As it turns out, I live 4 blocks from work and I have two nice bicycles and two “beater” bicycles.

A) Of course not. I have no intention of getting on the waiting list for any car. If GM – or any other car maker – is serious about getting business, they’ll make cars available to people who want them. I’m not on the waiting list for the improved Prius, either. But Toyota is scaling production to 460K/year in ‘09 and again to perhaps 700K/year in ‘10, so availability will not be an issue (moreover, they ship in volume TODAY). Some of the demand for hybrids will be supplied by the ‘09 Honda AntiPrius.

B) I hope to enlist other people to kick GM’s ass the way it needs kicking to save GM. You’ll notice that a major part of GM’s plan for salvation includes tax credits if – oops, WHEN, sorry – the Volt ships and a bailout loan – a big one – in advance of that. Unless they build a good conventional small car at a profit, none of that will happen. And I’m confident that GM will use a giant government backed loan to improve their road dinosaur offerings, rather than get more small cars on the market faster. Look at the Beat fiasco. “Do you want one? Which one? Vote! Oops… sorry… we didn’t design any of those for the US market.” Look at Lutz’ recent statements on the Cruze and Cobalt… “the Cobalt is just now coming into its own…” This is a signal that the Cruze is, at best, on the back burner and the overweight, overpowered, oversized Cobalt will continue to carry the flag for GM.

Luckily, I don’t believe in any concept of “karma.” I believe in embracing reality. And pessimists are rarely disappointed.

I do hope if a government subsidy is given to hybrids that they tie it to mpg. I believe that 40mpg ought to be the baseline. Let’s start getting serious about getting off of oil. A subsidy for a 20mpg Hybrid would be a joke.

I said:
“GM is building this because they don’t know how to build a small car that will sell and can’t be troubled trying.”

#57, Tagamet replied:
“How about the VOLT?”

How about it? Can I buy it? For how much?
Until they offer it in showrooms, in quantity, then we do not know if GM has finally figured out how to build a small car that will sell.
And I should have added “in quantity, for a reasonable price, profitably.” They are, to date, all over none of that.

Dagwood,
Two questions:
Are you on the waiting list?

and

If you believe what you’re saying, why are you wasting your time here?

Be well,
You’re burning a lot of karma on all that pessimism.
Tag

If GM is gearing for the big SUV market, GM is doomed. It might return in a few years but GM won’t last that long. As for Toyota “gearing for the big SUV market,” that’s wishful thinking. Toyota sells 800 Sequoias a month. That’s it. Other Big Toys sell in similarly miniscule numbers. Toyota is 70% cars and 30% trucks. Even after the radical (and probably ongoing) adjustment in the truck market, GM is still 60% trucks and 40% cars.

Sure, Toyota recently introduced a big truck. Capacity is 200K/year and you can bet Toyota will be comfortable with fewer sales than that and Toyota’s flexible manufacturing makes slow Tundra sales less problematic still. But Toyota noticed the American market is irrational about big vehicles and thought they might make some easy money before the crunch… they miscalculated. They’ll shrug it off, for now, and when the truck market returns, they’ll make some money.

GM is building a Volt. Why? Sales in 2011 will be 10K. That’s it. Even if they make money at it (doubtful), that doesn’t provide the revenue they need. GM’s decision making is entirely irrational. They’re likely to tank before this comes out. GM needs products focussed on today, not some Hail Mary play a few years out, which contributes to the bottom line even further out.

GM does not make a small car that the market finds attractive at Corolla and Civic prices. This is GM’s biggest problem. Rather than solving that problem, GM is wasting money on a variety of hybrids that they can’t afford to make and which do not sell. I take that back… the jury’s out on whether or not the Malibu and Aura would sell, as GM builds so few the market is essentially untested. However, they’re sorry pieces of hybrid hardware. GM should have implemented a better, cheaper start-stop system with electric air and called it a day. The Taho and Yukon hybrids are also made in infinitesimal quanties and they do not, in fact, sell. The local dealer has two on the lot for over three months each. Great landing, wrong airport.

GM has only recently introduced a compettiive automatic transmission for their 4-cylinder. It debuted on teh Malibu for $27K. That’s a value-oriented piece of hardware in an excessively upscale car. People looking at the base Malibu are still getting turned off by the non-competitive transmission. This is a habit with GM. Base cars get uncompetitve transmissions.

The Cobalt stick recently got an XFE treatment. Great. But some 10% of Cobalts ship with a stick. Fuel economy of the auto Cobalt, the one most people buy, is still wretched.

