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Pontiac Goes, GMC Stays, Chrysler’s on the Gallows Pole

April 25th, 2009 | Posted in: Financial, General

The end game for Chrysler is fast approaching, like the edge of a cliff.

The US government has given Chrysler until this Thursday to either complete a merger with Fiat or enter bankruptcy. Reports indicate that the government has already begun preparing for the bankruptcy proceedings, and that even if a deal is reached, bankruptcy may still ensure.

GM on the other hand has been given to June 1st to restructure or face similar consequences. Both companies are contending with debtholders who are unwilling to accept concessions to reduce the companies obligations.

There are indications that GM may announce on Monday that they will be shutting down their storied American iconic Pontiac brand forever, though the company has not confirmed this. Reports also indicate that GMC will be allowed to stay on along with Chevrolet, Cadillac, and Buick. Meanwhile GM will be idling 13 plants up to 9 weeks this summer to save cash and has just received another $2 billion in government funds to continue operations.

Even if GM too has to enter bankruptcy on June 1st, a smaller leaner and profitable GM along with the Volt and Voltec is expected to rapidly emerge.

Chrysler though may simply be liquidated and sold off if deals with banks and Fiat cannot be reached.

Stay tuned, the week ahead may be full of surprises.

Posted by: Lyle

96 Responses to “Pontiac Goes, GMC Stays, Chrysler’s on the Gallows Pole”

ziv Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:27 am

I really want GM to survive, but the Volt is just about the only reason. The Volt, the Corvette, and to some extent the Silverado, the Malibu and the Cruze. Pontiac and GMC, not so much.
nasaman Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:28 am

Gathering clouds frame GM —terrific graphic, Lyle!
zipdrive Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:46 am

Bye, bye Pointica (Oakland).

A sad, sad, sad,day in American History. This reminds me of the stories of the Great Depression, when scores of storied automobile companies went under. Cord, Deusenberg, just to name a couple.

At one time there were around 2500 car companies in this country.
Well, that was too many, of course. That was when every buggy and bicycle manufacturer got into the business. They were mostly hand built cars.

Only the really good ones survived. So it is truly sad to see one of the great ones go out of business.

Little GTO
You’re really lookin’ fine
Three deuces and a four speed
And a three-eighty-nine

Listen to her tackin’ up now
Listen to her unwind – yeah, yeah,
When I turn it on, wind it up,
BLOW IT OUT – GTO
john1701a Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:47 am

“Market Correction” is an interesting situation. Remember how not too long ago GM was striving to keep from loosing the production-volume crown from Toyota? They boasted about how Two-Mode & BAS would be the centerpieces of their future. All that sure has changed. Turns out those questioning the strategy were indeed correct.

So… when does reality come crashing down for Volt?

The schedule is too drawn out and the volume too low. Negative cash-flow like that is quite a risk for a newly emerging automaker.

Reconfiguring specs to make Volt competitive much sooner is what’s needed in this changed market.
PLJ Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:54 am

Did you know that as late as the 1950’s Detroit alone made 90% of the automobiles in the world? That’s right – in the world. You could go to any country (except communist ones) and find our exported cars.

I have traveled quite a bit, and when I do I always note what cars they drive in foreign lands.

Here’s a good one. decades ago I went to the island of Bali in Indonesia. I was amazed to find that nearly every car on the Island was a 1962 Chevy Impala. Taxis, private cars, almost every one. Those were solid cars. Not a single Japanese car to be seen.

What has happened to our great automobile industry?

This makes me almost cry.

Goodbye Pontiac.
Dave K. Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:56 am

What’s the big deal? Chrysler goes bankrupt. The free market works to sort out the REAL value of the brand. Outside buyers become involved. People willing to take a risk will position themselves for future profit.

GM/GMC, Pontiac is gone! The world will surely end on this news! Look at companies like Aptera, Tesla, or the few electric motorcycle companies. A buyer can walk into their showroom and see 3 or 4 model choices at the most. This is called, “quality over quantity”.

Our concern isn’t that a few brands are being discontinued. It’s the step by step governmental control of energy prices. Say we get a national fixed gasoline price of $3.33 a gallon. True, this will support alternative fuel use. The plan will be sold to our representatives as the greenification of America. Only to be followed by electric energy being regulated the same way.

Keep your eyes open folks. WE THE PEOPLE have been played like cattle animals since the 911 affair.

Oil, cattle, and pick up trucks…. hum?

=D~
Van Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:59 am

I have no idea why GMC should stay, I think the bulk of its line are simply rebadged Chevy trucks and SUV’s. Also, at one time it was thought the Pontiac name would stay, becoming a niche market model.

One would think a “leaner” GM would move away from selling the same vehicle with various badges. That smells like bloat to me. Ford has three lines, not four.
old man Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:59 am

The mental pressure on the folks at GM has to be enormous. looking bankruptcy in the eye and knowing that you are perfecting a drive system that will is the best hope for getting the world off oil in the near future and will propel GM back to greatness if they survive.

#4 john1701a
Go back to the last thread and check out #134 carcus and use the link to let Honda show you how to properly eat crow cause I think you will soon need this ability.
blkstne Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:01 am

Saturn will probally be next dispite what the commercials are saying.
Van Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:20 am

Zipdrive @ 3, I was recently in Phoenix, listening to Country music, and the announcer pointed out the words of a 1983 song which complained that Chevies should last ten years like they ought to. So if you look back and ask why did folks seek quality from Honda and Toyota, and abandon GM, you must go back to the 1970’s.
JEC Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:24 am

blkstne

I think Saturn makes it, one way or the other.

I see them as the most likely candidate to spin off and become it’s own company. The problem lies in how they will actually build the cars, but I have a hunch that they will either lease GM factory space, at least initially, and then become a full time player, as the markets turn up.

This is all just speculation, from someone who has no experience in how business’ run, but Saturn screams (at least to me) of a company that wants and will survive. They do have a nice lineup of vehicles, and they are already viewed by many as a separate company from GM (I bet most people, outside this forum, do not even realized the GM owns Saturn)
avatar Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:29 am

http://www.originoil.com/

Endless algae oil? If it is cost effective expensive electric cars might not be so popular after all.

Much of the world’s oil and gas is made up of ancient algae deposits. Today, our technology will produce “new oil” from algae, through a cost-effective, high-speed manufacturing process. This endless supply of new oil can be used for many products such as diesel, gasoline, jet fuel, plastics and solvents without the global warming effects of petroleum.
JEC Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:31 am

Funny, when I was in college, I wrote a paper about how Toyota was going to eventually rule the US markets in automobiles.

