Comments on: What Will the Volt’s Generator Mode Feel Like? http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/ Real-time news, information, and discussion about the Chevrolet Volt. Sat, 21 Nov 2009 05:07:32 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Karn K http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-122629 Karn K Tue, 30 Jun 2009 02:43:57 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-122629 I do not understand why the engine would rev up at very high rpm since the power that propel the car come from Motor. Assuming that you are not going up very long hill where it may deplete the battery completely, the power from battery PLUS from the engine should be sufficient to allow Volt to go up the hill. So the engine should be able to run at the most economic point during this time. Then when the load is less it can continue running at that most economic point to further charge the battery. Unless someone go up a very very long hill and completely discharge the battery to the lowest point then at that point the power that drive the car should come purely from engine which it has to run at high rev to cope of load. Not sure how high it have to be which depends on size of the engine, Motor Rated Power, Speed. If drive up at slower speed, it may not have rev up to high rev that has annoying noise. Sometime people forget what they might want. I would take 80-20 rule, if Volt can meet 80% of the population who might buy them without rev up very high rpm. Or if Volt can run without rev up very high rpm for 80% of the time people use them then why would someone worry? I even believe that it should be 99-1 rule rather than 80-20 here. Do climb the long hill at least one day in the last 3 months (100 days)? I can be wrong but I would guess 99% of the people don't. Why would any company design the car just to satisfy the last 1% and waste lots of money when rent a car which is best at climbing the mountain is a lot easier? For me, I am ok if the car have to rev up very high once in a while or if I have to go up the hill somewhat slower when the car consume significantly less than others. If someone want to feel better to hear the engine noise and vibration, a small electronics circuit would be able to simulate that for you, I guess:-) I do not understand why the engine would rev up at very high rpm since the power that propel the car come from Motor. Assuming that you are not going up very long hill where it may deplete the battery completely, the power from battery PLUS from the engine should be sufficient to allow Volt to go up the hill. So the engine should be able to run at the most economic point during this time. Then when the load is less it can continue running at that most economic point to further charge the battery.

Unless someone go up a very very long hill and completely discharge the battery to the lowest point then at that point the power that drive the car should come purely from engine which it has to run at high rev to cope of load. Not sure how high it have to be which depends on size of the engine, Motor Rated Power, Speed. If drive up at slower speed, it may not have rev up to high rev that has annoying noise.

Sometime people forget what they might want. I would take 80-20 rule, if Volt can meet 80% of the population who might buy them without rev up very high rpm. Or if Volt can run without rev up very high rpm for 80% of the time people use them then why would someone worry? I even believe that it should be 99-1 rule rather than 80-20 here. Do climb the long hill at least one day in the last 3 months (100 days)? I can be wrong but I would guess 99% of the people don’t. Why would any company design the car just to satisfy the last 1% and waste lots of money when rent a car which is best at climbing the mountain is a lot easier? For me, I am ok if the car have to rev up very high once in a while or if I have to go up the hill somewhat slower when the car consume significantly less than others.

If someone want to feel better to hear the engine noise and vibration, a small electronics circuit would be able to simulate that for you, I guess:-)

]]> By: What Will the Volt’s Generator Mode Feel Like? | CARSREVIEW.CO.UK http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-112158 What Will the Volt’s Generator Mode Feel Like? | CARSREVIEW.CO.UK Fri, 08 May 2009 16:11:03 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-112158 [...] the original here GM Volt Related Topics : car uk, chevy, driver, [...] [...] the original here GM Volt Related Topics : car uk, chevy, driver, [...]

]]> By: Herm http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111851 Herm Thu, 07 May 2009 13:42:44 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111851 also Toyota limits the rpm to 4600.. GM could allow the Volt to go higher.. the noise wont matter too much if you are tooling down the hwy at 100mph. Variable timing will just allow the computer to choose what is needed. also Toyota limits the rpm to 4600.. GM could allow the Volt to go higher.. the noise wont matter too much if you are tooling down the hwy at 100mph. Variable timing will just allow the computer to choose what is needed.

]]> By: Herm http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111848 Herm Thu, 07 May 2009 13:40:11 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111848 the 30% drop in hp is what Toyota gets, since they are one of the few examples available we go with that data. It is obvious that Toyota knows how to tweak hybrids, just look at the lastest Prius, bigger engine and better mpg. the 30% drop in hp is what Toyota gets, since they are one of the few examples available we go with that data. It is obvious that Toyota knows how to tweak hybrids, just look at the lastest Prius, bigger engine and better mpg.

]]> By: carcus1 http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111802 carcus1 Thu, 07 May 2009 01:03:21 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111802 Ok, got it. As mentioned, the 30% loss is speculation. It's just a number I've seen kicked out several times about the loss when going to Atkinson from Otto. Haven't seen any charts or graphs . . .and even then I'm sure there's a LOT of variables in engine design from one application to the next. Ok, got it. As mentioned, the 30% loss is speculation. It’s just a number I’ve seen kicked out several times about the loss when going to Atkinson from Otto. Haven’t seen any charts or graphs . . .and even then I’m sure there’s a LOT of variables in engine design from one application to the next.

]]> By: jeffhre http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111801 jeffhre Thu, 07 May 2009 00:38:39 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111801 Power loss is not necessarily 30% because you won't compare Atkinson and Otto linearly across the power band. Power loss is not necessarily 30% because you won’t compare Atkinson and Otto linearly across the power band.

