Comments on: Toyota Believes its Parallel Hybrid Approach is Better Than Volts Series Design http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/ Real-time news, information, and discussion about the Chevrolet Volt. Sat, 21 Nov 2009 05:07:32 -0800 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Dave G http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-87865 Dave G Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:02:41 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-87865 #30 Dante, Here are some charts that show what you're saying: http://mysite.verizon.net/vzenu6hr/ebay_pictures/Volt_Electrical_Block_Diagram.jpg As for CNG, there are 2 problems: 1) Compressed natural gas engines are very inefficient 2) CNG engines emit more CO2 than gasoline or diesel engines CNG engines are cleaner, so they emit much less pollution. But for the long term issue of global warming, CNG is worse than what we have today. But perhaps along the lines you were thinking, remember that the Volt's ICE runs on gas or E85. Cellulosic ethanol has none of the problems associated with corn ethanol, and can replace up to 35% of our gasoline consumption. See here for details: http://www.coskata.com/EthanolFeedstockPotential.asp GM is a major investor in this company. So if EREV can replace 80%, and cellulosic ethanol can replace 35%, that's 115% - more than enough to replace all of our current gasoline consumption. #30 Dante,
Here are some charts that show what you’re saying:
http://mysite.verizon.net/vzenu6hr/ebay_pictures/Volt_Electrical_Block_Diagram.jpg

As for CNG, there are 2 problems:
1) Compressed natural gas engines are very inefficient
2) CNG engines emit more CO2 than gasoline or diesel engines

CNG engines are cleaner, so they emit much less pollution. But for the long term issue of global warming, CNG is worse than what we have today.

But perhaps along the lines you were thinking, remember that the Volt’s ICE runs on gas or E85. Cellulosic ethanol has none of the problems associated with corn ethanol, and can replace up to 35% of our gasoline consumption. See here for details:
http://www.coskata.com/EthanolFeedstockPotential.asp
GM is a major investor in this company.

So if EREV can replace 80%, and cellulosic ethanol can replace 35%, that’s 115% – more than enough to replace all of our current gasoline consumption.

]]> By: Dante http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-87860 Dante Sat, 27 Dec 2008 06:16:59 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-87860 The diagram is also inaccurate. The Volt's "generator" shares the same electric "bus" with the battery, so all the power it generates doesn't have to go through the battery - some of it (or all of it, in theory) could go directly to driving the electric motor. The ICE and the battery can combine forces to propel the car directly through the larger and more efficient electric motor in the Volt. Less moving parts, less complex transmission, larger electric motor, flexible choices for the ICE, sounds like a winner to me. Personally, I'd love to get a Volt with one gasoline tank, and one CNG tank - a dual fuel ICE that prefers CNG and only dips into the gasoline when absolutely necessary. If I'm going to be plugging in my Volt to the electrical outlet in my garage every night, I'd love to be able to refill the CNG tank at the same time. The diagram is also inaccurate. The Volt’s “generator” shares the same electric “bus” with the battery, so all the power it generates doesn’t have to go through the battery – some of it (or all of it, in theory) could go directly to driving the electric motor. The ICE and the battery can combine forces to propel the car directly through the larger and more efficient electric motor in the Volt. Less moving parts, less complex transmission, larger electric motor, flexible choices for the ICE, sounds like a winner to me. Personally, I’d love to get a Volt with one gasoline tank, and one CNG tank – a dual fuel ICE that prefers CNG and only dips into the gasoline when absolutely necessary. If I’m going to be plugging in my Volt to the electrical outlet in my garage every night, I’d love to be able to refill the CNG tank at the same time.

]]> By: Judson Puckett http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-34222 Judson Puckett Mon, 24 Mar 2008 10:07:39 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-34222 intertone meroxene micronucleus swamp romancy unflunked lochial croceous <a href="http://www.catureglio.com/" rel="nofollow">Catureglio</a> http://www.cvco.org/civic/organ/roa/ intertone meroxene micronucleus swamp romancy unflunked lochial croceous
Catureglio
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]]> By: Charlie H http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-32925 Charlie H Mon, 17 Mar 2008 02:57:46 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-32925 Toyota's system has the advantage that you aren't required to plug it in to use it effectively.  With s small recharger motor, the Volt will be at a serious operational disadvantage if you don't plug it in. The key problem with that is that it limits the Volt to people who have a garage - or at least a place to plug in, reliably and safely, at night.  How much of the potential market does that eliminate?  If the Volt is expected to appeal to greens... many of them won't have a garage. As for the overall tenor of this blog post - Toyota thinks their system is better.  So? First, let's consider the history... Toyota has been studying actual Prius operation on the streets for years.  GM?  Not so much.  Who probably has better data?  If the one with better data is saying, "this approach is better," I'd give that possibility some serious consideration. Second, let's consider the venue in which Toyota said this... to their stockholders.  They intend to reassure them that they know what they're doing.  Considering that the Prius actually works, has been on the street for years, is highly reliable and is the fuel economy champ, I'd say... they probably DO know what they're doing. GM and its fanboys should spend more time emulating Toyota and less time trying to tear Toyota down. Toyota’s system has the advantage that you aren’t required to plug it in to use it effectively.  With s small recharger motor, the Volt will be at a serious operational disadvantage if you don’t plug it in.

The key problem with that is that it limits the Volt to people who have a garage – or at least a place to plug in, reliably and safely, at night.  How much of the potential market does that eliminate?  If the Volt is expected to appeal to greens… many of them won’t have a garage.

