Chevy Volt Design Freeze within Weeks

February 3rd, 2008 | Posted in: Design

A report out of Australia mentioned a few new facts about the Volt, garnered from original interviews with GM executives.

We have heard that the Chevy Volt’s design team, headed by Bob Boniface is very close to a final design for the production vehicle. Just how close?

Well, according to this article:

“…the styling for the 2011 Volt will be frozen in the next few weeks, while its overall packaging will also be set in stone soon after.”

Dont be taken aback by the 2011. The car is intended for release in the end of 2010 as a 2011 model year.

As to when GM will show us this whole new design…I don’t know yet.

Source (GoAuto)

Thanks to Brian M for the tip!

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Posted by: Lyle

45 Responses to “Chevy Volt Design Freeze within Weeks”

nasaman Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 8:45 am

Thanks, Lyle & Brian ….this article is one of the most fascinating I’ve seen recently! It reaffirms some things we’ve been aware of and mentions others, such as the design freeze coming in a few weeks, that I haven’t seen elsewhere.

The following statement, “The Volt’s second-generation drivetrain will be utilised in the next-generation (2009) Astra small car architecture – a global platform that will be produced at a rate of around two million units annually,” stunned me for these reasons:

1) GM is already at work on “the Volt’s second-generation drivetrain”!?!

2) They’re already planning a “people car” using the 2009 Astra platform!?!

3) They expect to produce ~TWO MILLION of this 2nd gen Volt/Astra annually!?!

All I can say is WOW!!!!!

[Reply]
Statik Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 9:53 am

Nasaman:

The stunning part isn’t about the next generation Volt already, its is the ‘to me…the stunning part is “utilizing Astra’s small car architecture–a global platform” — the key phrase is ‘a global platform’

AKA the Volt will not be produced in Michigan or North America for very long.

I’ll cut and paste GM’s announcement on future ‘Astra sites’:

“General Motors outlined four places where the next Astra would be built…Ellesmere Port–England, Bochum–Germany, Gliwic– Poland, Trollhattan–Sweden (Saab’s homeplant)…General Motors will continue to build all the Astras, including the Saturn version, in Europe, at least through to the next generation, as no North American plants were listed in this release”

I wonder how the 2nd gen will come down to 30K, when it will be made with Euro dollars? (”So far, the predicted investment cost for the next-gen 2010 Astra is 3.1 billion euros”).

[Reply]
Mark H. Canadian Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 9:53 am

I particularly liked this statement
“And, being badged a Chevrolet, it will be as affordable as any current Chevy small car.”.
Hopefully when Bob said ” if it is closer to 40k so be it ” he was saying that cost will not slow them down and they are determined to bring this car to market.” Any current Chevy small car” would not would not put it in the 40k zone surely.

[Reply]
Statik Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 10:20 am

I wish I could fix posts here like the forum, lol

…my first paragraph clearly illustrates my fantabulous first draft writing/cut and paste abilities…sigh

[Reply]
Jim C. Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 11:44 am

Very exciting news, and 2011 is only 3 years away. However, the estimated price of 40K is disturbing - and with inflation being what it is, by 2011 the price could be a lot higher unless GM factored that in when they made the estimate.

Affordability is still the key for the majority of car buyers.

[Reply]
Rashiid Amul Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 12:54 pm

The 2008 Chevrolet Aveo LT is a small car
and its MSRP is $14,580.00 USD. If he is serious about the Volt being as affordable as any current Chevy small car, the under $20K is perfect.

A few weeks ago, it was $40K and now it is “as affordable as any current Chevy small car”. Honestly, when it comes to price, I don’t know what to think anymore.

[Reply]
Stommps Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 1:46 pm

Well if GM was smart they are doing a lot of parallel work on their other platforms ie Astra, Cobalt, Malibu, HHR, Tahoe etc in secret gettng them setup to take the Volt’s EREV power train.

So in 2010-2011 the Volt launches at 40k fully loaded with all the bells and whistlles to validate the 40k price. They use that car to educate the public what it is and how it works. If they are really smart they build a PR campaign around the DRIVE TRAIN and not the car. They come up with some spiffy PR name for the drive train ie don’t call it a hybrid but something else to seperate themselves from all the other hybrids out there and to not confuse the public. This gives them there “Halo” drive train.