I remembered one of the article names (“The next Toyolets”) I referenced, and when I googled it I found the actual article from 1983.

Interesting read, about how things were 26 years ago.

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,955136,00.html
Adam Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:35 am

Anybody ever listen to Alanis Morsitte, “Ironic”? That plays well here, though most of us don’t want to hear Anybody but Honda and Toyota going away, that would be the day. It’s a shame GM and Chrysler couldn’t see how things were going before, and invested money of better technoligy 10 years ago, but they simply wanted to have more horsepower, and faster cars.

In one way, I would like to see Chrysler, and GM survive, with ALL brands intact, but on the other hand, something MUST be done with the way their thinking with fuel economy, and union labor wages, among other things.
CorvetteGuy Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:40 am

They’re not ‘approaching’ the cliff. It’s more like Wyle E. Coyote already past the edge of the cliff; and that long, slow whistle as he is falling into the distance… We’re just waiting for the “splat” when they hit the bottom.
CDAVIS Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:55 am

______________________________________________________
Save Hummer!!!

GM a while back made the decision to put Hummer up for sale as a PR demonstration that GM is serious about becoming a more green friendly car maker. The Hummer had become THE iconic symbol of “big gas guzzling” cars.GM has not to date found a buyer for Hummer.

There is a much larger opportunity for GM to demonstrate it’s transition to more green friendly cars than divesting in Hummer.

Here it is…The Huge Hummer Home Run:

Slap the VOLTEC platform into the Hummer to create an EREV w/ 20+miles AER.

GM will gain much more positive PR by converting the Hummer power plant to Voltec than GM will ever gain by simply cutting lose the Hummer brand. There are a bunch of folks that would purchase a Voltec Hummer. GM cound not make them fast enough. It would be a huge success story of how a car company took it’s most vilified (eco wise) brand and turned the brand on its head to become a showcase of how a rugged SUV can be both Bad Ass and Eco Friendly.

That sounds good but can it be done?

Here is a company that is doing what GM itself should be doing:

Raser Technologies of Utah wants to use technology similar to that in the Chevy Volt to make the HUMMER a 100 MPG fuel sipper. Raser is saying that using their EREV technology, the HUMMER plug-in hybrid will run up to 40 miles per day on its battery alone, then a small 4 cylinder combustion engine will kick in to generate more electricity.

http://www.rasertech.com/news/press-releases/raser-technologies-unveils-100-mpg-plug-in-hybrid-hummer
______________________________________________________
Electric Cars + Nuclear Power = American Energy Independence!
______________________________________________________
Dave K. Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:04 am

CDAVIS 16,

Raser Tech can’t call their E-REV off roader the “Hummer H3″ how about “Bat Ray” (bat-tery)?

=D~
john1701a Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:06 am

Go back to the last thread and check out #134 carcus and use the link to let Honda show you how to properly eat crow cause I think you will soon need this ability.
_____________________________

What in the world is that suppose to mean?

Those of use supporting hybrids praise that decision “to put more effort into advanced hybrids“.

That’s what we’ve wanted all along.
CDAVIS Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:06 am

_____________________________________________________
Follow up to #16 CDAVIS
Save Hummer!!!
——-

Check out the EREV Hummer video on this page (it is an excellent EREV promo/explanation video…best I have seen to date):

http://www.rasertech.com/media/videos/the-electric-h3
______________________________________________________
Van Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:09 am

JEC @ 13, a family member bought a used Prizm because you got toyota quality (high) and Chevy resale price (low). Apparently the lights were on in the upper floors of GM, but nobody was home.
Evil Conservative Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:28 am

Pontiac’s last great car was the T/A. Sad.
CA Hummer Owner Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:39 am

CDAVIS #16

I’d buy an Electric Hummer today!
It would sell very well here in California.

Also…its a car our Gov. Arnold could fit in unlike the toy Tesla he purchased but can’t get in.
CDAVIS Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:44 am

______________________________________________________
#22 CA Hummer Owner Said:
I’d buy an Electric Hummer today!
It would sell very well here in California.
———

I agree…it would be a very big seller in California…A Green Tech status symbol.
______________________________________________________
George K Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 10:52 am

#16 CDAVIS
“Slap the VOLTEC platform into the Hummer to create an EREV w/ 20+miles AER.”

I like that idea. Except, I would go for 40 aer. Because after the batt is empty, you’re not talking 50 mpg here. It could be buried in the $60+ 000 sticker price.

Yesterday, Arnold Schwarzenegger was on a video talking about his Hummer, which was converted to hydrogen. He was saying it’s not the Hummer itself. The problem is the gas engine….

=D~~~~
Chris C Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:37 am

On the other hand, Ford seems to be making a lot of good decisions. The have clearly decided that quality really is job 1 and according to Consumer’s Report latest car issue their quality is nearly up with Honda and Toyota on some models. I have to give them credit as well for selling losing brands (Range Rover etc.) as they have over the last few years.

While their hybrids are not nearly as exciting as Voltech technology, you have to admit that at least their’s are on the road. For those of us who won’t have the $$ for a Gen 1 Volt, the new Fusion hybrid looks like a great compromise. No, its not zero gas driving, but affordable e-revs are a long way off, if they are ever built. Today you can to support an American company and buy what looks like one fine automobile that gets amazing milage. If recent history is a guide you’ll also get a reliable car as well.

This looks pretty cool…

http://www.ford.com/about-ford/news-announcements/press-releases/press-releases-detail/pr-ford-team-aims-to-drive-2010-30233

While I’m not thrilled at the state of Chrysler and GM, they have made their bed. Glitz over quality in their cases. Now we see what the market does to companies that invest in style over substance to maximize the $$ in the short term. I for one believe that their failure has a lot more to do with engineering and decisions as to where to invest their money than the UAW. Not that the UAW doesn’t share in the blame…

So to the current Chrysler and GM, may they RIP. Hopefully whatever comes out the other side will be better run.

