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Tesla Motors Chairman Elon Musk on GM, Toyota, and the Whitestar
Elon Musk, founder of Paypal, is also chairman of Tesla Motors, the silicon valley start-up that has recently rolled it’s first production electric car, the Roadster, off the production line. Musk himself owns that one.
He was interview by Michael Kanellos of CNET and they covered a range of issues.
When asked about whether he felt the major automakers were serious about electric cars he responded that he thought Toyota wsa “really very serious” and that GM was only “pretty serious”.
When asked about the status of Tesla Whitestar, the company’s planned lower-priced (than the Roadster at $100,000) sedan he said, “We are about to finish the styling on the sedan and hope to unveil it in the second quarter of this year. The working prototype would be later this year”. He also said Tesla expected to build between 10,000 and 20,000 of these per year at a retail price of $50,000 to $60,000.
Source (CNET)
32 Responses to “Tesla Motors Chairman Elon Musk on GM, Toyota, and the Whitestar”
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February 16th, 2008 at 8:01 am
“I think actually the most efficient way to use cellulose is to burn it in a co-generation power plant. That will yield the most energy and that is something you can do today.” – Elon Musk
Better than wasting natural gas on power production. Still in the mean time we will need all the fuel available for the legacy cars.
2010 – 2011 crunch time for oil demand/supply.
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February 16th, 2008 at 9:10 am
I don’t think Whitestar is much of a competitor with the Volt, even it’s E-Rev version. For those that don’t follow Tesla, thier plan is to release two versions of Whitestar. One being an E-Rev like the Volt for a lower cost. And another version that is a BEV.
Still, both versions will cost about double the Volt. I for one would rather buy from GM, even if the all-electric range is 40 miles. I’d prefer longer, but I’ll have to take what I can get. I trust GM rather than a start-up as far as warranty and safety issues are concerned. I wish Tesla the best, but that’s one expensive car that the masses won’t buy.
But GM can keep learning from Tesla, sooner or later the 40 mile all electric range will not suffice. Plus, I LOVE the option of choosing a more expensive model with a longer range. This has been discussed before.
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February 16th, 2008 at 9:32 am
Hi Dave, #2.. Also remember, these Li-ion batteries lose ~10% of their capacity over time. SO GM had better figure it out before the Volt is released. It would suck, 2 years after you purchased a Volt, and your only able to get 30 miles electric mode when you were able to get 40 miles electric mode.
I’d purchase a Tesla before a Toyota..
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February 16th, 2008 at 10:56 am
I suppose it depends on how Elon interpreted the question of seriousness about electric vehicles, but his answer seems inconsistent. No doubt, both Toyota and GM are real, when it comes to hybrids, as they are both selling parallel hybrids today. Both Toyota and GM are planning plug-in hybrids – Toyota’s remains a parallel hybrid, while GM’s is a serial hybrid or E-REV, of which GM’s seems more serious if you are talking true EV.
In GM’s product plan, they are evolving towards all plug-in E-REV’s, where the range extender eventually becomes hydrogen, with no mention of a 100% BEV.
http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/PDF/presentation-sm.pdf
Toyota hasn’t announced a 100% BEV vehicle either, so neither is serious about 100% BEV. Then again, Tesla just announced that they would offer a range extender option for their Whitestar, so is Tesla no longer serious about 100% BEV’s? Does it really matter, as E-REV’s reduce petroleum consumption by 80% for the typical driver?
I think all these companies are serious about reducing petroleum, and all have market viable approaches for doing so, whether they are low or no emissions.
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February 16th, 2008 at 11:01 am
Dave B.,
Certainly, current vehicles from Tesla and Fisker may not have much customer overlap, but it is clear that both Tesla and Fisker are in a position to create a vehicle to compete in the Chevy Volt space, and vice versa, so all three are racing towards the middle – high volume, high profit mid sized sedans (think Buick / Oldsmobile position).