Then in 2011-2012 they announce that they are releaseing EREV versions of there other cars ie Astrs, Cobalt, Malibu’s etc. in 2012-2014. If Toyota only has their plugin Prius at that time it would give GM a huge edge especially if gas is 4-5 bucks at that time.

[Reply]
bruce g Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 2:23 pm

Excellent,

I couldnt have hoped for more.
Go GM!

[Reply]
koz Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 2:59 pm

40 miles/day for 10 yrs = 46,000 miles
30 mpg car would use 4,866 gallons
est cost of gas in late 2010 $4/gallon
Total gas cost = $19,467
Total electric ($0.11/KWh) = $4,015

Make your assumptions about e-miles, gas price, electric cost and draw your own conclusion but Volt including cost of battery could be substantially higher than a much cheaper ICE and still be cost competitive. We need to get over the initial vehical cost comparisons. They won’t favor EV’s or REEV’s anytime soon, but REAL costs of ownership can. Plus you’ll have a nice insurance policy against exhorbitant increases in gas prices.

[Reply]
pdt Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 3:14 pm

Has anyone looked into how insurance costs will be effected by the value of the batteries? I’m not sure how to factor that into the value proposition. The insurance will surely be effected by the increased value of the car as well as the significant residual value of the batteries/motor/generator (the copper content alone would not be completely insignificant) as compared to a normal car.

[Reply]
Jean-Charles Jacquemin Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 3:25 pm

Thanks Lyle,

One of my two cars is a third generation Astra station wagon, I owned a second generation Astra just before and my annual mileage will drive me to 2010/11 in time to change this 3rd gen Astra for the 4th one (electric this one, I hope be it called a Volt, a Flextreme, or …).
What is reassuring me is that my Astra’s have been excellent cars, with high realibilty and economic ones

[Reply]
kent beuchert Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 3:32 pm

As a past blurb from a GM spokesman noted : to reduce the costs, a car has to use parts being manufactured in the millions. This would seem to be especially true for the biggest cost of all - the battery pack. A123 System spokesman quoted here claimed their batteries will go down in cost to rival NiMH battery prices in the not too distant future under mass production. That would appear to reduce battery pack costs by way over 50%. And LG claimed their batteries will be easy to manufacture and use cheap components (iron) to boot. It’s very clear that the VOLT will go down in cost
by Gen II.

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john1701a Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 3:44 pm

>> 40 miles/day for 10 yrs = 46,000 miles
>> 30 mpg car would use 4,866 gallons

Comparing Volt to a 30 MPG car simply doesn’t make any sense, especially in 2011. Try 50 MPG instead.

Also, your calculation is off by quite a bit… 40 * 365 * 10 = 146,000

As for getting over intial vehicle cost considerations, don’t expect that until Volt’s reliability is established. It’s the same wait that other new technologies, like Prius, had to endure. Consumers have always used the wait-and-see method for measuring worth.

[Reply]
Statik Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 4:45 pm

#9 — a few issues

A) 10 years * 365days * 40miles = exactly the fully charge for 3,650 days? Not likely.

B) Next years Cobalt gets the 1.4L Turbo…which GM is targeting to get between 35 and 40MPG…so 365x$3.00=$1,095/year

C) HAve you checked your electric bill? That price at the pump is the bottom line. My bill says I pay XX/kwh…then there is all those extra charges..this is my last months office bill:
ELECTRICITY 33.60
DELIVERY 23.09
REG CHARGES 4.44
DEBT RETIREMENT CHARGE 3.28
TAX 3.28

TOTAL: $68.90 (I actually paid DOUBLE the KW/hr posted rate)

I’m sure every area is different, but I doubt someone just pays the KW charge with no fees or taxes.

D) Who wants to plunk down 40K+ for a new car, then drive the same car everyday for 10+ years?

[Reply]
bruce g Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 6:38 pm

While we are playing with figures here is another gross approximation.
Lets say we need to reduce the vehicle emissions by 30 % in the next 20 years because the europeans are getting angry.
200 million vehicles in North America?
Say we replace a third, 60 million with something pretty efficient like a volt or e-malibu.
Thats 3 million vehicles a year for twenty years.
That is what was once called doing calculations on the back of a cigarette packet!
ve a good day!

