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GM States the Volt Will Arrive in Europe in 2011 Under Opel/Vauxhall Brand

August 6th, 2008 | Posted in: Brand, E-REV, Opel

Carl-Peter Forster is GMs European president. He wrote a blog post about the Volt , inspired by all the media interest he witnessed at the London Motor Show.

He wrote how the US will get the Volt in late 2010 assuming "we will continue to attain all of our goals and milestones for the battery and integration of the power electronics."

He then confirmed Europe will get the EREV one year later, or late 2011.

Then he finally clarified under which brand it will appear. Since GMs goal is to get the technology into a high volume brand, for Europe is will make its appearance as an Opel/Vauxhall and will "be derived directly from the Chevrolet Volt to get into the market quickly". He then adds that Chevrolet will get the car there several months later.

He assures the European market that "more variations for Opel-specific designs of EREVs are already in the works," but gave no clues about them.

He added that European production capability for EREVs will be essential, and continued to support the idea of consumer government incentives and a super CO2 credit for GM for these vehicles which would increase GMs average CO2 credit for its entire fleet for a smaller volume of EREVs.

Source (Driving Conversations )

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Posted by: Lyle

79 Responses to “GM States the Volt Will Arrive in Europe in 2011 Under Opel/Vauxhall Brand”

Rashiid Amul Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:06 am

Jean Charles will be happy to hear this.
Cab Driver Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:25 am

Lyle,

You might want to change the “sates” in the headline to “states” or “says”.
Exp_EngTech Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:25 am

Does anyone know if there are plans to “E-Flex” the reborn Opel GT ?

That would be interesting.

http://wiki.gmnext.com/wiki/index.php/Opel_GT
NuclearBoy Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:39 am

GM continues to make more and more promises about E-Flex delivery. In reading accross many comments on many other sites, there is still a large number of people who doubt GM will deliver anything at all. Comments like “if they don’t go under”, “this is all just marketing spin to make them look green”, or “these guys can’t be trusted, they killed the EV1″.

Given the promises GM is making, it is highly unlikely that all of this is just a smoke screen. E-Flex is coming and GM’s image will be helped by all of this. Lets hope the first batch of vehicles are reliable and get good reviews.
Nissan Power Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:39 am

Nissan shows off new ELECTRIC cars !

http://www.salon.com/wires/ap/business/2008/08/06/D92COB080_japan_nissan/index.html
jan Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:45 am

Mr Forester summed it all up very nicely. I can’t imagine GM not getting financing now. Even the battery issue may be closer to resolution than we know. I may be a bit optimistic but everything seems to be falling into place. Even the high gasoline prices that tortures SUV/truck sales can be seen as a positive in the long run for the Volt. Yes the Volt is a game changer in more ways than one.
GM Begging Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:50 am

GM, Ford and Chrysler are begging Congress for $40 billion in cheap loans. This is pathetic.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080805/COL06/808050401
Gsned57 Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:59 am

“be derived directly from the Chevrolet Volt to get into the market quickly”

How come Europe get’s copies of our cars so quickly, but when we want smaller European sized cars it’ll take 3 to 5 years? I know I know crash test standards.

Glad to see they have at least a bit of the “Get this thing to market ASAP” mentality.
Joe Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 7:02 am

Glad to see GM spreading the Volt technology world wide. This is the car that will save GM!! GM makes a lot of great cars but consumers are not buying like they should, for whatever reason, but the Volt will get their attention into the showrooms.
Go GM….Go GM!!!
THOM Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 7:06 am

“He wrote how the US will get the Volt in late 2010 assuming “we will continue to attain all of our goals and milestones for the battery and integration of the power electronics.”"

Nice disclaimer!
jan Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 7:27 am

A fast ramp-up of batteries and EREV’s would be in everyones best interest. I think that older tech vehicles will be hard to sell once the change-over begins. Much like the sale of trucks today. But maybe plunging gasoline prices will occur or some other scenario. What’s a car company to do??? Chaos and market forces testing our convictions and resolve.
o.jeff Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 7:40 am

Reminder: CNBC will show “Saving General Motors” tonight (Aug 6) at 9:00 p.m. eastern.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 7:47 am

#10 THOM

I thought the same thing…although I think you are selling your quote short, lol. Lots more ifs and maybes out there.