Chris
Brian Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:40 am

This should have happened over a year ago, but GM was too arrogant to admit they had a failed business model. Now we are all 17 Billion dollars poorer due to their inability to run a profitable company. I think GM is severely underestimating the bailout backlash. People aren’t going to quickly forget when its time to buy a new car who they already gave their money to. If it wasn’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider a GM car at all.
LauraM Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:42 am

Wow! I’m sorry about Pontiac. I kind of liked the idea of a niche brand. But I guess they needed to eliminate some dealers…

The whole Chrysler issue is just upsetting all the way around. I’m angry at Daimler for that idiotic merger, and for mismanaging and then stripping the company. Of course, they’d probably still be in trouble right now. But there might actually have been something left to salvage if not for Daimler.

And, now I’m angry at Bush and Obama for throwing away money on them when everyone knew it was a lost cause, and hurting GM and Ford in the process. First of all, Chrysler is still taking up market share. Second, how is anyone supposed to take the threat of a GM (or Ford) bankruptcy seriously while the administration is keeping Chrysler on life support?

And now they’re going to spend another 6 billion for what? To sponsor yet another foreign automaker’s entry into the US market? In order to help the UAW in the short term? This is the kind of short term thinking that got them into trouble in the first place.
LWesson Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:43 am

My 1950, 51, and 66 Pontiac LeMans will be orphaned survivors from the failure of executives who reside in mansions that led the “parade”. A sad day. Zeus, Apollo, attack!

Carcus1 Big Nose Kate’s eyes do glow but I do declare that I think it more love than anything. Best wishes, Doc.
Anthony BC Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:45 am

#26 Brian – “People aren’t going to quickly forget when its time to buy a new car who they already gave their money to. If it wasn’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider a GM car at all.” – So very true!

#5 PLJ – “What has happened to our great automobile industry?” – Nobody’s cared about it for years, except for the Profits!”

Goodbye Pontiac – Sad to see you go
noel park Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:56 am

#19 Van:

My 85 Suburban had 430K miles on it when I finally had to let it go for a bigger truck. It’s still going.

#11 JEC:

They can continue to source cars from Opel after Fiat buys Opel, hehehe.

#23 CDAVIS:

Yeah, I bet those electric Hummers would sell like hotcakes in CA. Just like hybrid Escalades (and Tahoes and Silveradoes). The sales figures are clearly visible under a microscope.
coffeetime Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:07 pm

Van says “I have no idea why GMC should stay, I think the bulk of its line are simply rebadged Chevy trucks and SUV’s.”

Don’t forget that GMC sells light and medium-duty commercial trucks (www.gmc.com/commercialBridge.jsp) as well as the rebadged ones you refer to.
eightzero Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:10 pm

My first new car was a Pontiac Fiero. It was a horrific POS. Good riddance. GM/Ponitac treated me like dirt when it was recalled.

Next car was a Nissan: gas/oil for $250k/miles. Great support.

My next car must have a plug on it. Not because it is practical, not because it is economical, but because *that’s what I want.*
noel park Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:16 pm

#2 nasaman:

It is a cool graphic. Thanks for pointing it out. I would have missed it completely.

BTW, sorry if I have sounded a bit flip about all of this the last few days. Maybe it’s just a psychological reaction to being a spectator at this unfolding tragedy. Sort of gallows humor, to play off Lyle’s caption above. Once I said that we were sort of like the chorus in a Greek tragedy. Never more so than now.

#6 Dave K:

“WE THE PEOPLE have been played like cattle animals since the 911 affair.”

Alas, God’s truth my friend. Well said, as painful as it is to contemplate.
16falcon Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:18 pm

#25 Chris C Says:
Today you can to support an American company and buy what looks like one fine automobile that gets amazing milage. If recent history is a guide you’ll also get a reliable car as well.
======================================================

Chris’s reference to Ford above is spot on. If you can’t wait (who knows how long) for an EREV or BEV, Ford’s Hybrid offerings are a way to cut your gas use and reduce your carbon footprint right now while still supporting a U.S. company. I have owned mostly Fords over the last 17 years and have been very happy with the quality and the service I have received. I’ve had my 2009 Ford Escape Hybrid since July, 5000 miles, and have had no issues with it, it’s a great quality vehicle. Now with the Ford Fusion Hybrid (and it’s Mercury clone the Milan) you have the choice of a small SUV Hybrid (Escape or Mercury Mariner) or Mid sized car (Fusion/Milan).
vincent Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:37 pm

It’s sad indeed, but….
Hopefully one day after the New GM is born they will earn market place back with cutting edge cars and bring back the old glory!

I still feel all the doubters will be silenced when the GM E-Revs are a huge success!
kent beuchert Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 12:51 pm

There is a sort of perverse logic that sees a smaller, leaner profitable GM as somehow better than the large gigantic company that existed before. Sorry, but a smaller GM means its worth that much less to this country’s economic well-being. Success at GM does NOT mean that we are better off. If it’s smaller, we are that much smaller as a producing nation. It’s called physics. The media don’t get it (as if they get anything).
CDAVIS Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 1:25 pm

______________________________________________________
30 noel park Said:

“#23 CDAVIS: Yeah, I bet those electric Hummers would sell like hotcakes in CA. Just like hybrid Escalades (and Tahoes and Silveradoes). The sales figures are clearly visible under a microscope”
——

The Hybrid Tahoe offers 30% better mpg over regular Thaoe at a steep price premium. A Voltec Hummer would also be at a price premium but it would offer a SUV that can be driven on electric only for most of the driving. You could drive a Voltec Hummer to the store w/o burning a drop of gas. Take a look at the Electric Hummer commercial on the below linked page and imagine if that commercial was a GM commercial running today and that Electric Hummer was available today….it would be a hot seller IMO.

http://www.rasertech.com/media/videos/the-electric-h3
_____________________________________________________
Brian Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 1:27 pm

Are we are supposed to feel sorry for GM? These guys fought every single mileage increase and efficiency legislation with their enormous legal team for decades. Rather than focusing on delivering cleaner more efficient cars, they used up all their resouces fighting against them. Now they want to be known as the green car company with the Volt?
stopcrazypp Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 1:55 pm

@Brian #38
I don’t usually defend GM, but ALL the major automakers under the Alliance of Automobile Manufacturers fought mileage increases.

This includes:
BMW
Chrysler
Ford
Mazda
Mercedes Benz
Mitsubishi
Porsche
Toyota (yes the company viewed as most “green”)
Volkswagen
Keith Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:14 pm

EVWorld .com has an interesting post on its site about a fully electric car that is made in Australia .
They are not afraid to post lots of information on their link .
I would recommend that it be given a good read as these people seem to know what they are doing and are willing to share their expertise with anyone who is interested .

