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	<title>Comments on: Q &amp; A with Bob Reuter Chief Engineer, Plug-in Saturn VUE</title>
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	<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/</link>
	<description>Real-time news, information, and discussion about the Chevrolet Volt.</description>
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		<title>By: GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Concept Site &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Error in Motor Trend Magazine&#8217;s Plug-in VUE Advertisement Section</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-32859</link>
		<dc:creator>GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Concept Site &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Error in Motor Trend Magazine&#8217;s Plug-in VUE Advertisement Section</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Mar 2008 09:07:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-32859</guid>
		<description>[...] information although exiting did not match with what the vehicle&#8217;s chief engineer Bob Reuter told me in Detroit. There he noted the car could go 10 miles all electric, but that it was a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] information although exiting did not match with what the vehicle&#8217;s chief engineer Bob Reuter told me in Detroit. There he noted the car could go 10 miles all electric, but that it was a [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Larry Parylla</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-30227</link>
		<dc:creator>Larry Parylla</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Feb 2008 05:42:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-30227</guid>
		<description>I agree with you for the following reason. The A/C and the power steering both are powered by the hybrid battery. If the battery did not charge while the car is coasting the ICE would have to kick in to keep the A/C and P/S working. So rather than letting the battery run down to the point where the ICE will need to kick in the keep the battery powered A/C they designed it to keep the battery charghed every time you coast. The No charge coasting colud work if you don&#039;t need the A/C</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you for the following reason. The A/C and the power steering both are powered by the hybrid battery. If the battery did not charge while the car is coasting the ICE would have to kick in to keep the A/C and P/S working. So rather than letting the battery run down to the point where the ICE will need to kick in the keep the battery powered A/C they designed it to keep the battery charghed every time you coast. The No charge coasting colud work if you don&#8217;t need the A/C</p>
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		<title>By: Brian M</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29804</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 03:45:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29804</guid>
		<description>Wise Golden, #33:

It sounds like you are onto something.  There may be a more complicated and justified reason for the software to be the way it is; I&#039;m not sure.

But to make your numbers more legit, you need to keep track of a long-time average instead of relying on the instantaneous mileage.  The fuel economy gauge in cars is notorious for not being very accurate anyway.

I would suggest you start keeping track of how much gas you buy and how many miles you drive (using the odometer).  After you have gone through 5 tanks of gas, divide the miles driven by the gallons of gas bought (of course, fill up the tank before you start and when you finish, so that the tank is at the same level when you start as it is when you finish).  An average like this is much more error-free than instant readings.

I suspect your numbers are close to accurate, but others may be more willing to accept them if you follow that procedure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wise Golden, #33:</p>
<p>It sounds like you are onto something.  There may be a more complicated and justified reason for the software to be the way it is; I&#8217;m not sure.</p>
<p>But to make your numbers more legit, you need to keep track of a long-time average instead of relying on the instantaneous mileage.  The fuel economy gauge in cars is notorious for not being very accurate anyway.</p>
<p>I would suggest you start keeping track of how much gas you buy and how many miles you drive (using the odometer).  After you have gone through 5 tanks of gas, divide the miles driven by the gallons of gas bought (of course, fill up the tank before you start and when you finish, so that the tank is at the same level when you start as it is when you finish).  An average like this is much more error-free than instant readings.</p>
<p>I suspect your numbers are close to accurate, but others may be more willing to accept them if you follow that procedure.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29802</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Feb 2008 02:25:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29802</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the feedback Nasaman.  I&#039;m not an engineer just an enthusiast.  However, after pouring over AFS&#039;s site it does leave me scratching my head a little as to why GM can&#039;t, at the very least, match Trinity&#039;s specs.  They claim everything they&#039;ve used in the conversion is all &quot;off the shelf&quot; technology.  Perhaps GM is just holding their cards close.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the feedback Nasaman.  I&#8217;m not an engineer just an enthusiast.  However, after pouring over AFS&#8217;s site it does leave me scratching my head a little as to why GM can&#8217;t, at the very least, match Trinity&#8217;s specs.  They claim everything they&#8217;ve used in the conversion is all &#8220;off the shelf&#8221; technology.  Perhaps GM is just holding their cards close.</p>
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		<title>By: nasaman</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29788</link>
		<dc:creator>nasaman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 22:31:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29788</guid>
		<description>33Jeff:

After I saw a short piece with AFS Trinity CEO Edward Furia &amp; a CNN reporter driving a test vehicle last month, I emailed them. They called me back and after further study I&#039;m convinced they&#039;re legit.* 

GM&#039;s goals for the new Plug-in VUE, with a claimed EV range of only 10 miles, are not at all ambitious --to the contrary, they&#039;re too short-sighted-- and I&#039;m trying to convince them to offer a much longer EV range (35mi+) as at least an extra-cost option for the Plug-in VUE!