[Reply]
Jean-Charles Jacquemin Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 6:53 pm

Hi Bruce g #15,

Being European, I’m not angry at US people in general.
But the blindness of your administration (in fact its cynicism) towards the Kyoto protocol makes me (and us) impatient for a change in your leadership.

We live on the same planet.

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toy4two Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 7:58 pm

Am I the only one scared by this statement: “Do not, however, look to the 2007 Volt Concept as a hint of what the production vehicle will look like: GM has since discovered some serious aerodynamics-related shortcomings that have led to a new stylistic direction.”

The reason I liked the Volt was the styling, even if it was a petrol design. I expect some changes from concept to production, but this sounds like that sporty looking car I saw at the auto show won’t be there, the nice low slung roofline, the high belt line, large wheels.

I think GM as not going to sell as many as I initially predicted when I saw the concept, good looks can sell a car even when no one I know would buy an American car (see Sky / Solstice)

[Reply]
bruce g Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 8:29 pm

Jean-Charles,
That was really just a scenario,
Im from New Zealand but I share the european view that me must act globally to avoid turning the earth into burnt toast.
But when the american industrial machine finally starts to move it can do wonders.
I think Bush is counting on that too. GM’s work on the E-Flex plus large centralised energy sources, nuclear or coal may take the US to a emissions level that is globally acceptable.

[Reply]
David L G Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 8:32 pm

#13 & #14 I just did the math based on my total power bill divided by my KWH usage. I pay about $.08/kwh. Based on this I just compared to my 4 cylinder Camry which gets about 28mpg combined when it’s lucky. As compared to my Camry with a pretty generous 30mpg allowance for city driving, I would save about $800 and change per year with a Volt (on fuel cost alone).

Sure, some ICE’s will be getting 50mpg in 2011, but that’s certainly not going to be a city mpg! I used to drive a Geo Metro with a 1 litre 3 cylinder/5 speed and aside from being a little death box, it only got about 30 mpg in the city, 45 on the interstate.

Personally I think its going to be a long time (if ever) before the US will see a traditional ICE vehicle that runs on gasoline, seats 4-5 and gets a city mpg of even close to 50mpg.

And while $4/gallon may not be a realistic price for gas in ‘11, no one knows…it could just as easily be $8/gallon. Overseas I’ve paid as much as $7/gallon for gas and a car like the volt makes HUGE sense in that type of a fuel economy. The ICE’s we were driving (overseas) were certainly built for economy, but I doubt we were doing much better than 40 MPG at best. I don’t think there’s some great revolution in ICE technology that will suddenly make a traditional ICE get much better mileage unless you reduce engine/vehicle size, weight, and CD.

Just my thoughts…

[Reply]
john1701a Says:
February 3rd, 2008 at 10:36 pm

>> I don’t think there’s some great revolution in ICE technology
>> that will suddenly…

Why such an obvious red herring? Please, let’s try to remain constructive.

Whether or not that happens has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that 50 MPG hybrids will competing with Volt. Their much lower price will be the topic of endless number-crunch comparisons, not traditional vehicles.

[Reply]
Koz Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 12:30 am

john1701a- You’re correct, I mistyped and dropped the 1 in total miles. 30MPG was for cheaper ICE only comparison. 4-5 passenger hybrids will most likely get 50MPG by then but they will cost more too. In this example it works out to 2920 gallons or $11,680 total gas cost. The Volt, as proposed, would need to be under $30K today to win a strictly economic comparison to the current Prius.

Staik-
A) correct, however for people with >= 20mile commute it won’t be that far short (some may actually be more if they plug in more than once/day) but others with shorter commutes could have significantly fewer e-miles
B) Can’t find this on the web but assume it happens, it’s not realistic to assume 40mpg for first 40 miles.
c) Yes, I had and looked again. The incremental increase in the bill is what matters. Only charges proportional to usage are relevent and mine are 9.7 cents for first 1000KWh/mo and 11.6 after that. Many are less and many are more.
D) Some do, some don’t. Additional question if you want a car for less time is what you feel the resale value will be. Personally, I feel gasoline prices will significantly outpace the cost of electricity and new tech battery costs will continue to come down as they have for the past 10 years or more. This will only help the resale value of the Volt vs. ICE only cars. I beleive what life is left in the battery will be valued into the resale price. This does bring up an interesting point. The Volt (and all plug in vehicles) should track total KWH through battery just as Odometers track mileage.