“The “CURRENT” plans are to have the Chevrolet Volt ready for initial production in late 2010 for the U.S. market. This “ASSUMES” that we will continue to attain all of our goals and milestones for the battery and integration of the power electronics. “ASSUMING” we make the target in the U.S., “THE PLAN” is to have the first EREV vehicles for sale in Europe about one year later, which is late in 2011″

/comforting indeed

You’d think Carl-Peter Forster cut his teeth in the legal departmart in BMW back in the day. I checked…no such luck. He actually has a diploma in Aviation and Space Technology from Munich Technical University (and a economics degree too)…which sounds made up to me, everyone knows human beings have never gone/been into space.
Jason M. Hendler Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 8:17 am

The US Dept. of Treasury should issue “Green Bonds” to raise the capital needed to offer the $35 - $40 billion in loans our big 3 automakers require. In that way, no budget cuts would be needed to offset the money used to support our auto industry.

Take note, the big 3 automakers are not asking for grants or subsidies, they are simply asking for loans, which they will pay back with interest.
NZDavid Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 8:20 am

So 2012 looks good for NZ. Finally. That’s still FOUR years away. Don’t think my current wagon will last that long.

/must lie down now.
Jeff J Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 8:22 am

Good news to all my friends in Kaiserslautern Germany. I talked to a friend in Munich she is paying 85 euro or $113 a fill up for her car, The e-flex system will be hot item in europa .
bbm Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 8:40 am

Anyone know if GM is looking at any EREV minivans? Seems like a good application of the technology. Plenty of room for batteries.
Gsned57 Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:02 am

17 bbm, I’m with you. Minivans are more apt for this then SUV’s because they can be built off of a cars frame and don’t need to be designed for offroading that will never happen. The main issue I would see with a minivan is drag. Probably drop the 40 mile EV range to 30 or so, but like you said more room for batteries. Assuming the volt takes off and they are making at least a modest profit on it I can’t imagine it being too long (5 years or so) before they have an eflex in every style auto.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:04 am

#16 Jeff J

“Good news to all my friends in Kaiserslautern Germany. I talked to a friend in Munich she is paying 85 euro or $113 a fill up for her car, The e-flex system will be hot item in europa .”

Speaking about costs…I didn’t notice Mr. Carl-Peter Forster mentioning the price.

Despite being shocked that “the vast majority of questions (being) centered on when the Chevrolet Volt range-extended electric vehicle would come to Europe,” it is amazing how this question kept coming up…and no one ever asked about the price, one would think that question would be asked pretty much the same amount…and at the same time. That London press sure is inept.

Hrm…or maybe he just selectively chose not to blog on about that on the GM WEBSITE. No way…he wouldn’t do that.

Lets look around the net a bit.

“Despite Carl-Peter Forster’s recent assertion that Euro Volts would be built in America and shipped overseas, GM’s European leader is now claiming that Europe may get its own plant….GM execs also indicate that the surcharge for the Volt in Europe could be around £20,000 over the similarly-sized Astra. ”

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/07/24/vauxhalls-ellesmere-port-plant-could-get-volt-production-in-eur/

Seeing how the Astra sells around £12,000, it would seem he is saying with the £20,000 surcharge, the Volt would be around £32,000…or 60K USD for the Volt.

http://images.despair.com/banners/mugs/pessimistsbanner.jpg
Larry R Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:04 am

Reply to GM begging.

This is USA that you live in.
Be a American and Buy American.
Are you a American?
I doubt it.
I will bet you are a fag that reads Consumer Reports
and drives a KIA !
If the US auto industry needs a loan to retool for plug ins
then lend them the money!
Its good jobs and retirement for AMERICANS.
Pull your head out of your dupka.
This country is in trouble and attitudes like yours
are not helping out!
biodieseiljeep Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:18 am

Loans with interest? You watch them get 1/2 prime on these loans.

But I’m not a mean guy, we NEED these companies to survive. If the collapse…what would America actually be MAKING anymore?

Well, I guess we still make movies and politicians.
Spin Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:21 am

I am not against low interest loans for the big 3 as long as they spend it developing hybrids and other fuel efficient vehicles.
mitch Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:21 am

You know…I laugh..

“they killed the EV1..” “they made bad decisions..” they can’t make a good car ad hoc ad naseum…

Look at history…

GM has built no fewer than 5 electric models since 1905..they were not populart, not economical, whatever, the EV1 was not the only one..maybe Big oil is to blame not GM..how bout the gubermint? was it killed yes, by GM? partly..quit yer bit**in..the time is right, and it is coming.. (the volt is a LOT nicer than the EV1 even though the range is smaller (right now!))