]]> By: carcus1 http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111799 carcus1 Thu, 07 May 2009 00:00:55 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111799 #226, Huh? #226,

Huh?

]]> By: jeffhre http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111796 jeffhre Wed, 06 May 2009 23:48:57 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111796 carcus1 Says If you were to do nothing other than convert to an atkinson cycle. You can expect to lose 30% on the power. That’s what I”ve read, but on this there really can be no official source. I’ll admit it’s speculation. ___________________ Yes, if you view the application of power as linear in an attempt to work through the power band and through each gear of the transmission, with attendant traction control issues, and the dynamics of live loads through the differential to the hubs, tire deformation, wheel hop, bad surfaces, cross winds, headwinds, turning etc. However, these transients are eliminated as ICE constraints, ie you're predictably and consistently turning the shaft of the genset. Simply wind up the ICE to one of the rpm bands it is tuned for and the electric motor modulates all the other issues, uses a reduction gear w/o a trans, and provides for recapturing regen. Vehicle acceleration and a need for torque through a band of inefficient rpm's no longer hampers the ICE. carcus1 Says

If you were to do nothing other than convert to an atkinson cycle. You can expect to lose 30% on the power. That’s what I”ve read, but on this there really can be no official source. I’ll admit it’s speculation.
___________________

Yes, if you view the application of power as linear in an attempt to work through the power band and through each gear of the transmission, with attendant traction control issues, and the dynamics of live loads through the differential to the hubs, tire deformation, wheel hop, bad surfaces, cross winds, headwinds, turning etc.

However, these transients are eliminated as ICE constraints, ie you’re predictably and consistently turning the shaft of the genset. Simply wind up the ICE to one of the rpm bands it is tuned for and the electric motor modulates all the other issues, uses a reduction gear w/o a trans, and provides for recapturing regen. Vehicle acceleration and a need for torque through a band of inefficient rpm’s no longer hampers the ICE.

]]> By: carcus1 http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111786 carcus1 Wed, 06 May 2009 23:09:03 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111786 #224 Koz, Maybe, maaaaaybeeee the 100hp. Sounds like they've got plans for a little improvement but they don't even know what they're going to end up with ( your autobloggreen reference is the only one that mentions "about" 100 hp). And isn't that engine plant on hold? If so than I still think it's just gonna be what Opel ships over (i.e. the 2003 version 90 hp). We'll see. Very doubtful they can suffer the approx 30% HP loss off of 90 or 100 to convert to atkinson. Possible they won't want the loss in torque either. If the engine has trouble holding power under varying loads then the battery will have to make up for it. This could cause problems with battery life. - - -Purely a guess on the torque thing though. - Keep in mind they will not run that engine at max hp rpm. So you can take X percent off of max hp for max sustainable rpm, which is what will really matter. #224 Koz,

Maybe, maaaaaybeeee the 100hp. Sounds like they’ve got plans for a little improvement but they don’t even know what they’re going to end up with ( your autobloggreen reference is the only one that mentions “about” 100 hp). And isn’t that engine plant on hold? If so than I still think it’s just gonna be what Opel ships over (i.e. the 2003 version 90 hp). We’ll see.

Very doubtful they can suffer the approx 30% HP loss off of 90 or 100 to convert to atkinson.

Possible they won’t want the loss in torque either. If the engine has trouble holding power under varying loads then the battery will have to make up for it. This could cause problems with battery life. – - -Purely a guess on the torque thing though.

- Keep in mind they will not run that engine at max hp rpm. So you can take X percent off of max hp for max sustainable rpm, which is what will really matter.

]]> By: koz http://gm-volt.com/2009/05/04/what-will-the-volts-generator-mode-feel-like/#comment-111664 koz Wed, 06 May 2009 12:10:27 +0000 http://gm-volt.com/?p=1645#comment-111664 Carcus1 #211 That link is from 2003. It has been reported numerois times, including one of the links below, that Volt's engine will be based off of the ~100hp upgraded Family 0 normaly aspirated 1.4L I4. I don't believe GM has stated whether it will be Atikson, Otto, or otherwise. Since it is an inexpensive and relatively easy implementation with modern electronic controls, it only makes sense that it would Atkinson because of the efficiency gains. The other links indicate the power demands for the battery and info from GM about how the generator will be used. http://gm-volt.com/2008/07/26/gm-explains-why-the-14-l-ice-range-extender-was-chosen-for-the-volt/ http://gm-volt.com/2008/07/26/gm-has-decided-on-the-14-l-4-cylinder-engine-as-the-range-extender-for-the-chevy-volt/ http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/09/26/tech-analysis-of-gms-new-1-4l-four-cylinder-engine/ Carcus1 #211

That link is from 2003. It has been reported numerois times, including one of the links below, that Volt’s engine will be based off of the ~100hp upgraded Family 0 normaly aspirated 1.4L I4. I don’t believe GM has stated whether it will be Atikson, Otto, or otherwise. Since it is an inexpensive and relatively easy implementation with modern electronic controls, it only makes sense that it would Atkinson because of the efficiency gains. The other links indicate the power demands for the battery and info from GM about how the generator will be used.

http://gm-volt.com/2008/07/26/gm-explains-why-the-14-l-ice-range-extender-was-chosen-for-the-volt/

http://gm-volt.com/2008/07/26/gm-has-decided-on-the-14-l-4-cylinder-engine-as-the-range-extender-for-the-chevy-volt/

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/09/26/tech-analysis-of-gms-new-1-4l-four-cylinder-engine/

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