My point should have been made more directly and it wasn’t that everyone will save $15,452 for e-miles over the life of the car. The point is that everyone will save something. We should factor in our own circumstances and these savings when comparing prices.

David L G - That’s what I’m talking about! $4 may turn out to be high but I doubt many people would bet today that it will be lower in 2011.

[Reply]
David L Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 2:49 am

I live in British Columbia, Canada - where gas is currently $1.08/liter. This works out to about $4.10 per US gallon. Electricity is charged at $0.0615 per kWh (actually is $0.06348 after additional charges). Currently, I drive 15,000 KM (9450 miles) per year, using a 2005 Suzuki Aerio which “real world” averages about 24 miles/US gallon … which works out to about $1620/year for gas. I image that 80% of my driving could be “electric only” if I had a Volt.

In todays’ dollars, I would save about $1300/year in gas, but spend less than $100 ($95.38 ?) in extra electricity. With an approximate $1200 saved each year, over ten years the savings would be $12,000. I bought my Aerio for $21,000 (top-of-the-line version) three years ago. If I could buy the Volt for $33,000 and it was of similar build quality - this would be the “break even” point.

But, of course it isn’t all about money … I would be willing to pay more to know that I wasn’t pumping carbon into the atmosphere. (In British Columbia, about 85% of the electricity comes from hydro-electric generation.)

[Reply]
NZDavid Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 3:36 am

Well that’s great news that they are going global straight away. I am seriously worried about being at the wrong end of the fuel lines! I would easily be prepared to pay an extra $5,000 for the insurance of being able to move in the event of global instability.

Also when the major oil coys spend more on repurchasing their shares each year now than on exploration its time to be concerned.
eg: The International Energy Agency (IEA) warned in its latest medium-term oil market report that a market crunch is looming around 2012, but some OPEC producers are breaking even more negative news.

The IEA analysts stated:

“. . . the combination of declining spare oil capacity after 2010 and delayed new output will tighten fuel oil supplies, raising “serious concerns” for gas market security. Increased global competition and constrained export volumes will lead without a doubt to higher price levels.”
Also see:
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2008/01/mexicos-cantare.html
http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=632312855&play=1

I think $4 per gallon sounds cheap! Also you could convert every car in USA to BEV and you will still be importing oil. I don’t know the figures in USA but in NZ just under a third of oil goes to aircraft fuel, and about another third goes to diesel ( includes home heating oil). I would assume the figures are much the same for the states.

Finally as a previous post has mentioned, changing the worlds vehicle fleet just cannot be done in a couple of years.

[Reply]
NZDavid Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 3:57 am

Ahha
I found the link for the repurchase claim eventually!
http://www.energyandcapital.com/articles/big-oil-profits/609/
Regards

[Reply]
Brian Jenner Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 7:44 am

To post 19, David L G

You wrote, “Sure, some ICE’s will be getting 50mpg in 2011, but that’s certainly not going to be a city mpg! I used to drive a Geo Metro with a 1 litre 3 cylinder/5 speed and aside from being a little death box, it only got about 30 mpg in the city, 45 on the interstate.”

If you were getting such horrible mileage with you metro, what year was it? It must have been a later year model, say ‘95 on up, because the ‘92 -’94 versions achieved far greater fuel effeciency than what you posted. Of course your driving technique may be to blame. I’m not trying to be insulting, but the Geo Metro is not a sports car, and if one drives it hard and fast, the mileage will dive into normal car territory.

I have had a ‘92 Metro since ‘92. In the beginning I easily achieved 50mpg around town. 16 years later, my city mileage has gone down, but I still get 44 or so during the summer. My highway mileage goes up about ten percent.

As to the Metro being a “little death box,” I’d like to say that although safety is and should be a concern to everyone, defensive driving is the absolute best way to avoid an accident. And what percentage of accidents are catestrophic enough to warrant having a gas guzzling tank for protection. It’s like planning on getting struck by lightning.

I paid $7200 for the car in July of ‘92. The car has 178,000 miles on it. While it is hard to get a perfect average for mpg and $per gallon, let’s conservatively say I have a lifetime average of 45mpg and that gas has averaged $2/gallon since ‘92. That’s $7,911.11 on fuel over the past 16 years.