Wrong products..GM built a HUGE fleet of 4 bangers in the 70’s..and lost a mint, no one wanted them..gimme 8’s, through out history..GM has been great, often ahead of their time, and eaten their SHIRTS for it…the idea that big is better was driven by the american PUBLIC…once bitten twice shy…

I have owned or driven every manufacturer out there. (we rent a lot in my occupation), are the foreign cars better? IMO not really..the last Camry I had was a piece of turtle dung, the Honda was interesting..lock out the power windows and even the DRIVER can’t use them without unlocking all of them…say what?!?

Fit and finish…all equal (please note we do not rent BMW’s jags etc..mid and full size sedans.)

Japanese radios suck IMO, too tinny…and don’t quote the “consumers reports” dogma…any “unbiased” reporting that gives a “recommend” rating based on the name of the manufacturer IS biased.

Longevity..I have had no fewer than 6 GM’s all over 250,000 miles (400,000 km, I live in Canada and used to drive coast to coast A LOT)
Currently have 2 chevy’s a 96 lumina APV 224,813 and a blazer 296,745 (km.) both run flawlessly, and I have no plans to replace them..actually looking at adding a 93 s10..only has 112,000 on it..IMO good for at least another 112…

GM has, does, and always will build great vehicles…

this is a fan site for a gm product so if Nissan boy, and GM slammer, Toyato a$$kisser are here, I assume you are keeping up appearances, but a closet lovers of GM..come out of the closet admit you are american and love an american car…don’t be a woos..we will accept you here…(BTW its not that I think foreign cars are not as good, in some cases even better, but on the average, I think the “storry telling” (not journalism) that is spewed by auto reviewers is taken as gospel WAY too oftenn..can you say BAAAA (c’mon every one..like a sheep…a lot of people do…heaven forbid people think..)

Enough ranting…bad nights sleep, easily P.O’ed..

going for a joe.

Have a nice day…
paddyk Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:35 am

GM, Ford Should Receive $25 BILLION in Plant Aid, Dingell Says

——————————————————————————–

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aviz2sm08FDg&refer=home

The loans were authorized in last year’s energy bill, and rules to free up the funding are supposed to be written within a year of its December passage, Representative John Dingell said yesterday in a letter to U.S. Department of Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman.

—————————————————————-
Detroit 3 ask up to $40 billion in loans

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080805/COL06/808050401/1014/BUSINESS01

Detroit’s three automakers are urging Congress to make as much as $35 billion to $40 billion in low-cost loans available during the next two to three years to assure that the companies survive long enough to retool and build a new generation of fuel-efficient vehicles.

——————————————————————————–

for those so inclined, here is the letter that Congessman Dingel wrote to Sec. Bodman:

http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_110/110-ltr.080408.DOE.EnergyIndSecAct.pdf

Perhaps a campaign to support the Congressman’s efforts may help:

Written correspondence and phoning is particularly effective. Calls to Secretary of Energy Samuel. W. Bodman (phone: 202/586-6210 or 1-800-342-5363), by law, must be logged and returned or answered. There is no such requirement for e-mail or letters.
Jarn Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:35 am

For those people thinking about mini vans (bbm & Gsned57):
Opel Flextream:
http://www.autoblog.com/2007/09/07/frankfurt-preview-opel-flextreme-concept-leaks-onto-the-web/

Cadillac Provoq
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/08/ces-2008-cadillac-provoq-fuel-cell-concept-revealed/
NuclearBoy Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:42 am

#23
You are correct. Many in this country simply dislike GM and don’t think they could make a good car if their life depended on it. Listening to many in this country, you would think that ALL GM products are death traps that last for 3 years and that Toyotos last forever.

The reality is that GM vehicles are very good. Initial quality on the last 3 I have bought new was outstanding and the reliablity has been good.

Many have written GM off for good which is a shame. These same people would lament the loss of jobs if GM folded up. GM appears to have come back from some low points in the late 70s early 80s. People should give them a second look.

I can remember well when Japanese products were junk. They improved to be state of the art during the 70s and 80s. Things change.

GM has been changing.
Me Here Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:43 am

Larry R (err Chewvak) #20, I read consumer reports, I even paid to view their website before I bought my snowblower, does that make me a homosexual?

Your childish comments are not welcome here …

p.s. I am AN American, check your gramer err grammar
Datsun Electric Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 9:52 am

Here is a picture of Nissan’s new electric prototype:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=080806085901.thpknii3&show_article=1&image=large

looks kinda boxy to me.
Estero Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:00 am

This is good news!

