Comments on: At $40,000 the Volt Would Result in No Profit for GM http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/ Real-time news, information, and discussion about the Chevrolet Volt. Sun, 21 Mar 2010 07:41:21 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: Charlie H http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37156 Charlie H Wed, 16 Apr 2008 12:59:02 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37156 Jim I, That $10K 1995 Impala is hardly representative of 10 year old GM gars. It's an SS, probably very limited in quantity. For a more realistic appraisal, look at the 1994 Impala. World of difference. Or check a Lumina or whatever from that era. If you must factor in $10 gas to make the Volt look better thana Hyundai, forget the comparison altogether. If we have $10 gas to deal with, we'll be in deeeep doo doo and your car's fuel economy will be the very least of your worries. Moreover, the consumer buying the Volt won't be thinking in terms of $10 gas. They'll be thinking about $4 and worrying about $5. If the Volt can't compete at $5/gallon, it's not going to sell. Jim I, That $10K 1995 Impala is hardly representative of 10 year old GM gars. It’s an SS, probably very limited in quantity. For a more realistic appraisal, look at the 1994 Impala. World of difference. Or check a Lumina or whatever from that era.

If you must factor in $10 gas to make the Volt look better thana Hyundai, forget the comparison altogether. If we have $10 gas to deal with, we’ll be in deeeep doo doo and your car’s fuel economy will be the very least of your worries.

Moreover, the consumer buying the Volt won’t be thinking in terms of $10 gas. They’ll be thinking about $4 and worrying about $5. If the Volt can’t compete at $5/gallon, it’s not going to sell.

]]> By: Al http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37126 Al Tue, 15 Apr 2008 22:54:11 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37126 You did the comparison that Brian asked about, but I concluded that you did not truly compare the two. You left out the Time Vaule of money, as in what cost can be assigned to the money saved by NOT buying the Volt and buying the Hyundai Accent instead. At the end of 10 years that little Accent is still worth $1350, but an Impala was NOT manufactured in 1998. I checked and a Malibu was, its resale value is about $3300. $50,000 is too much money for a car. That is the opinion of most middle class Americans. To that end, not too many GM vehicles sell for that much. The cost alone puts the Volt in the company and competition for folks that can afford $50,000 cars, like BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Acura and the like. I really don't see them abandoning their really nice cars to save some gas, do you? You did the comparison that Brian asked about, but I concluded that you did not truly compare the two. You left out the Time Vaule of money, as in what cost can be assigned to the money saved by NOT buying the Volt and buying the Hyundai Accent instead. At the end of 10 years that little Accent is still worth $1350, but an Impala was NOT manufactured in 1998. I checked and a Malibu was, its resale value is about $3300. $50,000 is too much money for a car. That is the opinion of most middle class Americans. To that end, not too many GM vehicles sell for that much. The cost alone puts the Volt in the company and competition for folks that can afford $50,000 cars, like BMW, Mercedes, Lexus, Acura and the like. I really don’t see them abandoning their really nice cars to save some gas, do you?

]]> By: Jim I http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37017 Jim I Tue, 15 Apr 2008 04:19:50 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37017 Sorry Al, but it is you that is not answering the ORIGINAL QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED, and you that introduced all the new variables. You said the Hyundai with a ten year warranty would still have value. A 10K car at the end of 10 years will still have value? So I put in a "what if" Hyundai goues bankrupt? There would be no 10 year warranty, and no $10K car available to buy. And resale value would be nill. And before you say that is next to impossible, remember that three airlines went bankrupt this week... And by the way, a 1995 Hyundai Accent with 120K miles is work about $600 in "Good" condition for trade in value, according to Kelly Blue Book. You also said that a 10 year old Chevy would have no value, except for recycle value of the battery. Kind of harsh, don't you think? A 1995 Chevy Impala cost about $23K with decent options. According to Kelly Blue Book, it would still be worth about $7K in "Good" condition on a trade in with 120K miles. That is hardly scrap value. And if OPEC stops oil for gasoline? I can still drive 40 miles AER in a Volt, How far can you go in your ICE based vehicle? The main problem I have with your argument is that if we take your logic to the maximum, we should all take the bus, so we can save all that money for retirement. So therefore we do not need to build ANY cars......... But that is not how I want to live! And one more time, I answered the question that was asked, and not a long term financial strategy planning session! So can we agree to disagee? Sorry Al, but it is you that is not answering the ORIGINAL QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED, and you that introduced all the new variables.

