snippet taken from a larger body of text. Thanks for your clarifying my misunderstanding by what you meant by the term use of “them”….it was not intended on my part to manipulate your intended reference of “them”…lol.

By the way, regarding your comment “…This one is Republican started and Democrat finished…there was no candidate for either party that wasn’t going to go down this road…”

I completely agree with that except for the part of the Obama Administration giving the UAW preferential secured rights treatment over the bondholders.
______________________________________________________

(Quote)
Shawn Marshall Says:
June 21st, 2009 at 11:00 am

sleight of hand

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Preseli Says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:06 pm

“This one is Republican started and Democrat finished…there was no candidate for either party that wasn’t going to go down this road.”

Two words: Ron Paul

http://www.ronpaul.com/

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N Riley Says:
June 22nd, 2009 at 10:11 am

Fairness is in the eyes of the one who write the rules. The government is in control and you better believe the judge has been given his instructions, if he wants to move up the judicial ladder. Play ball or stay where you are forever. Just continues the style of this government.

(Quote)

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