With GM spreading the Volt technology world wide, I can only wonder how this translates into selecting a battery pack supplier(s). Is it possible GM will select Company A to supply battery packs for E-REV vehicles in the U.S. and Company B to supply battery packs E-REV vehicles in Europe. If so, GM could have an alternative source of supply should the battery pack from either company fail for any reason.
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:01 am

Tough room today….

I’ve decided to have my family physician place me in a chemically induced coma (kinda like the 60’s) until late 2009. I think I can handle the wait from there (and, of course, I wouldn’t want to miss an early VOLT release).
If I don’t post for a while, you know where I am.
Be well,
Tag
PS Before I “go”, can someone tell me how to put a pic in that icon? TIA.
RB Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:10 am

#30 Tag

My understanding is that to put a pic in the icon you go to
gravatar.com
and follow the instructions there. Essentially you have to sign up
with your email address and select a picture, or upload one, or something.

That said, you can see that I haven’t done it myself, so there is some uncertainty here
George K Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:13 am

#8 Gsned57
“Glad to see they have at least a bit of the “Get this thing to market ASAP” mentality.”

You couldn’t be more right! I believe GM’s future is E-Flex. Plus the Opel concept car looks pretty darn cool. I hope it isn’t changed much for aerodynamics.

http://gm-volt.com/opel-flextreme-gallery/#nogo
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:13 am

RB,
Thanks for the instructions! I’d checked that site and thought I was in the wrong place (not uncommon for me). I’ll check it again.
Be well,
Tag
Estero Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:15 am

#7 GM Begging

I don’t see this as either begging or pathetic. Think about it; low interest loans are a whole lot more attractive than the alternative of possibly seeing GM, Ford and Chrysler go belly-up!

I’ve said it before and say it again. One of the top priorities of this country should be the rebuilding of the U.S. manufacturing base. That translates into jobs, jobs and more jobs!

Another top priority of our country should be to free ourselves from the dependency on foreign oil, especially from those countries that wish us nothing but harm. The Volt and other E-REV vehicles is a step in that direction.

JMHO
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:16 am

George K,
Yep, I love the concept Opel. The interior shot also has what COULD be a battery running down the middle…..
Be well,
Tag
George K Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:19 am

#31 RB
#33 Tagamet
“That said, you can see that I haven’t done it myself, so there is some uncertainty here ”

I saw that nasaman did it, so I figure it’s pretty safe. Also, I;m sure Lyle checked it out as well.
DonC Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:27 am

#19 Statik - “Seeing how the Astra sells around £12,000, it would seem he is saying with the £20,000 surcharge, the Volt would be around £32,000…or 60K USD for the Volt.”

That is somewhat misleading because everything in the UK is more or less double what it is in the US. Eating out, taxi rides, hotels, pretty much everything looks like the prices in the US — except the prices are in pounds not dollars. At 1:1 the prices seem about right, maybe even a bit inexpensive. At 2:1 the prices induce heart attacks.

#23 Mitch

Politically there is a lot of anger at GM and the other US manufacturers because of how hard they fought the CAFE standards. They won that fight but burned some bridges, and now it turns out they made the oil problem worse.

On the quality front, yes the US manufacturers and GM have closed the quality gap, and for any one year they can claim the differences are statistically insignificant. But they come out below Toyota and Honda every year which makes the differences significant. No doubt however that the e-flex system is a great piece of technology.
rvd Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:34 am

to volt’s fanboys: wait until you see the sticker price. I suggest you start piling up Prozac now
ThombDbhomb Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:39 am

#38 rvd
Do you know something that we don’t know? The prevailing opinion here says price will be high initially, then go down as economies of scale are realized. We’ll be shocked if the price is initially low, but we won’t need Prozac.
RB Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:47 am

Tag Nice picture now, in place of the blank.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:48 am

Just watching CNBC at the moment.

CNBC is running a rogue spot on the Volt..showing the first test drive in the mule (exclusive) and a bunch of other stuff…RIGHT NOW.

Well after the commercial..you got about 2 minutes, lol.
Bernie Torbik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:57 am

#14 - “… Take note, the big 3 automakers are not asking for grants or subsidies, they are simply asking for loans, which they will pay back with interest. …”

Apart from the fact that government support of any automaker is a poor idea, none of the “big 3″ automakers has the financial capacity to repay more debt. Ford mortgaged its future by taking out loans on its worldwide production facilities, Chrysler is on death’s doorstep, and GM is right behind them.