You said the Hyundai with a ten year warranty would still have value. A 10K car at the end of 10 years will still have value? So I put in a “what if” Hyundai goues bankrupt? There would be no 10 year warranty, and no $10K car available to buy. And resale value would be nill. And before you say that is next to impossible, remember that three airlines went bankrupt this week… And by the way, a 1995 Hyundai Accent with 120K miles is work about $600 in “Good” condition for trade in value, according to Kelly Blue Book.

You also said that a 10 year old Chevy would have no value, except for recycle value of the battery. Kind of harsh, don’t you think? A 1995 Chevy Impala cost about $23K with decent options. According to Kelly Blue Book, it would still be worth about $7K in “Good” condition on a trade in with 120K miles. That is hardly scrap value.

And if OPEC stops oil for gasoline? I can still drive 40 miles AER in a Volt, How far can you go in your ICE based vehicle?

The main problem I have with your argument is that if we take your logic to the maximum, we should all take the bus, so we can save all that money for retirement. So therefore we do not need to build ANY cars………

But that is not how I want to live!

And one more time, I answered the question that was asked, and not a long term financial strategy planning session!

So can we agree to disagee?

]]> By: Al http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37005 Al Tue, 15 Apr 2008 03:34:03 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-37005 Jimbo, Your joke of a reply does not even come close to my reply which took a very conservative approach - most analysts agree 11 % is the 10 year plus avg for market return in the long term, I said 7% to account for 4% inflation. My point, Money has a time value which you ignored, conveniently. Most folks stake their retirement on this FACT. What if the stock market crashes? ans. Game over, no cars bought. What if OPEC decides to stop all oil shipments to the USA and gas prices go to $100 / gal? See above answer, same result! What if the first 10K Volts become collector's items and in 2020 are worth $200K? Really ridiculous... it is a Chevy, not a Bugatti. What if Hyundai goes bankrupt? No real effect... What if GM buys Fiskar and then Tesla? Who cares? Not me A scary scenario, "What if the Battery pack catches fire and burn up two kids in the back seat?" Ans: GM gets massively sued, end of BEVs, and anything with a LiOn pack. Best be careful! Jimbo,

Your joke of a reply does not even come close to my reply which took a very conservative approach – most analysts agree 11 % is the 10 year plus avg for market return in the long term, I said 7% to account for 4% inflation. My point, Money has a time value which you ignored, conveniently. Most folks stake their retirement on this FACT.

What if the stock market crashes? ans. Game over, no cars bought.

What if OPEC decides to stop all oil shipments to the USA and gas prices go to $100 / gal? See above answer, same result!

What if the first 10K Volts become collector’s items and in 2020 are worth $200K? Really ridiculous… it is a Chevy, not a Bugatti.

What if Hyundai goes bankrupt? No real effect…

What if GM buys Fiskar and then Tesla? Who cares? Not me

A scary scenario, “What if the Battery pack catches fire and burn up two kids in the back seat?” Ans: GM gets massively sued, end of BEVs, and anything with a LiOn pack. Best be careful!

]]> By: Bill Allen http://gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-36585 Bill Allen Fri, 11 Apr 2008 16:14:46 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/03/25/at-40000-the-volt-would-result-in-no-profit-for-gm/#comment-36585 I guess I'll be sticking with my Honda Civic Hybrid, 49-55+ MPG and a cost of $24K. $40K would price it way out of my reach. I was originally interested because of the moderate price and the possibility of have a diesel, which normally gives better mileage per gal than gas. Now I understand No diesel and high price. I was a bit surprised to hear diesel was not an option. I understood the car was for an international market. In Europe where fuel prices are substantially higher than in the US a large majority will not buy anything but a diesel because of the economy. I guess I’ll be sticking with my Honda Civic Hybrid, 49-55+ MPG and a cost of $24K.

$40K would price it way out of my reach. I was originally interested because of the moderate price and the possibility of have a diesel, which normally gives better mileage per gal than gas. Now I understand No diesel and high price.

I was a bit surprised to hear diesel was not an option. I understood the car was for an international market. In Europe where fuel prices are substantially higher than in the US a large majority will not buy anything but a diesel because of the economy.

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