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	<title>Comments on: Do MINI E Applications Tell Us Anything About Electric Car Demand?</title>
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	<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/</link>
	<description>Real-time news, information, and discussion about the Chevrolet Volt.</description>
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		<title>By: Larry Towne</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/#comment-143628</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Towne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Sep 2009 00:24:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gm-volt.com/?p=1456#comment-143628</guid>
		<description>supose you were to add a wind powered alternator withsolor cells to recharge, and use 4 motors with two used as generators while cornoring, you may be close to free energy or perpetual motion as you cqn come.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>supose you were to add a wind powered alternator withsolor cells to recharge, and use 4 motors with two used as generators while cornoring, you may be close to free energy or perpetual motion as you cqn come.</p>
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		<title>By: Larry Towne</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/#comment-143626</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Towne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Sep 2009 00:21:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gm-volt.com/?p=1456#comment-143626</guid>
		<description>My thought is that if you use the sun, 4 mototss with two used as generators when turning, and wind through the grill to turn an alternator, you may possibly achieve a vehicle that never needs to be pluged in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My thought is that if you use the sun, 4 mototss with two used as generators when turning, and wind through the grill to turn an alternator, you may possibly achieve a vehicle that never needs to be pluged in.</p>
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		<title>By: crx_rogus</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/#comment-109172</link>
		<dc:creator>crx_rogus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Apr 2009 18:21:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gm-volt.com/?p=1456#comment-109172</guid>
		<description>Re:
#87 says:
&quot;All of the cars that I have owned (foreign and domestic) have started to have major and/or frequent problems around 10 years. I think most of us have had that old car that is banged up, has lots of annoying problems, and seems to be in the shop every few months for $1,000-$2,000 dollars worth of repairs. And then you reallize that for a modest down-payment and a few hundred dollars a month in loan payments, you can eliminate that drain on your time, budget and psyche with a shiny new car. The Volt will be no different–you ditch it once the battery goes and move on just like you would with a ten year old ICE car that suddenly needs a new transmission, engine, or whatever.&quot;

My preferred transport for the past 18 years has been sub-ton &#039;80s Hondas whose only relationship to your comments is the cost of dealing well with rust issues.  I&#039;m saving up for a MkI Insight which I figure can get a PHEV conversion at some point, and in future years get a EREV/BEV conversion since Insights don&#039;t know how to rust and have already often proven as eternally reliable as the mid-80s Hondas I&#039;m used to.  Adding xEVs to America&#039;s Disposable Society&#039;s list of ingredients is not much of an answer to anything IMHO.  Disposable, low resale value cars via low-grade engineering is what brought the American car industry to this point in the first place, and why I switched to Hondas so long ago.  While I understand xEVs are seen by industry as much more like laptop computers than ICE cars regarding reliability and upgrades, IMHO it is vital that an xEV, especially BEV, typically prove as reliable as an old Honda or a good memory chip especially for non-battery components.  There is no reason for this to not be the case.  Mass adoption will be determined by earned reputation.

While you are correct that almost noone keeps a car for more than ten years, and most cars are junked before they see a decade of use, it a car&#039;s ability to keep going well past that decade mark if asked to that is key to market perception of that car.  That is a main reason Toyota eventually starting out-selling GM.

The main concern of most MkI Insight purchasers and would-be purchasers is the battery pack, not the rest of the car.  This is how it must be for vehicles with a more solid-state nature than purely ICE vehicles.  As folks expect compact flash -based hard drives to be more efficient and reliable than spinning-disk hard drives (while costing more), xEVs must earn a reputation for utter, total reliability.

The engineering around battery packs must not be lifetime-limited to match the battery pack.  That will kill the future of xEVs.


Re:
 wwskinn3 Says:
January 7th, 2009 at 3:27 pm

&quot;I’m still waiting for the first wrecked one at the junk yard so I can get the components. Perhaps put it in an old Mustang II.&quot;

NNNNOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!  What a perfect way to keep us tethered to Desert Islam&#039;s oil, if an oversized Pinto is what you want EVs associated with! Uuuurrrrgghhhhhhh!!!!!