Loans to the auto industry are just as bad an idea as bailing out subprime homeowners. In the end, you and I - the taxpayers - will be footing the bill.
DonC Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:58 am

#38 rvd - “wait until you see the sticker price. I suggest you start piling up Prozac now”

The salient point would be running costs. The difference between 150,000 miles in a Volt using electric mode and in an ICE car getting 20 mpg would be well over $30,000. And that assumes oil prices don’t go up, which is not a very good assumption after 2009.

Even if you had to pay $15,000 up front to get $30,000 on the back end you’d have a guaranteed return consistent with what you’d get from stocks. Not too shabby.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 10:59 am

Tag, you have the picture up now. (it does take about a hour to show after you do it).

However, you probably have not been seeing it. If you are using IE7 or something, you’ll proably have to clear your cache to see it.

You know the drill. “Tools”, “Interenet Settings”, “delete” etc.
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:00 am

Missed the Volt “spot”.
Rats.
Tag
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:03 am

#41 Statik (Me)

“CNBC is running a rogue spot on the Volt..showing the first test drive in the mule (exclusive) and a bunch of other stuff…RIGHT NOW. Well after the commercial..you got about 2 minutes, lol.”

Well, you totally missed it…they even showed the new body design in the segment, it wasn’t too bad at all…I might still buy one for $45K. There should probably be some screencaps showing up soon, I’ll try to find some and post.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:05 am

#46 Statik (Me)

“Well, you totally missed it…they even showed the new body design in the segment, it wasn’t too bad at all…I might still buy one for $45K. There should probably be some screencaps showing up soon, I’ll try to find some and post.”

Yeah, I totally lied there. It was just video of the mule bombing around.
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:12 am

Statik@44
Yeah, I’d gone in and manually cleared everything. Thanks for the advice though.
Was the mule a Malibu? What’d they SAY about it? (I know, I know, you don’t believe it, but what’d they SAY)?
Be well,
Tag
Rudy Z Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:20 am

Exacept that the European version will be the 2 door hatchback that I want in the US….
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:25 am

#48 Tagamet

“Was the mule a Malibu? What’d they SAY about it? (I know, I know, you don’t believe it, but what’d they SAY)?”

Only thing they said for sure is that they would under no circumstances sell to anyone who lives, or has lived in Pennsylvania.

The mule was a last gen Malibu. It showed Bob hopping in the car and turning the ignition. It also had a camera inside the car to catch all of his experience…it is too bad he swears so much or we could have had audio with the clip to see how noisy it is.

The car is actually very quiet (no shocker). Look like he just made a lap, then got on with the press junket.

It also has some footage from ‘inside the compound,’ shows a couple LG batteries on the bench and some tech gizmoes that I’m sure others would know what they are, flux capacitors and whatnot. There was also a brief clip of interior renderings…but only images of sketches and rudimentary drawings.
DonC Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:34 am

#42 Bernie -”Loans to the auto industry are just as bad an idea as bailing out subprime homeowners. In the end, you and I - the taxpayers - will be footing the bill.”

Interesting that you mention subprime homeowners — who get minimal help in absolute dollars — but don’t mention Fannie and Freddie stockholders who get a monstrous bailout. The loan guarantees for them are completely open ended and way way way more than 40 billion.

As for loans to the auto industry, we’re spending at least $12B a month in Iraq alone to protect oil supplies so you can fill up your car at a gas station. (More than one trillion since the war’s inception). Loans for $40B seems like a very small price to pay for not having to be there. Better for young people to be employed in factories making Volts than coming back in body bags or with missing limbs or with head injuries. There is a cost for caring for them, or are you suggesting we just thank them for their service and let them fend for themselves?

The “poor taxpayer” routine seems overdone. Some are making sacrifices that far outweigh the few bucks we pay in taxes.
Estero Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:39 am

Shucks! I went to register with http://www.gravatar.com and upload my picture but found my nickname (Estero) has already beem registered by someone else at http://www.wordpress.com. Does anyone know if there is a ‘work around’ for this?

Lyle, any suggestions?
Cautious Fan Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:48 am

I’m definitely opposed to loans to the automakers. If the free market won’t loan them money due to the risk, why should the gov’t. When all the airlines went into bankruptcy a few years back, the gov’t gave them some loans. That just dragged out the pain and makes taxpayers foot the bill. The airlines went into chapter 11 anyways, but came back stronger. Same with all the internet companies in the late 90’s. Thank goodness most went bankrupt. They weren’t financially viable. If 1 of the big 3 were to go away, the U.S. would be fine, it’s not a national security issue. The market share would largely be picked up by the other 2. A few decades ago we had the big steel companies. A bunch went belly up. America was fine.