As for the overall tenor of this blog post – Toyota thinks their system is better.  So?

First, let’s consider the history… Toyota has been studying actual Prius operation on the streets for years.  GM?  Not so much.  Who probably has better data?  If the one with better data is saying, "this approach is better," I’d give that possibility some serious consideration.

Second, let’s consider the venue in which Toyota said this… to their stockholders.  They intend to reassure them that they know what they’re doing.  Considering that the Prius actually works, has been on the street for years, is highly reliable and is the fuel economy champ, I’d say… they probably DO know what they’re doing.

GM and its fanboys should spend more time emulating Toyota and less time trying to tear Toyota down.

]]> By: Dan http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-31803 Dan Sun, 02 Mar 2008 05:31:24 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-31803 Well all I can say is that Toyota is better because it is out. I currently have a Prius and am waiting anxiously for GM to get their crap together on the Volt. I am so sick of waiting. Spark EV has a few electric cars out including a small suv which I would love to have but the range is not economical for me. GM is just playing games. With $4.00 a gallon gas expected Spring 2008 they would wipe the other car companies off the face of the earth with Summer 2008 Volt production. If they wanted to have it out they would have by now. They need to get with the times and what the market wants. If they would have had the Volt out by 2007 they would have had more units sold than the Prius. They wonder why their sales are in the crapper, well foresight would have saved their P.O.S company. Release the damn Volt rather than teasing the American public! Well all I can say is that Toyota is better because it is out. I currently have a Prius and am waiting anxiously for GM to get their crap together on the Volt. I am so sick of waiting. Spark EV has a few electric cars out including a small suv which I would love to have but the range is not economical for me. GM is just playing games. With $4.00 a gallon gas expected Spring 2008 they would wipe the other car companies off the face of the earth with Summer 2008 Volt production. If they wanted to have it out they would have by now. They need to get with the times and what the market wants. If they would have had the Volt out by 2007 they would have had more units sold than the Prius. They wonder why their sales are in the crapper, well foresight would have saved their P.O.S company. Release the damn Volt rather than teasing the American public!

]]> By: Vincent http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-31747 Vincent Sat, 01 Mar 2008 01:09:52 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-31747 In a Dae Woo Bus Study, a couple of professors at UCDavis did a comparison of ICE, Parallel and Series Hybrids, using simulations and guess what, the parallel hybrid was 100.8% better than the ICE while the Series was 70.3% better. Other than this, i have no other details. In a Dae Woo Bus Study, a couple of professors at UCDavis did a comparison of ICE, Parallel and Series Hybrids, using simulations and guess what, the parallel hybrid was 100.8% better than the ICE while the Series was 70.3% better. Other than this, i have no other details.

]]> By: Chevy Needs to Release the Volt Now http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-16599 Chevy Needs to Release the Volt Now Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:34:52 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-16599 Well it all comes down to this: Toyota has the most fuel efficient car out there right now. The Volt is still 3 years from actual production. There is much that can happen in 3 years that may scrap the project. If they were really serious, they should be taking down payments from the public. This way they will be forced to supply the consumers with a date and a product. Also, this will generate more money for R&D to make the product release more rapid. Once they have this in production, the rest of the car companies, including Toyota, will be left in the dust. Right now though, GM is not promising anything and Toyota owns the market. Well it all comes down to this: Toyota has the most fuel efficient car out there right now. The Volt is still 3 years from actual production. There is much that can happen in 3 years that may scrap the project. If they were really serious, they should be taking down payments from the public. This way they will be forced to supply the consumers with a date and a product. Also, this will generate more money for R&D to make the product release more rapid. Once they have this in production, the rest of the car companies, including Toyota, will be left in the dust. Right now though, GM is not promising anything and Toyota owns the market.

]]> By: Richard N http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-16005 Richard N Sat, 24 Nov 2007 01:44:58 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-16005 The discussion of whether series or parallel vehicle is better is really moot until the finished product with price comes out and a proper comparison is done. GM needs to keep the price of the Volt competitive with the Prius; 20 to 25k for the basic model. There are so many of us that really want to get one but the price will mean the difference whether we can get one or not. The discussion of whether series or parallel vehicle is better is really moot until the finished product with price comes out and a proper comparison is done. GM needs to keep the price of the Volt competitive with the Prius; 20 to 25k for the basic model. There are so many of us that really want to get one but the price will mean the difference whether we can get one or not.

]]> By: David http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-15699 David Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:40:11 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-15699 My crystal ball shows me that whatever configuration is purchased more is the configuration that will be produced more. I plan on buying the Volt's Series design... although MDI's CAT Car (www.theaircar.com) also interests me. No thanks to Toyota for this round. My crystal ball shows me that whatever configuration is purchased more is the configuration that will be produced more.

I plan on buying the Volt’s Series design… although MDI’s CAT Car (www.theaircar.com) also interests me.

No thanks to Toyota for this round.

]]> By: GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Concept Site » Toyota Denies it Denigrated the Volt http://gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-15684 GM-VOLT : Chevy Volt Concept Site » Toyota Denies it Denigrated the Volt Wed, 21 Nov 2007 15:09:13 +0000 http://www.gm-volt.com/2007/09/04/toyota-believes-its-parallel-hybrid-approach-is-better-than-volts-series-design/#comment-15684 [...] Toyota Believes its Parallel Hybrid Approach is Better Than Volts Series Design [...] [...] Toyota Believes its Parallel Hybrid Approach is Better Than Volts Series Design [...]

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