Regards,
Roger</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re:<br />
#87 says:<br />
&#8220;All of the cars that I have owned (foreign and domestic) have started to have major and/or frequent problems around 10 years. I think most of us have had that old car that is banged up, has lots of annoying problems, and seems to be in the shop every few months for $1,000-$2,000 dollars worth of repairs. And then you reallize that for a modest down-payment and a few hundred dollars a month in loan payments, you can eliminate that drain on your time, budget and psyche with a shiny new car. The Volt will be no different–you ditch it once the battery goes and move on just like you would with a ten year old ICE car that suddenly needs a new transmission, engine, or whatever.&#8221;</p>
<p>My preferred transport for the past 18 years has been sub-ton &#8217;80s Hondas whose only relationship to your comments is the cost of dealing well with rust issues.  I&#8217;m saving up for a MkI Insight which I figure can get a PHEV conversion at some point, and in future years get a EREV/BEV conversion since Insights don&#8217;t know how to rust and have already often proven as eternally reliable as the mid-80s Hondas I&#8217;m used to.  Adding xEVs to America&#8217;s Disposable Society&#8217;s list of ingredients is not much of an answer to anything IMHO.  Disposable, low resale value cars via low-grade engineering is what brought the American car industry to this point in the first place, and why I switched to Hondas so long ago.  While I understand xEVs are seen by industry as much more like laptop computers than ICE cars regarding reliability and upgrades, IMHO it is vital that an xEV, especially BEV, typically prove as reliable as an old Honda or a good memory chip especially for non-battery components.  There is no reason for this to not be the case.  Mass adoption will be determined by earned reputation.</p>
<p>While you are correct that almost noone keeps a car for more than ten years, and most cars are junked before they see a decade of use, it a car&#8217;s ability to keep going well past that decade mark if asked to that is key to market perception of that car.  That is a main reason Toyota eventually starting out-selling GM.</p>
<p>The main concern of most MkI Insight purchasers and would-be purchasers is the battery pack, not the rest of the car.  This is how it must be for vehicles with a more solid-state nature than purely ICE vehicles.  As folks expect compact flash -based hard drives to be more efficient and reliable than spinning-disk hard drives (while costing more), xEVs must earn a reputation for utter, total reliability.</p>
<p>The engineering around battery packs must not be lifetime-limited to match the battery pack.  That will kill the future of xEVs.</p>
<p>Re:<br />
 wwskinn3 Says:<br />
January 7th, 2009 at 3:27 pm</p>
<p>&#8220;I’m still waiting for the first wrecked one at the junk yard so I can get the components. Perhaps put it in an old Mustang II.&#8221;</p>
<p>NNNNOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!  What a perfect way to keep us tethered to Desert Islam&#8217;s oil, if an oversized Pinto is what you want EVs associated with! Uuuurrrrgghhhhhhh!!!!!</p>
<p>Regards,<br />
Roger</p>
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		<title>By: Darius</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/#comment-89593</link>
		<dc:creator>Darius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Jan 2009 14:42:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gm-volt.com/?p=1456#comment-89593</guid>
		<description>Due to fuel price decrease in my country government took opportunity to increase fuel tax by 0,15 EUR/liter on Christmas. Total fuel price including VAT is around 1 EURO/Liter. Nobody complaining. It is better send cash to own government than to Arabs or Russians. With this price EV is quite attractive. Send Volt to Europe. What for Obama is waiting?

And vice versa - everybody shall know that EV if become real issue will be tool of pressing oil demand and consequently oil prices down. And again - fuel tax in US is absolutely necessary and will help avoiding blackmailing of western world. Free trade is O.K. but only on fair basis.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Due to fuel price decrease in my country government took opportunity to increase fuel tax by 0,15 EUR/liter on Christmas. Total fuel price including VAT is around 1 EURO/Liter. Nobody complaining. It is better send cash to own government than to Arabs or Russians. With this price EV is quite attractive. Send Volt to Europe. What for Obama is waiting?</p>
<p>And vice versa &#8211; everybody shall know that EV if become real issue will be tool of pressing oil demand and consequently oil prices down. And again &#8211; fuel tax in US is absolutely necessary and will help avoiding blackmailing of western world. Free trade is O.K. but only on fair basis.</p>
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		<title>By: Chuanga</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2009/01/07/do-mini-e-applications-tell-us-anything-about-electric-car-demand/#comment-89460</link>
		<dc:creator>Chuanga</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 22:32:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://gm-volt.com/?p=1456#comment-89460</guid>
		<description>Paying $850 per month was the killer.  Who wants to help pay BMW&#039;s R&amp;D costs and not be on the payroll?  As the wise man says, LEASE is just a 5 letter word for RENT.  That comes out to over $10K to RENT this vehicle for 1 year.  I am an ex-Mini Cooper owner and would love to own an electric Mini Cooper.  Bring on the electric Mini Cooper BMW, but please make it affordable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paying $850 per month was the killer.  Who wants to help pay BMW&#8217;s R&amp;D costs and not be on the payroll?  As the wise man says, LEASE is just a 5 letter word for RENT.  That comes out to over $10K to RENT this vehicle for 1 year.  I am an ex-Mini Cooper owner and would love to own an electric Mini Cooper.  Bring on the electric Mini Cooper BMW, but please make it affordable.</p>
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