The Volt is such a good idea, I think even if GM went into chapter 11, they’d still develop it. Most of the development costs would already be covered.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:50 am

Remember, that old discussion we had about the i-Miev, and how their plant could only put out 2,000 batteries for the 2009 release?

Times change.

“… the two companies (Mitsu/Yuasa) have quintupled planned output before a single battery has even been manufactured. Mitsubishi is expecting high demand for its upcoming i-MiEV electric car…”

“At the outset, the plant will cost about 4 billion yen ($36.94 million) and be able to produce enough packs for 10,000 EV’s. By 2012, an additional 10 billion yen ($92 million or so) will have been spent to double that capacity. In order to make room for a plant this large, Yuasa is said to be searching for a new site in Japan.”

I’d wager they will increase the planned ‘next phase’ capacity for 2012 as well too, if they are pumping 09 production by 500%.

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/08/06/mitsubishi-yuasa-quintuple-lithium-ion-production-before-it-eve/

Mitsu is going to be out a year early and with 500% additional units. Can you imagine the pure pandemonium in here if GM made announcements like this?
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:55 am

#52 Estero

“Shucks! I went to register with http://www.gravatar.com and upload my picture but found my nickname (Estero) has already beem registered by someone else at http://www.wordpress.com. Does anyone know if there is a ‘work around’ for this?

Lyle, any suggestions?”

I don’t think your ‘id’ is really a big deal…the only person who sees it is you. Strictly for ’site’ purposes…and there is really nothing else on the site, lol.

The icon is tied to your email address directly…nothing to do with your handle. You don’t even have to remember it to log in later, it only needs your email addy and site password to access/update it.

I wouldn’t worry about it…I couldn’t get Statik myself, just make something up…like, ’statikfanboy27′, ’statikiscool’ or ’statikisaegomanic’
jan Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 11:56 am

#52 Estero
I see your default gravatar. So you must be registered now.
Estero Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:06 pm

#53 Cautious Fan said “A few decades ago we had the big steel companies. A bunch went belly up. America was fine.”

Oh really? Where do we get our steel today? The last time I checked it was mostly from imports. Take a look at the following and explain how this has NOT had a tremendous effect upon our balance of payments.

US imports of steel rose to 2.8 million tonnes in April, 16% up on March, and 4.6% up on April 2007. Imports of semi-finished steel, mostly slabs, jumped by 65% to 674 thousand tonnes, with imports of hot rolled coil up by 39% to 346 thousand tonnes. Welded tube imports actually fell slightly to 434 thousand tonnes. The semis mostly came from 5 countries: Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Ukraine and Russia. Canada was also the largest supplier of hot rolled coil with South Korea and the Netherlands in second and third place.
Jackson Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:17 pm

Jan (#11):

In the extremely unlikely event of having the bottom fall out of the price of gas by 2010, I strongly suspect that once the driving public feels that instant torque from 0 mph to highway speed, they won’t want to go back.

They would probably have to run public service announcements, though:
(To the tune of “Rub it in, rub it in”):

Plug it in, plug it in …

Estero (#52):

I ran into that too, but realized that this is only the nickname used at Gravatar. The icon will still match up to what you call yourself of a blog.

Yes, I got a gravatar. It does make it easier when you scroll down through the replies. It also goes back in time to comments you already made, which explains why I now have a pic above my initial “bah humbug” declarations.
Estero Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:19 pm

Thanks Statik and others! I took your suggestions and tried again.

It appeared when I first tried to register with http://www.gavatar.com that the Primary Key to their User Database was USERNAME (NICKNAME). If it is EMAIL ADDESS as you suggest, all should be fine. We’ll see what happens in an hour or so. Thanks again!
ThombDbhomb Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:20 pm

From one perspective, it is a business-eat-business world and capitalism should run its course. From another perspective, businesses are an extension of a state and that state, for its own well being, needs to help the business compete. Sometimes, throwing money at a failing business isn’t a good idea. Sometimes it is. The Big 3’s busnesses may not be equally viable, even if they got low-interest government loans. I’m not sufficiently informed to judge whether or not low-interest loans would do much long-term good in each individual case. I hope smart people study the matter and make sound business decisions (i.e., not political decisions) to support automakers that didn’t, in hindsight, make good business decisions.

Also, I hope people on this blog see the shades of gray* and nuances. If they do, we can get beyond the basic declarations of “yes” or “no” to government help. It would be more interesting to discuss the matter on a higher level.