The less said about the Aveo, the better.

Even in good times, fuel economy is important. GM has never worried about that. This hurts small car sales.

The Vue is 500lbs heavier than a Rav4. No extra cargo room or tow capacity. Many GM cars are like that. The Vue two-mode will be heavier still, very expensive and will probably sell somewhat better than the Tahoe/Yukon IF GM can afford to build it.

Many of the improvements in the Tahoe/Yukon hybrids have nothing to do with the hybrid drivetrain. They could be extended to a plain-jane drivetrain. Why doesnt’ GM do that? Probably to make the 200 unit/month hybrids look good. That’s pointless.

The fact of the matter is, across the board, GM is ceding large chunks of market to Toyota and Honda by failing to put a little bit of effort into their current vehicles. And, they distract us with “The Volt.”

What Volt? It’s not here and, until it gets here, en masse, it’s meaningless. I’m having a really hard time getting excited about a battery-electric drivetrain in a Chevy when one has been available in a Toyota since 1997. And, when it gets here, 99% of the GM’s product will still be mediocre to substandard conventional drivetrain vehicles. That 1% will save GM? I don’t think so.

If you want to save GM, take a big drink of reality, look at the cold, hard facts of the Volt and kick GM’s ass to get a better Cobalt and Aveo on the street.

Couldn’t agree with you more, I posted a while back that they are really closet GM lovers, but can’t bear to admit to being Americans proud of an American product.. I have a 72 silverado, 84 camero, 96 lumina APV (all 12+ years) I do not see the Japanese cars lasting that long, Mine are beautiful, well maintained, and all original bodies. Most 10+ year old japanese cars are rolling rusted out hulks. but I admit the engine runs well.. My father in law has a 71 chev station wagon with its ORIGINAL exhaust system…

GO AMERICA>>

For a majority of the Toyota lovers, the fact that you can not BUY a Volt this instant is all that matters. Apparently, since we can’t buy it now, then GM should just quit. I know the argument is silly, but consider the source.

They are here mostly to keep tabs on the Volt development and make sure those of us that support GM realize that GM has made mistakes in the past. I think we all know that already.

The problem they have is that the Volt will look better, and run circles around the Prius in most areas of concern and technology. All they have to come back with are the pricing issues, and to keep reinforcing the old GM legacy to scare people away.

The fact that GM quality is vastly improved, my own personal experience also is that they are top notch for 200,000 miles or more, they are getting their union house in order, and that the Volt is coming along strong, is a big worry.

Why they are here posting is interesting, though. I, myself, have no interest whatsoever to visit a Toyota site or discuss things in that venue. Just don’t care enough about them. Apparently, they do care about GM for some reason to be here. I think they’re worried about the Volt and how America is going to accept it.

pause..take a breath.. GM and many others (including Toyota) are gearing for the big SUV market. This DRAMATIC shift in consumer interest was totally unexpected by ALL. GM didn’t decide last wednesday over lunch to conceive, design, research, market and manufacture this vehicle..it has been in the pipes for at least 2 if not 3 YEARS (Average devellopment time for a new vehicle) All that money spent,they needed to launch it regardless to recoup. same as Tundra, Sequoia, Berrago (sp? the Kia 8 pass SUV)

Pepople like you are on a GM fan site more as trolls than fans..the fact the the VOLT will likely see the light of day in 3 years is AMAZING, the shift of a company like GM is HUGE, I look and your posting are like 90% negative about GM…the fact that the general is building a super luxery full size SUV that is as good inthe mileage dept as an accord or Camry is not impressive enough to you, never mind that GM full size vehicles are genereally better in the MPG arena than most if not all foreign manufacturers. If they can do it to a full size SUV, imagine the technology applied to lighter smaller vehicles. ( Before you b**ch about why they didn’t start there, remember 3 years Ago SUV’s were huge market place they dominated, they put where they thought best at that time..it’ll get there..)

Other folks like you, mr (s?) joe obrien, crow et al will never be satisfied with positive moves like this one, or see anything positive in anything else they do…do you even own a GM product? I do (3 right now and a Ford) I have driven all kinds (interated all over this forum) and I find the Japanese no better than the domestics, personal observation.

Be positive, its harder, than being pessimistic, but better for your health too..

Peace.

Mitch

#57, Tagamet replied:
“How about the VOLT?”

How about it? Can I buy it? For how much?

Until they offer it in showrooms, in quantity, then we do not know if GM has finally figured out how to build a small car that will sell.

And I should have added “in quantity, for a reasonable price, profitably.” They are, to date, all over none of that.