* But don&#039;t send AFS Trinity any money you can&#039;t afford to lose</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>33Jeff:</p>
<p>After I saw a short piece with AFS Trinity CEO Edward Furia &amp; a CNN reporter driving a test vehicle last month, I emailed them. They called me back and after further study I&#8217;m convinced they&#8217;re legit.* </p>
<p>GM&#8217;s goals for the new Plug-in VUE, with a claimed EV range of only 10 miles, are not at all ambitious &#8211;to the contrary, they&#8217;re too short-sighted&#8211; and I&#8217;m trying to convince them to offer a much longer EV range (35mi+) as at least an extra-cost option for the Plug-in VUE!</p>
<p>* But don&#8217;t send AFS Trinity any money you can&#8217;t afford to lose</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29782</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 21:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29782</guid>
		<description>I am surprised that AFS Trinity Power Corporations Xtreme Hybrid vehicle was not even mentioned to this point, particularly since the base vehicle is a Saturn Vue.  If anyone (not already aware) is interested, here is the link: http://www.afstrinity.com/ .
I am a big fan of GM&#039;s E-Flex program but If Trinity&#039;s vehicle is legit, it would suggest that GM&#039;s goals for this generation Vue are far from ambitious.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am surprised that AFS Trinity Power Corporations Xtreme Hybrid vehicle was not even mentioned to this point, particularly since the base vehicle is a Saturn Vue.  If anyone (not already aware) is interested, here is the link: <a href="http://www.afstrinity.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.afstrinity.com/</a> .<br />
I am a big fan of GM&#8217;s E-Flex program but If Trinity&#8217;s vehicle is legit, it would suggest that GM&#8217;s goals for this generation Vue are far from ambitious.</p>
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		<title>By: Wise Golden</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29781</link>
		<dc:creator>Wise Golden</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 20:37:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29781</guid>
		<description>#20 wise golden,
Would you be willing to share what it is your doing to increase your mpg to 38.1 average in your Saturn Aura? CW

Wise Golden says:

Yes.

When I first got the Saturn Aura, I was disappointed by the mileage, but after about 2 weeks of driving (I drive 1000 miles each week – sometimes only 700.) I started to understand that the car’s computer was doing some things that only made sense on certain occasions.  For instance, the car wanted to immediately go into charge mode as soon as my foot was released from the accelerator.  This would cause a form of regenerative breaking and would cause the car to loose momentum.  I speculate that GM engineers have decided that this is the only way to ensure that the battery captures it’s maximum charge, but it began to occur to me that the car was significantly wrong on most occasions (based on my driving route and my habits.)

I used the instantaneous fuel gauge to try to study the car mileage characteristics under various conditions.   As would be expected, the car gets very poor mileage from 0-20 mph (all cars do,) very good mileage at the sweet spot of 40-55 MPH, and unbelievable mileage during coasting and stopping.  In fact under coast and stop, the car gets beyond 100 MPG and I can only attempt to calculate the mileage because the gauge stops at 99.  On one occasion, I was so shocked by the improvement in my total trip average from one journey of 80 miles, that I manually calculated the journey fuel economy and found that it was in the 70’s MPG.  That finding leads me to believe that under coast situations, that the car may be experiencing in excess of 200 MPG, or even more because I believe that the fuel cuts off completely.  On highway speeds, the mileage drops significantly from a high of about 50-MPG at 40-55 MPH to around 34 MPG at 70-80 MPH – this clearly illustrates the aerodynamics that GM is discussing on the Volt.

All of this said, the strategy of the computer should be (but is not) to allow the car to maximize its Ultra, ultra high efficiency coasting (I really believe it’s above 200 MPG in that circumstance,) even if that is to the detriment of the battery charge.  I can say that under my driving conditions, the car will begin to charge at the very moment that the foot is removed from the accelerator and in a normal breaking distance, the car will reach a full charge that will cause the computer to stop charging before the end of the breaking cycle.  This has told me that the entire breaking cycle is not needed to charge.

To compensate for the computer’s lack of vision and decision making ability, I believe that GM programmed the most conservative scenario.  I have developed a better scenario and have learned to trick the computer into following my commands by using the accelerator and break as computer inputs.  Roughly 9 out 10 times that I take my foot of the accelerator; it is not my intention to break, rather, I wish to coast a bit (getting too close to the car in front.)  The car wants to break and charge.  I trick by tapping a very tiny tap at the accelerator to turn off the regen breaking.  I do it again, and I do it a third time as long as I want to coast.  On the third occasion, GM has programmed the computer to stop trying to do regenerative breaking – don’t know why.  At this point, the car will be allowed to coast, achieving phenomenal mileage.  Roughly 1 of 10 occasions, I want to slow down and I allow the car to go into regenerative breaking as it does naturally.