*By “shades of gray,” I don’t mean Statik’s dark clouds, which can bring nuturing rain.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:39 pm

#57 Estero

“US imports of steel rose to 2.8 million tonnes in April, 16% up on March, and 4.6% up on April 2007″

“The semis mostly came from 5 countries: Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Ukraine and Russia. Canada was also the largest supplier of hot rolled coil with South Korea and the Netherlands in second and third place.”

Oh yeah, we got all your sweet, sweet natural resouces right here in Canada, lol.
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

#59 Estero

Your good. Avatar is up. As I mentioned before, if you can’t see it yet…clear your cache.
Lurtz Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:51 pm

There’s a reason why people say “American cars are horrible!11!!” and those who say “American cars Roool!!!!1!!1″ and they both can be right.

American car manufacturers do raw-horsepower sports cars, large cars, and trucks well. My wife’s father pushed her to get a Ford for her first car because he always bought Fords (Crown Vic and Lincolns) and they worked great. She bought a used Ford Escort which failed in many frustratingly expensive ways. Her next car was a used Honda, which other than gas, tires and oil, is still running strong after 11 years. The experience resulted in her refusing to have anything to do with Ford to this day, even to rent one when we’re on vacation.

I bought a crappy used 1980 Honda Civic. Everything fell off that wasn’t necessary to get it moving. But it never ever quit. I once left it for four months without turning the engine on. A college roommate was with me when I returned, and he was saying “The gas is old, the battery will be dead, it’ll never start.” I put in the key: Vroom. A few months later his father helped him buy a car to take across the country to college, and his father encouraged him to a get a Pontiac 1000. That car didn’t even make it out of the state! My roommate said ‘You know what? Forget this. I want a Honda like Lurtz has.’ He got his money back and bought an old Honda.

Repeat those experiences for every person I knew in my generation. Our parents swore by American car reliability, because they were driving the large, well-engineered cars or trucks. We teenagers swore AT American car reliability, because those of us who bought the American compacts found them to be complete garbage. Those of us who bought used Japanese compacts at the same price found them to run forever. Twenty years later, we’re financially secure enough to buy the more expensive family cars, sports cars, and SUVs – and if someone suggests an American model we think they’re nuts. “American cars suck!”

American car companies do large cars, raw-horsepower sports cars, and trucks really well. Those are what American car companies put all their time and development into. They choose not to compete at the “bottom end” compact market. And in their defense, there’s not a lot of profit competing with a Toyota Yaris or Honda Fit. But they’ve lost a large part of my generation because the cars we bought when we were young were a horrible first impression.
Bernie Torbik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 12:57 pm

#52 - DonC:

My apologies for excluding the FRE, FNM and Wall Street morons when expressing my ire at the taxpayer having to foot the subprime bill. I hope that the value of their stocks drop to zero, as that’s about what they’re worth, when you factor in Tier 3 debt, etc.

I won’t argue your Iraq comments, other than to say the US imports comparatively little oil from there. Most, in fact, comes from the Western Hemisphere or Africa. My larger concern is that our oil addiction (one of the few things I agree with W on) has been fed by Detroit’s foisting gas-guzzling monstronsities on the public for the past half century. Instead of applying the lessons learned from the first two oil crises in 1973-74 and 1979-80, Detroit dreamt up newer, more capacious ways for Billie Bob and his ilk to ride around in pickups, SUVs, minivans and larger V8s while paying scant attention to fuel efficiency.

For these reasons, and their obvious inability to repay, I think offering loans, grants or financial assistance of any sort to Detroit is a terrible idea. While not advocating it, assistance to Japanese firms makes more financial sense, if tied to job creation in the U.S.. At least they won’t be going broke anytime soon.
DonC Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 1:09 pm

#53 Cautious Fan

You have some good points but this is an unusual situation. We have a crisis on our hands. We absolutely have to end our dependency on oil, both for national security, economic, and possibly environmental reasons.

Free markets work great but in this case they won’t get us to where we need to go in the time we have to get there. Incentives and loan guarantees won’t replace the market, they’ll just point it in the right direction and speed up the natural process.

With the Volt, GM has the best technology for effecting oil demand destruction and the best chance for wide scale deployment of that technology. Given this, a limited amount of government help ensuring that this technology is deployed on a timely basis is a good rather than a bad idea.
DonC Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 1:18 pm

#64 Bernie

I agree with you completely with respect to the US auto manufacturers. They did the country a horrible disservice by fighting the CAFE standards so strongly. The unholy alliance between the liberal Carl Levin and the oil lobbyists was not one of our finer moments.