The link

http://evme.com.au/
carcus1 Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:17 pm

#25 Chris C
#34 16falcon

I’m going to jump in with the GM should be more like Ford chorus for a minute.

Ford does appear to be doing it right. There’s a long list of fuel economy improvements for the 09 F150 including a 3rd valve on their 4.6 and a 6 speed tranny. I’m seeing 19-20 mpg city and 21 to 23 mpg highway (23 at 65 mph or less, 21 at 70 mph). My old F150 had a lifetime average of 14.8mpg over 184,000 miles. Looking forward to the “ecoboost” engines in a year and a half which should garner another 15% to 20% improvement.

Maybe Ford’s multifaceted shotgun blast is a better approach than hoping for one silver bullet.

GM, where is your 40+ mpg conventional hybrid, where is your economy sized BEV, and what’s happened to the plug-in vue?? (which had more sales potential than the volt, IMO)

/Chris’ referenced fusion hybrid 1,000 mile challenge: with Wayne Gerdes leading the charge that should be no problem.

P.S. Not trying to kick ‘em while they’re down here, just hope that Fritz and the all new (I hope) B.O.D. might learn something from the blue oval competition.
Zach Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:18 pm

Wow!! I just saw that Electric H3 Hummer video and it’s amazing! VERY well put together!

Thanks for sharing!
an_outsider Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:32 pm

Leaner new GM line-up : Chevrolet, Buick, Cadillac. GMC

Okay… Would the GMC products be “only” medium-duty & commercial trucks, excluding all Chevy re-badged light duty pick-up & so on, in this futur smaller GM?

(Saturn lost is a shame for my humble opinion, time will tell..)
Guy Incognito Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:37 pm

Chrysler will be gone by next week, GM a little later, June 1st perhaps.
PLJ Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:42 pm

Brian @26 says:
“If it wasn’t for the Volt, I wouldn’t even consider a GM car at all.”

—————————————————————————-
Why not? Buick is now the highest quality vehicle on the planet.

http://www.whybuyusedcars.com/2009/03/21/jaguar-jumps-buick-bumps-lexus-lags/

And, I might add they are (my opinion here) great looking cars.

The Chinese are buying Buicks by the trainload. Buick is always at or near the top in sales over there. Why? I think it is because the Chinese are new to the car market and have a fresh perspective on all these cars from around the world. They don’t have the “baggage” that we attach to certain brands because of past mistakes those companies have made. They judge cars on their CURRENT quailities. Also their last Emperor owned nothing but
Buicks. They respect that.

So, I invite you to take a new look at some of the cars GM is making. Actually sit in them and drive them. I have. I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

One last point. Some people are angered at the “bailouts” (loans) the car companies are getting. Well, the Japanese government injected huge amounts of money and gave unfair advantage to their car companies for years until they got a foothold in the US. So why can’t we help our own industries? If that’s the game the competition wants to play, then turnabout is fair play.
carcus1 Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 2:43 pm

#28 LWessonhiggins,

“My 1950, 51, and 66 Pontiac LeMans will be orphaned survivors from the failure of executives who reside in mansions that led the “parade”. A sad day. Zeus, Apollo, attack!”
__________________________

I guess when you live on an island you can’t have too many boats! If that ‘66 orphan needs a new home I’ll take it in.
Adrian Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 3:04 pm

Too bad for Pontiac. The G8 is a great car. It will be saved and moved to Buick (can you say Grand National?) but everything else goes away.

You could almost spin Pontiac and GMC off as it’s own brand but not in this economy (with the huge energy tax coming in congress gets their way, things will only get worse).

#1 thing that should happen is for Chrysler and GM to merge under the GM brand. Jeep is added, and GMC gets the Ram name. Caddy or Buick get the 300 and Chevy gets the zero since the cheap cars Chrysler makes aren’t worth keeping. GM also gets access Hemi (if it wants it), and Mopar parts. Also, if the merger were to happen Pontiac wouldn’t have to go away but you could have Dodge-Pontiac-Jeep dealers (maybe just Dodge-Jeep). Hot cars and cool offroad vehicles and Dodge gives you a SUV. Then you have Buick-GMC for next tier pricing luxury. Chevy and Caddy stay the way they are.
Ed M Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 4:18 pm

It’ll be really sad to see Chrysler hit the skids. I’ve owned my share of their products, mostly Dodge but only one Pontiac. I found them mostly enjoyable The only thing wrong with these products was the quality controls over the years.

With the Valiant, it was leaking seals that prematurely caused steering failures, the Aspen had severe water leaks around the windows and lights and the door hinges were substandard, the Dakota had faulty steering parts and very poor brakes and the Pontiac Sunbird was just a cheap car all around with always something breaking down. But they were all fun to drive. I’ve never been one to buy foreign vehicles because I prefer the feel of American design.

I’ll be buying a Volt no matter what comes out of Asia.
zipdrive Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 5:18 pm

GM can do nicely around the world with just three car brands – Chevy, Buick, Cadillac – plus GMC.

GM merging with Chryser is a completely screwball idea. They have nothing to offer each other. Let Fiat pick up Chrysler and get the dealer network they need and keep the good stuff Chrysler has (like JEEP) alive.

By the way the new Buick Lacrosse is one sweet vehicle.

http://www.autoblog.com/photos/detroit-2009-2010-buick-lacrosse/1281324/
PLJ Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 5:57 pm

Anthony @29 answers #5 PLJ – “What has happened to our great automobile industry?” –
————————————————————————
Nobody’s cared about it for years, except for the Profits!”
————————————————————————-

This is just an idiotic statement. What sensible company is not concerned with profits?

What happened is the Japanese companies got lucky during the 1970’s when the oil crisis (ie. the Arab shakedown of the world) made their little fuel-sipping cars more desirable than the huge behemoths that Detroit was making.

GM for example had just redesigned all their full-sized cars for the 1971 model year. They weighed around 400 lbs. more than the cars they replaced, were bigger in every dimension, had smog device-choked engines that were down on power, used more fuel, yet had to haul around more weight.

Then the 1973 fuel crisis hit and drove gas prices through the roof.

Then the stock market crashed at the same time.

All this was a multiple sucker punch to the gut for the big three auto makers.

The Japanese cars weren’t very good, but they got good gas mileage, and so Americans bought them by the boatload.

GM tried to come out with some small cars but they were real crap, like the Chevy Vega. Its aluminum engines would melt if they lost any coolant.