I want to make two comments on the paragraph I just wrote.
One) If money is one’s only concern, I have you all beat. Between the cost of my car and the fuel the fuel, I’ve spent just over $15,000, maintenance not included. Also, if one is only going to consider the financial aspects of car ownership, then lobby the car manufactures to bring something back like the Metro - a hybrid version, perhaps.
Two) Although I have saved enormous amounts of money during my adult life (My Metro is the only car I have ever owned.), I am ready for a substantial improvement, and money is no object. I do not care if the Volt costs $40K or $25K. I will pay cash for the vehicle using the money I have saved over the last 2 decades and feel better about myself everytime I get out of my car at Panera Bread.

Why not get a normal car you ask? Because… Although my initial purchase in ‘92 had nothing to do with the environment (It was simply personnal economics.) now I am older and wiser and realize I should attempt to live with integrity. Having a Corvette might be cool, but ultimately it is not something that would be good for us all if everyone had that mentality. The Volt seems to be the best of both worlds - a cool design that is good for the environment.

When PEV become commonplace, we can talk money savings between various PEVs. Right now, however, the push should be to get the technology out there for all to see. Those of us who can afford it should buy it so that later the price can drop for others who currently cannot afford it.

[Reply]
NZDavid Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 7:52 am

To #25 Brian

If the world was full of people like you, the planet would be in a much better condition. It’s about dong the right thing and you will be. Still will be fun watching all those people lining up for gas as you cruise past.

[Reply]
john1701a Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 12:01 pm

I sure am glad about the upcoming freeze.

The number-crunching hasn’t been sincere so far… Why compare to the current Prius knowing quite well that the newer will be available in 2011 instead? And what’s with the traditional ICE nonsense? It makes no sense in 2011 with hybrids so well established and plug-ins being available. Then of course, there’s the ignoring of overall emissions.

Anywho, try this:

($21,000 base * 7% tax) + (150,000 miles / 50 MPG * 3.25 gas)

The result of that equation provides some realistic perspective. $32,220 is still less than what Volt is expected to cost before tax or electricity. That’s what the press will repeatedly publish. That’s what the attention will focus around. That’s what you should be addressing.

[Reply]
noel park Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 12:31 pm

14Statik:

Where did you get the info on the 1.4 turbo in the Cobalt? If true, it’s the best news I’ve heard today.

15bruce g:

I think that this is about Americans getting fed up, not about Europeans getting angry. I’m not buying another car until GM fulfills the promise of the Volt. Well maybe a 40 mpg 1.4 turbo Cobalt to bridge over, if it actually happens. Plenty of people feel the same way. That’s why GM needs to get with it. Although they certainly have a right to be angry. Thank you Jean-Charles for your patience and generosity, as always.

19David L G:

“…reduce engine/vehicle size, weight and CD.” That’s exactly what needs to happen. I’ve been begging for it all along. It’s simple physics, not rocket science. How about an Aveo with the 1.4 turbo? If people are concerned about the “death box” issue (my wife for one) how about beefing up the body structure a bit, al la the Smart? If a Smart can pass US crash test requirements, what’s the problem? If it adds a bit of weight, take it out via composite or aluminum body parts. GM is a leader in composite car body technology, even if they wimped out on the Vue.

[Reply]
Statik Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 1:15 pm

Hi Noel #27

The 1.4L turbo has alot of press clippings…originally slated to roll out in ‘alot’ of models in 2010…the Cobalt gets it for ‘09…probably in counteract Ford’s ecoboost

Hers’s a linky I dug up…I’ve got a few more if you want them:

http://www.motorauthority.com/cars/general-motors/gm-looks-to-compact-turbo-engines-to-improve-mileage

I will say something, I was just arguing the math…if you want to argue good of the environment or put a price on that…I can see the value of buying a Volt at 40k. Course, very few will do ‘the math’ on the environment when it comes to a extra 20k…especially when their house is being foreclosed.

Of course, that being said, arguing ‘environment effects’ is also a double edge sword. The next person in line can take your reason to buy a Volt, one step further, like:

Greenies: Why don’t you take a bus?
Ultra-Greenies: Why don’t move close to your work and ride a bike?
Amish: Why don’t you form a collective and live off the land?

