Comments on: Chevy Volt on CBS Sunday Morning: Lutz Says Priced “Nicely” Under $30,000

By: Don

Don — Sun, 23 Sep 2007 17:31:25 +0000

we dont need a $30,000 dollar mini cadilac,we need a $12,000 affordable car

By: Neil

Neil — Tue, 18 Sep 2007 15:35:52 +0000

FYI: kent’s been badmouthing/trolling Tesla for some some time now. I hope he has the grace to eat his words publicly and often when the first production Tesla roadsters hit the road in the next few months (I recall him claiming that the whole company is nothing more than a scam and that they’ll just run off with the money, they’ll never get to production etc..).

GM: You made my day when you introduced the Volt!

By: rx_tx

rx_tx — Tue, 18 Sep 2007 12:56:17 +0000

You can “download” and watch the cbs video here:

http://tinyurl.com/ytjjk6

For those that can’t stream (including me

By: kent beuchert

kent beuchert — Tue, 18 Sep 2007 02:44:44 +0000

Did they call Tesla “crappy” or “scrappy” ?
Crappy is the better fit. I see they finally fired (kicked sideways,perhaps) their less than accurate CEO Eberhard. He was the goofball who swore that the Tesla’s would get 250 miles “regardless” regardless of AC usage, terrain, etc. which every EV person knows is pure BS). Then the EPA ran tests and set mileage as “200.” Then Tesla started claiming “over 200 miles.” The cost of batteries they claimed was “low” because they were using generic (and first generation) li ions, but refused to say how much the replacement costs would be, claiming that costs would fall 7% per year,
and be much lower when replacements were needed, a time interval which they refused to estimate. Then came stories of $25,000
battery packs that only lasted 5 years, then Tesla claimed the battery pack would last “150,000″ miles, an absurd notion unless one lived in the car and somehow managed to put 30,000 miles a year on the clock. At that point I wrote off Tesla as a goofball bunch of CA airheads who have way too much money and way too little sense or honesty.

By: voltman

voltman — Tue, 18 Sep 2007 02:14:25 +0000

“Will the Volt be nicely under #30,000 including the battery?”

What the hell are you paying for if the batteries are not in there? A generator and a motor? My 06 honda was 18k and it gets 40mpg.

By: AES

AES — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 23:07:29 +0000

It’s important to note, however, that the lithium iron phosphate chemistries (of which A123 is only one variation) don’t need the same degree of “coddling” as conventional, Tesla-type cells. I mean just look at the Killacycle crash from last week – the cells were kept in just an aluminum box, and NOTHING HAPPENED. If those were laptop cells, there would have been a rather violent conflagration. So I think in the future, individual cell energy density isn’t going to be nearly as important as gross battery pack density. The gross pack density of Tesla’s pack is only 120 Wh/kg – that’s not too far above the Killacycle pack at somewhere between 100-108.

By: Tim

Tim — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 18:27:51 +0000

My understanding is that the A123 batteries could not be used easily in a Tesla like vehicle. A123 have better power density, but not as good energy density as conventional commodity Li-Ion batteries. To make an all electric vehicle with a long range using A123 batteries would be too heavy.

Tesla is banking on conventional Li-Ion prices falling with performance increasing. When a vehicle goes 500 miles on a charge, nobody may care about the recharge time. You can’t drive forever without sleep. I think GM might beat them to the punch with a more practical and affordable solution that stands up to real world use.

By: Estero

Estero — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 17:20:10 +0000

Thanks Neil!

By: Steven B

Steven B — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 16:30:34 +0000

For the nano-phosphate technology, just go to the A123 Systems web site to see for yourself. They are atypical, extremely advanced lithium-ion batteries. The web site is full of useful information, and the technology is extremely impressive.

By: Neil

Neil — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 15:42:45 +0000

Estero: Li-ion batteries degenerate both with time and use. I’ll quickly describe degradation due to usage. Battery lifetime is described in “cycles”. A “deep cycle” describes the complete usage of the battery from full charge to pretty much flat. Batteries are rated by the number of times they can be deep cycled (at high discharge rates) before they can only hold 80% of their original capacity. The A123 batteries probably have a cycle live in the order of 2000 cycles. Wear and tear on the battery is proportional to the depth of discharge. A battery like the A123 could handle hundreds of thousands of shallow discharges without much loss of capacity. Therefore the cycle life represents a worst case scenario. Even then you still have a workable battery.
Hope that answers your question.