If GM would simply reprogram the car to coast upon the action of a foot being removed from the peddle (with fuel off,) and program the car to wait for an input from the break before it begins regenerative breaking, the mileage of the car would fall in line with mine.  As of today, 38.3 MPG over 13,418 miles, an increase of .2 MPG on 13,418 miles in a journey of 68 miles (I said 13,300 in my previous post, but I was rounding – didn’t think it was going to become thesis material.  It was about 13,350 miles.)  Correct me if I’m wrong, but that means I got 53.9 MPG today on my 68-mile journey.  Now granted, I have an ideal journey where I am able to keep the car in the sweet spot for many miles at a time, but I promise that I stopped no less than 20 times at lights.  By using my strategy, I was getting maybe 200 MPG as I coasted for several tenths of a mile into a stoplight.  Using GM’s strategy, I would have been forced to maintain a slight acceleration into the final 150 feet of the approach into the stop light, because otherwise, the car will go into regen breaking.  This super mileage pays for the penalty of accelerating and brings the overall mileage to that of the sweet spot, which is evidently about 53.9 MPG.

I wish to also say that I am a normal driver – I do not inconvenience the people on the road around me.  I always travel at the same speed as the car in front of me, and I don’t start coasting a half a mile away from a light.  People are not routinely passing me.  I don’t get honked at.  I’m blending in.  

Some people might have other conditions that would be less advantageous than the scenario that I have outlined, but the fact is that I think it would be a real step forward for GM to have the car learn the drivers habits and adapt.

Additionally, I am aware that GM is able to monitor my engine via On-Star if they want to.  They have my permission, and I will be happy to discuss this with them.  Lyle, you may give them my e-mail address if they request it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#20 wise golden,<br />
Would you be willing to share what it is your doing to increase your mpg to 38.1 average in your Saturn Aura? CW</p>
<p>Wise Golden says:</p>
<p>Yes.</p>
<p>When I first got the Saturn Aura, I was disappointed by the mileage, but after about 2 weeks of driving (I drive 1000 miles each week – sometimes only 700.) I started to understand that the car’s computer was doing some things that only made sense on certain occasions.  For instance, the car wanted to immediately go into charge mode as soon as my foot was released from the accelerator.  This would cause a form of regenerative breaking and would cause the car to loose momentum.  I speculate that GM engineers have decided that this is the only way to ensure that the battery captures it’s maximum charge, but it began to occur to me that the car was significantly wrong on most occasions (based on my driving route and my habits.)</p>
<p>I used the instantaneous fuel gauge to try to study the car mileage characteristics under various conditions.   As would be expected, the car gets very poor mileage from 0-20 mph (all cars do,) very good mileage at the sweet spot of 40-55 MPH, and unbelievable mileage during coasting and stopping.  In fact under coast and stop, the car gets beyond 100 MPG and I can only attempt to calculate the mileage because the gauge stops at 99.  On one occasion, I was so shocked by the improvement in my total trip average from one journey of 80 miles, that I manually calculated the journey fuel economy and found that it was in the 70’s MPG.  That finding leads me to believe that under coast situations, that the car may be experiencing in excess of 200 MPG, or even more because I believe that the fuel cuts off completely.  On highway speeds, the mileage drops significantly from a high of about 50-MPG at 40-55 MPH to around 34 MPG at 70-80 MPH – this clearly illustrates the aerodynamics that GM is discussing on the Volt.</p>
<p>All of this said, the strategy of the computer should be (but is not) to allow the car to maximize its Ultra, ultra high efficiency coasting (I really believe it’s above 200 MPG in that circumstance,) even if that is to the detriment of the battery charge.  I can say that under my driving conditions, the car will begin to charge at the very moment that the foot is removed from the accelerator and in a normal breaking distance, the car will reach a full charge that will cause the computer to stop charging before the end of the breaking cycle.  This has told me that the entire breaking cycle is not needed to charge.</p>
<p>To compensate for the computer’s lack of vision and decision making ability, I believe that GM programmed the most conservative scenario.  I have developed a better scenario and have learned to trick the computer into following my commands by using the accelerator and break as computer inputs.  Roughly 9 out 10 times that I take my foot of the accelerator; it is not my intention to break, rather, I wish to coast a bit (getting too close to the car in front.)  The car wants to break and charge.  I trick by tapping a very tiny tap at the accelerator to turn off the regen breaking.  I do it again, and I do it a third time as long as I want to coast.  On the third occasion, GM has programmed the computer to stop trying to do regenerative breaking – don’t know why.  At this point, the car will be allowed to coast, achieving phenomenal mileage.  Roughly 1 of 10 occasions, I want to slow down and I allow the car to go into regenerative breaking as it does naturally.</p>
<p>If GM would simply reprogram the car to coast upon the action of a foot being removed from the peddle (with fuel off,) and program the car to wait for an input from the break before it begins regenerative breaking, the mileage of the car would fall in line with mine.  As of today, 38.3 MPG over 13,418 miles, an increase of .2 MPG on 13,418 miles in a journey of 68 miles (I said 13,300 in my previous post, but I was rounding – didn’t think it was going to become thesis material.  It was about 13,350 miles.)  Correct me if I’m wrong, but that means I got 53.9 MPG today on my 68-mile journey.  Now granted, I have an ideal journey where I am able to keep the car in the sweet spot for many miles at a time, but I promise that I stopped no less than 20 times at lights.  By using my strategy, I was getting maybe 200 MPG as I coasted for several tenths of a mile into a stoplight.  Using GM’s strategy, I would have been forced to maintain a slight acceleration into the final 150 feet of the approach into the stop light, because otherwise, the car will go into regen breaking.  This super mileage pays for the penalty of accelerating and brings the overall mileage to that of the sweet spot, which is evidently about 53.9 MPG.</p>
<p>I wish to also say that I am a normal driver – I do not inconvenience the people on the road around me.  I always travel at the same speed as the car in front of me, and I don’t start coasting a half a mile away from a light.  People are not routinely passing me.  I don’t get honked at.  I’m blending in.  </p>
<p>Some people might have other conditions that would be less advantageous than the scenario that I have outlined, but the fact is that I think it would be a real step forward for GM to have the car learn the drivers habits and adapt.</p>
<p>Additionally, I am aware that GM is able to monitor my engine via On-Star if they want to.  They have my permission, and I will be happy to discuss this with them.  Lyle, you may give them my e-mail address if they request it.</p>
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		<title>By: NZDavid</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29744</link>
		<dc:creator>NZDavid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 04:38:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29744</guid>
		<description>I just read an amazing post on the Tesla Motors site about Grid frequency management and the important EV&#039;s could/will make to it in the future.
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/?p=62