Those smug Amish…hate those guys.

[Reply]
noel park Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 2:58 pm

29Statik:

Thanks for the link.

I had read in the paper about Ford’s move toward turbos, but this is the first I have heard about GM with the 1.4 turbo. A very good move on their part IMHO.

I could get really interested in a 35 - 40 mpg Cobalt to drive while waiting for the Volt. Plus, it would give a really viable option for people who are not going/able to pay the sort of “early adopter premium” for an early Volt. Something to compete with the Yaris, Fit, Crolla and Civic on gas mileage.

I said last week on the Fastlane blog that, if Chevy would offer an Aveo/Cobalt with mileage equal to the above, I would buy one. Maybe they will force me to put my money where my mouth is. I hope so.

[Reply]
noel park Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 3:03 pm

29Statik:

Also, those are all good “greenie” suggestions. We are working on “move closer to work and drive less”. My wife used to drive about 9500 miles a year, and last year it was 6000.

[Reply]
SuperSchupp Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 3:36 pm

Finalize the design, good news.

[Reply]
Andrew Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 4:44 pm

You guys get away cheap….

Try living in California like i do where gas is the most expensive in the nation ($3.15 for the cheap stuff last week - tho i know still alot cheaper than Europe) and my electricity bill averages out at $0.17 per kwh - that total/kwh used. Note that in CA with PGE there are 5 tiers for electricity, starting at $0.115/kwh and going up to $0.348/kwh in tier 5. I’m deep into Tier 4 ($0.30/kwh) in my 2400 sq ft home with two adults and two kids. I’m not looking for sympathy, just pointing out that the whole math eqaution looks alot different depending on where in the world you live.

As a note i just purchased a 2001 Dodge Durango top of the line, for $5500 - you can get used SUVs and trucks dirt cheap these days. At current prices, and commuting 50 miles each day, i spend $75 a week on gas, or $3750 a year. So even if a Volt ran on free electricity, at $40k its still going to take me 9 years in my current vehicle, at current gas prices, to use up that $40k. Factor in my cost of electricity and its even longer. So, just to be a devils advocate, tell me why i should buy a Volt again, assuming gasoline prices remain stable?

[Reply]
noel park Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 5:55 pm

33Andrew:

How about so that the money stays here instead of going to Saudi Arabia (home of almost all of the 9/11 hijackers), Kuwait, Iran, Russia, Sudan, et al.

Or, how about so the balance of payments defecit drives the US to its knees later, rather than sooner.

Or, how about to create less air pollution and global warming.

That’s just for a start. No doubt others can do better

[Reply]
Hoang Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 6:41 pm

I quote from #6 post: “A few weeks ago, it was $40K and now it is “as affordable as any current Chevy small car”. Honestly, when it comes to price, I don’t know what to think anymore”

Just don’t think, ignore it. Sound like science fiction, doesn’t it? I quess, GM can say anything they want as long as they can fool average Joe. It is too bad for them because most of the visitors of this site who are the only people interesting in the car are not average Joe.

Or who knows, GM already took the inflation into account when they said 40K because 40K at 2010 is like 25K today.

[Reply]
noel park Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 7:24 pm

29Statik:

Well I poked around on Google/Yahoo a bit, and sure enough I did come up with several references to the 1.4 turbo in the Cobalt. Thanks for the heads up. Who knew?

It’s always amazed me that the Cobalt is several hundred pounds heavier than the Aveo, and yet the mileage ratings are strikingly similar. Evidently the 1600 cc engine in the Aveo is a generation older than the 2200 cc (2400?) Ecotec in the Cobalt. I had heard of the 1.4 naturally aspirated Ecotec in Europe. I assume that is the one they intend to turbo for the Cobalt.

My suggestion was to use the non-turbo 1.4 in the much lighter Aveo, thus giving it usefully more mileage. If a turbo Cobalt can get 35-40, imagine what a non-turbo Aveo could get. No response though. Globalization or no, I guess European GM doesn’t talk to Korean GM.

The Aveo is pretty light, and not that bad looking, IMHO. Also, I think that the 5 door is to be restyled for 2009. As Rick Lupori famously said on the Fastlane blog, “It’s a pretty good car in search of a drive train.” I think that a credible Yaris, Fit, Versa fighter would be a good thing, Volt or no.