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February 16th, 2008 at 11:29 am
For those here who may not know about it, Martin Eberhardt, Tesla’s original founder, started a blog in which he refers to the Volt in his opening Jan 14 ‘08 post. Postings have slowed a lot since then, but Martin keeps an eye on new comments and responds to those that interest him. I check it daily to see what might be new…..
http://teslafounders.wordpress.com/2008/01/14/getting-from-here-to-there/
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February 16th, 2008 at 11:35 am
>> No doubt, both Toyota and GM are real, when it comes to hybrids, as
>> they are both selling parallel hybrids today. Both Toyota and GM are planning
>> plug-in hybrids – Toyota’s remains a parallel hybrid,
Toyota stopped selling parallel hybrids several years ago. The ASSIST design simply didn’t amount to much.
FULL hybrids are what they been focusing entirely on, since their series ability can very easily take advantage of greater battery capacity and a plug.
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February 16th, 2008 at 11:48 am
I didn’t take Mr. Musk’s comment that GM was “only pretty serious” about hybrids. If you read the full article, he states: “Toyota is really very serious about hybrids and GM is, I think, pretty serious.” I think he meant it as “GM is pretty serious about hybrids as well.” I guess one whould have had to be at the interview to hear exactly how he made the statement.
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February 16th, 2008 at 12:28 pm
50-60,000 is STILL too much for the average person to drop on a car. When will these companies learn that we want an affordable electric car? It seems to me that these companies sell the electric cars at a level that only the rich can afford, the same people who can afford a gas guzzling hummer.
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February 16th, 2008 at 1:05 pm
SilverBlade,
Most new technologies that emerge start out very expensive, and are snatched up by wealthy early adopters. These products are then cost / price reduced over a few years – look at VCR’s, DVD players, CD players, plasma TV’s, DLP TV’s, and so on. Once these platforms have had a few years to increase in volume, the prices for the vehicles will come down.
Right now, our federal government is processing tax breaks of up to $4,000 for buying hybrid vehicles, so the price issue is getting a lot of attention / support. Hopefully, state and city governments will follow suit.
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February 16th, 2008 at 1:10 pm
Tucker, Muntz Jet, Kaiser, Fraser, Hudson, Studebaker, Nash, Crosley, Oldsmobile, Bricklin, Yugo, Delorean, to name just a few.
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February 16th, 2008 at 1:20 pm
Check out the Toyota concept hybrid small pickup on page 12 of the February Automobile magazine If Chevrolet offered something like that, I would buy one in a heartbeat for my business deliveries.
Note the solar panel on the dash to help keep the battery pack charged! Am I dreaming, or have about 100 loyal GM-volt.com commenters suggested that for the Volt?
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February 16th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
The race is on for PHEV short term conversions. OEMtech is in the SF Bay area looking to convert existing Prius models to over 100 mpg by added battery power without tearing up the car.
Other companies are also on the move for the existing 1 million plus existing market.
http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_8280588
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February 16th, 2008 at 4:10 pm
Not to mention Star, a UK startup circa 1906.
Each time they received an order for a car they went to Lucas to buy the bits….
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February 16th, 2008 at 4:33 pm
noel park
“Check out the Toyota concept hybrid small pickup on page 12 of the February Automobile magazine If Chevrolet offered something like that, I would buy one in a heartbeat for my business deliveries.”
Noel Park, check the GMC Denali XT Hybrid concept.
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February 16th, 2008 at 4:40 pm
Haid D’Salaami, #15:
I have. It’s way too big for me. This thing is about the size of my S-10, which is exactly what I want. I’m not buying a Toyota, even if they produce it. I’m just saying, this is the “pickup” of the future.
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February 16th, 2008 at 5:04 pm
I read the full article. Despite the fact that I think Tesla will be a martyr in EV history, what he’s doing is actually good, maybe not for Tesla, but for EVs and their survival.
The reason I say this is that Tesla and to some degree Phoenix are keeping the big automakers honest. If Tesla sold out, it could very well be to an oil giant, and that would only be for one reason. I’m not saying that would drop the chances of the Volt, but it certainly wouldn’t help.
I’ve said it before, the Volt and it’s followers have got to come to market and start selling. Once they do there will be nothing to stop progression of this type of vehicle. Despite the fact that I don’t think Tesla will make it, their efforts until EV’s are mainstream is critical.
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February 16th, 2008 at 5:55 pm
I’m curious about the Volt’s range extender. With it basically being a “generator,” how often would the oil need to be changed. What other kinds of fluids/maintenance would be required to operate the extender.