EV&#039;s and windfarms could really help each other out!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just read an amazing post on the Tesla Motors site about Grid frequency management and the important EV&#8217;s could/will make to it in the future.<br />
<a href="http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/?p=62" rel="nofollow">http://www.teslamotors.com/blog4/?p=62</a></p>
<p>EV&#8217;s and windfarms could really help each other out!</p>
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		<title>By: Swimdad623</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29741</link>
		<dc:creator>Swimdad623</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 02:00:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29741</guid>
		<description>To me, one of the most attractive features of this is the ability to minimize idling in the &quot;black car&quot; market.  I work in lower Manhattan, and in front of every building are the &quot;black cars&quot; (either Lincolns or Chevy Suburbans) idling in front of the building.  These cars are limo services waiting to pick up a passenger, and they have the engine running so that the driver can leave the air conditioning and radio on.

Since a plug-in hybrid has to have all-electrical systems (including air conditioner), the plug-in hybrid &quot;black car&quot; could plug-in and turn the engine off while waiting.  That would be a big savings over the zero MPG they get while idling now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To me, one of the most attractive features of this is the ability to minimize idling in the &#8220;black car&#8221; market.  I work in lower Manhattan, and in front of every building are the &#8220;black cars&#8221; (either Lincolns or Chevy Suburbans) idling in front of the building.  These cars are limo services waiting to pick up a passenger, and they have the engine running so that the driver can leave the air conditioning and radio on.</p>
<p>Since a plug-in hybrid has to have all-electrical systems (including air conditioner), the plug-in hybrid &#8220;black car&#8221; could plug-in and turn the engine off while waiting.  That would be a big savings over the zero MPG they get while idling now.</p>
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		<title>By: Rashiid Amul</title>
		<link>http://gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29737</link>
		<dc:creator>Rashiid Amul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 06 Feb 2008 01:17:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.gm-volt.com/2008/02/05/q-a-with-bob-reuter-chief-engineer-plug-in-saturn-vue/#comment-29737</guid>
		<description>Tom M, # 19,  &quot;I just wish I wasn’t so old so I could see some of this great technology on the highway.&quot;

My friend, none of us know when we are checking out.
I&#039;m 44, drive on one of the most insane highways in my state,
and have a wife and two kids.  I could check out tomorrow.
Stay healthy.  Someday we&#039;ll meet.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom M, # 19,  &#8220;I just wish I wasn’t so old so I could see some of this great technology on the highway.&#8221;</p>
<p>My friend, none of us know when we are checking out.<br />
I&#8217;m 44, drive on one of the most insane highways in my state,<br />
and have a wife and two kids.  I could check out tomorrow.<br />
Stay healthy.  Someday we&#8217;ll meet.</p>
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