Ford tried the same thing with its Pinto. This car was famous for its gas tanks that could explode if impacted from the rear.

It was this luck, plus the fact that the Japanese government and JAPAN INC. subsidized the Japanese entry into the car market over here (and simultaneously prevented any US competition in the Japanes homeland), that allowed the Japanese companies to gain a foothold in this country.

My feeling in all this is that the American people have been asleep. We play the Laissez Faire, free-enterprise game because it’s the right thing to do, while the rest of the world plays a dirty takeover-at-any-cost game. They have done this with many of our industries. They play us for suckers.

My strong advice is this: Buy American stuff people. Keep our own brothers and sisters working – at manufacturing jobs at American owned companies – or we will be driving down the road to poverty before long.
PLJ Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 6:19 pm

By the way, if you don’t know what I mean by JAPAN INC. please read the following article. It is a lengthy read but well worth the effort.

http://www.uwsa.com/issues/trade/japanyes.html
Chuck Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 6:30 pm

My strong advice is this: Buy American stuff people. Keep our own brothers and sisters working – at manufacturing jobs at American owned companies – or we will be driving down the road to poverty before long.
———-

Whats wrong with keeping our Japanese brothers and sisters employed? People need to work and eat whether they live in Tokyo or Detroit.
GM-fan Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 6:52 pm

# PLJ
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
My feeling in all this is that the American people have been asleep. We play the Laissez Faire, free-enterprise game because it’s the right thing to do, while the rest of the world plays a dirty takeover-at-any-cost game. They have done this with many of our industries. They play us for suckers.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Hey, I am surprise you think US is “Laissez Faire”, think about what Obama do for the banks/cars, US nationalize/subsidies so many major companies…..

US is more socialize then some communist country nowadays…

Don’t trust the magazine you read, my friend
RB Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 6:59 pm

#45 PLJ responds to an earlier question by asking about Buick
“Why not? Buick is now the highest quality vehicle on the plane.”
——————————————————–

I have a Buick. It has been and is a great car. Smooth, quiet, fast. But I would never buy another one, because Buick has taken on the image of being for the very very old. Creep around the neighborhood in your Buick.

GM has made a huge mistake in letting (or even encouraging) this image of the Buick to become dominant. Once upon a time there was the Buick racing car company. Recalling some of that heritage every now and then, rather than the stodgy ads GM uses now for Buick, would have been much much better.

I suppose Buick survives to be the China car.
RichardG Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 7:03 pm

http://www.theoaklandpress.com/articles/2009/04/15/business/doc49e5b05917d48557524415.txt

Is this a case of too little too late or is there an “electric core” left to Chrysler?

Bankruptcy is not the end of the line, either. All the major US airlines have been in bankruptcy at least once.

Jeep should be a valuable franchise that would receive several bids from foreign companies if Chrysler files.
LauraM Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 7:30 pm

#53 Chuck

Nothing is wrong with supporting the Japanese economy. It’s just that as an American, my future depends on the American economy not the Japanese economy. I’m still hoping that social security and medicare will be there when I retire. (I know–it’s delusional.) My savings are all in US dollars, and I don’t want them wiped out by hyperinflation. (I’ve thought about buying gold, but it seems somehow unpatriotic. Besides, it’s way too popular right now.) Also, while my job is relatively secure (and as far away from the auto industry as you can get in this country), if we have a 1930s style depression, nothing is safe. Finally, I’m worried about my future tax burden and that of my unborn children given all the deficits the government is running up. And the huge trade deficit makes a US government bailout through GDP growth look increasingly unrealistic.

If you’re an American, you’re probably in the same boat I am, which is why you should care. I believe that the Canadians are also affected, but I don’t want to speak for them.

ETA: I also feel that Japan, China and numerous other countries don’t play fair when it comes to trade. And that puts US industry at an unfair disadvantage. But that’s another story.
Dave K. Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 7:39 pm

Maybe it’s time for President Obama to step up and partially subsidize the Volt manufacturing program. In it a fixed price of $20,000 per Volt to all who can afford one.

Ford, Honda, and Nissan will moan about it. But this is the most fair way of bailing out GM. We just can’t toss another $6 billion without getting some vehicles for it.

Let’s do the math. The after tax credit cost of the Volt will be about $30,000. With the $20,000 Obama Volt plan the government (U.S. tax payers) will be paying GM $17,500 per Volt.

$6 billion (would be TARP dollars) divided by $17,500 and we have 343,000 inexpensive Volt to buy. 343,000 divided by 57,000 produced per year = 6 years of Volt production.

This could have been done with the first $20 billion.

yes we can?

=D~
Herm Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 7:45 pm

sure we can, but as long as someone else is paying for it, drop the price to $15k
JEC Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:50 pm

58 Herm

Right on! Those darn taxpayers might as well supplement everyone…why not just give a Volt per family.

Dave K, I totally hope your tongue was firmly pressed into your cheek when you put together this plan, right?
john1701a Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 8:54 pm

Maybe it’s time for President Obama to step up and partially subsidize the Volt manufacturing program. In it a fixed price of $20,000 per Volt to all who can afford one.
_____________________

That would require a substantial commitment from GM, significantly scaling back other vehicles for the sake of delivering enough Volt for all that would buy.

GM has not expressed any interest in that. In fact, we’ve been told volume on that level isn’t expected until 2015.

Many of the extras would have to be dropped too, matching the interior to their non-hybrid vehicles… since it would be the efficiency benefit for all, not futuristic features.
Brian Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:03 pm

#57

Right, lets subsidize cars for people with our tax money. I think we should also subsidize flat screen tv for everyone I mean that’s a necessity these days and why should we be buying Japense TVs. Let’s also subside 2 week vacation cruises for all Americans while we are at it, because we are just too damn stressed out. Aw hell, lets just give 100% of our money to taxes and let the government just buy us everything we need.
carcus1 Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:06 pm

Continually subsidizing the big 2 (or 3) could very well be counter-productive if it’s the electrification of the automobile that you’re after.

Pure EV’s will likely need almost no maintenance. This is a profound factor that should not be overlooked. Big OEM’s may very well look at the manufacturing of inexpensive BEV’s as “cuttting their own throat”.

This guy said it better than I could. (Tomi, commentor on green car congress, 2005):

“Automotive engines are designed for a running life of 5000 hours. During that time they make many (sometimes MANY) trips to the dealership/repair shop/parts store etc. Maintenance of the traditional internal combustion engine and ancillaries is a huge revenue source for the automotive industry.