[Reply]
NZDavid Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 7:40 pm

#33 Andrew

1. Security/insurance: If theres a supply disruption you won’t spend hours in lines at the gas station.

2. Uncle Sam needs you. Someone needs to pay off the deficit !

3. You will make friends due to the cool car you drive.

4. Fuel prices will go up. The question is by how much?

[Reply]
Statik Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 9:59 pm

Noel,

There is no confirmed other numbers/modelsyet, but apparently the 1.4L turbo is going to be a option on no fewer than 6-8 models in the lineup by 2010. Basically everything on the Astra platform will be getting it….which is ’supposedly’ going to produce 1.5 to 2 million cars for GM by 2012.

[Reply]
MetrologyFirst Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 10:22 pm

After reading all of this discussion about what the future will hold, I think everyone needs to step back. It is not clear what comparisons can be assumed using future cars, hybrid or not. We had 40mpg cars 20 years ago; using mpg projection arguments, we should already be driving 80mpg cars now. You can not assume parallel hybrids like the Prius will evolve into higher mpg cars; It should be clear by now that the current hybrid or ICE technology has hit a wall at about 45-50 mpg. That’s more of a physics argument than anything. After all we want more and more stuff in our new cars, making them heavier, countering all the gains in engine efficiency.

Along those lines, the best use of hybrid tech today are the new GM full size SUV hybrids. Going from 15mpg to 22 mpg saves a lot more gas than anything else. But that’s another discussion.

The game changer here is the E-flex chassis. A new paradigm. Electric first, then supplementary generator driven by whatever fuel is the best local solution. This is why the Volt is important. Far more important than the Prius every dreamed about. The Volt will change our future cars, not just improve the current 100yr old solution.

GM is on the right track in more ways than one.

[Reply]
john1701a Says:
February 4th, 2008 at 11:11 pm

>> The game changer here is the E-flex chassis. A new paradigm.

That’s missing the point. Solutions are needed now.

60,000,000 new vehicles are produced worldwide each year. Affordable high efficiency, very clean vehicles are needed in massive quantity right away. Well proven “full” hybrids, like Prius, with fulfill that need.

Of course, that paradigm is coming… but no where near as soon as you hope. Time will establish their reputation. That takes years of real-world miles though. Patience.

>> You can not assume parallel hybrids like the Prius will evolve into higher mpg cars;

What is there to assume? The prototypes are already on the road. For example… http://www.google.org/recharge/

[Reply]
MetrologyFirst Says:
February 5th, 2008 at 1:08 am

Intersting website about the Prius plug in mods. It is hard to tell from the data given how well of a controlled experiment this is though. An awful lot of 1 and 2 mile drives. A wild fluctuation in measured mpg. From low 40’s to ~100?? That is somewhat disconcerting, I would think. What type of driving techniques are used by the drivers? I’ve read many articles on hypermilers that can routinely get 60+mpg out of a regular prius. If the driving techniques are not standardized, it seems like a driver could manipulate the results rather easily.

Doesn’t talk about battery size; how big are they and how much space do they take up? You can’t see in the windows of the modified Prius. How well will they handle repeated cycling? That’s always the kicker. What does it cost?

I’ll take GM’s E-flex approach, thank you. It appears it will be a more solid and integrated technique.

[Reply]
Twitchy Says:
February 6th, 2008 at 4:35 am

Screw you lot and your silly ‘comparison’ arguments. I’ll still love the Volt (or whichever variant we get in NZ) as it could be used to power my home in the event of an electricity outage - a very real risk we face once again thanks to an unusually dry summer.

[Reply]
Chevy Volt Dreamer Says:
February 9th, 2008 at 3:18 am

The Volt is absolutely amazing!

Check out these great videos and commercials at:

http://www.chevy-volt.net

[Reply]
Ashley Wood Says:
February 12th, 2008 at 1:45 am

Fallen for volt!

[Reply]
Ashley Wood Says:
February 12th, 2008 at 1:48 am

Fallen for VOLT! I want it in high metallic purple/green, with a clear gloss and black interior with silver trim! Hot fast, and efficient it is the only CAR!

[Reply]

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