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February 16th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
17, Grizzly,
If it came to the point where GM or other industry giants produce vehicles that out-sell Tesla, Fisker, et al in their own space, they yes, those companies would sell out or shut down, but as you say, GM et al would have to first seriously market and sell similar vehicles to do it.
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February 16th, 2008 at 6:12 pm
I’m wondering why there aren’t more posts regarding Phoenix Motor Cars offerings. They claim to be prepared for consumer release next year. If you’re unfamiliar with this company, their link is posted.
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February 16th, 2008 at 6:13 pm
Sorry! Here’s the Phoenix Motor Compan link http://www.phoenixmotorcars.com/index.html
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February 16th, 2008 at 6:17 pm
Jason (great name btw),
Yes, Pheonix is going directly after corporate fleets tethered to a home base – low range vehicles with rapid recharge capability. Hyundia and VW are involved in this effort. If it takes off, look for consumer targeted vehicles next.
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February 16th, 2008 at 7:27 pm
#20 Jason wrote: I’m wondering why there aren’t more posts regarding Phoenix Motor Cars offerings. …
Other than some a few specs about the battery and engine torque – their Web site has very little information … Does anyone know the expected price for either the fleet SUT or consumer SUV?
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February 16th, 2008 at 8:11 pm
Serious?!?! Hmmm… GM is going to convert almost entirely to the E-flex design and whether they eventually move to all electric or not has nothing to do with how serious they are about it. Since they are willing, advances and the cost of batteries in the future will determine if the cars of the future are pure battery driven or supplemented by something else.
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February 16th, 2008 at 9:18 pm
OK guys! I am excited about the Volt but this entirely electric pickup with 100 mile range and 10 minute charge time at nearly the same price is swaying my Volt commitment just a tad.
This link provides a first hand account of a test driver’s experience.
http://www.practicalenvironmentalist.com/eco-gadgets/test-drive-phoenix-motorcars-electric-sport-utility-vehicle.htm
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February 16th, 2008 at 11:20 pm
Jason,
Yes, the Pheonix truck becomes a serious contender, but some people want a truck, and others a sedan. Some want a gasoline range extender for unlimited driving across the country, and others just need a vehicle that never goes 50 miles from homebase.
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February 17th, 2008 at 12:18 am
Jason #25 the Phoenix pickup is on the order of about $45K+, so I don’t think it’s the same price as the Volt. And IIRC it does not come with a warranty.
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February 17th, 2008 at 12:56 pm
Why should I care what the head of Tesla has to say about GM or Toyota? So far he has managed to build and deliver ONE car and that was to himself. GM has been building and DELIVERING cars for over 100 years. They sell millions of cars every year. GM built and delivered over 1,000 EV1s, more than any other manufacturer on earth. That’s 1000x better than Tesla. Who is serious about EVs indeed?!
Seriously, Tesla is a quirky footnote in automotive history. There is way too much weight given to their opinions and achievements.
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February 21st, 2008 at 3:27 pm
I have driven the Phoenix Motor Cars SUT and am on the waiting list for one, when available. If they haven’t delivered it before the Tesla Whitewater is available; I may make the switch to the sedan. The Volt option of pure EV would be my choice if GM is more than “pretty serious” about allowing true consumer choice.
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July 21st, 2008 at 10:22 pm
Yeah… except… is GM going to Take all our Volts back from us when they get scared that it might actually outsell gas cars.. like they did with the EV-1? … Thank you Tesla Motors for not being scared to stand up to the Jerks of Corporate America…
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December 6th, 2008 at 9:19 pm
Just have to say it. Ha Volt what a joke?? 40 miles a charge? forreal. GM. assholes how dumb do they think cusmers are? a electric car with only a 40 mile charge time has been possible for almost 100 years. The ev.1 had more than 70 and that was created in 1996? man now there begging congress for money. small side note ….again. Asshole=GM
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April 6th, 2009 at 8:30 pm
I wouldn’t trust a company where the ceo stabbed his founding partner in the back. Tesla was Martin’s brain child not Elon’s. If he can’t resolve a simple issue with his partner then how can I trust him not to stab me in the back.
Stan
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