Assuming your refrigerator motor/compressor runs 5 minutes out of every hour on average (probably a conservative estimate), after 20 years that motor will have racked up 14,600 hours of run time, and all of it start/stop, start/stop, etc. Yet how many of us have or know someone with a 20-year-old refrigerator? Rather than wearing out it’s probably been moved to the basement to make way for something more stylish. And how many times has it been to the shop or even serviced in that 20 years? Once? Maybe?

The OEMs do not see this future EV trend as beneficial to them. Think about it: no transmission, a virtually indestructible motor, not even any oil changes! Where’s the profit in that? Yes, the technologies mostly exist today, but you’re not going to see the drive for them coming from the companies that stand the most to lose from their implementation. It’s the little guys making this revolution happen.”
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/12/smart_shows_die.html

(counterpoint: Hopefully, big OEM’s can recognize continued profitability by offering upgrades and new models in a rapidly changing electric car industry.)
ccombs Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:09 pm

Sad for such a historic name brand to go, but necessary. I think the GM brand should go as well. Chevy- Buick- Caddy. A simple ladder system.
JEC Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 9:20 pm

carcus1

I agree with this assesment. Pure BEV’s are the ultimate freedom from expensive car repairs. I look forward to the day when all the iron and oil is gone from my car.

It will come, how soon, I am not sure, but it is the ultimate direction of the future vehicle, but as you said their will be resistance to the change by those with a vested interest in the profits now taken by the obsolete ICE machines.

Bring on FULL ELECTRICS!
Nelson Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:05 pm

Rick Wagoner was the number one factor in bringing GM to the state it finds itself today. One thing he said that I fully agree with is if GM can’t pull out of this bankruptcy nose dive, its future will be very bleak. No matter what they sell, customer confidence will be non-existent. I hope the UAW and debt holders have half a brain and accept concessions or they will lose it all.

NPNS!
koz Says:
April 25th, 2009 at 11:13 pm

Brian #61

While certain incentives to spur the adoption of EV’s may not be part of the answer, you are clearly missing the points of why reducing our oil consumption is impotant?

-$400-$700 billion per annum leaves this country to pay for oil
-pollution (noise, particulate, and gaseous) in urban centers negatively affects health and quality of life
-Military expenditures to ensure stable oil supply (including but not nearly limited to war in Iraq IMO)
-Declining affordably accessable world oil reserves and rapidly increasing demand trend (beyond near term world recession)
-GW (IMO & in most people’s opinion)
-More sustainable, longer lived vehicles
-Synergy with renewable energy technologies with opportunity charging and source of grid energy storage batteries after useful automotive life

LCD TV’s, vacations, etc do not offer significant society benefits. Blind Laissez Faire free market governance has little mechanism for recognizing or accounting for these kind of secondary societal issues.
Battery Expert Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 12:02 am

Chrysler will be gone and won’t be missed by anyone in America except Chrysler employees and dealers. As for GM, history will prove they are the wrong side when they decide to work on PHEV even their top scientist doubt battery reliability in 10 years when it is constantly blasted at high rate, not to mention the backlash against them if they fail the project next year. I have witnessed (scientist doubt battery reliability) in last year during ECS meeting in Phoenix, AZ and it is just a matter of time for me to reveal my own identity here (If I no longer work in battery business, I will reveal my identity to WSJ and this date may only be weeks away depends on the economy) and my own credential in battery R&D. Ford/Toyota in my opinion is on the right track, so is Johnson Control/SAFT. Anyone who wants to help the domestic industry should switch to Ford. When it comes to battery powered vehicle, it is important for anyone here NOT to be too emotional, such as: “We gotta make pure EV, we gotta support Tesla, we must be 100% oil inpedent,” These are good wishes which won’t come true any time soon.

As a scientist in the battery field, it is my sincere hope renewable energy can replace oil, but unfortunately it can’t. That is why Toyota and Honda are much more conservative and it is for good reasons. (Cost, reliability, customer acceptance). Customers enthusiasm is cheap, even 100,000 people here sign up for Chevy Volt is also meaningless unless they deposit non-refundable $8000 to GM should the customer change his/her mind when actual product come out w/o meeting unrealistically high expectations. If you criticize me here, please ask yourself if you are willing to deposit non-refundable $8K today and it can only be used for final purchase price and non-refundable under any circumstances.

Why I am posting so much here? because I know the stupid enthusiasm here and bad corporate planning by GM hurts battery scientists tremendously. I have talked to a bunch battery guys (who have >10y industrial experiences) privately and none of them buy the GM and Tesla ideas and conservatively optimistic about HEV, etc. There are one thing in common for battery scientist/engineer, their life have been very difficult (extremely unstable job, constantly relocating throughout the country, divorce and foreclosure, etc), partially contributed by “stupidity” shown here and mainly by bad corporate planning which focused only short-term stock price, which in my opinion will ruin A123 and Boston-Power one day.

May god bless you all, because I know you sincerely care, but just somehow uneducated (battery wise), poorly informed, misguided and too emotional!
Jim I Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 12:03 am

That bad old GM was making those big stupid SUV’s that no one wanted…

Are you kidding me? They were making exactly what people wanted. And up until the gas prices went through the $4.00 ceiling, everyone was happy. Right now, people are just not buying GM vehicles. They are not buying anything, unless they absolutely have to!

Should GM have had some smaller higher mileage cars in the mix? Should they have had some more hybrids? Should they have continued the EV-1? Sure, but just remember that hindsight is 20-20.

To go to a Prius clone at this time makes no sense. The Volt design is the right decision. They will get no second chance however, so this car has to be perfect right out of the gate. And Nov, 2010 is post time….

My only complaint is the 10K car production run for the first model year. If this is THE car and design you are going to bet your future on, and you are sure of your design, go for it. Put the production facility on full capacity and get as many of these cars out on the road as soon as you can. Then get the less expensive Cruze version out in 2012, along with a smaller 20 mile AER Buick SUV (A new use for the name Electra?). In 2013 release the high end Caddy Converj and a small less expensive E-REV pickup truck for Chevy or GMC. Now you have shown the world you are really serious about the transformation of GM. Every year after that, start to covert any other possible models one at a time to the E-REV design with varying AER.

GM will either become wildly successful again, or go out in a blaze of glory!