That said, given where we are, and where we need to get to, the loan guarantees for factory retooling that will produce cars which effect oil demand destruction seems a small price to pay. Claw back provisions or whatever, much like those in the housing bill, are fine with me. Let’s just get this process moving.

BTW, somewhat off topic, I see that Iraq is making so much money from oil sales that they have a huge budget surplus, leaving us to borrow money to build their infrastructure. Talk about our government at work!
DaveP Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 1:52 pm

#61 Statik:
“Oh yeah, we got all your sweet, sweet natural resouces right here in Canada, lol.”

I just want the Canadian Tylenol with the codeine in it.
Jackson Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 1:56 pm

Lurtz (#63):

That ought to be inscribed on a brass plate and affixed to GM headquarters. Or, at the GM museum, if they fail to read it.

Bravo.
Bernie Torbik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 2:02 pm

#66 - DonC:

I think we’re in agreement on Iraq. The biggest favor the gubment could do for Detroit, and the American people, is to progressively raise the floor price of a barrel of oil so that the real constant dollar price of petrol/diesel steadily rises.

To offset the increase, cut income taxes, starting with the AMT and marriage penalty, The tax reduction would cushion the impact of higher gas prices, and low and behold, the market would work! People would seek out more efficient vehicles, and if Billie Bob still had to have a gas guzzler, he could pay accordingly for the cost of “securing the Middle East oil supply”.
Cautious Fan Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 2:50 pm

Estero #57

I’m fine with buying my steel from Canada or Mexico or wherever. They’ve got more money to buy airplanes, software or big Macs. You’d be hard pressed to find an respected economist who says free trade has hurt America, despite what Lou Dobbs says.

If we prop up the big 3, should we do the same when Microsoft & Google start having a hard time, what about Cisco or McDonalds or Boeing. Should we bail them out when they get in trouble? Maybe GM will learn not to return to making big vehicles like they did in the 80’s. If we bail them out then they can go back to making SUV’s if the price of oil goes down, knowing the gov’t will bail them out again. By not bailing them out it tells people to take oil risk seriously. America will be better off for it.
Jean-Charles Jacquemin Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 3:27 pm

Hi Raschiid,#1

I’m just back from vacations where I didn’t had the occasion to check what happened on the blog.

I just found the blog on which CP Forster wrote the news and I commented that OK I’m happy to learn that but disappointed that it is one year later than announced a year ago by the same CP Forster. But it is better late than never. Thanks Raschiid.
Nixon Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 3:43 pm

Who wants to put a bet on the European versions ending up being better looking than the US versions?
Statik Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 3:48 pm

#71 Jean-Charles Jacquemin

Your alive my friend! I was worried about you, hehe.

“I just found the blog on which CP Forster wrote the news and I commented that OK I’m happy to learn that but disappointed that it is one year later than announced a year ago by the same CP Forster. But it is better late than never. Thanks Raschiid.”

Well…at least it is still scheduled to come. (I’m just trying out the glass half-full approach for a change…just to say I tried it).
Jean-Charles Jacquemin Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 4:11 pm

Hi Statik #73

I was not aware of such an attention from you all, thanks, I’ll say in the future when I will leave for a while.
Back to the Volt and the comment of CP Forster, for those of you that are interested, its is here : http://drivingconversations.gmblogs.com/2008/08/and_what_of_the_chevrolet_volt.html
Jim I Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 4:26 pm

Wow! This thread is all over the place……….

The war in Iraq, Canadian natural resources, sub prime loans, and Gravitars…….

What was the original topic again? I think it had something to do with the Volt.

PS I did my Gravitar - See me petting a dolphin???
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:20 pm

Statik@62
I’m sure you meant you’re, not “your”, right?
/evil grin
Tag
Tagamet Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 6:38 pm

Statik@73
I’m sure you meant you’re, not “your”, right?
/eviler grin
Tag
Frankie Says:
August 6th, 2008 at 8:15 pm

I think this is the video they were refering to earlier. I can’t play it at work.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=807139236
Chevy Volt - The Environment Site Forums Says:
August 13th, 2008 at 5:20 am

[...] and in Europe first under the brandname of Opel/Vauxhall in 2011 and later (by 2012) as a Chevy. See here. I am sure they will start making EV’s some time in the future but I am a little skeptical about [...]

GM States the Volt Will Arrive in Europe in 2011 Under Opel/Vauxhall Brand

79 Responses to “GM States the Volt Will Arrive in Europe in 2011 Under Opel/Vauxhall Brand”

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