Now the question is – does anyone in GM’s upper management have the guts to put their necks out that far for the future of the company?????

JMHO
Jim I Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 12:14 am

Battery Expert #67: You need to quote some real sources, rather than the vague references you keep mentioning.

LG Chem sure would not risk the hit to their corporate future if they thought the battery pack design would not hold up. A123 fought for their design right down to the last minute. And if you are right, that would be GM’s easy out to not produce the vehicle, that they could have taken at any time. But that does not seem to be the case.

I guess only time will tell………..
Dave K. Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 12:45 am

JEC 59 & Brian 61

In a perfect world I would agree with you on both points.

The reality is that tax payers dollars are flowing out. The tax payer is asking that the TARP hole in the bucket be stopped up with super putty. Our representatives are telling us that they know what is right and to not worry about it.

So, in this flawed world we live in, is getting a $20,000 Volt really that crazy of an idea? We’re already in each (future?) Volt for $7,500.

Okay, let’s have it your way. We’ll inject another $6 billion without seeing a single E-REV roll off the UAW line.

By any definition: madness

=D~
Batttery Expert Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 1:11 am

# 69,

GM top scientist, Dr Abbas said that. In the case of LG Chem, they want to produce battery for GM, several reasons:
1). Like everyone else, there is a big urge to DO IT, even it is too risky, but political pressure, business pressure (LG CEO may not be battery expert, but will push battery division to it, no matter what).
2). LG need to ramp production to reduce cost, they will also sell HEV battery to other company, despite PHEV HEV battery design is different, once volume goes up, their HEV battery cost will also come down dramatically.

#69, you can contact Dr. John Kerr at LBL.gov
http://berc.lbl.gov/

I am always troubled by GM’s insistence on marketing it on 10/15/2010? Maybe they use it solely as a bargaining tool to get tax payer’s money? If I am in charge of GM, I will do this:
1). Continue to do battery R&D and engineering on HEV, PHEV, EV.
2). Priority on HEV first, but no commitment on PHEV, HEV unless HEV battery ramp up production and battery reliability thoroughly evaluated. Ask team to design parts in way that max amount of parts can be shared among HEV, PHEV and EV (I know many parts have to be different)
3). Ask GM engineers to set up production line so it is relatively short (still at least a few months) to switch from HEV to PHEV.
4). VERY important: Do not give up or even under invest in Fuel cell R&D.
Timaaayyy!!! Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 2:01 am

’bout time–decades in the making. I’m way past tears on this one.

World auto manaufacturing mkt in 10 yrs: SE Asian makes (including GM China) blowing away the rest of the world.

Then after that, Africa becomes the last lowest cost producer.

My BYDDY had a good couple of weeks…
Drmalikia Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 3:25 am

I was going to get a Volt until Obama started “Wheeling & Dealing” in the auto markets. Not to mention attempts at making “Cap & Trade” a reality. I saw the death of Pontiac news story Friday and decided that I would rather enjoy cars as Americans have for almost a century. I bought a Pontiac G8 GT, Liquid Red, 363 HP V8, guzzles gas all the way to the pump. The Volt will be great on the pocket book and that was the primary reason I am drawn to it. This my third Pontiac and now seems it maybe my last “real” car. The Pontiac icon falling is symbolic of American and the path being blazed by our government. Did I mentioned I signed for the G8 before I test drove it? :0)
Thomas Gilling Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 4:43 am

Iconic, oh please! Pontiac is nothing, it’s just a car company! There is nothing iconic!
sudhaman Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 5:24 am

pontiac g8 was superb. it must be sold under the chevy brand in future. the volt would be a game changer across the line. pontiac brand may be reborn some years after GM comes to profitability
sudhaman Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 5:29 am

chrysler will have to make a deal with fiat. the chrysler is an american icon and it must be saved at all costs please
sudhaman Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 5:33 am

we must be patriotic and buy american cars. see the japanese ,do they buy any imported car from outside no then why the hell do we have to. is it quality efficiency.well buying imported car at the cost of bankrupting the economy by building trade deficits,not the right way
Herm Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:09 am

I see no problem with increasing the subsidy on BEV, double it, it will shift the balance of trade from foreign oil to locally produced electricity.. the problem is that the batteries are not made in the US.. and probably neither will the cars…

I see a lot of future tax money in many countries being poured into BEV subsidies.. it just makes too much sense.
Herm Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:15 am

Battery Expert, with that statement you now really need to salvage your reputation..

I hope you are not talking about hydrogen fuel cells and instead about SOFC running on liquid fuels.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solid_oxide_fuel_cell

I’m also not confident on the 10 year warranty but time will tell.

………………

#71 Batttery Expert Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 1:11 am

4). VERY important: Do not give up or even under invest in Fuel cell R&D.
Arthur Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:40 am

As I Scot I am amazed and saddened by what has happened to so such much of American industry. Solid advance and invention has been choked out by the marketing men, the suits, the guys in tune with ‘fashion’ rather than what will improve the product in the longer term in the broader sense.

In engineering so much that makes sense technically ultimately makes sense in the success of a product. America always had the talent and engineers to make great, innovative, game changing, products but just like here in the UK, the ‘business’ guys, usually with no technical background, took control of product development and look what has happened. A good example was how Apple nosedived when the suits got rid of Steven Jobs and how it soared after he was again placed in charge of product innovation and development.

Further, as the old saying goes “Empires make you poor”. There were always two ways to make money. Take somebody else’s or work hard and earn it yourself. I think the age old conflict of Scotland and England reflects this. The Scots, who formed a large group of your Founding Fathers, were hard working and honest. Science, medicine, engineering and industry were valued. However their was also the Anglo Saxon (English) influence on America (the WASP), which look down on industry and saw wealth being created through speculation, imperial expansion and the projection of American power and influence. This route has now caused a massive collapse of the economy.

The UK persisted with its imperial aspirations after the war by hanging on to America’s coat tails. Now the UK is effectively bankrupt – the final result of Empire. Now the USA is too vast and great a country for that to happen to it but as we see it has suffered an enormous cost for its dalliance with the carpetbaggers, imperialists and money men. However, I think that it has now set itself on a different course where genuine talent and honest enterprise are again valued and most importantly – listened to.

I know its been a but of a heavy duty post but as for Scotland – I think we have learned that to return to prosperity we need to start standing on our own two feet and hope that our good friends in America will look kindly on our endeavours and we can start fixing our roofs together. I am sure America will become more Scottish than Anglo Saxon from now on. That will certainly be more in keeping with the spirit of the Founding Fathers.
old man Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:52 am

john1701a
Sorry about taking so long to respond to your post [was gone most of yesterday]

My post was based on two things.
one in my opinion you are often negative regarding the Volt and GM.
second now even the Japanese are admitting that E-REV is a winner and will be with us a long time. They pushed the dual system rather than the serial system used in voltec.
koz Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:54 am

Battery expert? Perhaps more approriately, hope for Battery Savant. Your expresed logic outside of batteries is elusive but perhaps you are at one with battery tech.

$/(kwh useful lifetime) is what will matter in the end and this is initial $ minus rsidual value after automotive life.

There are now more than 2.5M LiCo cells on the road in Tesla vehicles. How many fires? They warranty the car, including battery, for 3 years/36,000 miles and offer a 2 year battery warranty extension option.
NZDavid Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:55 am

OK Statik, holidays over, crunch the numbers on Ford and tell us what it all means.

/Hope the holiday went well for everyone.
john1701a Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 8:58 am

…now even the Japanese are admitting that E-REV is a winner and will be with us a long time. They pushed the dual system rather than the serial system used in voltec.
________________________

Interpret whatever way you want. It still doesn’t change the reality that COST was always the reasoning, not the technology.
statik Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 10:20 am

#83 NZDavid said:

OK Statik, holidays over, crunch the numbers on Ford and tell us what it all means.

/Hope the holiday went well for everyone.
=================================
Holidays are over, sigh. Got back home around 3 AM last night/this morning. (8 hours ago). Everyone had a good time….none more than my son, which is a good thing. I get most of my satisfaction out of watching his happiness.

Enjoying a little tranquility at the moment. (=
—
As for Ford, I actually amused myself reading their earnings pdf on the plane for a bit, lol. It can be found here:
http://www.ford.com/doc/20090424_ir_1q09_financial_results.pdf

The stock had a little ‘dead-cat’ bounce after ‘only’ losing a lower than expected 1.8 billion. Which I guess is fair, relatively speaking, I expected probably 2.5ish myself going into it.

Revenue dropped from 39.2B to 24.8B. Sold 44.4% less cars. Income went from about 500 million in the good to 1.8 (not so good).

But the only thing that means anything right now-cashburn: -3.7 billion. That brings them down to about 21.7ish. They need around a 10 billion float to stay solvent, so that leaves then 11.7 to set on fire. At the current ‘reported’ pace, that makes them GM (circa november 2008) in about 9.5 months.

Side note: Ford actually played some games with the timing of some buyout of debt and other payments. As in they reported they had 21.7 billion…but that was March 31st. The have blown probably 2-3 billion in the 3-4 weeks since then…so Q2 will likely have a larger cash burn than that of Q1. Front loading the next quarter seems to be very popular for companies in this situation.

Anywhoo…good to be back home.
fas Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 1:02 pm

I think GM should sell everything and just retain Chevrolet.
drG Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 6:53 pm

Thanks Red Ink Rick for killing an American icon.

How can he even look himself in the mirror?
jeff j Says:
April 26th, 2009 at 10:08 pm

Owned a Grand Am for 10 years Great car never a problem with it . Thank you to all the folks that produced it . I hope you land on your feet!!! God Bless ya
k-dawg Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 7:04 am

#2 nasaman Says:
Gathering clouds frame GM —terrific graphic, Lyle!
———–
That’s actually a typical day in Michigan.
Tim Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 8:23 am

Lyle said:

“Meanwhile GM will be idling 13 plants up to 9 weeks this summer to save cash and has just received another $2 billion in government funds to continue operations.”

WRONG! I’m getting sick and tired of this LIE!

The CORRECT statement would be:

“Meanwhile GM will be idling 13 plants up to 9 weeks this summer to save cash and has just received another $2 billion in TAXPAYER funds to continue operations.”

The TRUTH is that gov’t has no funds! They can only spend by:

1) borrowing to put taxpayers into debt
2) printing and debasing fiat paper money which causes inflation which is a tax.
3) taking and then redistributing TAXPAYER money with a huge loss in bureaucracy costs.

We, the Taxpayer gov’t slaves ALWAYS pay the bills and NOT “the Gov’t”!
Tony Gray Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 8:29 am

Ah, my family’s record for killing car companies remains intact.

Had two (yeah two) Renault Alliances. No more AMC.
Had a Geo Prizm. Geo Gone (but nobody notices).
Linda has a Saturn Aura XR…Saturn on life support.
Had two Grand Prix and picked up a 66 GTO Tri-power two weeks ago. Pontiac now going, which I think is a huge mistake.
Heartland-Dan Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 9:25 am

Youre kidding me! Get rid of GMC, its the SAME THING as Chevy. Pontiac has fresh, fun ideas for their car lineup and produces great vehicles. HORRIBLE job GM, thats why your going out of business.
David Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 11:17 am

Ironically, the Chrysler 200C concept would be the E-REV produced with American-made batteries (A123)! We the taxpayers saved the banks. Why aren’t the banks helping save Chrysler ??? GEM (A Chrysler subsidiary) actually sells electric NEVs today, and has sold thousands of them. And oh yeah — doesn’t Barack Obama own a 300C?
Bob G Says:
April 27th, 2009 at 3:24 pm

#80 Arthur Says, “… As I Scot I am amazed and saddened by what has happened to so such much of American industry.”

Thank you for that truly fascinating post! As an engineer and an American, I couldn’t agree with you more.
Jim in AR Says:
April 28th, 2009 at 11:13 am

GM keeps eating its young, thinking it will survive. Hopefully, another car company can take over the Volt concept car and actually build it someday.
Nathan Says:
May 1st, 2009 at 1:04 am

Another example of General Motors terrible decision making. Keeping Chevy and GMC they are exactly the SAME!!! Maybe they have to keep GMC because that division makes industrial equipment. But seriously, I mean if you are old enough to consider even buying a Buick or have the 45,000 dollars to do so…make people BUY THE GD CADILLAC. Pontiac was the only thing they had that worked for dual gender demographic, middle aged to youth, and the possibilities were infinite for that brand. That could have been their risk taking venture, classy or stylish and customizable like Scion is for Toyota…too bad. Dumbass GM

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Pontiac Goes, GMC Stays, Chrysler’s on the Gallows Pole

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